Evangelicals Will Be Extinct Within Ten Years

[CWBetts]

This reminds me of a point I want to bring up but I don’t know if it has been discussed already. always gr8ful, where did you get the Bible from? Yes, you got it from a bookstore, but where did the Bible originate? The Catholic Church is where the Bible originated. You can pontificate all you want about how the Holy Spirit simply guided some believers in the right direction, but that doesn’t change the fact that they were all Catholic. I’m sure you don’t belive me, but Early Church Fathers back me up. Heck, even Martin Luther said that all Protestants owe a debt to the Catholic Church for discovering the Bible. So let’s face it. The Catholic Church has God’s Divine Authority no matter how you slice it. This should show you why we believe the Church to be infallible; if the Church is guided by God, and we go to the Church, are we not going to God as well, through the Church? God usually acts in society through men. Look at Jesus, Paul, and the saints, all who were important figures of their time. They were all humans. If God works 99.99% of the time through our fellow man, wouldn’t it make sense for God to install a place on Earth where us humans have direct access to Him and His Presence? Hence, the Catholic Church

***As well, if you claim to accept the Bible as Divinely Inspired, you also claim to accept the Catholic Church’s authority. It was the Catholic Church that decided which books of Scripture were “God-breathed” and which weren’t. ***This gave us 73 books of the Bible, ALL Divinely Inspired, but then Protestants reduced that to 66, but THAT’S ANOTHER THREAD!

This argument does no good because Always will not accept the simple fact the the Bible is a Catholic book.

 

[rinnie]

This argument does no good because Always will not accept the simple fact the the Bible is a Catholic book.

Oh thats right. That was another question she would not answer. Or could not.

 

[josie_L]

Wow. Y’all are really indoctrinated into this stuff, aren’t you? You all say the same thing like it’s Gospel. Well, it’s not. In the words of another poster -“what you have is a different Gospel and therefore must be rejected”. BTW, please point out the Catholic Jews and where they worship.

You know always grateful you can be very rude!!! We are Christians as much as you are.

No, hence the Holy Spirit. God is inside of those who believe. We don’t have to go somewhere to be in His presence because Jesus said “For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.”~Matthew 18:20, so He is here with us in this discussion. Jesus also said “And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.”~Matthew 28:20

The last bit, was a passage directed at the apostles who in their love for Christ set forth to create his Church, otherwise known (literally), as the “one, holy, Catholic, apostolic” church, which is, and you know it’s coming, the CC. He is with his bride (notice the singularity of that word) always. And he is present in every tabernacle of every CC there is.

No, I don’t have to accept the Church’s authority. My God is not some God-in-a-box the Church can hang their hat on. He is All-Powerful, All-Knowing and Sovereign. **He is God **Almighty and can do anything and use anyone He wants for His purpose. In this case, the choosing of scriptures that make up the Perfect Word of God.

Yet, he chose the CC to compile the Word of God. Not you Always Grateful, nor for that matter any other Protestant.

 

[TheWhoFreak]

Wow. Y’all are really indoctrinated into this stuff, aren’t you? You all say the same thing like it’s Gospel. Well, it’s not. In the words of another poster -“what you have is a different Gospel and therefore must be rejected”. BTW, please point out the Catholic Jews and where they worship.

No, I say YOU are indoctrinated falsely always gr8ful. Please prove to me where the Bible says that the Holy Spirit compiled it or some other heresy. And don’t shove 2 Timothy 3:16 in my face either. That simply says that Scripture is authoritative and necessary to know what God wants. Saying that it is our only rule of Faith is unbiblical and heretical. That’s reading into the text simply what isn’t there.

Bold, extra large text comes across as screaming in a forum, btw.

I could care less. If I need to use bold/big font to emphasise a point, I will.

No, hence the Holy Spirit. God is inside of those who believe. We don’t have to go somewhere to be in His presence because Jesus said “For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.”~Matthew 18:20, so He is here with us in this discussion. Jesus also said “And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.”~Matthew 28:20

Really? I am not saying that the CC is the only place to be in the LORD’s presence, I am saying that it is the best one. A Protestant can experience God in a service just fine. God left his representative on Earth as the Pope, and by extension, the CC. When you enter a Catholic Church you are in God’s house. Built by Christ and maintained by the Priests, Deacons, and Bishops. When you enter a Protestant Church, you are walking into a building that happens to have Jesus’s presence simply because of a Biblical promise.

