Faith and Works

[KjetilK]

And yet we can lose our state of justice in any case.

Yes, the state you are in. But you can never loose the status of having been justified, and you can never loose that initial justice. But that initial justification won’t get you saved if you fall.

 

[CatholicKnight3]

Still wondering if the Good Samaritan had faith in Christ, or what John 5:29 means.

Where it says those who have DONE GOOD DEEDS will be going to heaven. Not, those who had FAITH IN ME.

I am still wondering if it was just FAITH ALONE what the entire point of Matthew 25:31-46 is.

Or where it says in Romans ch 2 that God will render judgement on each person according to THEIR DEEDS.

Or where it says BLESSED ARE THE MERCIFUL, for they SHALL RECEIVE MERCY. What does it mean by MERCIFUL? Acts of mercy? Like what?

I am still trying to understand when Christ says NOT ALL THOSE WHO SAY LORD LORD WILL ENTER BUT ONLY THOSE WHO DO MY FATHERS WILL.

How about where it says you can have faith to MOVE MOUNTAINS, but if you do not HAVE LOVE then you have nothing.

Are all those verses just irrelevant or they do not mean what they say they mean? Is it that I am just reading it wrong?

 

[Duane1966]

Yes, but you cannot go from having been initially justified to never having been initially justified by not doing the works He has prepared for you.

And that initial justification stays. Or else you would have to be rebaptised if you apostatised and came back.

Okay, thanks for your patience, and bear with me for just one, or possibly two, more questions.

First a little bit of information about me. I have been Catholic since being baptized as an infant. I have two kids. I was born in 1966. I have never left the Catholic Church.

Now a statement. If someone said about me: ** Duane was baptized as an infant, he has two kids, he was born in 1966, and Duane is a Protestant.**

Now the question, or questions. Is the above statement about Duane true or false? If false, why?

 

[rcwitness]

Still wondering if the Good Samaritan had faith in Christ, or what John 5:29 means.

Where it says those who have DONE GOOD DEEDS will be going to heaven. Not, those who had FAITH IN ME.

Verse 30 answers this question…

30*“I can do nothing on my own authority; as I hear, I judge; and my judgment is just, because I seek not my own will but the will of him who sent me."

This is the pinnacle of true faithfulness.

 

[StuMondo]

Here is what I was taught about faith and works:
In English the terms righteousness and justice are different words, but in both the Hebrew Old Testament and the Greek New Testament there is only one word group behind these two English terms…. James is using the word justified in a different sense from the way Paul uses it
God says a person is justified (demonstrated or shown to be righteous to other men) by works and not by faith alone."
God says a person “a person is justified (declared to be righteous by God) by faith alone and not by work.”

How do Catholics respond to this?

In my opinion, the root difference between “faith plus works” and “faith alone” is how one believes we receive righteousness and justification from God.

Catholics believe that Christ graces man with righteousness. In that act of being graced, man is changed internally (regenerated/sanctified). Therefore, man is MADE righteous by God. At this point I want to be sure to note that man does not do anything to earn or merit this grace from God that makes him righteous. BUT – once he is graced and made righteous by Christ, that righteousness is now his. It is a part of him. The Catholic view of salvation blends justification and regeneration/sanctification. You are justified when you are regenerated/sanctified, and likewise you are regenerated/sanctified when you are justified. The point is that justification is the result of an internal change that occurs within man making him righteous (by no merit on man’s part).

The Reformed Protestant’s position is that justification and regeneration/sanctification are two separate, distinct items. Regeneration/sanctification is something that occurs and changes man inwardly, but does not affect his salvation in any way. Man is not justified when he is regenerated/sanctified. Rather, man is justified when God declares him righteous while at the same time not actually making man righteous. Man is credited with an outside righteousness that is not his own, namely the righteousness of Christ. Man is credited with Christ’s righyeousness while still being unrighteous himself. The distinction to be made from Catholicism here is that in the Reformed Protestant position, man is NOT MADE righteous, he is only DECLARED righteous. In this declaration, the righteousness of Christ is credited to the man’s account.

