R
rinnie
Guest
Sorry my mistake. I did not mean grace alone you said we were justified by faith alone. My mistake.
- Status
M
Marsha_Adams
Guest
Rinnie:
OSAS advocates always like to quote Paul. But here are some quotes from Jesus that prove “believe + nothing” is false.
Mark 10:17And when he was gone forth into the way, there came one running, and kneeled to him, and asked him, Good Master, what shall I do that I may inherit eternal life? 18And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God.
19Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Defraud not, Honour thy father and mother.
20And he answered and said unto him, Master, all these have I observed from my youth.
21Then Jesus beholding him loved him, and said unto him, One thing thou lackest: go thy way, sell whatsoever thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, take up the cross, and follow me.
Luke 10:25And, behold, a certain lawyer stood up, and tempted him, saying, Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?
26He said unto him, What is written in the law? how readest thou?
27And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself.
28And he said unto him, Thou hast answered right: this do, and thou shalt live.
John 6:53Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you.
54Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.
55For my flesh is meat indeed, and my blood is drink indeed.
OSAS advocates always like to quote Paul. But here are some quotes from Jesus that prove “believe + nothing” is false.
Mark 10:17And when he was gone forth into the way, there came one running, and kneeled to him, and asked him, Good Master, what shall I do that I may inherit eternal life? 18And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God.
19Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Defraud not, Honour thy father and mother.
20And he answered and said unto him, Master, all these have I observed from my youth.
21Then Jesus beholding him loved him, and said unto him, One thing thou lackest: go thy way, sell whatsoever thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, take up the cross, and follow me.
Luke 10:25And, behold, a certain lawyer stood up, and tempted him, saying, Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?
26He said unto him, What is written in the law? how readest thou?
27And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself.
28And he said unto him, Thou hast answered right: this do, and thou shalt live.
John 6:53Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you.
54Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.
55For my flesh is meat indeed, and my blood is drink indeed.
M
Marsha_Adams
Guest
paulabbe.net/?p=393
This link will take you to an interesting article “Justification by Faith vs. Justification by Faith Alone.”
This link will take you to an interesting article “Justification by Faith vs. Justification by Faith Alone.”
A
always_gr8ful
Guest
I should have know that “justified by faith alone” was some kind of doctrain, because the question made no sense to me. We are justified THROUGH Christ, and Christ alone.
R
Roman_Catholic_1
Guest
Catholics know this:
And there is salvation in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given among men by which we must be saved. Acts 4:12
You did not know that faith alone was a doctrine (a protestant one of course)? Honestly?
God bless
A
always_gr8ful
Guest
Hi Marsha!
This statement of yours is amazing to me. Are you saying that Paul wasn’t speaking the truth? Should we discount the gospel to the Gentiles, toss it all out because YOU think that Jesus said something different?
Didn’t you tell me that you believed ALL the Bible?
IF you believe ALL the God’s Word, than it is your DUTY to reconcile the Gospel, at least for yourself! Do you want the Truth, or do you want to be right? I counted four times in this scripture you posted (below) where Jesus said “believe” (plus nothing) to be saved, but you only posted a line that made you “right”.
26 Jesus answered them and said, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Ye seek me, not because ye saw the miracles, but because ye did eat of the loaves, and were filled.
27 Labour not for the meat which perisheth, but for that meat which endureth unto everlasting life, which the Son of man shall give unto you: for him hath God the Father sealed.
28 Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God?
29 Jesus answered and said unto them, **This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent. **
30 They said therefore unto him, What sign shewest thou then, that we may see, and believe thee? what dost thou work?
31 Our fathers did eat manna in the desert; as it is written, He gave them bread from heaven to eat.
32 Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Moses gave you not that bread from heaven; but my Father giveth you the true bread from heaven.
33 For the bread of God is he which cometh down from heaven, and giveth life unto the world.
34 Then said they unto him, Lord, evermore give us this bread.
35 And Jesus said unto them, I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall never hunger; and he that believeth on me shall never thirst.
36 But I said unto you, That ye also have seen me, and believe not.
37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.
39 And this is the Father’s will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.
41 The Jews then murmured at him, because he said, I am the bread which came down from heaven.
42 And they said, Is not this Jesus, the son of Joseph, whose father and mother we know? how is it then that he saith, I came down from heaven?
43 Jesus therefore answered and said unto them, Murmur not among yourselves.
44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.
45 It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.
46 Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he which is of God, he hath seen the Father.
47** Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life**.
48 I am that bread of life.
49 Your fathers did eat manna in the wilderness, and are dead.
50 This is the bread which cometh down from heaven, that a man may eat thereof, and not die.
51 I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.
52 The Jews therefore strove among themselves, saying, How can this man give us his flesh to eat?
53 Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you.
54 Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.
55 For my flesh is meat indeed, and my blood is drink indeed.
56 He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, dwelleth in me, and I in him.
57As the living Father hath sent me, and I live by the Father: so he that eateth me, even he shall live by me.
58 This is that bread which came down from heaven: not as your fathers did eat manna, and are dead: he that eateth of this bread shall live for ever.
59 These things said he in the synagogue, as he taught in Capernaum.
60 Many therefore of his disciples, when they had heard this, said, This is an hard saying; who can hear it?
61 When Jesus knew in himself that his disciples murmured at it, he said unto them, Doth this offend you?
62 What and if ye shall see the Son of man ascend up where he was before?
63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.
