Doug Batchelor: His Catholic Church Attacks

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.I’m just wondering what special insight, or gift of discernment, that you might have into people’s personal prayers which allow you to make the statment that prayers to Mary should be prayers directed to God.
I use the Bible. Jesus taught his disciples to pray directly to the Father. I gave the textual support.
How do you know any person’s prayers, let alone to whom they should go?
For you to make that statment is for you to know the hearts and motives of all who pray.
That’s called eisegesis (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eisegesis). I didn’t say anything about the one doing the praying.
 
You asked for scriptures that prove that Mary carried the divine Trinity. I gave you the scriptures.
Most of which had nothing to do with that. Try again–bold only those portions that support your claim.
Do you or do you not believe that Jesus Christ was fully and totally and completely divine?
Not relevant to my question. Why can’t you stay on topic?
 
a.) God called the Jews to be circumcised.
Any Gentile who joined also had to be circumcised.
b.) God called the circumcised Jews to keep the Sabbath holy.
  1. The Sabbath was made long before there ever was a Jew.
  2. Any Gentile who joined also had to keep the Sabbath.
  3. The commandment explicity states that any “stranger within thy gates” (whether Jew or not) had to keep the Sabbath.
  4. In over 100 languages (created at the Tower of Babel) the name of the seventh day of the week is known as “sabbath.”
  5. Jesus said that the Sabbath was made for man, not just the Jews.
c.) God never called His people with whom He made the New Covenant to be circumcised NOR keep the Sabbath.
The first, yes; as for the Sabbath most Christians at least as late as the 5th century kept the Sabbath.
d.) Apostles and Christians were martyred for being Christians, not errant Jews.
No one has ever claimed that they were.
 
Any Gentile who joined also had to be circumcised.

Which then made him a Jew and subject to keeping the Sabbath.
  1. The Sabbath was made long before there ever was a Jew.
Who was called to keep it before there were Jews?
  1. Any Gentile who joined also had to keep the Sabbath.
Addressed.
  1. The commandment explicity states that any “stranger within thy gates” (whether Jew or not) had to keep the Sabbath.
It states that you should expect your guests to honor “YOUR” Sabbath. Just as I would expect any guest in my home to come to church with me on the day I worship, which is Sunday. Notice it does not require you to circumcise your guest 🙂 It simply says if you were a Jew, your whole household must keep the Sabbath day of rest, including your servents and domestic animals.

See: (From KJV)

***But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, nor thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thine ox, nor thine , nor any of thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates; that thy manservant and thy maidservant may rest as well as thou.
  1. In over 100 languages (created at the Tower of Babel) the name of the seventh day of the week is known as “sabbath.”
This proves that they knew what day Sabbath was. I suspect God wanted even those outside Isreal to “know” the Sabbath. But there is still no command to “keep” the Sabbath outside of the Sons of Isreal.
  1. Jesus said that the Sabbath was made for man, not just the Jews.
No, that is not what He said. He said the Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath. That’s an odd passage coming from the most devout Jew that ever lived, huh.

The first, yes; as for the Sabbath most Christians at least as late as the 5th century kept the Sabbath.

No one has ever claimed that they were.
 
The first, yes; as for the Sabbath most Christians at least as late as the 5th century kept the Sabbath.

Who were “most” of these Christians? In 70 AD Christians were keeping the Lord’s Day. There were no SDA’s then, no sarcasm . Who were most Christians outside the catholic Church in 70 AD?

No one has ever claimed that they were.
My point was you can’t keep the Sabbath the way Jews kept it and be a Christian. So obviously, they weren’t keeping the Sabbath. Neither are “Sabbath Keepers” of today. You are worshipping and resting on Saturday, but you are not keeping the Sabbath.

You claim to be the keepers of the Sabbath. The true keepers of the Sabbath are the Jews. Ask them if you are keeping the Sabbath as God intended.

You don’t seem to understand why you are directly in the middle of two separate Covenants with God. How is that correct? Us catholics have it wrong. The Jews have it wrong, but SDA’s have it right and that revelation came along in the 1800’s?

