Even grandma had premarital sex, survey finds

[Nohome]

resource to these stats please

Your welcome!

Abortion rate: guttmacher.org/pubs/fb_induced_abortion.html

STDs:cdc.gov/std/stats/Tables/Table1.htm Note: while the number of cases may be higher, the incidence rate (cases per 100,000) is down. Way down in some cases.

Teen Births:guttmacher.org/pubs/2006/09/12/USTPstats.pdf Just read the summary, down 28% since 1991.

I read your CDC report link and the graphs clearly show a declining trend for gonnoreah and syphilis.

Nohome

 

[mrs_abbott]

msnbc.msn.com/id/16287113/

This does not surprise me very much. Will people lay off my generation now…

No kidding!

 

[Karianne]

Remember that the grandparents of today (2006) are the children of the 1960’s. Many of us remember the Kippy, free love generation. I am not proud that it is my generation. I am proud that I did not get involved with the drugs, sex and me first way of life.

While many were doing their own thing there were many of us in the armed services, working and trying to remain moral as best we could.

So no these stats don’t surprise me. Just sadden me.

What on Earth is The Kippy?
I am so happy that you were so good in your younger years, most of us were not.
I can’t figure out what being in the armed services had to do with anything.
Being in the armed services has nothing to do with leading a moral life.

 

[Karianne]

Let me just start by saying I do not agree with pre-marital sex. However, I wonder if from a biological standpoint we come into our sexuality during our teens because that is when we were meant to enter into marriages and then produce children. With today’s society putting a priority on education and careers before marriage, are we going counter to what is biologically natural. Many people do not get married now until their late 20s and I can’t imagine what their sexual urges must be like if they are being chaste. Of course it’s commendable if they can remain chaste. As people get older and older before marriage are they faced with a burden of abstinence that no other generation has ever faced? I have no knowledge in this area so I may be completely out to lunch.

I think that you make a valid point, however, I think that the lifespan of women, in general was very short at one time.

 

[TobyLue]

When I was in high school in the 50’s we didn’t have sex education. There were some pregnancies yes, but not the large amount there is today. So to counter those pregnancies, sex education was introduced in the 60’s to the high schools. There were more pregnancies so in order to educate the youth, some felt it was necessary to introduce sex education to middle schools. So the results were that there were more and more pregnancies. Many liberals were shocked at how little teens knew about sex so they determined that the way to solve the problem was to have sex education in elementary schools. Has that stopped pregnancies? No! Now many want to introduce sex education (if it isn’t already being done) to pre-k children. When that is done and there are still many pregnancies, what will be the excuse? As it is now, Hollywood with its sex-oriented movies and TV programs consider free sex with anyone at anytime as just fine and dandy. It may come to pass that people will be able to have sex anywhere, anytime, with whomever they feel like it. It may be out in the streets, in restaurants, out in public since “it’s just normal” and besides, everybody is doing it. And BTW, the Catholic Church does not have its head in the sand. It is the only church that still considers ABC immoral and a sin. All the others have caved in to the Prince of the World, as somebody so rightfully put it, and approve condoms, pills, IUD, etc.
One of the problems IMO was when many denominations started calling evil as good. (We are warned in scripture about it.) Allowing the use of ABC was something that was not good.
Hmm, let’s see, divorce rates are up, so why don’t we start educating the youth in elementary, the best way to get most out of a divorce. Teach young girls what they can do to get the most $$ out of their ex’s. And teach young boys what they can do to avoid having to pay alimony, or maybe pay child support. AMOF since it seems to be a given, and everybody has given up, that teens will be having sex, why not have them prove that they have learned about sex by having them perform sexual acts and teachers can grade them. They can have sex with each other or even the teacher. Then role-play pretending they are married and go through make- believe divorces and see who can get more out of the other spouse. Teach them all they need to know about pre-marital contracts.
I’ll admit that I had pre-marital sex. However, that was not till my 30’s just before I entered into an invalid marriage. My wife admitted she did to before she met me. But once I came to have a relationship with my Lord, I knew that it was wrong for me (not that I didn’t know back then) and I made it a point to remain chaste and when I met my wife we knew that we would remain faithful and not have sex until we got married. Yes, we had the opportunity, but every time she and I went out on a date, we knew that it was not only she and I but we took Jesus along with us. We made it a point to pray together often. The sex education that children should get is teaching young boys how to become men and respect women, and teaching young girls, how to become mature women and to care for their bodies. A banana is a fruit that should be consumed and not used to teach boys and girls the proper way of using a condom. BTW, the only safe sex is with your spouse. Any sex outside of marriage, whether using the pill, IUD, condoms, whatever is putting your soul in danger of eternal damnation. There was a program sometime back that alluded to some dude dying of a heart attack during a sexual act with somebody other than his wife. Some said “What a way to go. That’s the way I would want to die”. If that happens to somebody, will the condoms, pill or whatever save them from hell? What is “safe” about that?