Now if this isn’t Jesus speaking figuratively like he did when he told the woman at the well He was Living Water, than how do you explain Jesus telling the people that by eating the loaves the day before they “were full”, but that “they believed not”? How do you reconcile the many times Jesus says “Believe” plus nothing?
A
always_gr8ful
Guest
10 "Jesus answered and said unto her, If thou knewest the gift of God, and who it is that saith to thee, Give me to drink; thou wouldest have asked of him, and he would have given thee living water.
11 The woman saith unto him, Sir, thou hast nothing to draw with, and the well is deep: from whence then hast thou that living water?
12 Art thou greater than our father Jacob, which gave us the well, and drank thereof himself, and his children, and his cattle?
13 Jesus answered and said unto her, Whosoever drinketh of this water shall thirst again:
14 But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life."
~John 4:10-14
Please don’t tell me that Catholics have some ritual where they drink Living Water unto everlasting life. That would be just a bit much to bear today, this most sacred of days.
11 The woman saith unto him, Sir, thou hast nothing to draw with, and the well is deep: from whence then hast thou that living water?
12 Art thou greater than our father Jacob, which gave us the well, and drank thereof himself, and his children, and his cattle?
13 Jesus answered and said unto her, Whosoever drinketh of this water shall thirst again:
14 But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life."
~John 4:10-14
Please don’t tell me that Catholics have some ritual where they drink Living Water unto everlasting life. That would be just a bit much to bear today, this most sacred of days.
A
always_gr8ful
Guest
Honestly. The only way I am saved AND justified is through the Blood of Jesus Christ. How do I know? Because the Bible tells me so.
R
Roman_Catholic_1
Guest
I’m not asking that. Have you never heard of the protestant belief of faith alone before this?Honestly. The only way I am saved AND justified is through the Blood of Jesus Christ. How do I know? Because the Bible tells me so.
God bless
A
always_gr8ful
Guest
To be clear, when I say “the Blood of Jesus Christ” I’m not talking about communion. I am talking about His death and resurrection. Jesus, the Perfect Lamb, died for my sins, shed His Blood for me so that believing, I have eternal life and am counted as a child of God, fully righteous in His sight THROUGH Christ.Honestly. The only way I am saved AND justified is through the Blood of Jesus Christ. How do I know? Because the Bible tells me so.
A
always_gr8ful
Guest
That’s exactly what I thought you were asking and no, I have never heard of that doctrine.
A
always_gr8ful
Guest
Quite frankly, I think that talking about doctrines is kind-of messed up (no offense to any doctrinees). I mean, what does GOD say? Do we want to learn the doctrines of man, or the plain teaching of the Word of God?
R
Roman_Catholic_1
Guest
A
always_gr8ful
Guest
What belief? The doctrine of justified by faith?
The question itself is odd. We are justified THROUGH Christ.
R
Roman_Catholic_1
Guest
What is it about the statement:
Salvation through faith alone in Jesus Christ
That you do not agree with?
God bless
A
always_gr8ful
Guest
Ahh Ha Ha! You want me to play a doctrine game! That’s why you put the word “faith” in there. But I don’t want to play. It’s hard enough trying to get people to see the plain Truth of the Word without confusing things with man-made doctrine. And we all know who the father of confusion is.
My salvation is through the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ, and Jesus Christ alone. I am saved through Him. I am justified through Him. Period. His work was finished. I can add nothing to it, and what an incredible insult to Him to think that I can!
R
Roman_Catholic_1
Guest
Usually it is the word alone that gives people problems.
So faith has nothing to do with salvation? Repentance? Nothing?
God bless
A
always_gr8ful
Guest
Marsha posted the one-liner, and I posted the entire scripture where Jesus says “Believe” plus nothing. If you want to take what is clearly figurative speech and turn it into a man-made doctrine, you do so at His advisement that your worship will be in vain.
(Jesus speaking)“Ye hypocrites, well did Esaias prophesy of you, saying,
This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips; but their heart is far from me. But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.” ~Matthew 15:7-9
Interestingly, the prophet Isaiah used the words “mouth” and “lips”.Could Isaiah have meant more than just talking? I wonder…
A
a_burger
Guest
A
always_gr8ful
Guest
Again, taking one line of scripture to try and prove man-made doctrine which flies in the face of all other scripture. So let’s have a look keeping in mind that Jesus had not yet gone to the Cross:
16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
Now right here Jesus could have said like he has said so many times “Believe” (plus nothing), but He is using this seemingly righteous man to make a point. Reading on…
18 He saith unto him, Which? (which commandment?) Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,
19 Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
20 The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept from my youth up: what lack I yet?
21 Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me.
22 But when the young man heard that saying, he went away sorrowful: for he had great possessions.
23 Then said Jesus unto his disciples, Verily I say unto you, That a rich man shall hardly enter into the kingdom of heaven.
24 And again I say unto you, It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.
25 When his disciples heard it, they were exceedingly amazed, saying, Who then can be saved?
26 But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible.
This Jew living under the law at the time of this story was righteous in his own eyes until he realized he was unwilling to part with his possessions. Jesus used this man to show us that even keeping all the commandments is not enough in the sight of God, and that is why we need Him ALONE (“with men this is impossible”) in order to be saved.
If you want to make a law out of keeping the commandments in order to gain salvation, then you must sell all you have and follow Jesus. Sounds outrageous, right? Well, that’s what you are saying! Jesus said keeping the commandments wasn’t enough. So when’s the big sale?
- Status