Gay Marriage and the End of Christian Civilization

[DawnInTexas]

Father Corapi didn’t say anything in any of those talks that was contrary to what I said. He even has a video on youtube called “fear is useless” which furthers my point that this doom and gloom thing that we have going on in this topic does not fit with Catholic teachings. Again I never said sin wasn’t damaging to society, I agreed that it was. I have no problems with anything Father Corapi said, I am merely contesting the idea that gay marriage is somehow special in that it symbolizes the “End of Christian Civilization.”

Doom and Gloom?

Like we pray at Mass each day:

As we wait in Joyful Hope, for the Coming of Our Savior, Jesus Christ.

Joyful.

Also, the article for the OP is a commentary by Father Euteneuer, who is just as powerful a voice today as Father Corapi. Father Euteneuer is an Exorcist. Father Corapi has stated he has a Charism of God the Holy Spirit (for speaking). They, among others have warned us where our Country is heading.

Father Euteneuer’s Commentary says one thing-you say another.

Time will tell then, won’t it?

As we wait in Joyful Hope.

God Bless.
+Jesus, I Trust In You.
Love, Dawn

 

[kenofken]

I have a sister who works as a Librarian in a Catholic University. She said the Franciscans she is around every day leave everything in God’s Hands, and don’t worry about it.

However-they don’t attempt to argue with others that everything is well in the world.

I truly believe the world is sick, and needs the Divine Physician.

Pope Leo XIII’s Vision of the Period Satan was granted a special time to attempt to destroy the Church is coming to an end. It is the End of an Era, not the world.

One of the names is the “Triumph of the Immaculate Heart of Mary.” Scripture speaks of her heel crushing the head of the Serpent.

Then, the period of peace-where Christ in the Holy Eucharist reigns- where Satan is chained until a short time before the end of the world will follow.

The chain that chains Satan in hell for a thousand years-is the Rosary. Pray it!

God Bless.
+Jesus, I Trust In You!
Love, Dawn

If God loved humanity enough to sacrifice his own son to break Satan’s hold on the world, why would he then allow Satan free reign to undo his work? I know I’ve been out of Catholicism quite a while, but I distinctly remember that God was, you know, against Satan and at least somewhat more powerful.

 

[Charlotte1776]

It sounds like many people are trying to brush this issue off as not a big deal, but it really, really is. Marriage and family form the basis of society. When you start messing with the bedrock of society, there will be major repercussions. In countries where gay “marriage” has been legal for several years, for instance, the number of straight people who get married has fallen off a cliff. Marriage has been completely devalued and children are growing up in unstable, broken homes. And you don’t have to look hard to find out how damaging that is.
And if gay “marriage” is made legal, people who oppose it for moral reasons are legally vulnerable. In many countries, such as Canada, speaking out against homosexuality is a hate crime and people have been sent to jail for it. If this isn’t stopped, that’s where America is headed. This isn’t something Christians should just accept without a fight.

 

[PatrickSebast]

I agree. The end times must be nearer than we think.

Here’s a small list:

-Legal Abortion

-Legal building of mosques over war sites of radical Islamic militants

-Legal Homosexual Marriage

-Legal fiat currency not backed by gold - “monopoly” money

If anything I have said is against the Catholic Church, let it be anathema.

Every generation of the faithful since the time of Christ has demonstrated the belief we were in end times. Every generation has also had evidence similar to yours that they like to point to. In this case you seem to be focusing especially on America and what is happening here to back your claim. Why is America so special, sure it is important as a world Superpower, but why should God given any precedence to the things happening in one particular piece of the world? The Chinese government is allowing their people more and more freedoms, the Church is booming in South America and the conditions there are steadily improving. Middle Eastern civilians have been showing increasing level of unrest with the natures of their government and the actions of terrorist organizations. Some things in the world are changing for the better, but likewise I could mention negatives about all of these places. Judging the arrival of end times is so difficult that the Church fathers and saints have messed it up, and certainly should not be a task for laity.

Rather than worrying about the end of the world we should realize that our own personal end could come any minute and act accordingly. Looking for evidence to match the prophecies is best left to the Church.

 

[wisdomseeker]

well, some good news for us, at least for now. gays cannot marry in California.

 

[PatrickSebast]

It sounds like many people are trying to brush this issue off as not a big deal, but it really, really is. Marriage and family form the basis of society. When you start messing with the bedrock of society, there will be major repercussions. In countries where gay “marriage” has been legal for several years, for instance, the number of straight people who get married has fallen off a cliff. Marriage has been completely devalued and children are growing up in unstable, broken homes. And you don’t have to look hard to find out how damaging that is.
And if gay “marriage” is made legal, people who oppose it for moral reasons are legally vulnerable. In many countries, such as Canada, speaking out against homosexuality is a hate crime and people have been sent to jail for it. If this isn’t stopped, that’s where America is headed. This isn’t something Christians should just accept without a fight.

