Donald Trump leads Walker, Bush in Fox national poll

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Path_Finder said:
First off, those charges are not proven nor any role by Christie. That is really just something we’d hear MSNBC or someone like that speak about. He is in office, the idea of indicting him as not even been dreamed of.
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The link I posted was not from MSNBC, it was from a local New Jersey news source.

Christie exists in a political environment where a number of incidents of corruption have blossomed: Bridgegate, the Port Authority, Hoboken. He was either complicit in them, which makes him corrupt, or he was not complicit in them, which makes him a dubious manager of people, and clueless about his political organization.

He’s either corrupt, or incompetent. Which option do you find more palatable?
Secondly, considering that the way your point of view comes across, makes it sound as if you would vote for Hillary, really, talking about corruption and how the Clintons have been able to mass millions, let alone, someone who has been dragged before congress, loses her email server and so on.
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This isn’t about me.

It’s generally a bad move in an argument to support one’s positions by attacking the messenger, and ascribing motives and views that are irrelevant to the conversation in question. It doesn’t prove anything beyond the bankruptcy of your position. It doesn’t make Christie any less corrupt.
 
Oops :o
I’ve been single minded in my news reading the past couple days.

I’m shocked actually and now a little afraid. I’m thinking I better vote in the Republican primary to vote for someone, anyone that’s not Trump. I really, truly thought he wasn’t seriously running.
 
Darryl_Revok said:
The link I posted was not from MSNBC, it was from a local New Jersey news source.

Christie exists in a political environment where a number of incidents of corruption have blossomed: Bridgegate, the Port Authority, Hoboken. He was either complicit in them, which makes him corrupt, or he was not complicit in them, which makes him a dubious manager of people, and clueless about his political organization.

He’s either corrupt, or incompetent. Which option do you find more palatable?

This isn’t about me.

It’s generally a bad move in an argument to support one’s positions by attacking the messenger, and ascribing motives and views that are irrelevant to the conversation in question. It doesn’t prove anything beyond the bankruptcy of your position. It doesn’t make Christie any less corrupt.
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Christie is in a blue state and has not been indicted. Someone under his authority did this bridgegate deal.

Yes, I do think if someone is calling someone “corrupt” or worse, but supports Hillary Clinton that it is hypocritical and should be stated.
 
Path_Finder said:
Christie is in a blue state and has not been indicted. Someone under his authority did this bridgegate deal.
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Which, again, was my point: Do you think him dishonest or incompetent?
Yes, I do think if someone is calling someone “corrupt” or worse, but supports Hillary Clinton that it is hypocritical and should be stated.
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I have never mentioned Hillary or evinced any kind of support for her. You’re putting words in my mouth.

This is what’s called building up a straw man. It is a tool used by the intellectually dishonest and the philosophically bankrupt.
 
SwizzleStick said:
I wish I could disagree, but I cannot. I think what I most often feel now is sadness and loss, sometimes accompanied by stunned disbelief that whatever the latest happens to be could happen. I know we are called to be hopeful, but I continue to have a very difficult time with that…
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yes great sadness and a feeling of great loss!! I see how greatly changed the makeup and the fabric of our country will be in the future.
 
7_Sorrows said:
yes great sadness and a feeling of great loss!! I see how greatly changed the makeup and the fabric of our country will be in the future.
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:sad_yes:

We are definitely going in the wrong direction. Progressives are not bringing progress to this country, but instead destruction, loss and chaos.
 
To all JEB! supporters, I’ll admit that I am very curious. Why do you rate Jeb ABOVE all the other candidates? I can’t think of a single reason to vote for him, even if he is the nominee next November. Thanks, Rob 🙂
 
outremer said:
I’m disappointed to not see Santorum on this poll.
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You shouldn"t be. This country is not going to elect a Catholic as President this time around. So that takes care of Christie, Santorum, Rubio(?) Jindal. Jindal and Rubio have other “issues”, but being Catholic will be obvious. Look at how much guff the Catholics on the Supreme Court are getting. Can you imagine the backlash a Catholic President will get from other Catholics?

It simply won’t happen…
 
Personanongrata said:
You shouldn"t be. This country is not going to elect a Catholic as President this time around. So that takes care of Christie, Santorum, Rubio(?) Jindal. Jindal and Rubio have other “issues”, but being Catholic will be obvious. Look at how much guff the Catholics on the Supreme Court are getting. Can you imagine the backlash a Catholic President will get from other Catholics?