So…how does this affect “faith plus works” and “faith alone”?

The answer is this:

In the Catholic understanding of salvation, man is made righteous and the righteousness which saves him is inside of him, it is his own righteousness that has been graced to him. Therefore he is responsible for it. And because it is his own and he is responsible for it, he can corrupt it by committing grave sin thereby killing the state of justification in his being/soul. His works have an impact on the righteousness by which he will be saved.

In the Reformed Protestant understanding of salvation, man is declared righteous without actually being made righteous by God’s grace. The righteousness which saves him is Christ’s righteousness credited to him, and that righteousness is not his own. It is a righteousness that is outside of him. Therefore, since it is a righteousness that is not his own and outside of him, he is not responsible for it. There is nothing he can do to corrupt it. His works do not impact the righteousness that will save him.

So, in the Catholic understanding of salvation, works do not merit man going from an unsaved state (being a child of wrath) to a saved state (becoming an adopted son of God), but rather, good works keep a justified man in a state of justification. They keep him from falling from a state of justification to a state of corrupted justification, or unjustification. Good works keep man from falling from grace.

To conclude:

To arrive at the Reformed Protestant position of “faith alone” one must reject God’s ability to be able to make man righteous. In my opinion, to arrive at the Reformed Protestant position of “faith alone” one must actually take away from the awesomeness of God, one must take away the total power of the “intergalactic champion of the universe” (lol).

The Catholic position of Christ infusing man with his grace and thereby making him righteous is actually the position that gives more glory to God than the Reformed Protestant position which restricts God’s ability to make man righteous. Because, in my opinion, no matter how depraved man is from the fall, there is no amount of unrighteousness that God is unable to make righteous.

 

[KjetilK]

Okay, thanks for your patience, and bear with me for just one, or possibly two, more questions.

First a little bit of information about me. I have been Catholic since being baptized as an infant. I have two kids. I was born in 1966. I have never left the Catholic Church.

Now a statement. If someone said about me: ** Duane was baptized as an infant, he has two kids, he was born in 1966, and Duane is a Protestant.**

Now the question, or questions. Is the above statement about Duane true or false? If false, why?

Well, it is false because you aren’t a Protestant (and neither am I, btw).

 

[eazyduzit]

In my opinion, the root difference between “faith plus works” and “faith alone” is how one believes we receive righteousness and justification from God.

Catholics believe that Christ graces man with righteousness. In that act of being graced, man is changed internally (regenerated/sanctified). Therefore, man is MADE righteous by God. At this point I want to be sure to note that man does not do anything to earn or merit this grace from God that makes him righteous. BUT – once he is graced and made righteous by Christ, that righteousness is now his. It is a part of him. The Catholic view of salvation blends justification and regeneration/sanctification. You are justified when you are regenerated/sanctified, and likewise you are regenerated/sanctified when you are justified. The point is that justification is the result of an internal change that occurs within man making him righteous (by no merit on man’s part).

The Reformed Protestant’s position is that justification and regeneration/sanctification are two separate, distinct items. Regeneration/sanctification is something that occurs and changes man inwardly, but does not affect his salvation in any way. Man is not justified when he is regenerated/sanctified. Rather, man is justified when God declares him righteous while at the same time not actually making man righteous. Man is credited with an outside righteousness that is not his own, namely the righteousness of Christ. Man is credited with Christ’s righyeousness while still being unrighteous himself. The distinction to be made from Catholicism here is that in the Reformed Protestant position, man is NOT MADE righteous, he is only DECLARED righteous. In this declaration, the righteousness of Christ is credited to the man’s account.

So…how does this affect “faith plus works” and “faith alone”?