Now for me, I don’t mind one way or another. I have SDA friends, so I don’t fault you the way you fault me, but I believe the Jews and catholics would be the authorities on the matter, not a religion that came along in the 1800’s. The Jews and catholics were the only two God worshipping religions the moment of Christ’s resurrection and the both of them agree. So, where does that leave SDA’s?

I don’t want to sound confrontational. It’s hard to talk about this without being somewhat confrontational. But I mean all this in the spirit of understanding and learning. I welcome any correction in what I’ve said.

Peace Be With You,

HC
 
Hello Gabriel of 12,
I live in a very Catholic country and am surrounded by Catholics and have them in my family. Thanks to God some of them had their eyes opened and refrained from men invented doctrines of Catholic church.
I according to you have false ideas of the teachings of Catholic church…To me Bible is the mirror to tell me what is right or wrong,what is of God and what is of men and their traditions, I do not fall for emotional stuff when discussing the Bible.I repeat again that if you show me from the Scriptures that any of Apostles support doctrines of Catholic church I will admit that what I say is wrong but none gives me any Biblical backgrounds instead I get this reply:
Please allow me to explain what I myself a Roman Catholic believes about the blessed Virgin Mary. I don’t want to get scriptural with you here, I prefer to give you personal interpretation of what I believe as a Catholic about Mary the mother of Jesus.
I am sorry but what you say and feel is what you say and feel and not what Bible says. Many will be honest and will think they were on the right path. If people’s feelings had importance in God’s eyes why would Jesus said that there will be the ones who will say we did this and that in His name and what will be the reply: I really do not know you!
For me the only merit has what God and His Son say. It is interesting, I have never heard any of you pray to Moses, Elijah or Enoch for whom we have Scriptural backgrounds that they are alive with God but your prayers are directed to the Queen of Heaven-interestingly the pagan nations prayed their idol with the same name.
cont…
 
Hello Gabriel of 12,
I live in a very Catholic country and am surrounded by Catholics and have them in my family. Thanks to God some of them had their eyes opened and refrained from men invented doctrines of Catholic church.
I according to you have false ideas of the teachings of Catholic church…To me Bible is the mirror to tell me what is right or wrong,what is of God and what is of men and their traditions, I do not fall for emotional stuff when discussing the Bible.I repeat again that if you show me from the Scriptures that any of Apostles support doctrines of Catholic church I will admit that what I say is wrong but none gives me any Biblical backgrounds instead I get this reply:

I am sorry but what you say and feel is what you say and feel and not what Bible says. Many will be honest and will think they were on the right path. If people’s feelings had importance in God’s eyes why would Jesus said that there will be the ones who will say we did this and that in His name and what will be the reply: I really do not know you!
For me the only merit has what God and His Son say. It is interesting, I have never heard any of you pray to Moses, Elijah or Enoch for whom we have Scriptural backgrounds that they are alive with God but your prayers are directed to the Queen of Heaven-interestingly the pagan nations prayed their idol with the same name.
cont…
Please see:

2 Thessalonians 2:14(15),: “Therefore, brethren, stand fast; and hold the traditions which you have learned, whether by word, or by our epistle.”

What is more important than this passage is the context in which Paul gives it. If we begin at the beginning of Thessalonians Paul is telling them he is proud of them and to hold on even in their persecution, even as there are liers and deceivers that would tell them wrong.

Then he says “…STAND FAST AND HOLD THE TRADITIONS WHICH YOU HAVE LEARNED…” as if to say there will be those that will challenge you in your beliefs in the Gospel you’ve been taught wether by word or epistle. In person or by letter.

This says that every word spoken by an Apostle has not been recorded. Every tradition has not been written in Scripture. I doubt an Apostle found it necessary to tell Christians to receive Christ in the Eucharist every Sunday if they were already doing that.

You should read this part of Scripture. It describes what you are doing on this forum to catholics in questioning Tradition.

What you must realize is that all New Testament Scripture was Tradition until it was written. You admit as much where the Sabbath is concerned. (You claim that the Sabbath was kept before the Torah was written.) There is nothing in Scripture that says every Tradition was recorded in a complete way. We must rely on early Christians, in my case the Church, to be a guiding light on such matters.
 
