Drinking alcolhol

[Melchior]

Peace-bwu:

Wow, good post!
Has anyone been to a “dry” wedding reception? They are extremely boring! ( the three I attended were, anyway. Not quite the wedding receptions my family always has at the Knights of Columbus Hall, now that’s a party!)

I sure have! When I was in the Assemblies of God denomination my friends weddings were the most boring lame “celebrations” I have ever been to. Since they had 13 Commandments since God apparently forgot a few. The three additions were No drinking, no dancing and no movies.

Can you magine a wedding with sparkling cider no dancing and contemporary Christian music? :ehh: The highlight of one was a slideshow of the couples baby pictures. Simply an abomination of a celebration.

Mel

 

[Melchior]

SPOKENWORD:

Tell that to AA Members. Any sin will leave room for satan to enter in.

I would be happy to. Since drinking is not a sin, abusing acohol is. A mature Christians freedom, according to scripture, should not be dictated by the weaker brother. If you cannot handle alcohol then don’t drink. And those around you should be considerate. But they should not be expected to live by the weaker brothers standards on matters of freedom.

You bring up AA as if the fact that drunkards (I refuse to use responsibility absolving phsycho-jargon for sins i.e. “alcoholic”). exist is reason enough not to drink. Any abuse of God’s gifts is a sin. I would rather set a Christian example than to be an extremist. Red meat leads to heart disease. I can either abstain completely or I can eat it in moderation which is actually healthier provided I currently have a healthy heart. But I will not let someone from PETA force their sensibilities on me. You see my point?

In fact not drinking has been a bad witness in my life. Moderate drinking has allowed me more opportunites to share my faith rather than acting holier-than-thou. When I was an Pentacostal I went to our yearly Passover Seder at my uncles (I am half Jewish). I refused the ceremonial wine and made myself look like an idiot. I said I don’t drink because I’m a Christian. Well that went over fantastically .

Mel

 

[Poisson]

Melchior:

You bring up AA as if the fact that drunkards (I refuse to use responsibility absolving phsycho-jargon for sins i.e. “alcoholic”). exist is reason enough not to drink.

I guess this would be equivalent to saying we should all be celibate because prostitutes, adulterers and fornicators exist.

 

[Ham1]

nucatholic:

What does everyone think if an under 21 but over 18 young adult has a few beers in the presence and approval of older adults? I am 19 and have been to a few parties with either Lutherans (these guys drink more than we do!) and Catholics and no one thought it was a problem if I had a few cold ones. It was actually really enjoyable to just have a few and get to know some of my elders in the faith. I was then torn apart by a few Evangelicals who said that its against the law so it is wrong. I kind of see their point because we must obey the law of the land. Any thoughts?

No problem at all.

The drinking age in my family is graduate from high school. That means when you are in college you are drinking age.

In my experience, most of the problem drinkers were people who never had a drop growing up and went to college and tried to drink everything they could find.

Europeans let teens start drinking with family. It’s a good thing.

By the way, in my view the law of the land is unjust and violates natural law and you are not bound to obey it. But that’s just me.

 

[patg]

A good (and fairly brief) reference to drinking and the church:

scripturecatholic.com/drinking.html

Pat

 

[nucatholic]

Ham, I agree with you that it seems fine if it is responsible and there are of age adults present. However, I decide not to drink if it will cause my evangelical brothers to fall. If they aren’t there then bring on the brew!

 

[dredgtone]

10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.

Alcoholics are truly diseased and sick people. Their addiction is truly not their fault, I do not see why they should be punished for their disease.

 

[SPOKENWORD]

Melchior:

I would be happy to. Since drinking is not a sin, abusing acohol is. A mature Christians freedom, according to scripture, should not be dictated by the weaker brother. If you cannot handle alcohol then don’t drink. And those around you should be considerate. But they should not be expected to live by the weaker brothers standards on matters of freedom.