The answer is this:

In the Catholic understanding of salvation, man is made righteous and the righteousness which saves him is inside of him, it is his own righteousness that has been graced to him. Therefore he is responsible for it. And because it is his own and he is responsible for it, he can corrupt it by committing grave sin thereby killing the state of justification in his being/soul. His works have an impact on the righteousness by which he will be saved.

In the Reformed Protestant understanding of salvation, man is declared righteous without actually being made righteous by God’s grace. The righteousness which saves him is Christ’s righteousness credited to him, and that righteousness is not his own. It is a righteousness that is outside of him. Therefore, since it is a righteousness that is not his own and outside of him, he is not responsible for it. There is nothing he can do to corrupt it. His works do not impact the righteousness that will save him.

So, in the Catholic understanding of salvation, works do not merit man going from an unsaved state (being a child of wrath) to a saved state (becoming an adopted son of God), but rather, good works keep a justified man in a state of justification. They keep him from falling from a state of justification to a state of corrupted justification, or unjustification. Good works keep man from falling from grace.

To conclude:

To arrive at the Reformed Protestant position of “faith alone” one must reject God’s ability to be able to make man righteous. In my opinion, to arrive at the Reformed Protestant position of “faith alone” one must actually take away from the awesomeness of God, one must take away the total power of the “intergalactic champion of the universe” (lol).

The Catholic position of Christ infusing man with his grace and thereby making him righteous is actually the position that gives more glory to God than the Reformed Protestant position which restricts God’s ability to make man righteous. Because, in my opinion, no matter how depraved man is from the fall, there is no amount of unrighteousness that God is unable to make righteous.

Glad you joined in and brought up this point Stu. It was the subject of great debate in the Reformation.
Catholics normally use it to claim that Ps are not changed in salvation and all they have is a “legal fiction”.

But here is what the bible says:

2Cor5:17. “Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a. new creature: old things are passed away; behold all things are become new”.

In salvation, the spirit is regenerated and God puts us in Christ. This “in Christ” position is the actual reason we are righteous. V.21 explains that we are "the righteousness of God in Him.
GOD DOES NOT AND CANNOT MAKE MAN RIGHTEOUS in himself because the only righteousness in the universe is Christ. Christ ALONE is the righteousness of God. That can never be changed, but scripture says that God puts us in Christ, and that is a good place to be. Paul says in Ph.3:9 “And be found in Him, not having my own righteousness”.

Then you have said that you “depend on your works to keep you justified”.

This is nothing other than a performance based relationship.
This is exactly what we can’t accept. Paul says in Gal.3:5. He therefore that ministers to you the Spirit, and worketh miracles among you, worketh he it by the works of the law or by the hearing of faith?"
We are to walk by faith and not by sight.

We cannot compromise on these things.

Peace

Eazy

 

[fhansen]

Still wondering if the Good Samaritan had faith in Christ, or what John 5:29 means.

Where it says those who have DONE GOOD DEEDS will be going to heaven. Not, those who had FAITH IN ME.

I am still wondering if it was just FAITH ALONE what the entire point of Matthew 25:31-46 is.

Or where it says in Romans ch 2 that God will render judgement on each person according to THEIR DEEDS.

Or where it says BLESSED ARE THE MERCIFUL, for they SHALL RECEIVE MERCY. What does it mean by MERCIFUL? Acts of mercy? Like what?

I am still trying to understand when Christ says NOT ALL THOSE WHO SAY LORD LORD WILL ENTER BUT ONLY THOSE WHO DO MY FATHERS WILL.

How about where it says you can have faith to MOVE MOUNTAINS, but if you do not HAVE LOVE then you have nothing.

Are all those verses just irrelevant or they do not mean what they say they mean? Is it that I am just reading it wrong?

Yes, you’re right. You know, Jesus came to restore to man faith in God first of all, Whom He happened to be of course. As such, I think the Good Samairtitan displayed an implicit faith, at least, and more yet, he displayed love, by his deeds. And whatever we do for the “least of these”, we do for Him, we do for God.