No, I don’t have to accept the Church’s authority. My God is not some God-in-a-box the Church can hang their hat on. He is All-Powerful, All-Knowing and Sovereign. He is God Almighty and can do anything and use anyone He wants for His purpose. In this case, the choosing of scriptures that make up the Perfect Word of God.

Ooh! A straw man! The God of Catholicism is the same as your God always gr8ful. To say that the CC God is God-in-a-box, is to say that we only experience God in Church. That is incredibly untrue. I experience God in many places, like at school, or home, or at a friends house. Simply because the CC stresses the importance of the Mass doesn’t mean God limits His presence to the Mass.

"When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your sinful nature, God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins, having canceled the written code, with its regulations, that was against us and that stood opposed to us; he took it away, nailing it to the cross.
~Col. 2:13-14

Yet Galatians 5:4 mentions believers falling from Grace. Unless you reconcile those 2 statements, your argument of OSAS is contradictory.

because by one sacrifice he has made perfect forever those who are being made holy

That’s Catholic actually. The Word says they are being made perfect. It does not say that Christ made them perfect instantly. You incorrectly view Sancitification as an instant event. Scripture (as illustrated above) says otherwise. Sanctification is a life-long process, continuing after death in Purgatory, where we are cleansed in the Holy Love of God, being made ready for Heaven.

 

[always_gr8ful]

You never answed my question Always, you danced around it and repeated it, But tell me how do we do the will of the Father, if not by following his commandments. I am going to have to pull a protestant here now. Scripture please. Please show me the scripture that says you do not have to follow the ten commandments to get into heaven. No more beating around the bush. Just plain true, pure scripture. thank you.

I’m starting to enjoy you saying I never answered your questions. This is good stuff, worth repeating. Here it is again:

So what did Jesus mean when He said “Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.” Again, scripture is clear:

**"Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God?

Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent."
~John 6:28-29**

"He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him."
~John 3:36

We obey completely the will of the Father to believe in Jesus Christ alone for eternal salvation because we will never be perfect and fit to stand before Him. It is only through Jesus alone that all sins, past, present and future are forgiven. If we don’t believe this, we have not done or are doing the will of the Father.

“Lord, Lord have we not prophesied, cast out demons, and done many wonders in Your name” are most likely are people who are may have been baptized, prayed and witnessed and done what they thought were many deeds which made them think that they were probably saved. Notice that Jesus does not question whether they actually did such works. Yet He rebukes them for not doing the Father’s will and He denies them kingdom entrance. Those who do not believe in Christ alone for their salvation have failed to do the will of the Father.

It is a sad possibility that some in the “works are the will of the Father” camp have never placed their trust in Christ alone. They may go to their graves preaching passages like Matthew 7:21-23 only to find out that Jesus was talking about them, not someone else.
I hope and pray that such people wake up before it is too late.

Do you believe in the Jesus of the Bible? The Lamb of God that takes away all our sins? The One who justified us and made us perfect and righteous though His death and resurrection so that we may stand before Him holy and perfect?

One last thing. Jesus said “And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you”. Never knew you.

 

[always_gr8ful]

IRONIC isnt it. Always show me where Jesus said when he died on the cross he paid for past, present and future sins. We have to do nothing.

Then please explain to me the scripture Col 2:13-14

All means ALL, Rinnie. Study it - look it up in the Greek. The whole enchilada!
Col. 2:13-14, when we were dead in our sins, Christ died for us and made us alive through Him. He forgave us ALL our sins, canceling out (blotting out) the written code (the ordinances, regulations, rules) that stood opposed to us ( no man is justified by the law in the sight of God (Gal.:3 ) and took it out of the way (no longer an issue) and nailed it to the Cross (Jesus did it, and He did it ALONE through His death and resurrection)

We have to do nothing.

That’s not true. You don’t get Salvation without belief. It’s a choice, and I pray you make that choice.
Jesus, the Perfect Lamb of God died for you, doing for you what you could never, ever do for yourself. He did it ALL. He said “It is finished.” THIS is the Jesus of the Bible.

 

[always_gr8ful]

This argument does no good because Always will not accept the simple fact the the Bible is a Catholic book.