 

[TobyLue]

My last post, I meant “prenuptial” contracts not pre-marital contracts.

 

[tamccrackine]

Abortion rate: guttmacher.org/pubs/fb_induced_abortion.html

gee, hmm… guttmacher… planned parenthood… there’s a massive connection there. So to say the results of any report they have is skewed is an understatement.

STDs:cdc.gov/std/stats/Tables/Table1.htm Note: while the number of cases may be higher, the incidence rate (cases per 100,000) is down. Way down in some cases.

huh? it may be way down, but the number of cases are higher. I don’t know about you, but I don’t care about semantics… the number is higher. Period.

Teen Births:guttmacher.org/pubs/2006/09/12/USTPstats.pdf Just read the summary, down 28% since 1991.

like I said, I’d give you that one but only because birth control and abortion is shoved down a girl/womans’ throat. So the only thing this number is indicative of is how forceful Planned Parenthood is in perpetuating the lies they spread. Like I said, it’s not based on any respectable and life affirming tool given to women/girls.

I read your CDC report link and the graphs clearly show a declining trend for gonnoreah and syphilis.

I’m not looking at one or two diseases… I’m looking at the whole of STD’s. Thus my giving you the CDC link. NOT Guttmacher, NOT planned parenthood. But a center that doesn’t give a hoot about forcing an agenda of their own to produce results that are skewed and promotes their agenda.

Nohome

 

[Nohome]

gee, hmm… guttmacher… planned parenthood… there’s a massive connection there. So to say the results of any report they have is skewed is an understatement.

O.K., CDC data, exactly the same. cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/ss5212a1.htm

huh? it may be way down, but the number of cases are higher. I don’t know about you, but I don’t care about semantics… the number is higher. Period.

You have to normalize the data against population to make a meaningful comparison. I think you know this but won’t let fact get in the way of your debate.

I’m not looking at one or two diseases… I’m looking at the whole of STD’s. Thus my giving you the CDC link.

I gave you CDC data too, you just didn’t bother to read it.

My point in all of this isn’t to debate the merits of ABC, rather to point out, in light of the current topic, that sexually transmitted disease has been a constant human condition and that current “safe sex” is not the cause of the problem.

Nohome

 

[corvidae]

O.K., CDC data, exactly the same. cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/ss5212a1.htm

Nohome

No, it is not the exact same, look at figure 2, In the CDC report.

The guttmacher study polled women betwen 15 and 44,

The CDC data shows the largest percentage of abortions is in the under 15 year old range. In addition, the CDC data shows a decline starting in the nineties, (Fig 1) not in the seventies. Those are very large differences.

Please look at your data before saying it shows something it does not.

A lone Raven

 

[KathleenElsie]

What on Earth is The Kippy?
I am so happy that you were so good in your younger years, most of us were not.
I can’t figure out what being in the armed services had to do with anything.
Being in the armed services has nothing to do with leading a moral life.

I honestly think you knew I meant HIPPY sorry for the typo. And no I was not so “GOOD” as you say. I just knew what was right for me to become involved in and not to become involved in. So it makes me sad that many women of my generation have bought into the anti-life and me first life styles. But I am proud of the fact that I won’t have to tell my children and grandchildren that I did not follow the moral teaching of Holy Mother Church.

As for the armed forces at the time. It was not a popular decision with the “me hippy” generation. But it was a moral decision on many of our parts to defend the country we loved and serve. There were many many men that were drafted and served with honor and dignity. There were many that left the country because their consence led them to do so, Both decisions if done because of true conviction and moral belief were personal decisions.

 

[Nohome]

No, it is not the exact same, look at figure 2, In the CDC report.

You need to stand back from a graph and look at the trend. The trends are the same. My point being, sexually transmitted disease, unwanted pregnancy and abortion are not the result of recent moral decay or “safe sex” education. They have been and remain a part of the human condition.

