Does US Airstrike in Iraq Violate Just War Doctrine?

[EndTimes]

OK, so you are quite concerned about the US following Catholic teaching in this regard, but seemingly not so concerned when it comes to other Catholic teachings, like just war. Do I understand you correctly?

No. Never said that at all.

Question to understand you better:

Was WWII a just war? and if yes, why?

 

[LeafByNiggle]

No. Never said that at all.

OK, glad to hear that you do value the just war concept and its relevance to US policy.

 

[EndTimes]

OK, glad to hear that you do value the just war concept and its relevance to US policy.

Why stop at the US - when "just war’ Teachings apply to every nation?

 

[o_mlly]

Does US Airstrike in Iraq Violate Just War Doctrine?

As an act of self-defense, “No”.

CCC#2308 All citizens and all governments are obliged to work for the avoidance of war.
However, "as long as the danger of war persists and there is no international authority with the necessary competence and power, governments cannot be denied the right of lawful self-defense, once all peace efforts have failed.

 

[EndTimes]

AGain… Was WWII a just war? and if yes, why?

 

[LeafByNiggle]

LeafByNiggle:

OK, glad to hear that you do value the just war concept and its relevance to US policy.

Why stop at the US - when "just war’ Teachings apply to every nation?

No one is saying that the just war doctrine applies only to the US. It does apply to every nation. And it would be proper to acknowledge when other nations violate that teaching too.

AGain… Was WWII a just war? and if yes, why?

I do not answer irrelevant questions. If you would like to expand on what sort of argument you hope to make about WWII and its relevance to the questions of today, I might reconsider.

 

[EndTimes]

I do not answer irrelevant questions.

I anticipated possible avoidance to an answer…

It’s relevant b/c it lends Understanding of Just War…

Who determines who’s Just in War?

Both “sides” claim that they rank amongst the Just.

 

[Ridgerunner]

I don’t think we can take this action in isolation and ask whether it is, in itself, a “just war”. It’s part of a larger and ongoing conflict between Iran and its allies and the U.S. and its allies. In speaking of “allies” both have some of what might better be called “fellow travelers”.

Solimani was an Iranian general who had an army in Iraq, which is not his country. He used it to kill Americans, but much more to kill Arab and Kurdish citizens of Iraq; some Shia, some Sunni. His objectives were imperialistic; to extend the Iranian domain to the Mediterranean and govern peoples who largely don’t want to be governed by Iran. The question is whether it is just for America to be a participant in that war; a war that will go on whether we actively participate or not.

 

[Beryllos]

Who determines who’s Just in War?

The CCC spells it out clearly enough that regular folks like we can make an attempt to determine whether a country’s waging of war is just or unjust.

2309 The strict conditions for legitimate defense by military force require rigorous consideration. The gravity of such a decision makes it subject to rigorous conditions of moral legitimacy. At one and the same time:

• the damage inflicted by the aggressor on the nation or community of nations must be lasting, grave, and certain;
• all other means of putting an end to it must have been shown to be impractical or ineffective;
• there must be serious prospects of success;
• the use of arms must not produce evils and disorders graver than the evil to be eliminated. The power of modern means of destruction weighs very heavily in evaluating this condition.

These are the traditional elements enumerated in what is called the “just war” doctrine.

The evaluation of these conditions for moral legitimacy belongs to the prudential judgment of those who have responsibility for the common good.

 

[Theo520]

Just so we are clear, they (Iran) orchestrated an attack on US soil (Embassy), they have this as a habit. Here is what they did to your living room
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Trump won’t repeat Carter’s mistakes.

 

[mdgspencer]

.
Thanks to Beryllos for his post.
People haven’t been answering the opening poster, which is about the just war doctrine of the Catholic Church.

 

[Aquinas11]

My brother is currently sitting somewhere over there, and is supposed to be ending his deployment shortly. I just hope this doesn’t interfere with that.

Prayers your brother comes home safe

 

[Theo520]

But we now have a worse relation with our allies since before WW2, a worse relations with China, worse with Iran, worse with NK.
More soldiers deployed than under Obama, and all along Trump says “End foreign wars”. I think he’s taking us all for fools.

You seem to be throwing out talking points you haven’t researched.

• Relations with NK are equal or better.
• Relations with China have been tense since they started building their Islands. Trade wise, we are moving in the right direction.
• Agreed, we are putting severe pressure on Iran, a known instigator of terrorism. Actual conflicts have been minimal though with sanctions being the main weapon.

Please provide a source showing the trend of troops abroad, I can’t find one (I looked and none show recent numbers).

I found a snapshot of 2018 that doesn’t look problematic, most troops are in bases with long standing allies

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[Briain]

There was nothing just about this bombing. The CCC does not allow for this. This was a blatant and deliberate act of international terrorism by a rogue superpower designed to provoke an Iranian reaction. This was an arrogant and abominable error on the part of the USA.

The Iranians will not respond in kind. But what we will witness in the next few months will be the beginning of the end of the US occupation of Iraq and Syria. The US has lost the Middle East. It lost in Syria and it will lose in Iraq.

The irony is that the corrupt Iraqi government, installed by the US occupation, will turn against the Americans by demanding their departure. No doubt Russian advisors, and possibly troops, will eventually replace them.

A massive mistake and totally unjust.

 

[buffalo]

Technically this was not a declared war.

 

[Hodos]

No, since the airstrike was retaliatory for a multitude of recent attacks (not just the attack on the embassy, which would be sufficient justification on its own merits).

 

[Beryllos]

Why are you guys turning this into the World News forum?

 

[Theo520]

NK just rescinded it’s Nuclear Test Moratorium.

For the majority of his term, relations with NK have been far better. Their missile testing was curtailed.

Our relations with China at an all-time low, certainly worse under Trump than before.

Don’t confuse trade negotiations with bad relations with China, we need each other and will get through the IP and trade issues. However, militarily and on foreign policy, we are not in worse shape with China. We have disagreements about their ‘ownership’ of South China sea, but there has been no escalation. We even got China to support some of our sanctions on NK.

Troop levels fluctuate. It’s dishonest to cherry pick a few deployment articles and claim the levels are increasing, unless you can compare that to a trend line. Yes, I think foreign troops are up this year over last year, but show me how that compares with Obama’s full term.

 

[AlNg]

The list of deaths since WWII because of militaries is in the 10’s of Millions.

And who has profited from this?

Our entire global economy is dependent on the free flow of oil.

Oil?

The list of deaths since WWII because of militaries is in the 10’s of Millions.

Which is more important
Oil or
the lives of innocent children and civilians?

 

[OurLadyofSorrows]

I am doing a lot of Catholic learning through a few different Priests and Bishops who post on youtube. I discovered them mostly thanks to CAF. There is one by Father , now Bishop Barron , that discusses the conditions for just war. He states there are 7 and they are very difficult to meet.