It isn’t that I think this isn’t an issue of importance, I just don’t think it is of particular importance compared to any of the major legislations that have impacted the structure of marriage in the past. People are treating the issue like we suddenly jumped down a flight of stairs when really all we have done is taken another step. American society has been moving away from being a Christian society for decades and it has never really been a Catholic society.

 

[DawnInTexas]

If God loved humanity enough to sacrifice his own son to break Satan’s hold on the world, why would he then allow Satan free reign to undo his work? I know I’ve been out of Catholicism quite a while, but I distinctly remember that God was, you know, against Satan and at least somewhat more powerful.

Ask Him when you see Him.

Why did He have to become one of His own creatures, come down here, and be tortured and killed by his creation-in order to redeem us?

If you look at the last 100 years (roughly the 20th Century)—man has come farther than all of time before that. Man now has electricity, clean running water, plumbing in the home, radio, television, computers, automobiles, airplanes, trains, air conditioning, heating, telephones…man is “into” himself, and doesn’t need God.

Each of us has someone in their family who has fallen away from God, don’t we? My family does have its share-plus. Many who don’t need to go to Church, they’re “good people” and they believe that’s all that’s necessary.

Like boiling frogs.

God Bless.
+Dominus Vobiscum.
Love, Dawn

Click Here: Benedict and the End of the World

 

[Los_Angeles]

… Why is America so special, sure it is important as a world Superpower, but why should God given any precedence to the things happening in one particular piece of the world?..

You hit the nail on the head with that question.

America is special because of the blood spilled by our men and women in the armed forces to defend all Americans and our freedoms and the Constitution of the United States of America, which allows us the freedom of religion and speech which allows us to speculate about end times, which as events start to unfold that that potentially desire to harm our country such as Homosexual “marriage” occur.

 

[PatrickSebast]

You hit the nail on the head with that question.

America is special because of the blood spilled by our men and women in the armed forces to defend all Americans and our freedoms and the Constitution of the United States of America, which allows us the freedom of religion and speech which allows us to speculate about end times, which as events start to unfold that that potentially desire to harm our country such as Homosexual “marriage” occur.

There are people of other countries who spilled their blood to defend freedoms. And some of those freedoms included religious freedoms. America is in no way unique on that front.

 

[irishpatrick]

The cases had NO topic INSIDE marriage. They were totally unconnected. Irrelevant. If you want to claim that you also think that gays should die, or that persons should be free to public say so without reference to the Bible, then have at it. Right here.

Otherwise, back to gay marriage and whether churches will HAVE TO marry people. Again, there is NO EVIDENCE that anything is moving this way. Not even IN CANADA.

Please…read the title of this thread. It is not just about gay marriage, it is also about the “End of Christian Civilization,” which is the major thrust behind my points: that we are seeing the end of Christian civilization and that gay marriage is part of that.

As for gays, I love them as I love all people and the very thought of saying some of those vile things is just as disgusting and wrong to me, as it is to you–we will both agree such statements should be condemned, but my point really had nothing to do with those statements.

In the end, I am asking you and others to simply look around and see what “IS” actually going on.

 

[larkin31]

Please…read the title of this thread. It is not just about gay marriage, it is also about the “End of Christian Civilization,” which is the major thrust behind my points: that we are seeing the end of Christian civilization and that gay marriage is part of that.

As for gays, I love them as I love all people and the very thought of saying some of those vile things is just as disgusting and wrong to me, as it is to you–we will both agree such statements should be condemned, but my point really had nothing to do with those statements.

In the end, I am asking you and others to simply look around and see what “IS” actually going on.

no no

I mean that when the Canada cases came up, it was in a discussion of the dangers of opposing gay marriage. Then I read the cases, and they had NOTHING to do with opposing gay marriage. They were requests that gays be killed.

Did you mean that hate laws protecting groups from death wishes are part of the destruction of society? I just don’;t understand how you could have read these cases AND then referrred to them to help your point about homosexuality and culture. The cases were about publicly (not in a church, mind you) stating that one wishes a group of non-criminal citizens to die or be executed.

 

[irishpatrick]

There are people of other countries who spilled their blood to defend freedoms. And some of those freedoms included religious freedoms. America is in no way unique on that front.

True, yet the USA is unique in all history in its foundation of:

1. In God we trust.
2. Liberty for all.
3. Out of many, one (E Pluribus Unum).

The left wants to get rid of the first two, which will end the Christian era.

 

[irishpatrick]

no no

I mean that when the Canada cases came up, it was in a discussion of the dangers of opposing gay marriage. Then I read the cases, and they had NOTHING to do with opposing gay marriage. They were requests that gays be killed.

Did you mean that hate laws protecting groups from death wishes are part of the destruction of society? I just don’;t understand how you could have read these cases AND then referrred to them to help your point about homosexuality and culture. The cases were about publicly (not in a church, mind you) stating that one wishes a group of non-criminal citizens to die or be executed.