Also I am a little ignorant so I need someone to enlighten me concerning the heaven and life after death. If Moses ,Elijah and Enoch are alive and in heaven in their bodies how do they interact with dead saints in the heaven are they visible or they are not visible for we know that Jesus and these three prophets are in their bodies and alive and also in Heaven. I do not understand why would they need their bodies there if they will all eventually spiritually go to heaven also I do not see point in resurrection if Jesus’ spirit will eventually go to His Father and not to hell? Why resurrection? Also I want somebody to give me explanation: Jesus said on the cross: Father into Your hands I commend My spirit” later when He resurrected He said to Mary : Touch me not for I have not yet ascended to My Father…
So, was Jesus’ spirit lingering or traveling somewhere, maybe it was in hell? Or maybe spirit hangs around the body for three days and after that Spirit is sure that there is no chance that person will be awaken to life and then it goes wherever it is supposed to go. Or would you consider that spirit is something else of what you think it is.🤷
cont…
 
Jesus clearly stated that He will come for us when he makes the place ready for us. So are there two different heavens for dead people and the heaven for those who are alive in their bodies or are the invisible souls mingling with those alive in their bodies and if they are cohabiting together how does all this get along with scriptures that says that those who died know nothing and do not praise God. What about all that died before Jesus was born if during Jesus’ time on earth the places still were not prepared?

John 5;28,29 Do not marvel at this for the hour IS COMING in which all who are in the graves will hear His voice and come forth those who have done good to the resurrection of life and those who have done evil to the resurrection of condemnation-something seems not right here. If there is hell for evil ones in which they are sent after they die, are they going to be taken out of that hell after some time spent in it and then will be judged and condemned and then again taken to hell? If that is what God says then I would call that God-God of chaos, but I am sure that is not what God says.
Do you know that even Sodom and Gomorrah that were destroyed by God,their inhabitants still have not faced the judgment as we read in the Bible/ Mark 6;11, and surely if Catholic church doctrine is correct they should have been in purgatory or in hell already-without the judgment? And when they face the judgment what their sentence would be then? Some more eternal fire?
You may give me scriptures where it mentions eternal fire…but does it mean what is says or is it a figure of speech and it has different meaning…“Sodom and Gomorrah are set forth as an example,suffering the vengeance of ETERNAL FIRE” - I do not see that these cities are still burning, do you?
Ecclesiastes 9;6,6 For the living know that they will die but the dead know nothing and they have no more REWARD,for the memory of them is forgotten.Also their love their hatred and their envy have now perished nevermore will they have a share in anything done under the sun.
That is interesting ,if the wicked are tormented in hell fire as thought by most Christians ,wouldn’t they have some knowledge of the torment they are supposed to be experiencing?
Ecclesiastes 9;10 whatsoever thy hand findeth to do,do it with thy might ,for there is now work,nor device,nor knowledge,nor wisdom in the grave thou goest.
If the righteous go to heaven after they die would they not be praising the Lord?

Psalm 115;17 The dead praise not the Lord neither any that go down in silence.

If people pray to saints who died do they hear? Yes if what Job was saying was a lie. " His sons come to honor and he knoweth it not and they are brought low but he perceiveth it not of them"
In Jude 9 archangel Michael disputed about the body of Moses not over his soul.
 
In Bible there are many times when it is used a figure of speech and we need wisdom to understand when we read such the case. When Jesus said let dead bury their dead, how are we going to take it or when He tells us we should be born again? figure of speech. I always wondered how Jesus raised so many dead people and neither one of them had anything to say about their dead experience by the way I would be angry if someone raised me and called my soul that was happy in heaven back to this sad planet. Death is something we would all like to know about and I am sure at least one of these dead and risen back to life people would tell us something about it but obviously there was nothing to be told.