Nohome

 

[Nohome]

As my dd approaches her teens, I am honestly thinking of making sure she has a chaperone.

Actually, since we now know that it is males that have the more agressive sex drive, maybe this time we should try chaperones for young men. Women have taken the rap for this issue way too long.

Nohome

 

[rlg94086]

Actually, since we now know that it is males that have the more agressive sex drive, maybe this time we should try chaperones for young men. Women have taken the rap for this issue way too long.

Nohome

You seem to misunderstand the purpose of a chaperone for one’s daughter. It is to protect her from the advances of a young man. The woman isn’t “taking the rap.”

 

[tamccrackine]

You need to stand back from a graph and look at the trend. The trends are the same. My point being, sexually transmitted disease, unwanted pregnancy and abortion are not the result of recent moral decay or “safe sex” education. They have been and remain a part of the human condition.

Nohome

How can you say it’s part of the human condition when it’s exploded since “safe sex” education started? The numbers of abortions went up when it was legalized, and then safe sex measures were then started to be pushed on kids at school.

If “safe sex” and the push of ABC’s and abortion ISN’T the reason we have so many problems, then what is? The human condition has never been this way… I offer you to look at www.ccli.org for more information regarding when birth control actually came out. Not until the 1930’s was birth control “accepted” as something that should be used.

So no… I disagree with you on this point… ABC’s (aka, “safe sex”) was never part of a normal human condition. Fertility is a normal human condition… not suppressing it with injections, ingestions, barriers, patches, and then abortions if all the above fail.

 

[Nohome]

How can you say it’s part of the human condition when it’s exploded since “safe sex” education started? The numbers of abortions went up when it was legalized, and then safe sex measures were then started to be pushed on kids at school.

If “safe sex” and the push of ABC’s and abortion ISN’T the reason we have so many problems, then what is? The human condition has never been this way… I offer you to look at www.ccli.org for more information regarding when birth control actually came out. Not until the 1930’s was birth control “accepted” as something that should be used.

So no… I disagree with you on this point… ABC’s (aka, “safe sex”) was never part of a normal human condition. Fertility is a normal human condition… not suppressing it with injections, ingestions, barriers, patches, and then abortions if all the above fail.

O.K., I’ll bite. When did “safe sex” education start? It wasn’t even a term of common language until the mid 1980’s in response to AIDS. Show me the start of “safe sex” education and show me the resulting “explosion” of disease.

If I’m restricted to debate using unbiased sources of data, so are you. CCL is to this debate what Guttmacher is to the other side of the coin. I found other sources and you should too.

Birth control has been around long before the 1930s. The condom made its way into society in the 17th century. Ancient egypt used the pessary, Europe used beeswax, and Asia used the cervical cap.

The transmission of venerial disease is documented in writting as far back as 1540. The primary control wasn’t moral behavior, but rather that people didn’t travel. Every army to traverse the Earth has been followed by prostitutes, pilaging and rape. Disease traveled with them.

There were (still are) many herbal abortificants and abortionist have done their trade throughout history. Infanticide was much more common before abortion but appears to still be practiced.

AIDS is the exception and truly is an epidemic. Everything else is here just as it was before, only now we do a better job of gathering information.

Do you really think sin is something new? Also, how could the Church condemn birth control and abortion since its founding if the practice didn’t exist?

Back to my original premis, there is nothing “new” about this news article.

Nohome

 

[gilliam]

O.K., I’ll bite. When did “safe sex” education start? It wasn’t even a term of common language until the mid 1980’s in response to AIDS. Show me the start of “safe sex” education and show me the resulting “explosion” of disease.

Planned Parenthood (PP) developed its programs in the 1920’s. Sex education became very popular in the 60s. I remember going to a class around that time.

Here is a reference.

 

[Nohome]

Planned Parenthood (PP) developed its programs in the 1920’s. Sex education became very popular in the 60s. I remember going to a class around that time.

Here is a reference.

Are you saying that PP used the term “safe sex” in the 20’s? This would be news to me. I had sex education starting in the 70’s. Birth control wasn’t mentioned until 10th grade health (1980). That was when I learned that ABC was forbidden in the Catholic Church. Not at home, not in CCD, but in public school.

BTW, it was not taught to me as “safe sex”, just birth control. As a bit of irony, there was only one pregnancy in my graduating class of nearly 300 compared to four in my wife’s Catholic school class of 70. Clearly too small of a pool to mean anything, but ironic nonetheless.