You got that right! The Bible is the very Word of God!

And I believe every Word He says.

 

[CWBetts]

You got that right! The Bible is the very Word of God!

And I believe every Word He says.

You don’t believe every worrd He says, becuase you reject Sacred Tradition.

 

[always_gr8ful]

Yet Galatians 5:4 mentions believers falling from Grace. Unless you reconcile those 2 statements, your argument of OSAS is contradictory.

Do you not see that scripture is talking about YOU?

“Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.”
~Galatians 5:4

You think because he says you have fallen from grace, that GOD took it away?! NO! You separated yourself from Christ, pushed Him away with both hands by trying to justify yourself by your works, like keeping the commandments (the law).

(Lord let them hear and understand)

1 Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.

2 Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing.

3 For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law.

4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.

5 For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith.

6 For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love.
~Galatians 5:1-6

Galatians 5:1-6 (Amplified Bible)

1 IN [this] freedom Christ has made us free [and completely liberated us]; stand fast then, and do not be hampered and held ensnared and submit again to a yoke of slavery [which you have once put off].
2 Notice, it is I, Paul, who tells you that if you receive circumcision, Christ will be of no profit (advantage, avail) to you [a]for if you distrust Him, you can gain nothing from Him].

3 I once more protest and testify to every man who receives circumcision that he is under obligation and bound to practice the whole of the Law and its ordinances.

4 If you seek to be justified and declared righteous and to be given a right standing with God through the Law, you are brought to nothing and so separated (severed) from Christ. You have fallen away from grace (from God's gracious favor and unmerited blessing).

5 For we, [not relying on the Law but] through the [Holy] Spirit's [help], by faith anticipate and wait for the blessing and good for which our righteousness and right standing with God [our **conformity to His will in purpose, thought, and action, causes us] to hope.

6 For [if we are] in Christ Jesus, neither circumcision nor uncircumcision counts for anything, but only faith activated and energized and expressed and working through love.

 

[josie_L]

All means ALL, Rinnie. Study it - look it up in the Greek. The whole enchilada!

Hmmmmm, I’m hungry now!!!

Col. 2:13-14, when we were dead in our sins, Christ died for us and made us alive through Him. He forgave us ALL our sins, canceling out (blotting out) the written code (the ordinances, regulations, rules) that stood opposed to us ( no man is justified by the law in the sight of God (Gal.:3 ) and took it out of the way (no longer an issue) and nailed it to the Cross (Jesus did it, and He did it ALONE through His death and resurrection)

Whoopee, I never have to repent or say sorry to God whenever I commit a sin (which being human I’m bound to commit), and all because I’ve been forgiven beforehand by Jesus.

We have to do nothing.

Wow, even better, I don’t have to do a single thing except sit on my *** all day long. Being a saint is easssssssy.

That’s not true. You don’t get Salvation without belief. It’s a choice, and I pray you make that choice.

But I thought I didn’t have to do anything.

Jesus, the Perfect Lamb of God died for you, doing for you what you could never, ever do for yourself. He did it ALL. He said “It is finished.” THIS is the Jesus of the Bible.

And because Jesus is perfect, I’m perfect too, I’m just like Jesus (I guess I don’t have to carry the cross to wear the crown afterall ).

 

[always_gr8ful]

That’s Catholic actually. The Word says they are being made perfect. It does not say that Christ made them perfect instantly. You incorrectly view Sancitification as an instant event. Scripture (as illustrated above) says otherwise. Sanctification is a life-long process, continuing after death in Purgatory, where we are cleansed in the Holy Love of God, being made ready for Heaven.

That’s Catholic actually

I’m glad to hear that Catholics can agree on some of the Word of God!

You couldn’t have gotten from my posts that I view sanctification as an instant event, because it’s not and I don’t hold that unbiblical view. So please be careful when talking about others and stating something as fact.

Being made holy is a progressive sanctification, NOT sinless perfection. We will not be holy and perfect until we stand before Him:

“So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.”
~1 Cor. 15:52-54

 

[always_gr8ful]

Col. 2:13-14, when we were dead in our sins, Christ died for us and made us alive through Him. He forgave us ALL our sins, canceling out (blotting out) the written code (the ordinances, regulations, rules) that stood opposed to us ( no man is justified by the law in the sight of God (Gal.:3 ) and took it out of the way (no longer an issue) and nailed it to the Cross (Jesus did it, and He did it ALONE through His death and resurrection)

Whoopee, I never have to repent or say sorry to God whenever I commit a sin (which being human I’m bound to commit), and all because I’ve been forgiven beforehand by Jesus.