 

[eazyduzit]

Still wondering if the Good Samaritan had faith in Christ, or what John 5:29 means.

Where it says those who have DONE GOOD DEEDS will be going to heaven. Not, those who had FAITH IN ME.

I am still wondering if it was just FAITH ALONE what the entire point of Matthew 25:31-46 is.

Or where it says in Romans ch 2 that God will render judgement on each person according to THEIR DEEDS.

Or where it says BLESSED ARE THE MERCIFUL, for they SHALL RECEIVE MERCY. What does it mean by MERCIFUL? Acts of mercy? Like what?

I am still trying to understand when Christ says NOT ALL THOSE WHO SAY LORD LORD WILL ENTER BUT ONLY THOSE WHO DO MY FATHERS WILL.

How about where it says you can have faith to MOVE MOUNTAINS, but if you do not HAVE LOVE then you have nothing.

Are all those verses just irrelevant or they do not mean what they say they mean? Is it that I am just reading it wrong?

First of all, Jesus is the Good SAMARITAN. We are the dude that was mugged and Jesus comes to our rescue. (spiritually speaking)

Now in Jn5, look at the whole context. You assume that “have done good” refers to works, but Jesus has said in v. 24 “He that hearth my word and believeth…shall not come into condemnation”. This is a direct promise. Making your own assumption is dangerous.

In Rm.2, the subject is “law”. It is a message to those that wish to be justified by the law. Paul does not say that it is impossible, but makes clear that it is a very high standard and questions if those who preach the law really keep the law themselves. Paul has said this to make a contrast with the grace in ch. 4.

The apostles asked Jesus what they were to do to “work the works of God”? Jesus answered, “This is the work of God, that ye believe on Him” Jn.6:29.

What would Jesus say to you?

 

[rcwitness]

The apostles asked Jesus what they were to do to “work the works of God”? Jesus answered, “This is the work of God, that ye believe on Him” Jn.6:29.

I agree that faith is necessary to do the father’s will. And that we are justified before any work. I also believe the works of God is not belief alone.

Jesus says, “Believe on Him.” And, “Believe in Me.”

This means trusting, converting, and being doers of the Word while being thankful that By His grace we have life.

I think most all of St Paul’s Chapter 8 of Romans tells much also! A

So then, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh—13for if you live according to the flesh you will die, but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body you will live.14For all who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God.15For you did not receive the spirit of slavery to fall back into fear, but you have received the spirit of sonship. When we cry, “Abba! Father!”16it is the Spirit himself bearing witness with our spirit that we are children of God,17and if children, then heirs, heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ, provided we suffer with him in order that we may also be glorified with him.*

Faith Alone does NOT co-operate with Him. It does not suffer with Him. It gives us the supernatural awareness that we are loved, forgiven and led by our creator and Father of Jesus.

 

[mijac]

Here is what I was taught about faith and works:
In English the terms righteousness and justice are different words, but in both the Hebrew Old Testament and the Greek New Testament there is only one word group behind these two English terms…. James is using the word justified in a different sense from the way Paul uses it
God says a person is justified (demonstrated or shown to be righteous to other men) by works and not by faith alone."
God says a person “a person is justified (declared to be righteous by God) by faith alone and not by work.”

How do Catholics respond to this?

Saved By Faith “Alone” is Man Made Tradition-; It Is Not Biblical

I think that we can all agree that Scripture if understood will never contradict itself

All of Protestantism teaches that one is saved by Faith “Alone”. Faith “Alone” is totally unscriptural!!!

The words “Saved by Faith “Alone” cannot be found anywhere in the Bible. The word
“Alone “, is repeatedly inserted into the Biblical passages which state , “Saved by Faith” The words “Not saved by faith Alone” are in the Bible in the book of James 2:24

Faith and baptism are two sides of the same coin. Are we saved by faith or by baptism? Are we saved by believing or by the Spirit? These are false dichotmies that should have no place in Christian thinking!!