All the explanation you give me is a way around it. Explaining something from your perspective and do you remember what God thinks of traditions of men and how He saw us people in many situations?
We know who is in heaven Bible tells us that, Bible did not leave us in dark about that so why would I accept something that is not evident in the Bible and put myself in danger? Why would I need a statue to call my Creator in my mind if I love Him with all my heart and mind. God clearly told us not to make ANY carved image , so if that is not needed of us why would we want it. The statues are being carried aroundimages.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://arxxiduc.files.wordpress.com/2007/09/virgen.jpg&imgrefurl=http://arxxiduc.wordpress.com/2007/09/08/&usg=__qaKnuX21lX6dBhH6D5wNj2plD_Q=&h=341&w=400&sz=101&hl=en&start=26&um=1&tbnid=FiLujH8NeQj_qM:&tbnh=106&tbnw=124&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dvirgin%2Bmary%2Bstatue%2Bcarried%26ndsp%3D20%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DN%26start%3D20%26um%3D1, people kiss the statues, burn candles and it is so easy to link this kind of worship with the kind of worship we find in Bible and that was not liked by God. You can tell me stories of love, family and all other heart breaking stuff but you cannot back it up from the Scriptures and verify all these ordinances invented by men are needed for salvation and if not needed why would anyone practice them?
All I am trying here is to show that doctrine of Catholic church is a man made doctrine, based on people’s feelings and man made traditions, also that there are bunch of pagan origins in it clothed in Christianity so today we have worshiping Easter,goddess of fertility and spring and when one reads about this goddess one can find hares-or bunnies,eggs etc…- Bible teaches us not to mix pagan with the holy… I do not need lent or special day to celebrate resurrection of my Lord Jesus Christ for every day I sacrifice my own desires and my own will to be His will.I praise Him daily for the Sacrifice He did for me and the mankind.I do not need any saints nor dead people or Jesus’ mother to open the door to me when I call on the name of Jesus. He is ever willing to accept me and my prayers. My faith is when I call Jesus’ name believing that He is there for me just like He promised He would be. So I guess there is advantage in my case,I come to Jesus directly and He is the door to my salvation and in the case of many other Christians led by human teachings their door open some dead saints. Why don’t you come directly to Jesus without any helpers and mediators,directly to Him,have faith in that You are allowed to do that and He will readily accept you.
And to comment on what you said about kneeling in front of statues and all other things…all this practices are not having anything in common with the manner of worship of Apostles so I wander after your statements, does being a Catholic means being a Christian?
 
To happycatholic:)

I cannot believe you give me such a reply at all. This is funny but thank you maybe soon we will see eye to eye.
What tradition Apostles have been thought? Tradition of men or of God?
I can give you this verse if you like to see that there are different kinds of traditions,traditions of men(elders) God never aproved. Matthew 15 ;2-3…“ Why do Your desciples transgress the tradition of the elders? For they do not wash their hands when they eat bread ? But He answered and said to them „ Why do you also transgress the commandment of God because of YOUR TRADITION? „
Mark 7;8,9 For laying aside the commandment of God you hold the tradition of men-the washing of pitchers and cups and many other such things you do…all to well you reject the commandment of God that you may keep your tradition“ JUST LIKE PEOPLE DO TODAY.
Colossians 2;8 Beware lest anyone cheat you through philosophy and empty deceit according to the TRADITION OF MEN,according to the BASIC PRINCIPLES OF THE WORLD AND NOT ACCORDING TO CHRIST.
2. Thessalonians 3;6 But we command you brethren in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ,that you withdraw from EVERY BROTHER who walks disorderly and not according TO THE TRADITION HE RECEIVED FROM US.
So what you say is based on something you were lead to and not something you know otherwise you would not give me this verse. If someone teaches you that is not according to the tradition of apostles and to them it was given by God then it should not be part of your doctrines. Very clear
 
Because this is a thread in which the subject is Doug and his attacks on the Church we can also summize that it is SDA and their attacks on catholicism. And indeed that has been proven in the posts here.

To those who ‘THINK’ they are Sabbath Keepers: Please read this :


The Sabbath (or Shabbat, as it is called in Hebrew) is one of the best known and least understood of all Jewish observances. People who do not observe Shabbat think of it as a day filled with stifling restrictions, or as a day of prayer like the Christian Sabbath. But to those who observe Shabbat, it is a precious gift from G-d, a day of great joy eagerly awaited throughout the week, a time when we can set aside all of our weekday concerns and devote ourselves to higher pursuits. In Jewish literature, poetry and music, Shabbat is described as a bride or queen, as in the popular Shabbat hymn Lecha Dodi Likrat Kallah (come, my beloved, to meet the [Sabbath] bride). It is said “more than Israel has kept Shabbat, Shabbat has kept Israel.”