You bring up AA as if the fact that drunkards (I refuse to use responsibility absolving phsycho-jargon for sins i.e. “alcoholic”). exist is reason enough not to drink. Any abuse of God’s gifts is a sin. I would rather set a Christian example than to be an extremist. Red meat leads to heart disease. I can either abstain completely or I can eat it in moderation which is actually healthier provided I currently have a healthy heart. But I will not let someone from PETA force their sensibilities on me. You see my point?

In fact not drinking has been a bad witness in my life. Moderate drinking has allowed me more opportunites to share my faith rather than acting holier-than-thou. When I was an Pentacostal I went to our yearly Passover Seder at my uncles (I am half Jewish). I refused the ceremonial wine and made myself look like an idiot. I said I don’t drink because I’m a Christian. Well that went over fantastically .

Mel

Isnt it amazing that christians are different. You keep believing that moderate drinking allows you to share your faith. Thats what satan wants you to believe. Next youll tell me its okay to use foul language,or its okay to gamble,its okay to tell lies.Sounds like catholic teaching to me.

 

[Ann_Cheryl]

JesusIsTheWay:

Now when Jesus turned water into wine, the wine that was used back in the day was not fermented and had very few if any alcoholic properties… it was for ceremonial purposes… not the wine that was in the bars…

The wine back then was ALWAYS fermented. They did not have refrigeration. Jesus did not turn water into wine for a ceremony but because the bride and groom had no more to give there guest which would have been inhospitipal.

 

[Ann_Cheryl]

SPOKENWORD:

okay to gamble,i

So tell me why it is not okay to gamble??? What makes gambling in and of itself wrong. What commandment does it break?

 

[Poisson]

SPOKENWORD:

Isnt it amazing that christians are different. You keep believing that moderate drinking allows you to share your faith. Thats what satan wants you to believe. Next youll tell me its okay to use foul language,or its okay to gamble,its okay to tell lies.Sounds like catholic teaching to me.

You anti-alcohol people have still not been able to tell us how they prevented the grape juice from fermenting in Jesus’ days. Because if Jesus and the apostles drank wine at the last supper then moderate drinking should not be a problem.

 

[J_Chrysostomos]

SPOKENWORD:

Isnt it amazing that christians are different. You keep believing that moderate drinking allows you to share your faith. Thats what satan wants you to believe. Next youll tell me its okay to use foul language,or its okay to gamble,its okay to tell lies.Sounds like catholic teaching to me.

You’re obviously a Protestant (or something like it), as am I. Tell me, where does SCRIPTURE tell you that drinking is forbidden? Not fundamentalism’s “house rules”. The BIBLE.

Why did NO Christian group forbid alcohol before the nineteenth century? Why did Luther, Calvin, Wesley, and Spurgeon think it was ok to drink? Why has neither the Roman Catholic, Classic Protestant, or Orthodox Churches ever forbidden drinking? Why don’t the Church Fathers forbid it?

 

[SPOKENWORD]

Ann Cheryl:

So tell me why it is not okay to gamble??? What makes gambling in and of itself wrong. What commandment does it break?

Let us live by example. Did Christ gamble?.What did He do in the temple when they were selling wares and gambling in the temple? He got angry. Also when you gamble you are playing a game of chance which involves luck. Anything to do with our Lord does not involve luck,.our God is a God of certainity. The other thing is we should not do anything that may cause our brother to stumble.

 

[SPOKENWORD]

Ann Cheryl:

So tell me why it is not okay to gamble??? What makes gambling in and of itself wrong. What commandment does it break?

Let us live by example. Did Christ gamble?.What did He do in the temple when they were selling wares and gambling in the temple? He got angry. Also when you gamble you are playing a game of chance which involves luck. Anything to do with our Lord does not involve luck,.our God is a God of certainity. The other thing is we should not do anything that may cause our brother to stumble.

 

[MParedon]

I have a question. When Jesus turned water into wine, why didn’t he stop and say. “Well noooo, I’m not going to do this because I might cause someone to stumble.”

 

[SPOKENWORD]

J_Chrysostomos:

You’re obviously a Protestant (or something like it), as am I. Tell me, where does SCRIPTURE tell you that drinking is forbidden? Not fundamentalism’s “house rules”. The BIBLE.