I do not care about the content, my point is that Canada has hate crimes laws protecting gays, making gays in a very real way a special class. The truth is when someone says that about any person (gay or straight or from mars) it is immoral and wrong.

I am 100% against hate crimes laws, I think they serve a perverse purpose, yet we have them anyway. If a person is attacked, it is a crime and the person doing the attacking should be punished for the crime. For example: say person X attacks person Y, and does harm to that person–he should face legal punishment. Yet, under hate crimes laws if person X attacked Y out of what some court thinks was hate, than X will receive an even greater punishment, which to me is wholly unjust. Yet, I understand the perverse reasons for those laws. Even the term homophobe carries with it an agenda as do hate crimes laws.

A major part of my argument is that in the near future hate crimes laws will be used to force RC churches to marry same sex couples.

 

[larkin31]

A major part of my argument is that in the near future hate crimes laws will be used to force RC churches to marry same sex couples.

And these cases had nothing to do with marriage. A church saying “no” to a potential married couple (it was done to me) has NOTHING to do with hate crime legislation.

 

[irishpatrick]

A church saying “no” to a potential married couple (it was done to me) has NOTHING to do with hate crime legislation.

I agree, today that is wholly accurate. It won’t be true within ten years…that is what I have been saying over and over. What is true today, will not be so in the near future and hate crimes laws will form the foundation for those changes.

If hate crimes laws can be passed making crimes appear to be worse than they already are, than they can certainly be used against churches if the left finds the right judge to hear their cases (think of CA and how the left shopped their case to Judge Walker).

 

[larkin31]

I agree, today that is wholly accurate. It won’t be true within ten years…that is what I have been saying over and over. What is true today, will not be so in the near future and hate crimes laws will form the foundation for those changes.

I KNOW that you have been repeating this. You simply have no rational basis for thinking it is true.

If hate crimes laws can be passed making crimes appear to be worse than they already are, than they can certainly be used against churches if the left finds the right judge to hear their cases (think of CA and how the left shopped their case to Judge Walker).

Saying no to a wedding couple in a church has never been a crime. Nor is it now, even in states/countries with gay marriage rights. You are irrational about this. Churches have been and continue to be free to refuse to marry whom they choose. I repeat: I was refused the sacramental marriage in a Catholic church. NO CRIME WAS COMMITTED IN DOING SO.

The comment about Judge Walker is more smokescreen irrelevancy.

 

[irishpatrick]

I KNOW that you have been repeating this. You simply have no rational basis for thinking it is true.

Saying no to a wedding couple in a church has never been a crime. Nor is it now, even in states/countries with gay marriage rights. You are irrational about this. Churches have been and continue to be free to refuse to marry whom they choose. I repeat: I was refused the sacramental marriage in a Catholic church. NO CRIME WAS COMMITTED IN DOING SO.

The comment about Judge Walker is more smokescreen irrelevancy.

I disagree (surprise right). Things will change over the next 5-10 years, watch and see. Thanks for the (name removed by moderator)ut though.

 

[larkin31]

I disagree (surprise right). Things will change over the next 5-10 years, watch and see. Thanks for the (name removed by moderator)ut though.

Change is universal, even in the RCC (albeit at a glacial pace, there)

But the change you fear will not happen in the next 10 years.

 

[irishpatrick]

Change is universal, even in the RCC (albeit at a glacial pace, there)

But the change you fear will not happen in the next 10 years.

I believe it will…time will tell.

I have a question for you. If it is okay to redefine marriage to be any two people, than why can’t marriage be defined to any arrangement (two men and two women, etc.)?

Try to logically explain why marriage cannot be opened to any loving arrangement?

 

[Tigg]

The idea that gay marriage is somehow special in that it is going to be the death of stable American society when legalized divorce, abortion, birth control, etc. haven’t done it is crazy. Society does not collapse as a result of one thing and the idea that previous societies have collapsed because of the acceptance of homosexuality is completely unsupportable. History is not so well recorded that we can determine the specifics of any societies collapse unless it was a result of something obvious like war, famine, or disease. Even if Christian Civilization does collapse in the near future it won’t be because gays were allowed to marry, it may be a contributing factor, but we do ourselves a great disservice whenever we latch onto one issue like this. There are more battles going on than than homosexual marriage and if we were to somehow win that battle while ignoring all the others we wouldn’t really be any better off.

What the majority simply do not acknowledge is that same sex marriage is very much a part of the prevalent anti-life force of one larger issue - that of controlling the world’s population. It ultimately serves the same purpose as abortion and/or contraception. It is but another method of altering the growth rate of what the enemies of God consider to be an overpopulated earth. If the anti-life forces cannot get their message across to control the population and conserve the world’s resources through abortion, euthanasia and "family planning"such as touted by the United Nations, then they will do so by means of gay marriage which will effectively help put an end to the unwanted numbers of God’s people who were born in His image. It is an affront to the Creator of all Life.