If you never repented or were sorry for your sins, I would question if you had the Holy Spirit living on the inside of you, and it you really loved God.

We have to do nothing.

That’s right. Jesus did it all, once and for all. You don’t HAVE to do anything, but if the Holy Spirit is living on the inside of you, you would WANT to please God.

Wow, even better, I don’t have to do a single thing except sit on my *** all day long. Being a saint is easssssssy.

Yep. You could do that. But is that what you WANT to do?

That’s not true. You don’t get Salvation without belief. It’s a choice, and I pray you make that choice.
But I thought I didn’t have to do anything.

If you choose to do nothing, you still have made a choice. Accept the Gift, or push it away with both hands. Your choice.

Jesus, the Perfect Lamb of God died for you, doing for you what you could never, ever do for yourself. He did it ALL. He said “It is finished.” THIS is the Jesus of the Bible.
And because Jesus is perfect, I’m perfect too, I’m just like Jesus (I guess I don’t have to carry the cross to wear the crown afterall

As posted, you won’t be perfect until you stand before, washed clean by His Blood and His Blood alone. No, you don’t HAVE to carry the cross, but most who are saved WANT to. Does it disappoint you that there will be believers in Heaven that never did a single thing for the Lord but were saved through their belief alone? There will be. Here you worked all your life to EARN His free Gift, and there will be those that did nothing but believe on Him for their salvation. There will be others that walked their faith, carried their cross, and there will be crowns for them, yes. But all who believe on Jesus are saved, like it or not. We didn’t make the rules, HE did.

 

[josie_L]

If you never repented or were sorry for your sins, I would question if you had the Holy Spirit living on the inside of you, and it you really loved God.

I don’t need to repent or feel sorry, I was already forgiven, I mean why say sorry or feel bad when you’ve already had your sins (past, present, and future) forgiven? God will understand I’m sure.

That’s right. Jesus did it all, once and for all. You don’t HAVE to do anything, but if the Holy Spirit is living on the inside of you, you would WANT to please God.

But, pleasing God doesn’t suit me all the time, it means sacrifice and quite frankly I’m happy just being saved.

Yep. You could do that. But is that what you WANT to do?

Well, yes that is what I want to do, because I’m saved. God saved me!

If you choose to do nothing, you still have made a choice. Accept the Gift, or push it away with both hands. Your choice.

Man, you’re making this more complicated, you said I only need to believe to be saved, I believe and so I’m saved. And guess what I’m still Catholic. Or do you mean I have to be saved in your church?

As posted, you won’t be perfect until you stand before, washed clean by His Blood and His Blood alone. No, you don’t HAVE to carry the cross, but most who are saved WANT to. Does it disappoint you that there will be believers in Heaven that never did a single thing for the Lord but were saved through their belief alone? There will be. Here you worked all your life to EARN His free Gift, and there will be those that did nothing but believe on Him for their salvation. There will be others that walked their faith, carried their cross, and there will be crowns for them, yes. But all who believe on Jesus are saved, like it or not. We didn’t make the rules, HE did.

Personally, I’ll take the easier route. I mean God should have realized that this would happen. I guess the path to Heaven is not so narrow after all.

 

[Marsha_Adams]

Josie:

I would remind you of two passages of Scripture.

Matthew 7:6 Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.

Proverbs 26:10-12 The great God that formed all things both rewardeth the fool, and rewardeth transgressors. As a dog returneth to his vomit, so a fool returneth to his folly. Seest thou a man wise in his own conceit? there is more hope of a fool than of him.

Clearly Always is wise in her own conceit, and like the proverbial dog will choose her OSAS vomit over the clear word of God. Do not cast your pearls before her or she will surely turn and rend you. She prefers to twist God’s word to say what she wants it to say rather than what it actually says.

I would advise you to shake the dust off your feet and leave her to her own devices, and we know whose devices those are.

 

[josie_L]

Josie:

I would remind you of two passages of Scripture.

Matthew 7:6 Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you.