Why did NO Christian group forbid alcohol before the nineteenth century? Why did Luther, Calvin, Wesley, and Spurgeon think it was ok to drink? Why has neither the Roman Catholic, Classic Protestant, or Orthodox Churches ever forbidden drinking? Why don’t the Church Fathers forbid it?

I personally do not see a problem with drinking a glass of wine at your meal. I have made it a rule in my life I will not drink a glass of wine outside of my dinner table. I will not put myself in a position where I may stumble. I also dont drink any other alchol. Especially if you are involved in any of our Lords ministry. Dont give satan that oppertunity to come in and cause you to fall.

 

[Catholic_Eagle]

One can drink wine but not in excess. If you drink or even eat excessively you make yourself easy prey for the devil. And remember what the Bible saith about the devil

I Peter 5.8
Brethren be sober,be vigilant; because your advesary the devil,as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour; whom resist ye, stedfast in the Faith But thou,O Lord have mercy upon us.

I Pet. 5.8 Fratres: Sobrii estote et vigilate : quia adversarius vester diabolus tamquam leo rugiens circuit, quaerens quem devoret:cui resistite fortes in fide Tu autem,Domine,misere nobis

 

[Ann_Cheryl]

SPOKENWORD:

Let us live by example. Did Christ gamble?.What did He do in the temple when they were selling wares and gambling in the temple? He got angry. Also when you gamble you are playing a game of chance which involves luck. Anything to do with our Lord does not involve luck,.our God is a God of certainity. The other thing is we should not do anything that may cause our brother to stumble.

The apostles threw lotts (a gambling game) to choose a new apostle. Not everything that Jesus did was recorded and I could not find that they were gambling in the temple? My point was that there is not a direct prohibition. Do you buy insurance? That is to me a gamble you are betting that something will go wrong and the Insurance company is betting it won’t.
The important thing is does it hurt someone? If the answer is yes, than you shouldn’t do it.

 

[bengal_fan]

nucatholic:

What does everyone think if an under 21 but over 18 young adult has a few beers in the presence and approval of older adults? I am 19 and have been to a few parties with either Lutherans (these guys drink more than we do!) and Catholics and no one thought it was a problem if I had a few cold ones. It was actually really enjoyable to just have a few and get to know some of my elders in the faith. I was then torn apart by a few Evangelicals who said that its against the law so it is wrong. I kind of see their point because we must obey the law of the land. Any thoughts?

if you read my earlier posts, you will know where i stand on alcohol in general so this one might come as a shock but…

i believe it is wrong to drink before you are 21. even in the presence of “responsible” adults. the law says it. if you say the drinking age is wrong (which i think it should be 19 but it’s not) and so you aren’t bound to obey it, then the argument follows that there are other “wrong” laws and we aren’t bound to obey them either. just because europe does it (as some one else pointed out) doesn’t mean we should. i think you should show some self restraint and abstain until you are 21. follow the God appointed leaders and their judgement. (i know some one is going to say, “well…do you speed because that is against the law…” well, no i don’t speed. i haven’t had a speeding ticket in 10 years and don’t see getting one anytime soon as i don’t exceed the speed limit (at least not on purpose as i might go 1 or 2 over once in a while because i can’t constantly watch the speedometer or i will wreck). the argument that the people who abuse alcohol are the ones who didn’t drink until they were 21 is not true. alcohol abuse (in most cases) starts early. you don’t need alcohol to fellowship and talk with others. it is a gift and this gift should wait until you are 21 in america. just like you have to wait until you are 16 to drive. i have seen a lot more destruction when it comes to underage drinking than anyone should see in a lifetime.

 

[SPOKENWORD]

Ann Cheryl:

The apostles threw lotts (a gambling game) to choose a new apostle. Not everything that Jesus did was recorded and I could not find that they were gambling in the temple? My point was that there is not a direct prohibition. Do you buy insurance? That is to me a gamble you are betting that something will go wrong and the Insurance company is betting it won’t.
The important thing is does it hurt someone? If the answer is yes, than you shouldn’t do it.

They did it once to chose a new apostle.The only thing they were giving up was themselves.