Ford Motor Company Supports Homosexual Marriage Movement

[Brad]

Richardols:

Thomas Monaghan, the Catholic who used to own Domino’s Pizza gave a lot of his money to charity, much to pro-life organizations. Some pro-choice organizations wanted to boycott Domino’s because it was supporting pro-life.

Monaghan said that customers were exchanging their dollars for his pizza, and they should have no say about where the profits went, as pizza buyers got the value they expected for their money.

How is the business with Ford any different? You give Monaghan or Ford your money, they give you a pizza or a car in exchange. End of transaction.

That is extremely simple thinking. Customers have every right to care about where profits are going if they so desire. If Monaghan were churning up a holocaust or slavery factory in a side business then people had better care. The fact that some wanted to protest his business because he is using his profits to oppose the holocaust of the unborn is there perogative, as misguided and demnted as it may be.

 

[Swiss_Guard]

TPJCatholic:

Swiss Guard,

Tell me, if Cook County Hospital was in the side business of selling illegal drugs to minors within cook country schools, and they purchased the drugs by using tax money from cook county gas stations…would you still purchase gas at those stations?

I answered this question when I said I buy gas in DuPage County unless the needle is on ‘E’ and I’m too far from a surrounding county. You can keep asking the question but you will get the same answer.

TPJCatholic:

Indirectly supporting sinful behaivor is not always sinful and I never said that it would be a sin to buy gas in cook county. The point is really about making choices. Do we want to advance a more moral culture, or do we ignore the culture and do whatever we please?

Why do you think I purchase gas in DuPage, Lake, Kane or Winnebago Counties? I purchase gas in Winnebago County when I attend the ICR Indult Mass in Rockford. Gas is cheaper there, but i digress.

---

You seem to be suggesting it is a sin from the following sentence.

TPJCatholic:

If Cardinal George has alternatives and does not take them, that is his choice. If he has no real alternatives, then there is no real problem.

If Cardinal George has an alternative and doesn’t take it, he’s committing a sin? Cardinal George could close all the Catholic schools in Cook County and keep open the ones in Lake County (Archdiocese of Chicago extends to Cook and Lake Counties). You seem to be saying anyone who buys gas in Cook County is complicit in abortion, which means they are excommunicated:

Can. 1398 A person who procures a completed abortion incurs a latae sententiae excommunication.
vatican.va/archive/ENG1104/__P57.HTM

Are you suggesting that any Catholic who buys gas in Cook County or shops at a retail store that gives money to organizations that promote an agenda contrary to the Catholic faith is guilty of sin? If so, then Cardinal George, the auxiliary bishops and most priests along with most of the faithful are automatically excommunicated for buying gas in Cook County.

---

Again, unless you can provide some documentation to support your claim, you should re-think what you have said.

 

[GloriaPatri4]

norbert:

Would you support a company that actively discriminated against gays? Is that what Jesus would do? I

I would not support a company that actively discriminates against homosexuals unless by discrimination you mean a company that financially supports pro-family (marriage between a man and woman) groups. Some may view this as discrimination.

The Catechism speaks of “**unjust discrimination.” **Is it not just dicrimination to oppose Homosexual activity? Would these words discriminate against homosexuals “Under no circumstances can they be approved.” ?

from the Catechism of the Catholic Church

**Chastity and homosexuality ****2357 **Homosexuality refers to relations between men or between women who experience an exclusive or predominant sexual attraction toward persons of the same sex. It has taken a great variety of forms through the centuries and in different cultures. Its psychological genesis remains largely unexplained. Basing itself on Sacred Scripture, which presents homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity,140 tradition has always declared that "homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered."141 They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity. Under no circumstances can they be approved.

**2358 **The number of men and women who have deep-seated homosexual tendencies is not negligible. This inclination, which is objectively disordered, constitutes for most of them a trial. They must be accepted with respect, compassion, and sensitivity. Every sign of unjust discrimination in their regard should be avoided. These persons are called to fulfill God’s will in their lives and, if they are Christians, to unite to the sacrifice of the Lord’s Cross the difficulties they may encounter from their condition.

vatican.va/archive/catechism/p3s2c2a6.htm#I

 

[buffalo]

Brad:

That is extremely simple thinking. Customers have every right to care about where profits are going if they so desire. If Monaghan were churning up a holocaust or slavery factory in a side business then people had better care. The fact that some wanted to protest his business because he is using his profits to oppose the holocaust of the unborn is there perogative, as misguided and demnted as it may be.