The Bible teaches much more then Saved by Faith. Everything surrounding salvation, the ten commandments etc can be summed up in the two great commandments which are in numerous places throughout Scripture. We are instructed to Love God with all our hearts mind and soul. Then also to Love our neighbor of as our selves. So Everything depends on both Faith and Love,- all by the Grace of God.

How does one receive salvation, justification, new birth and Eternal life??
We Are Saved by:

1. by grace (Rom 3:24 Rom 11:6 Acts 15:11, Eph 2:8)
2. by the work of the Spirit (Jn 3:5, 2 Cor 3:6)?
3. by His Blood (Rom 5:9, Heb 9:22)?
4. by His Righteousness (Rom 5:17, 2 Pet 1:1)?
5. by His Cross (Eph 2:16, Col 2:14)
6. by coming to knowledge of the truth ( 1Tim 2:4, Heb 10:26)?
7. by believing in Christ (Jn 3:16, Acts 16:31)?
8. by repentance (Acts 2:38, 2Pet 3:9) ?
9. by baptism (Jn 3:5, 1Pet 3:21, Titus 3:5) ?
10. by Declaring with our mouths (Lk 12:8, Rom 10:9)?
11. saved by hope. Rom 8 :24
12. Saved by faith working in love Gal 5:6
13. Saved by Works of obedience- doing the will of the Father _ Matt 7:21, Mat 19:16-17, Jn 14:21
14. Saved by feeding the hungry, sheltering the homeless, = WORKS of LOVE etc Math 25:35-46
15. Saved by converting the sinner James 5:19
16. by works of Love of God and neighbor (James 2:24, Rom 2:2-8)
17. By faith (Rom 3:28, 5:1, Gal 3:24)
18. Not by works (Works of Jewish Law most alwasys related to Circumcision) (Gal 2:16 , Eph 2L9 NOTHING to do with WORKS OF LOVE & Obedience WHICH ARE NECESSARY, & come by grace
19. Not saved by faith alone James 2:24
20. Faith Without Works of Love is Nothing 1Cor 13:2

Can we cut any one of these out of the list and proclaim it “alone” as the means of salvation? Can we be saved without faith? without God’s Grace? without repentance? without baptism? without the Spirit? These are all necessary:" not one of them can be dismissed as a means of obtaining eternal life. Neither can one be emphasized to the exclusion of another. They are all involved in salvation and entry into the church.

In Summary We are Called to Know, to Love &to Serve God So we might enjoy eternal Happiness with God in heaven… Works of love of God &of our neighbor are necessary; the ability to Obey God, give love to God/neighbor & have faith all come by the grace of God.

 

[Duane1966]

Well, it is false because you aren’t a Protestant (and neither am I, btw).

Sorry for the long delay in answering back. This is why I asked the question that you answered above. If there are a 100 parts to a statement, if even one part of the statement is false, then the whole statement is false. Every time you have said we are justified by faith alone, you have had to qualify it by stating you are talking about initial justification. My answer, then say "we are initially justified by faith alone. The statement we are justified by faith alone is false because being justified is not just a one time event. If it were a one time event, how could we lose it, which you say we can when I asked you if we could here’:

Yes, of course.

and regain it, as you agree we can here?:

Or else you would have to be rebaptised if you apostatised and came back.

Now you have stated that works are essential to justification when asked if we could lose justification by not doing works here:

Yes,

So when you say we are justified by faith alone, that is a falsehood, because you always have to qualify it by saying initial justification. But initial justification is just one part of being justified.

I liken it to someone saying that: * “Duane has blue eyes”.* If I say "no you are wrong I have brown eyes", under your paradigm it is perfectly okay for the person to come back and say: "I am not wrong because you were born with blue eyes, you only have brown eyes now, so that makes my statement true because I am really talking about the initial color of your eyes, even though I never said that, initially. And when I continue to say it, I will still say you have blue eyes, even though currently, you don’t.