Proverbs 26:10-12 The great God that formed all things both rewardeth the fool, and rewardeth transgressors. As a dog returneth to his vomit, so a fool returneth to his folly. Seest thou a man wise in his own conceit? there is more hope of a fool than of him.

Clearly Always is wise in her own conceit, and like the proverbial dog will choose her OSAS vomit over the clear word of God. Do not cast your pearls before her or she will surely turn and rend you. She prefers to twist God’s word to say what she wants it to say rather than what it actually says.

I would advise you to shake the dust off your feet and leave her to her own devices, and we know whose devices those are.

I’m not afraid of her, but thanks Marsha for the advice. I would say God bless, but we’re saved, so what’s there to bless.

 

[guanophore]

Not gonna play your doctrine games. You either believe the Bible is the inerrant very Word of God, or you don’t - and are carried away by winds of different doctrine.

What is a 'doctrine game"?

Of course Catholics believe teh Bible is the inerrant very Word of God. We just are not available to be carried away by your winds of different doctrine.

Hummm…for this to be TRUE to Catholics, where are Paul’s traditions of papacy,

The traditions that we were charged to keep by the Apostles are alive and well in the Catholic Church.

worship / adoration of Mary

Catholics do not worship or adore Mary. these activities belong to God alone. Worship or adoration of any but the One True God is a violation of the first commandment.

(or the immaculate conception of Mary, the perpetual virginity of Mary, the assumption of Mary,

These doctrines, like the doctrine of the Trinity, were not formed until after the Apostolic age.

or Mary as co-redemptrix and mediatrix),

This is not a doctrine of the Church, but a theological speculation.

petitioning saints in Heaven for their prayers,

Why would you think that the Apostles would believe that those who had passed from this world in the friendship of Christ were unable to pray for us?

apostolic succession,

2 Tim 2:2-3
what you have heard from me before many witnesses entrust to faithful men who will be able to teach others also.

If you have a problem with Apostolic Succession, it should probably go on another thread. However, one of the reasons that Evangelical Protesantism is destined to death is because of the Apostolic Succession.

 the ordinances of the church functioning as sacraments, infant baptism, confession of sin to a priest, purgatory, indulgences,

We find all these in scripture, because we are not reading it with anti-Catholic glasses.
always_gr8ful;5107907:

or the equal authority of church tradition and Scripture?

2 Thess 2:15
15 So then, brethren, stand firm and hold to the traditions which you were taught by us, either by word of mouth or by letter.

The marvel is how it came to be that the traditions that came by word of mouth somehow lost their value to those who rebelled against the authority appointed by Christ.

Speaking of marveling - I marvel that the wall of scripture snippets you posted will go unread in context by you and your fellow Catholics, whereby you might see that you are actually making a case against

yourself.

Is this one of those “I only post scripture, not my own opinion” examples?

You are making prejudiced assumptions about Catholics.

I would say that holding traditions and outside teaching OVER the very Word of God is more than a “shortcoming”.

And you would be right. Where you are not right is thinking that the Word of God is confined to the pages of Scripture.

1 Thess 2:13

13 And we also thank God constantly for this, that when you received the word of God which you heard from us, you accepted it not as the word of men but as what it really is, the word of God, which is at work in you believers.

The Word of God received by the Church did not cease to be at work in the believers when some of it was committed to writing.

Maybe it’s because y’all are always fighting for your traditions that you don’t know there is Truth that is complete and perfect on it’s own. I absolutely PRAISE the new Pope for telling y’all it’s ok to study the Bible.

There is Truth that is complete and perfect. His name is Jesus. His Truth He committed to the Church,a nd the Church has preserved it. This was accomplished by the infallible power of the HS, who is the Soul of the Church.

The Bible isn’t a compilation of books brought together by man. If it was, it would be so full of errors, both historically and figuratively and would have failed as the Word of God centuries ago. But it’s not full of errors, it’s perfect, and it’sperfect because His Word is exactly the way He wanted it.

It seems that you know very little about the history of your faith, always. Indeed, the Bible is most certainly a collection of books brought together by man. These men belonged to theApostolic Succession that you have denied, those who preserved those writings for 400 years until they were canonized into the Bible. These men were inspired by the HS, to choose the inerrent books from among 400+ works floating about at the time, claiming to be inspired.

You are wrong, the fact that God uses men to accomplish the infallible does not mean the results are “full of errors”.