Yeah, if he had owned Nike they would have been all over him.

 

[oat_soda]

…This inclination, which is objectively disordered, constitutes for most of them a trial. They must be accepted with respect, compassion, and sensitivity. …

CCC 2358 applies to everyone. this does not mean that homosexuals have an excuse or permit to indulge in this perversion of sexuality. we all have trials, life is one big trial for each of us in different ways. that’s why Jesus told us to take up our cross. we are to avoid treating everyone unjustly, not just homosexuals.

the main point is that homosexuality is always objectively disordered and thus sinful if consented on, even just in thought. because it is more twisted and unatural then same sex lust, it is more evil and contrary to the dignity of people.

i drive a volvo now. it’s a great car but i’ll never buy one again. sweden must be the most gay of all countries. they make me sick.

 

[TPJCatholic]

swiss guard,

You seem to have a personal obessession with sin (no insult intended).

I did not say that buying gas in cook county was a sinful act…you are the one saying that. A given action does not have to be declared sinful in order to know it is something to stay away from. I do not get the impression that you are a “do the minimum” type Catholic…in other words I seriously doubt you are a go to Mass only on Sundays and nothing else type Catholic, I think you care far more then that. Yet, if one goes to Mass only on Sundays and Holy Days, they are not sinning–we can agree on that right? Likewise, there are plenty of things to avoid even if they are not sinful…

On a personal level I have a great deal of admiration and respect for Cardinal George. I live in cook county (suburb), and Cardinal George has helped me personally on several occasions…I consider him to be one of our nation’s best Cardinals. I am not about to say that the good Cardinal or any other person has sinned if they buy gas in cook county. It is quite possible that the Cardinal is not aware of the situation, or that he has already addressed the matter with the city as best he could…either way my point has nothing to do with avoiding sin, it has to do with advancing the Gospel of and life in general. We are all called to do everything we can to advance the Gospel and life in general. While it is likely not sinful to buy gas in cook county (give to Ceasar what belongs to Ceasar through mandatory civil taxation), there are more productive Gospel based ways to spend our money. If people have alternatives and they are aware of a problem, then they should take those alternatives. Yet not taking the alternative is not always a sin and I never said it was.

Again, it is not about sin, and I sure hope you are not saying you will not take a given action unless the Church formally declares something is a sin.

If we collectively send messages to many companies about their support of sinful behaivor, then we can have a postive impact on the culture–which is exactly what Jesus calls us to do–we are to help bring the truth to the world and we cannot do that if we ignore the problems.

 

[TPJCatholic]

It comes down to this:

If there is something we CAN do to help the culture, then we should do it…that does not mean we will get it right everytime, or even that we will know what to do all the time–it just means that if there is something we can do, then we should just go ahead and do it. If one person is in a large rowboat and pulling an oar all alone, that person will not get very far–yet if many people are pulling on oars (even if they are not strong, or even if they do not contribute a lot), then the boat can advance quite nicely.

Let us all try to advance the boat of Jesus’ Gospel in every way that we can, no matter how big or small. In the scheme of things no buying a Ford is not even a drop in an ocean, yet if we all take actions together, we can and will transform the world.

 

[GloriaPatri4]

TPJCatholic:

It comes down to this:

If there is something we CAN do to help the culture, then we should do it…that does not mean we will get it right everytime, or even that we will know what to do all the time–it just means that if there is something we can do, then we should just go ahead and do it. If one person is in a large rowboat and pulling an oar all alone, that person will not get very far–yet if many people are pulling on oars (even if they are not strong, or even if they do not contribute a lot), then the boat can advance quite nicely.

Let us all try to advance the boat of Jesus’ Gospel in every way that we can, no matter how big or small. In the scheme of things no buying a Ford is not even a drop in an ocean, yet if we all take actions together, we can and will transform the world.

 

[Richardols]

ichabod:

The Ford Foundation is one of the biggest contributors to Planned Parenthood, so much so that when I brought this up to my neighbors and they researched it themselves, they sold both of their Fords and bought something else.

It seems to me that selling the cars was pointless as Ford already made its profit from them and had the discretionary amounts available to give to PP.

 

[GloriaPatri4]

Richardols:

It seems to me that selling the cars was pointless as Ford already made its profit from them and had the discretionary amounts available to give to PP.

It wasn’t pointless if they were trying to make a point regardless if Ford had already made its profit.