Shabbat is the most important ritual observance in Judaism. It is the only ritual observance instituted in the Ten Commandments. It is also the most important special day, even more important than Yom Kippur. This is clear from the fact that more aliyot (opportunities for congregants to be called up to the Torah) are given on Shabbat than on any other day.
Shabbat is primarily a day of rest and spiritual enrichment. The word “Shabbat” comes from the root Shin-Beit-Tav, meaning to cease, to end, or to rest. Shabbat is not specifically a day of prayer. Although we do pray on Shabbat, and spend a substantial amount of time in synagogue praying, prayer is not what distinguishes Shabbat from the rest of the week. Observant Jews pray every day, three times a day. See Jewish Liturgy. To say that Shabbat is a day of prayer is no more accurate than to say that Shabbat is a day of feasting: we eat every day, but on Shabbat, we eat more elaborately and in a more leisurely fashion. The same can be said of prayer on Shabbat.

Also, it talks about work on this website. Work as SDA’s would have it is not clocking in to your job and making money or causing anyone else to do so (shopping on Sabbath). In reality, Shabbat is not practiced in that way. There is MUCH more to it. You can’t even turn on a light. So no, you can’t work, but it’s not about not going to a “job”. There is a list of tasks which are defined as work in which something is created. Hence, the ceasing of creating which is observed in the Sabbath. And please, please note what it says about prayer on the Sabbath. I can take this only to mean it is not meant to be a day of worship as the SDA’s have fashioned it. Not to say they don’t attend services, they do.

**And notice the absence of this in the definition: Redeemer. **

Notice here it talks about freedom from wait for it…slavery in Egypt:

What does the Exodus have to do with resting on the seventh day? It’s all about freedom. As I said before, in ancient times, leisure was confined to certain classes; slaves did not get days off. Thus, by resting on Shabbat, we are reminded that we are free. But in a more general sense, Shabbat frees us from our weekday concerns, from our deadlines and schedules and commitments. During the week, we are slaves to our jobs, to our creditors, to our need to provide for ourselves; on Shabbat, we are freed from these concerns, much as our ancestors were freed from slavery in Egypt.

**It says nothing of Christ or freedom from sin. They have other ways of freeing themselves from sin. **

**This all tells us something. The Sabbath was given to Isreal (the Jews) as a gift of rest. Period. That’s it. It is so important to them because it is their rest from slavery and oppression. There STILL was no obsolvence of sin. No forgiveness. No way to God for us. **

Christ is the Way, the Truth, and The Life. Yet where is He in the Sabbath? You cannot write Him into the Sabbath if Moses didn’t. No where in the Bible does it say to worship Christ on the Sabbath. Christ did not tell us to remember him in the Sabbath. The one time he told us to remember him was in the Eucharist and that was done on Sunday.

Christ is our Savior from sin. He is our way to God. Yet if you worship on the Sabbath you are leaving him out. It’s clear by the very definition of the Sabbath from the ones for whom it was given.

You can call the Sabbath what you want and do as you want on Saturday and call it keeping the Sabbath. But the truth is you aren’t.
 
To happycatholic:)

I cannot believe you give me such a reply at all. This is funny but thank you maybe soon we will see eye to eye.
What tradition Apostles have been thought? Tradition of men or of God?
I can give you this verse if you like to see that there are different kinds of traditions,traditions of men(elders) God never aproved. Matthew 15 ;2-3…“ Why do Your desciples transgress the tradition of the elders? For they do not wash their hands when they eat bread ? But He answered and said to them „ Why do you also transgress the commandment of God because of YOUR TRADITION? „
Mark 7;8,9 For laying aside the commandment of God you hold the tradition of men-the washing of pitchers and cups and many other such things you do…all to well you reject the commandment of God that you may keep your tradition“ JUST LIKE PEOPLE DO TODAY.
Colossians 2;8 Beware lest anyone cheat you through philosophy and empty deceit according to the TRADITION OF MEN,according to the BASIC PRINCIPLES OF THE WORLD AND NOT ACCORDING TO CHRIST.
2. Thessalonians 3;6 But we command you brethren in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ,that you withdraw from EVERY BROTHER who walks disorderly and not according TO THE TRADITION HE RECEIVED FROM US.
So what you say is based on something you were lead to and not something you know otherwise you would not give me this verse. If someone teaches you that is not according to the tradition of apostles and to them it was given by God then it should not be part of your doctrines. Very clear
What?
 
