And it will be people with Elton John’s thinking who will one day stop at nothing to destroy The Church and have us all under the spell of the Anti-Christ.I want to apologise for my last message, I didn’t mean to insult anyone and I certianly don’t think people’s responses should be censored.
I just felt very angry and disappointed when I read the other messages that instead of people showing Elton John that he’s wrong about organised religion by saying, “Look, Elton, we represent organised religion and we’re not saying cruel, homophobic things,” many people did the opposite!!!
Surely christianity is supposed to be about forgiveness, healing and trying to treat people with understanding and humility whoever they are.
I can’t imagine Jesus slinging insults at sinners so even if you disagree with homosexuality, isn’t there a better and kinder way to react to it?
Also, don’t you think that Elton John has a point if in his experience, religious people have proven to be homophobic? I think this is something we need to address, something that we need to change.
You don’t have to accept homosexuality as a good thing but I think we do have to accept that it exists and Christians are not supposed to judge or persecute anyone. The bible says it’s wrong but maybe this is a little test from God to see just how Christian we really are. If you get to the pearly gates and the first question is, “Have you spent your life trying to treat everyone with understanding and kindness (EVEN homosexuals!)?”
What will your answer be?
How does one condone a homosexual lifestyle? What is the observable difference between someone who condones the lifestyle and someone who does not?I do believe in treating homosexuals with kindness, but I cannot condone their lifestyle. I would encourage them to live chaste lives, and so-called “gay marriage” is NOT chastity. I cannot, in good conscience, condone the sinful homosexual lifestyle.
Condoning the lifestyle means not saying anything against homosexuals living together, practicing homosexuality and wanting to be “married”. To not condone the lifestyle means to say that homosexuals must live chaste lives and not practice their behaviour.How does one condone a homosexual lifestyle? What is the observable difference between someone who condones the lifestyle and someone who does not?
If someone does not condone the lifestyle, what would they have to do differently in order to condone it?
Likewise, if someone does condone it, what would they have to do differently if they decided they would not condone it?
YOU are dead wrong. Truth does not equal Hate. I take offense that you use my statement as an example of hate.We, too, are promoting the hate we are against in this thread. I’m just trying to point out the irony, that’s all.
I’m sorry you feel that way. I’m not saying people on this thread DO hate him. I’m saying their words were hateFUL. By the way, which statement of yours did I use as an example of hate. I can’t find it, and I want to know what you’re referring to before I try to explain or defend myself.YOU are dead wrong. Truth does not equal Hate. I take offense that you use my statement as an example of hate.
I cannot condone the practice.Condoning the lifestyle means not saying anything against homosexuals living together, practicing homosexuality and wanting to be “married”. To not condone the lifestyle means to say that homosexuals must live chaste lives and not practice their behaviour.
This thought has my vote for the idea of the millenium.I think we should ban celebreties talking about anything other than what they actually got famous for.
You did provide an answer to my question. Is there something you want?HoppityRedux, I answered your question. Have you seen my response, or do you just not have an answer because I am supporting the traditions of the Church and the Scripture?:whacky:
I really don’t think most people who hate or use hateful wods recognize it.I’m sorry you feel that way. I’m not saying people on this thread DO hate him. I’m saying their words were hateFUL. By the way, which statement of yours did I use as an example of hate. I can’t find it, and I want to know what you’re referring to before I try to explain or defend myself.
Perhaps, but it is also true many who accuse others of hate speach have no idea what hate is or redefine hate to mean truth that pricks their conscience and makes them uncomfortable in their moral life.I really don’t think most people who hate or use hateful wods recognize it.
I doubt many Catholics agree with your idea they have an obligation to inform people about the gravity of their sins. This conjures up an image of Catholic scolds patrolling the streets looking for sin. (I presume sin extends beyond homosexual behavior and lying.)I cannot condone the practice.
To Christians and Catholics in particular, the normative act of homosexuality is sinful behavior. If a Catholic is aware that one is committing an act contrary to the love of God then it is an obligation of the Catholic motivated by charity to inform the person committing the act concerning the gravity of it. This is a work of mercy in order that the Catholic might participate in the reconciliation of the offender to his/her Father in heaven and thereby keep the offender from perishing in the eternal fire. This should be true of all Catholics when they encounter a person or persons engaged in activity contrary to the love of God, i.e. stealing, lying, deliberate hatred, etc.
As a parallel, Catholics should not condone the act of lying and if it has been committed, it is our obligation to inform the one or persons responsible for generating and/or perpetuating the falsehood. We ask that persons must live lives free from starting rumors and/or spreading falsehoods and certainly not to practice this deviant behavior. All are encouraged to refrain from this behavior just as all are encouraged to refrain from engaging in the homosexual act.
It appears that Sir Elton John has a problem with this particular sin or rather has an intolerance of those who hold to another view of the regular expression of homosexuality. We should pray for him and those like him who hold to a similar view. It is tragic that one as famous as he would seek to alienate those like myself who have enjoyed his music these past decades. Personally, I shall no longer listen to or purchase his music, not because he is an admitted homosexual (heck, I believe that Tchaikovsky also had difficulty with this particular sin yet I do so love The Nutcracker Suite!) but because Sir Elton John made public with his intolerant and perhaps bigoted views of organized religion and via association, his intolerance of people like myself who adhere to the tenants of one particular religion so organized.
True. Many are afraid of the mirror since they know they are right.Perhaps, but it is also true many who accuse others of hate speach have no idea what hate is or redefine hate to mean truth that pricks their conscience and makes them uncomfortable in their moral life.