Doesn’t saying we are justified by faith and works really cover the whole spectrum of justification?

 

[benhur]

Still wondering if the Good Samaritan had faith in Christ, or what John 5:29 means.

Where it says those who have DONE GOOD DEEDS will be going to heaven. Not, those who had FAITH IN ME.

I am still wondering if it was just FAITH ALONE what the entire point of Matthew 25:31-46 is.

Or where it says in Romans ch 2 that God will render judgement on each person according to THEIR DEEDS.

Or where it says BLESSED ARE THE MERCIFUL, for they SHALL RECEIVE MERCY. What does it mean by MERCIFUL? Acts of mercy? Like what?

I am still trying to understand when Christ says NOT ALL THOSE WHO SAY LORD LORD WILL ENTER BUT ONLY THOSE WHO DO MY FATHERS WILL.

How about where it says you can have faith to MOVE MOUNTAINS, but if you do not HAVE LOVE then you have nothing.

Are all those verses just irrelevant or they do not mean what they say they mean? Is it that I am just reading it wrong?

I think the opening post answers you. One is justified before men and the other before God.

The judgement of a believers works has little to do with being justified. That is, being saved by faith alone does not mean our works thereafter will not be judged. Just that the judging has nothing to do with salvation, but our rewards or loss of them, and our placement and role in the new kingdom.

As to your “Lord, Lord…” scripture, those professing faith at times shall not enter, just as assuredly as at times those doing good works shall not enter per another scripture.

Blessings

 

[guanophore]

I think the opening post answers you. One is justified before men and the other before God.

This is an eisegesis… There is nothing in the text to support such a presupposition. It is just a ruse to avoid the rightful role of works in salvation, and discount what James is saying. Luther called James a letter of straw.

The judgement of a believers works has little to do with being justified. being saved by faith alone does not mean our works thereafter will not be judged. Just that the judging has nothing to do with salvation, but our rewards or loss of them, and our placement and role in the new kingdom.

This perspective represents a significant departure to what the Apostles believed and taught.

 

[guanophore]

But here is what the bible says:

2Cor5:17. “Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a. new creature: old things are passed away; behold all things are become new”.

In salvation, the spirit is regenerated and God puts us in Christ. This “in Christ” position is the actual reason we are righteous. V.21 explains that we are "the righteousness of God in Him.
GOD DOES NOT AND CANNOT MAKE MAN RIGHTEOUS in himself because the only righteousness in the universe is Christ. Christ ALONE is the righteousness of God. That can never be changed, but scripture says that God puts us in Christ, and that is a good place to be. Paul says in Ph.3:9 “And be found in Him, not having my own righteousness”.

I think describing it as “makes him righteous in himself” may not be the best way to phrase it. What God does is place His Spirit of righteousness within us to cause us to will and to do His good pleasure. The righteousness comes from God, but it is at work in and through us to produce the works He has designed for us to complete. As we walk in that righteousness, we are transformed by it, becoming sanctified.
eazyduzit;13401730:

Then you have said that you “depend on your works to keep you justified”.

This may not be expressing the sense of it because it lacks the point that the works are produced in us by grace, through faith… It is God who is at work within us that keeps us justified. We see the evidence of that grace in our works.

This is nothing other than a performance based relationship.

I can understand how it might seem that way to you, because you don’t seem to believe that God’s grace actually transforms us and creates righteousness inside us. But in any case, the fact that Catholics see the role of works differently does not mean that our relationship with God is “performance based”. Our relationship with God is based on grace, through faith. A valid faith will perform. Faith works through love.

This is exactly what we can’t accept.
We cannot compromise on these things.

Peace

Eazy

Who is the royal “we” for whom you speak?

For the record, Catholicism does not teach these things, though there may be some misguided Catholics who don’t properly understand the role of grace expressing itself through faith and works.