A little off the point: Imagine if Harley Davidson motorcycles was bought up by a Pro-homosexual corporation which was run by 90% of a homosexual staff and they mainly targeted gays in their marketing ads which caused many homosexuals to purchase the motorcycles pretty soon Harley Davidson motorcycles would no longer be viewed as the macho manly bike. Would it be pointless for all the herterosexual men to sell their hogs? Just a thought.

 

[Richardols]

GloriaPatri4:

It wasn’t pointless if they were trying to make a point regardless if Ford had already made its profit.

A point to whom? If they had refused to buy a new Ford, it would have hit Ford in the pocket. But, by selling their car used? Just like millions of people do every day?

Did they think someone was going to say, “I hear the folks down the block sold their Explorer. Must have been to protest Ford’s social agenda.”

 

[TPJCatholic]

richardols,

It is never pointless to make a decision to choose life. It makes no difference that Ford already made their profit…those are people who will not buy Ford again and they will likely tell people why they dumped their Ford cars. It was a very productive thing for them personally and for all those who hear about it. They will likely take a financial hit because of their dumping the cars, yet that did not matter to them…it was important to them to make a message, even if that message is to their neighbors and family and it is quite possible that they sent a letter to Ford as well.

One person at a time…live your life as a Christian right where you are in the middle of the world. Try to work on your own life, then as you can try to impact other lives…a dam does not reveal its many leaks unless the leaks grow…if we are determined to live and spread the Gospel, the culture will find it has many leaks.

One single person at a time…it does not take a conversion of thousands at one time…just one person at a time.

 

[Richardols]

I am reminded of the grape boycotts of a few decades ago. Even after the growers changed their ways, people only remembered the admonition to boycott grapes, and kept up the boycott. Everyone suffered - the growers and especially the workers, who were supposed to have been helped.

Do what you will. It’s a personal decision. Frankly, I think I do better to picket an abortionist than to rely on the extreme subtlety of not buying even a used Ford to get the message across.

 

[GloriaPatri4]

Richardols:

A point to whom? If they had refused to buy a new Ford, it would have hit Ford in the pocket. But, by selling their car used? Just like millions of people do every day?

Did they think someone was going to say, “I hear the folks down the block sold their Explorer. Must have been to protest Ford’s social agenda.”

Maybe they weren’t trying to make a point to anyone. Maybe it was for their own comfort level.

Let’s say you were the employee at a company that was responsible for hiring maketing/advertising firms and your boss told you “we really need to reach out to married homosexual couple with kids I’m putting you in charge to let the marketing/advertising firm know what we want”. Would you be comfortable with doing this or would you protest and risk your job?

 

[TPJCatholic]

richardols,

And…I think we are called to do everything we can. There was a sucessful boycott against Dairy Queen several years ago, I am sure that all of there boycotting customers have not returned, yet they were supporting the murder of babies…it is not surprising that people would take a while to go back.

One thing I know, companies are in business to make a profit and if enough people boycott a given company, they will either change their ways, or they will collapse.

I hear you about employeees, etc…yet should a company be able to exist if they are directly supporting murdering babies or supporting sinful activity that is bad for society?

 

[TPJCatholic]

gloria,

Even if the neighbors did it just for their own peace of mind, the Holy Spirit has an amazing way of using such actions. After all, people on this thread now know about what they did…and who knows how many others will know about it over time.

 

[Richardols]

TPJCatholic:

One thing I know, companies are in business to make a profit and if enough people boycott a given company, they will either change their ways, or they will collapse.

Dairy Queen is a lot, lot weaker than Ford and was far more susceptible to pressure.

I hear you about employeees, etc…yet should a company be able to exist if they are directly supporting murdering babies

Directly supporting murder? If you put it that way, of course not.

or supporting sinful activity that is bad for society?

Like a brewery or distillery?

 

[TPJCatholic]

richardols,

Actually, I think Ford is in far more vulberable position then DQ. They are only one two domestic car makers left, and they are not known for making great products (except for maybe their truck line). Their profit margins are always being cut into by the Japanese autos. They cannot afford to lose any customers.

Abortion is murder.

Breweries are not sinful, there is nothing wrong with beverages containing alchohol–it is the abuse of alchohol that is wrong.

 

[Richardols]

TPJCatholic:

Breweries are not sinful, there is nothing wrong with beverages containing alchohol–it is the abuse of alchohol that is wrong.

You said “supporting” sinful activity. They are, by producing a product so easily abused,

 

[TPJCatholic]

richardols,

No, there is nothing wrong with beer.