Nohome

 

[tamccrackine]

O.K., I’ll bite. When did “safe sex” education start? It wasn’t even a term of common language until the mid 1980’s in response to AIDS. Show me the start of “safe sex” education and show me the resulting “explosion” of disease.

If I’m restricted to debate using unbiased sources of data, so are you. CCL is to this debate what Guttmacher is to the other side of the coin. I found other sources and you should too.

Birth control has been around long before the 1930s. The condom made its way into society in the 17th century. Ancient egypt used the pessary, Europe used beeswax, and Asia used the cervical cap.

The transmission of venerial disease is documented in writting as far back as 1540. The primary control wasn’t moral behavior, but rather that people didn’t travel. Every army to traverse the Earth has been followed by prostitutes, pilaging and rape. Disease traveled with them.

There were (still are) many herbal abortificants and abortionist have done their trade throughout history. Infanticide was much more common before abortion but appears to still be practiced.

AIDS is the exception and truly is an epidemic. Everything else is here just as it was before, only now we do a better job of gathering information.

Do you really think sin is something new? Also, how could the Church condemn birth control and abortion since its founding if the practice didn’t exist?

Back to my original premis, there is nothing “new” about this news article.

Nohome

I used CCL as a resource to learn, historically, when BC because accepted as a norm. What you’ve described is methods used in a minority of society. BC as a “norm” is what we’re discussing here… not the historical aspects of what was used before the norm. And yes, as I stated… I’m well aware of what is considered the human condition. I am trying to explain, I guess not as clearly as I thought, that BC as a norm didn’t explode until it became normalized in the 1930’s.

“safe sex” started the second BC was “normalized” for usage within the family. Which would be in the 1930’s. Who cares about a specific term? It’s the concept. I offer this source

When it comes to depictions of sexual activity, however, television entertainment programs are contributors to the STD problem much more frequently then they are part of the solution. A 1999 study by the Henry J. Kaiser Family Foundation showed that 67 percent of prime-time television programs contained verbal or visual references to sex, but only 10 percent made any mention of safe sex or contraception. Within the program sample studied, 88 scenes were identified portraying or implying sexual intercourse, and not one contained any depiction or mention of safe sex. These results were consistent with similar studies performed in 1986, 1993, and 1996: there was considerable sexual activity portrayed on television, but very little mention of STD prevention by any of the sexually involved characters.

There have been a few notable exceptions to this trend. In 1989, an episode of the situation comedy Head of the Class caused a stir when one of the characters, a teenage boy, asks his teacher whether he should have intercourse with his girlfriend. The teacher (portrayed by Howard Hesseman) advises the boy not to have sex, but, if he must, to be sure to use a condom. In the late 1990s, several shows on the WB network, including Dawson’s Creek and Felicity, showed characters discussing sex with disease prevention raised as an issue; similar scenes have also been seen on the UPN network’s popular show Moesha.

If discussion of condoms is rare in network television shows, it is unheard of in the advertising that pays for those programs. Neither the major networks (ABC, CBS, NBC, or Fox) nor the largest independents (WB and UPN) will accept paid advertising for condoms, even during late-night shows. The networks’ concern is that such advertisements would cause offense in the more conservative areas of the country, and also that some advertisers of more conventional products would not wish to have their advertisements preceded or followed by a condom commercial.

So yes… BC isn’t anything new in a sense. But I offered the CCL site for historical information. I really don’t think we disagree either. IMNSHO, the “safe sex” agenda is broken, so is the abstinence program because most family structures are broken. So it’ll take getting the paradigm to shift to focus on the family, stop pushing the free sex mentality, the abortion -is-a-solution mentality, the same-sex is ok mentality. Otherwise… I really don’t know. Society as a whole stinks in this arena and when personal responsibility is taught to our kids, then maybe we can get some headway in this problem. ya know?

 

[Agnieszka]

I cant understand what the obsession is about sex in our culture. I cannot understand it one way or the other. I cant comprehend why its such a huge issue in popular media nor can i comprehend why people are so fixated on abstinence.