To happycatholic:)

I cannot believe you give me such a reply at all. This is funny but thank you maybe soon we will see eye to eye.
What tradition Apostles have been thought? Tradition of men or of God?
I can give you this verse if you like to see that there are different kinds of traditions,traditions of men(elders) God never aproved. Matthew 15 ;2-3…“ Why do Your desciples transgress the tradition of the elders? For they do not wash their hands when they eat bread ? But He answered and said to them „ Why do you also transgress the commandment of God because of YOUR TRADITION? „
Mark 7;8,9 For laying aside the commandment of God you hold the tradition of men-the washing of pitchers and cups and many other such things you do…all to well you reject the commandment of God that you may keep your tradition“ JUST LIKE PEOPLE DO TODAY.
Colossians 2;8 Beware lest anyone cheat you through philosophy and empty deceit according to the TRADITION OF MEN,according to the BASIC PRINCIPLES OF THE WORLD AND NOT ACCORDING TO CHRIST.
2. Thessalonians 3;6 But we command you brethren in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ,that you withdraw from EVERY BROTHER who walks disorderly and not according TO THE TRADITION HE RECEIVED FROM US.
So what you say is based on something you were lead to and not something you know otherwise you would not give me this verse. If someone teaches you that is not according to the tradition of apostles and to them it was given by God then it should not be part of your doctrines. Very clear
You are silly. The Apostles were given Tradition BY GOD. They NEVER taught anything outside God’s word and will for us taught to them by God Himself and through Christ.

Hence your references above. Most of which refute the Pharisees and the Suddacees and their strict laws and the sins of others. Not the teachings of the Apostles which are one and the same as God’s through Christ.

Thanks for this one:
  1. Thessalonians 3;6 But we command you brethren in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ,that you withdraw from EVERY BROTHER who walks disorderly and not according TO THE TRADITION HE RECEIVED FROM US. 🙂
Maybe we are seeing eye-to-eye.
 
Happycatholic,

You still not proved me that doctrines of the Catholic church are based on Apostolic teachings but traditions of men and derive even from pagan origins. As I already mentioned Mary,none of the apostles worshiped the way Catholic church teaches people to worship,none of them used any rosaries,did not celebrate Easter,colored eggs and such… This doctrines are NOT DOCTRINES OF GOD NOR APOSTLES. I searched the whole Bible for eggs and easter bunny and I found none.So I am not sure from which apostle did you receive this traditions?
John was the last apostle and I am sure that he survived Mary still he never said anything about praying to her neither he did pray to her. So what about that tradition?
 
You are silly. The Apostles were given Tradition BY GOD. They NEVER taught anything outside God’s word and will for us taught to them by God Himself and through Christ.
Hence your references above. Most of which refute the Pharisees and the Suddacees and their strict laws and the sins of others. Not the teachings of the Apostles which are one and the same as God’s through Christ.
Thank you for the kind attribute silly:) that you treated me with…I welcome some more.
I do not see what did I say opposite of what you say in the statement above? I was showing you with the given verses that there were two kinds of traditions,of men/church,and of God which were followed by apostles. Such we have today traditions of men given by Catholic church and some others too and traditions and commandments of God. So I really do not see what were you actually trying to say,that you agree with me?👍
  1. Thessalonians 3;6 But we command you brethren in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ,that you withdraw from EVERY BROTHER who walks disorderly and not according TO THE TRADITION HE RECEIVED FROM US.-are you maybe in belief that Catholic church is mentioned in this verse above or what?!
 
HAPPYCATHOLIC,

What do you think. Were there any commandments or statues of God before Moses,before there were Israelities?
 
Any Gentile who joined also had to be circumcised.
Which then made him a Jew and subject to keeping the Sabbath.