I agree with you completely.I cannot condone the practice.
To Christians and Catholics in particular, the normative act of homosexuality is sinful behavior. If a Catholic is aware that one is committing an act contrary to the love of God then it is an obligation of the Catholic motivated by charity to inform the person committing the act concerning the gravity of it. This is a work of mercy in order that the Catholic might participate in the reconciliation of the offender to his/her Father in heaven and thereby keep the offender from perishing in the eternal fire. This should be true of all Catholics when they encounter a person or persons engaged in activity contrary to the love of God, i.e. stealing, lying, deliberate hatred, etc.
As a parallel, Catholics should not condone the act of lying and if it has been committed, it is our obligation to inform the one or persons responsible for generating and/or perpetuating the falsehood. We ask that persons must live lives free from starting rumors and/or spreading falsehoods and certainly not to practice this deviant behavior. All are encouraged to refrain from this behavior just as all are encouraged to refrain from engaging in the homosexual act.
It appears that Sir Elton John has a problem with this particular sin or rather has an intolerance of those who hold to another view of the regular expression of homosexuality. We should pray for him and those like him who hold to a similar view. It is tragic that one as famous as he would seek to alienate those like myself who have enjoyed his music these past decades. Personally, I shall no longer listen to or purchase his music, not because he is an admitted homosexual (heck, I believe that Tchaikovsky also had difficulty with this particular sin yet I do so love The Nutcracker Suite!) but because Sir Elton John made public with his intolerant and perhaps bigoted views of organized religion and via association, his intolerance of people like myself who adhere to the tenants of one particular religion so organized.
I will keep him in my prayers. Even though he is part of the “entertainment industry” and part of the media, I don’t think that it is impossible for him to repent of his evil ways and be forgiven by God. As it says in the Bible, “With God all things are possible.” We need to pray for him and for all other homosexual offenders, liars, thieves, fornicators, etc. that they will realize that they are sinning in the sight of God, that they will repent of their sins, and that they will live chaste and holiy lives in the future.Sadly, I’m not the least bit surprised.
Another day, another temper tantrum from the entertainment industry.
That might conjure up that image in your mind, but it would be a fallacy to think that just because a group does it in Saudi Arabi does it, doesn’t mean you have to do it that way. I’m sure you could conjure up an image of some one posting something to a forum on the computer or someone telling friends how he feels when the subject is brought up.I doubt many Catholics agree with your idea they have an obligation to inform people about the gravity of their sins. This conjures up an image of Catholic scolds patrolling the streets looking for sin. (I presume sin extends beyond homosexual behavior and lying.)
Saudi Arabia has such an organization. It is called the Committee To Prohibit Vice and Promote Virtue, otherwise known as Muttawa. They do patrol the streets scolding people.
I want to apologise for my last message, I didn’t mean to insult anyone and I certianly don’t think people’s responses should be censored.
Maybe you should consider waiting until you’re calm to post a reply. That’s what I do when I read something that makes me upset.
I just felt very angry and disappointed when I read the other messages that instead of people showing Elton John that he’s wrong about organised religion by saying, “Look, Elton, we represent organised religion and we’re not saying cruel, homophobic things,” many people did the opposite!!!
I agree some people said inappropriate things.
Surely christianity is supposed to be about forgiveness, healing and trying to treat people with understanding and humility whoever they are.
You’ll find I said nothing cruel or offensive. You’ll also find I said nothing that would condone homosexuality either.
I can’t imagine Jesus slinging insults at sinners so even if you disagree with homosexuality, isn’t there a better and kinder way to react to it?
Of course. But people don’t always react kindly, as your previous response indicates. But we just have to try harder.
Also, don’t you think that Elton John has a point if in his experience, religious people have proven to be homophobic? I think this is something we need to address, something that we need to change.
His point is that he can’t rise above petty hate, like of a lot people, some Christians included. But to “address” the issue in a way that would satisfy Elton John and other gays we’d have to tell them their lifestyle was okay and start blessing their “unions.” That is not happening.
You don’t have to accept homosexuality as a good thing but I think we do have to accept that it exists and Christians are not supposed to judge or persecute anyone. The bible says it’s wrong but maybe this is a little test from God to see just how Christian we really are. If you get to the pearly gates and the first question is, “Have you spent your life trying to treat everyone with understanding and kindness (EVEN homosexuals!)?”
We are to preach the Gospel, which includes telling people what is and is not sin. We don’t have to judge people or persecute them to do that. We are all sinners, of which I am the worst. May God show His mercy to all of us.
I don’t care what people in Saudi Arabia are doing. As a Catholic, I believe that if I do not warn people about sinful things that they are participating in, that I am an accessory to their sin. I love all of God’s creation, and that includes homosexuals, but I cannot condone homosexual behaviour. If persons with homosexual inclinations live chaste lives, then they are doing what is good and right. If they are practicing homosexual lifestyles, then I must, in good conscience, inform them of the errors of their ways. It is possible for persons with homosexual inclinations to live chastely, just as it is possible for persons who are “straight” to live chastely. I, myself, am a single woman, and I am straight. I find many single men to be attractive, but I choose to not act on lust. There is no difference between straight or gay persons. If one is not married, he or she must not act upon lustful desires. God will provide the graces needed to resist the temptation. We just need to pray to Him, and resist the devil, who will flee from us when we resist him.That might conjure up that image in your mind, but it would be a fallacy to think that just because a group does it in Saudi Arabi does it, doesn’t mean you have to do it that way. I’m sure you could conjure up an image of some one posting something to a forum on the computer or someone telling friends how he feels when the subject is brought up.