It simply won’t happen…
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Not only that, but all of the Catholic candidates except Santorum okayed the SSS decision. Many excused this approval on the basis of “It’s the law of the land”. I’m particularly dismayed that Marc Rubio didn’t fight against it. I don’t particularly like Trump, but at least he says what he thinks where the other candidates flip flop about issues. I think you can count on Hilary being the next president unless the candidates get their act together.
 
utah_rose said:
I liked Ben Carson until I learned he was pro abortion, which is terrible since he’s a doctor himself.
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He is?! No! That is terrible!

:(:mad::banghead:

I really liked what I thought I knew of him before, though he isn’t a politician, so I am not sure he is even electable or presidential since he is a doctor with no experience in politics. If he does, in fact, support abortion, my opinion of him has slipped. Are you sure? Info or links or source, please?

I pray that we get a good candidate and that he/she wins. It is a shame that choosing the lesser of two evils seems to be our only choice of late, though…
 
utah_rose said:
I liked Ben Carson until I learned he was pro abortion, which is terrible since he’s a doctor himself.
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I certainly wouldn’t go that far in describing his position on this issue and he was heavily critical of Planned Parenthood last week.

ontheissues.org/2016/Ben_Carson_Abortion.htm
The website addresses Carson’s views.

What I heard him say that I’m not sure if I agree with is that if someone came to him asking for an abortion, he would refuse but recommend such a provider. I think that is what he said. So, let’s be balanced in our analysis.
 
SwizzleStick said:
He is?! No! That is terrible. I really liked what I thought I knew of him before, though he isn’t a politician, so I am not sure he is electable or presidential since he is a doctor. Now, if he supports abortion, my opinion has changed.

:(:mad::banghead:

I pray that we get a good candidate. It is a shame that choosing the lesser of two evils seems to be our only choice of late…
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Well, I’m not sure if he is, I have looked into this before too, please see prior post.
 
Path_Finder said:
I certainly wouldn’t go that far in describing his position on this issue and he was heavily critical of Planned Parenthood last week.

ontheissues.org/2016/Ben_Carson_Abortion.htm
The website addresses Carson’s views.

What I heard him say that I’m not sure if I agree with is that if someone came to him asking for an abortion, he would refuse but recommend such a provider. I think that is what he said. So, let’s be balanced in our analysis.
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Thank you for this!
 
Path_Finder said:
Well, I’m not sure if he is, I have looked into this before too, please see prior post.
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Thank you! I probably shouldn’t have posted so quickly and probably should have thought it through more first, so ended up editing my post that you quoted above. I like Dr. Carson, so I just reacted… Anyway, thank you for sharing the link and info! That goes to any and all.
 
SwizzleStick said:
He is?! No! That is terrible!

:(:mad::banghead:

I really liked what I thought I knew of him before, though he isn’t a politician, so I am not sure he is even electable or presidential since he is a doctor with no experience in politics. If he does, in fact, support abortion, my opinion of him has slipped. Are you sure? Info or links or source, please?

I pray that we get a good candidate and that he/she wins. It is a shame that choosing the lesser of two evils seems to be our only choice of late, though…
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You need not worry about Carson. He is on the “Book tour” version of the process kind of like Herman Cain. He has “zero-chance” of being seen and heard by voters who actually vote.
 
utah_rose said:
I liked Ben Carson until I learned he was pro abortion, which is terrible since he’s a doctor himself.
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I didn’t know he was pro abortion! he is seventh day adventist. I wouldn’t think they would be pro abortion. like you say, he is a doctor himself.
 
Path_Finder said:
I certainly wouldn’t go that far in describing his position on this issue and he was heavily critical of Planned Parenthood last week.

ontheissues.org/2016/Ben_Carson_Abortion.htm
The website addresses Carson’s views.

What I heard him say that I’m not sure if I agree with is that if someone came to him asking for an abortion, he would refuse but recommend such a provider. I think that is what he said. So, let’s be balanced in our analysis.
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I don’t have a problem with a physician refusing but recommending another provider. 🤷
It is legal in this country and I would rather have someone who knows what they are doing, rather than a quack who is inexperienced doing terrible damage to a patient of mine.
 
Personanongrata said:
You need not worry about Carson. He is on the “Book tour” version of the process kind of like Herman Cain. He has “zero-chance” of being seen and heard by voters who actually vote.
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Dr. Carson comes off as an extremely intelligent but politically naive individual. He has never proved that he could win an elective office. His whacking of Obama at that breakfast, which much of America cheered, illustrated his mettle and courage, but I doubt that will be enough for him to seriously challenge for the nomination.
Carson WILL have his chance to prove me wrong at the imminent debates. :rolleyes: Rob
 
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