Eternity and foreknowledge

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opusAquinas

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God is eternal.
God is pure act.
If the world can be created but eternal then when did God think us up?
So God has always thought of us?
So is the very thought of us eternal?
 
opusAquinas said:
God is eternal.
God is pure act.
If the world can be created but eternal then when did God think us up?
So God has always thought of us?
So is the very thought of us eternal?
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“when” and “always” are linked to time and are meaningless words in the context of God. So, the first two questions are unanswerable.
Since God is immutable, all of God’s thought is unchangeable.
 
davidv said:
“when” and “always” are linked to time and are meaningless words in the context of God. So, the first two questions are unanswerable.
Since God is immutable, all of God’s thought is unchangeable.
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Right, so we were eternally conceived but created.
 
davidv said:
Since my conception occurred within time, it not clear that this is a logical conclusion.
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God exists outside of time. But the past and the future are all fixed - as in for example the 1st and 2nd coming of Our Lord.

The thought of us is eternal and so our eternal destiny. So yes we were created but the thought of us and our destiny eternal.
 
opusAquinas said:
God is eternal.
God is pure act.
If the world can be created but eternal then when did God think us up?
So God has always thought of us?
So is the very thought of us eternal?
Click to expand...
GOD is eternal 👍

The world/Universe is NOT eternal. They are finite 👍

“When” to GOD cannot apply HE is in the Eternal now. HE is outside time and space and sees all moments of our time at once.

“When to us” (the world/Universe) according to the latests data measured from the satellites and probes sent into space goes back roughly 13.8 Billion years ago. That is the age of the Universe. You can read about it here:

map.gsfc.nasa.gov/universe/uni_age.html
 
JerryZ said:
GOD is also eternal 👍

The world/Universe is NOT eternal. They are finite 👍

“When” to GOD cannot apply HE is in the Eternal now. HE is outside time and space and sees all moments of our time at once.

“When to us” (the world/Universe) according to the latests data measured from the satellites and probes sent into space goes back roughly 13.8 Billion years ago. That is the age of the Universe. You can read about it here:

map.gsfc.nasa.gov/universe/uni_age.html
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Thomas Aquinas said it is possible the universe is eternal but created.
Why? God exists outside of time.

Also, you notice that big bang theory often does not stated as that there was absolutely nothing. But that there was something a very small something that expanded to form the universe.
 
CCC 600:

“To God, all moments of time are present in their immediacy.”
 
Bookcat said:
CCC 600:

“To God, all moments of time are present in their immediacy.”
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Right. So… God knew about us from eternity. He knew about us from eternity planned our existence from eternity. The thought of us is eternal?
 
opusAquinas said:
Right. So… God knew about us from eternity. He knew about us from eternity planned our existence from eternity. The thought of us is eternal?
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If God is eternal, His thought is eternal. Was this ever doubted?
 
opusAquinas said:
Right. So… God knew about us from eternity. He knew about us from eternity planned our existence from eternity. The thought of us is eternal?
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Your approaching God somewhat as if God were a creature in time…

God does is more unlike us than like us.

God does not know as we know.
 
davidv said:
What do you mean? Knowledge does not equal cause.
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God is an artist. A potter. He makes different pots for different uses. Ultimately each pot represents something about the potter. Tells us something.
Also, did God both eternally conceive of a design and a use?
He may have permitted the creation of different pots as opposed to specifically plan the creation like the Blessed Virgin Mary. But He assigns a use for everyone whether He specifically wanted or did not want them to be created.
 
davidv said:
What do you mean? Knowledge does not equal cause.
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True, but preordination of all future events does. That is made abundantly clear in the very detailed and approved Catholic Encyclopedia.

John
 
oldcelt said:
True, but preordination of all future events does. That is made abundantly clear in the very detailed and approved Catholic Encyclopedia.

John
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I think you are saying since God sees the future and that’s the same as sending someone to hell. It is not.
 
opusAquinas said:
I think you are saying since God sees the future and that’s the same as sending someone to hell. It is not.
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No, I’m saying that the Christian God, based on Catholic teaching, preordains (decree, rule, order, command, enjoin, lay/set down, establish, dictate, legislate, prescribe, pronounce) all future events. That is causation. What follows should be obvious.
 
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