2 Peter 1:21
21 because no prophecy ever came by the impulse of man, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God.

When men are moved by the HS, and speak from God, the results are always inerrant and infallble. Such was the decision of the Church when she chose the books that God inspired. You are right, though, the Scriptures are exactly as He desired. Which begs the question why the Reformers felt it necessary to change them.

Do you actually believe that God is so weak that He is unable to move man to put the scriptures together in book form - the very scriptures He breathed? The very God who came to earth in the form of a man to die for you?

On the contrary, this is exactly what we believe. We further believe that God is able to preserve His word in the Church, just as He promised, whether by word of mouth, or in writing.

I would pray not!!

Do y’all even have a clue how serious this is?

Is that why you are here gr8ful? Are you here to inform us you are praying that you will never become Catholic, and that being Catholic is a “serious” error?

 

[guanophore]

Tell me, what do the words of Jesus here mean to you?

"Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity."
~Matthew 7:21-23

They mean the same thing to us they do to you. We just don’t carry the same anti-Catholic prejudice as you do, so we understand them differently.

And PLEASE - don’t go looking for what the Chruch says those words say. Just tell me what they mean to you. If I cared what your doctrine says about them, I’d google it.

If you are not here to learn what the Catholic Church believes and teaches, then you are probably in the wrong place. That is the purpose of this site.

We do not interpret scripture apart from the teaching of the Apostles. THey never intended for the Scriptures to be separated from the teachings committed to the Church by Christ.

“Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.”
~Matthew 7:21

Up for some Bible study?
So Jesus is say not every one who says Lord will enter into heaven, but he that does the will of His Father.

What is the will of His Father that we should do?

Is this related to the topic of the thread?

 

[josie_L]

They mean the same thing to us they do to you. We just don’t carry the same anti-Catholic prejudice as you do, so we understand them differently.

If you are not here to learn what the Catholic Church believes and teaches, then you are probably in the wrong place. That is the purpose of this site.

We do not interpret scripture apart from the teaching of the Apostles. THey never intended for the Scriptures to be separated from the teachings committed to the Church by Christ.

Is this related to the topic of the thread?

I like you Guanophore, you’re so concise.

 

[guanophore]

What is the will of His Father that we should do?

Ok. Let’s look at what God’s Word says about your answers. But first off, let me say I don’t care if you are Catholic, Baptist, Pentecostal, Church of Christ, etc. - God’s Word never changes and it is what we are all united under.

Actually, what you have stated here is far from true. There is no unity among those communities that all interpret scripture apart from the Apostolic Teaching. On the contrary, each one does what is right in his own eyes, as your posts have well demonstrated.

I don’t know who came up with the maxim “In essentials - Unity, in nonessentials - Liberty, and in all things Charity”, but I do know this is an essential and I pray that hearts are opened to God’s Word.

How can this be, if it is not in the Bible? The Bible does not say that we are “all united under” it.

This is another of your personal opinions that you are pandering as Word of God.

Now I don’t know if the Church has something to cover such sudden death, but are you aware of just how perfect we must be to stand before Him?

The Church has the infinite mercy and grace of Almighty God.

Well, the Pharisees and scribes kept the law to the letter, and Jesus only had disdain for them.

This, also, is a fabrication of your theology. Jesus loved the Pharisees and Scribes. He tried everything to reach them, and when they rejected Him, He gave his life on the cross to purchase them. This is not disdain. He disdained their rebellion and hardness of heart, but not their persons, whom He created in Love, and for whom He became the Lamb slain for their deliverance.

You have prejudiced the Jews just like you have the Catholics!

“Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.” How are you ever going to reach this perfection through keeping His commandments?

Perhaps you are laboring under the misunderstanding that Catholics believe we can reach perfection by keeping commandments? Or perhaps that we try to keep them apart from grace?

So if the law can’t save us by making us perfect by keeping His commandments, then there must be more - the answers given here are “the works we do”.

No, gr8ful. You have misunderstood the answers given here just like you have misunderstood the Scriptures.

Have you ever considered that what Jesus said was impossible?

Yes, but we know that He never commands that which is impossible, so we are confident that He gives us the grace to obey His commandments.

Continued…

CAF is not provided as a venue for you to attempt to convert Catholics into “bible christians”.