I challenge you to find anything in the catechism that offers this distorted “performance based” relationship with God!

 

[benhur]

This is an eisegesis… There is nothing in the text to support such a presupposition. It is just a ruse to avoid the rightful role of works in salvation, and discount what James is saying. Luther called James a letter of straw.

This perspective represents a significant departure to what the Apostles believed and taught.

Hi g,

In short, as you were, you get to the crux of the matter. Indeed it is not just solo fide that is between Catholics and reformed Christians, but also Christ alone, scripture alone and to God’s glory alone (there is one more but it slips my mind) as put put forth by the reformers. My post and your response fit the above like a glove.

Blessings

 

[rcwitness]

Hi g,

In short, as you were, you get to the crux of the matter. Indeed it is not just solo fide that is between Catholics and reformed Christians, but also Christ alone, scripture alone and to God’s glory alone (there is one more but it slips my mind) as put put forth by the reformers. My post and your response fit the above like a glove.

Blessings

Not sure the doctrines of “Christ Alone” and “God’s Glory Alone” are in conflict with Catholic Teaching.

“Faith Alone” and “Scripture Alone” have much in common with the Catholic faith, yet depending on definitions, there is slight differences.

 

[Duane1966]

James is certainly NOT talking about being justified before men. Why would he, or any Christian care what men think? It is only what God thinks that matters. It amazes me to no end the lengths that people will twist scripture (in this case saying James is talking about justification before men), rather than admit that we are justified by faith and works.

James clearly is talking about people who have faith, but do nothing else. They think faith is all that is needed. Yet both he and Jesus condemn that line of thinking. Every time Jesus talks about judgment, IT IS ALWAYS BASED ON OUR WORKS.

 

[Starwarsfan2]

James is certainly NOT talking about being justified before men. Why would he, or any Christian care what men think? It is only what God thinks that matters. It amazes me to no end the lengths that people will twist scripture (in this case saying James is talking about justification before men), rather than admit that we are justified by faith and works.

James clearly is talking about people who have faith, but do nothing else. They think faith is all that is needed. Yet both he and Jesus condemn that line of thinking. Every time Jesus talks about judgment, IT IS ALWAYS BASED ON OUR WORKS.

And it amazes me to see how many will twist Paul to include works in justification,when he explicitly rejected that interpretation.

 

[Duane1966]

And it amazes me to see how many will twist Paul to include works in justification,when he explicitly rejected that interpretation.

He rejected works of the law, not works of charity. But Paul is pretty explicit here. From Dave Armstrong.

Scripture doesn’t teach faith alone at all; thus the fathers do not, either. In fact, the only time the phrase appears in the Bible, it is expressly denied:

James 2:24 You see that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone.

Paul states:

Romans 3:28 For we hold that a man is justified by faith **apart from works of law.** (cf. 3:20; 3:24: "justified by his grace as a gift")

But saying “justified by faith” is different from saying “justified by faith alone”. The “works of the law” he refers to here are not all works, but things like circumcision. In other words, we are saved apart from Jewish rituals required under Mosaic Law. Paul makes clear that this is what he has in mind, in referencing circumcision in 3:1, asking rhetorically, “Are we Jews any better off? No, not at all” (3:9), multiple references to “the law” (3:19-21, 28, 31), and the following statement:

Romans 3:29-30 Or is God the God of Jews only? Is he not the God of Gentiles also? Yes, of Gentiles also, [30] since God is one; and he will justify the circumcised on the ground of their faith and the uncircumcised through their faith.

Paul is not against all “works” per se; he tied them directly to salvation, after all, in the previous chapter:

Romans 2:6-8 For he will render to every man **according to his works:** [7] to those who by patience in well-doing seek for glory and honor and immortality, he will give eternal life; [8] but for those who are factious and do not obey the truth, but obey wickedness, there will be wrath and fury.(cf. 2:13: "the doers of the law who will be justified")