Personally ive had 3 sexual relationships with 3 different men. The first 2 were a huge mistake i’ll admit and if i had the chance to do it again i would not have slept with them, but when you are young, not religious and you get caught up in the moment thats what happens. I havent had an easy life, nor did i have staunch catholic parents who brought me up to believe that sex is a sacred act between two people, all i knew was what popular culture taught me. My parents did a good enough job but their focus was for me to get an education. Anyway, im off track.

When i met my current partner i was considering becoming a nun. For some reason i woke up one day and learned the truth. From that day forth i was in love with Christ, with Catholocism and everything the truth is. Ive seen the way the world is, i have the ability to read people and to see their hurt, i also have compassion, i have knowledge i couldnt dream of learning in a lifetime on my own. To be honest to this day i know that if something ever happened to my partner i would become a nun, even though, shock horror, i am having pre-marital sex with my boyfriend (my best friend, my one and only). I havent lived the ideal life as far as chastity is concerned, and this doesnt make me a bad person. This makes me a person who understands others and not judge them. I see people looking down on me and others who have had pre-marital sex and i know thats wrong, because nobody is too low for me to serve, nobody is too low for me to wash their feet. I will look at a prostitute in the same manner as i would a chaste nun, because at the end of the day it is the Lord who will judge us all, and not one of us is free from sin, so why so much emphasis on one sin? I am aware of my sin, but i cant play the chastity card with my past. If i was a virgin on the day i found Christ then i would be one today, but i wasnt, and despite the fact that people will always say “well that was then, this is now, repent and do not sin again” nothing will turn me into a virgin again. As much as i could claim that i am saving myself for marriage (a born again virgin) i know that i will not experience that as a virgin would.

So to most of you i am a walking contradiction, a woman who would love nothing more than to be a catholic nun, yet who has met a man she loves and wants to guide to Christ. To get the work done sometimes you have to get your hands dirty. That is a fact of life. I may be sinning, i may have faults, but tell me which one of you does not? Is my sin so great? When you walked past that homeless person and thought “not today” did you not reject Christ? and in doing so is that a lesser sin than remaining clean? Jesus was also criticised for not washing his hands before eating, yet he retaliated and said that people are more concerned with outward manifestations of purity than inner holiness. This is how i see most Christians and Catholics who so desperately focus on the sex before marriage issue. They condemn others to hell when they have no authority to do so. They are so focused on that one issue they are oblivious to what is important. There are families suffering, people dying, people living in desperate poverty, people who have no dignity left, reach out your hands to them and stop focusing on one thing. Stop obsessing over one outward manifestation of holiness, to some this is unachievable, to others it comes too late, still others consider it more important to focus on living as Christ did and working for others as he did. I tell you i would not be half the woman i am today if it werent for Christ. I would not be socially aware, i would not bite my tongue, i would not be suffering for Him and giving up my childhood dreams for Him if i didnt find Him, for Him i have given up much, much more than i see most religious people do. When i tire of loving others and doing good i am reminded to never tire of doing good for Christ, i turn to the Bible and see what the Lord needs me to see. I have an active and beautiful relationship with Christ, he sees me for all that i am and still does not reject me, but people do. He knows of my failures and knows of my pain, yet does not threaten me with images of hell, rather shows me a time when i will be free of my pain.

 

[Nohome]

“safe sex” started the second BC was “normalized” for usage within the family. Which would be in the 1930’s.

At the risk of beating this topic to death, I offer this. ABC was promoted as a method of avoiding pregnancy. It wasn’t talked about in “proper society” until the 1930’s, but it was most certainly know about and discussed. The other big shift in the 30s is that ABC made the jump from home remedy to commercial product.

“Safe sex” is a reletively new term of the mid 1980’s. Here avoiding pregnancy is secondary to preventing the spread of disease. Its promotion becomes contraversial because some believe it promotes having sex. The UN indicates that 68 independant studies all agree that “safe sex” education does not lead to more sex.

I really don’t think we disagree either. IMNSHO, the “safe sex” agenda is broken, so is the abstinence program because most family structures are broken.

You are correct that we are not on opposite sides of the isle. I see “safe sex” as a failure as big as abstinence only programs. Having been a teacher, I saw first hand how uninvolved parents were in their children’s lives. Just asking “where are you going?” shows that you care.

I guess I’m not willing to blame a man-made program on a natural problem. Sexually transmitted disease is found in just about every plant and animal. It is part of life, just like sex. Saying the disease will go away if we live moral lives is like saying obesity will vanish if we eat well and exercize. The human condition gets in the way of the ideal.

Nohome