Are you so foolish? After beginning with the Spirit, are you now trying to attain your goal by human effort?"
~Galatians 3:1-3

gr8tful, you seem to be suffering from the misunderstanding that Catholics are Pelagians. this is not the case.

Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;"
~Titus 3:3-6

All these scriptures you have posted are written by Catholics, for Catholics. they are in the Bible because they representm, 100%, Catholic belief. This one here is a reference to Baptism.

Yes, it’s true we must be perfect to stand before God, but scripture is clear that we can’t reach perfection though the law or works.

Scripture is clear on this because it is the teaching of the Catholic Church, and there is nothing in scripture that is not.

We obey completely the will of the Father to believe in Jesus Christ alone for eternal salvation because we will never be perfect and fit to stand before Him. It is only through Jesus alone that all sins, past, present and future are forgiven. If we don’t believe this, we have not done or are doing the will of the Father.

So,is coming to CAF to evangelize Catholics an expression of your faith in God?

any wonders in Your name" are most likely are people who are may have been baptized, prayed and witnessed and done what they thought were many deeds which made them think that they were probably saved. Notice that Jesus does not question whether they actually did such works. Yet He rebukes them for not doing the Father’s will and He denies them kingdom entrance.

This is your perception of what you have read.

It is a sad possibility that some in the “works are the will of the Father” camp have never placed their trust in Christ alone. They may go to their graves preaching passages like Matthew 7:21-23 only to find out that Jesus was talking about them, not someone else.

Are you here to evangelize us because you are sad on our behalf?

Works are the will of the Father, gr8ful. Scripture is quite clear on this. You just quoted Eph. 2:10 above! He saved us by grace so that we could walk in His works. This is part of our spiritual worship.

I hope and pray that such people wake up before it is too late.

Thank you for your prayers.

Do you believe in the Jesus of the Bible? The Lamb of God that takes away all our sins? The One who justified us and made us perfect and righteous though His death and resurrection so that we may stand before Him holy and perfect?

We do. We believe in this Jesus because He was the one preached to us by the Apostles, and the message brought by their successors in an unbroken and infallible line of faith.

One last thing. Jesus said “And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you”. Never knew you.

Is your goal here to convince us that Jesus does not “know” us because we are Catholic?

 

[always_gr8ful]

I don’t need to repent or feel sorry, I was already forgiven, I mean why say sorry or feel bad when you’ve already had your sins (past, present, and future) forgiven? God will understand I’m sure.

That’s right. You don’t NEED to repent or say sorry or feel bad - you are already forgiven, your salvation is sealed. Does a dead-in-their-sins, unsaved person (let’s call them a heathen), does a heathen feel bad for their sins? (No!) Do they even know what sin is most the time, or do they only know the “biggies” like murder and such?(Just the biggies)

So did God give us the Holy Spirit to point out sin in our lives (among other things) so that we would feel bad? (No!) Or so we would want to repent and not do that anymore because we recognized it was sin and we want to be God pleasers?(Want to please God) Because I can’t think of a time that Jesus or the Apostles and Paul said “feel BAD when you sin”. Jesus and the Apostles did say “repent!”. You seem to think that if you don’t do the “biggies”, you’re living holy. But the Spirit shows us just how far we fall from the mark, and it doesn’t make us feel bad or sorry, it makes us cherish the Gift we have in Jesus all that more.

From the Garden, we are BAD, we don’t have to feel bad. Without Jesus, we’d be toast! Thank God He sent His Son who was tempted just like we are tempted every day, and understands the adversary that hates us, and the struggle we endure to please God.

And guess what I’m still Catholic. Or do you mean I have to be saved in your church?

LOL, I don’t have a church, so I guess that answers that. You don’t have to “do religion” to be saved - just believe on Jesus.

Personally, I’ll take the easier route. I mean God should have realized that this would happen. I guess the path to Heaven is not so narrow after all.

Oh, you might be surprised. There are those that will not believe because it means coming to the light, or they think it means giving up control of their life. Then there are those who don’t know Jesus at all, but think that God will be ok with THEM because after all, they’re good people. Then there are the religions. Islam, Hinduism, Chinese traditional and Buddhism - none accept Christ as Savior. Then there are the Christian religions - How many teach the Jesus of the Bible? I couldn’t tell you - but do you feel that road narrowing now?