Ah, but you said simply “a.) God called the Jews to be circumcised.” What I’m showing is that any Gentile who decided to worship God also had to be circumcised.
The Sabbath was made long before there ever was a Jew.
Who was called to keep it before there were Jews?

Again, your original statement limited the Sabbath to the Jews: “God called the circumcised Jews to keep the Sabbath holy.” And if your statement was true then the circumcised Jews from the time of Abraham kept the sabbath–and yet where do we see a “command” to do so? Finally, we need to ask how precise a “command” do you need? When you Father makes you in His image and then does something do you need to be told explicitly to do it as well? As Christians we often say that the institution of marriage bewteen a male and a female was made at the Garden of Eden–where do we see that “command”?
  1. Any Gentile who joined also had to keep the Sabbath.
Addressed.

Yes and no. Anypone who decides to worship God kept the Sabbath; i.e., all true believers kept the Sabbath.
  1. The commandment explicity states that any “stranger within thy gates” (whether Jew or not) had to keep the Sabbath.
It states that you should expect your guests to honor “YOUR” Sabbath.
Hmmm, in the example below you correct my statement, now it is my turn: “but the seventh day is a sabbath to the LORD your God; in it you shall not do any work, you, or your son, or your daughter, your manservant, or your maidservant, or your cattle, or the sojourner who is within your gates;”. There’s nothing about “expect your guests to honor.” They are not to work, period.
Notice it does not require you to circumcise your guest
Nowhere in the Bible does it say that anyone who is within your home to be circumcised. It does say that they are to keep the Sabbath.
  1. In over 100 languages (created at the Tower of Babel) the name of the seventh day of the week is known as “sabbath.”
This proves that they knew what day Sabbath was. I suspect God wanted even those outside Isreal to “know” the Sabbath. But there is still no command to “keep” the Sabbath outside of the Sons of Isreal.

Why should they know what the Sabbath was? Why would God tell anyone what day the Sabbath was (and that He had made it holy) unless He expeceted them to keep it? No explicit command and yet all mankind knew what day the Sabbath was?
  1. Jesus said that the Sabbath was made for man, not just the Jews.
No, that is not what He said. He said the Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath. That’s an odd passage coming from the most devout Jew that ever lived, huh.

Cute trick; I’m not falling for it.
 
Work as SDA’s would have it is not clocking in to your job and making money or causing anyone else to do so (shopping on Sabbath).
I don’t know of any SDA who does that. I have heard of doctors and nurses who donate whatever they earn from the hospitals to charity. As Jesus taught and showed by example it is lawful to do good on the Sabbath. Even in His day, if an ox fell into a ditch they would unhestatingly “work” to get it out.
In reality, Shabbat is not practiced in that way.
It doesn’t help when one looks at current cultural practices vs. looking at Scripture.
You can’t even turn on a light.
Hmmm, they didn’t even have lights in the biblical days.
There is a list of tasks which are defined as work in which something is created.
Jesus dealt with that when His critics asked why His disciples were shucking grain to eat.
I can take this only to mean it is not meant to be a day of worship as the SDA’s have fashioned it.
Who told you that SDA’s have “fashioned” the Sabbath into a day of prayer? It sounds like you have been lied to and want to know who did it.
 
Will somebody tell me is there any day to be worshiped if it is not to be Sabbath? If so in what manner do you worship if at all? Sunday keepers do you cook on the day of your rest,do you go to work? I used to go to the store on Sunday hoping it would be empty for people should be at church if they are Sunday keepers but no,the store was swarmed with people. So I was thinking maybe it would be good if priests would put their altars in the big superstores and do their mass there.
I do not see anyone gave me any Scripture where it says that Lord’s day means Sunday or the day of Sun and Sun worship. If you say God abolished Sabbath and we do not see that in the Scriptures so far but we can see that Sunday after the resurrection had no more value than it had before because it was addressed by apostles as the first day as before why then you would worship on any day at all? In my country all the stores must be closed on Sunday because the Catholic priests mingled with politicians too much as they always have. So little by little you like it or not the prophecy is being fulfilled,even with this world crisis,but you still do not see it…The one world currency,the one world order, soon they will discuss one world religion…
 
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