Gays May Be Prosecuted at 2014 Olympics

[LisaA]

So much gold in your post I’d like to respond to, Tarpeian, but I’m going to stick with the link and quote here from that page, because it’s so vitally important that people SEE this:

The following was taken from the Principles and Practices page of a group called B4U-ACT. This ought to be chilling, and I find it particularly appalling when held up against a person here who keeps insisting there’s no ‘logical’ connection.

And will we one day have businesses and vacation plans catering toward child moles…excuse me ‘minor-attracted people?’

The scary thing is, this is all STRAIGHT OUT OF THE PLAY BOOK. Word for word. This is exactly where we’re headed, if something doesn’t change.

Agree, great post by Tarpeian and the link IS chilling in its obvious analogy to the way homosexual activity was “normalized” in a dishonest and insidious manner. Again it’s not a matter of persecuting people, spying on them in their bedrooms, but rather stopping the onslaught of attacks upon traditional values, the sanctity of life and family and their own sacred cow, privacy.

As to my gay/Lesbian friends, I wish them no ill and in fact wish they were not burdened with this disordered desire. It is sadly very strong and very compelling once the road is taken. I’ve always seen homosexuality as analagous to addictive behavior in so many ways. It is hard to quit, maybe even impossible in most cases. I wish our brains didn’t function that way with respect to any self destructive behavior but they do.

That being said, this is yet another reason NOT to mainstream homosexual activity NOT to shove it down the throats of school children NOT to pretend that what happens in Will and Grace or Glee represents the homosexual life. Temptations we succumb to become habits become ingrained become very difficult to leave behind. A confused child or teen who gets attention from an older person, whether homo or heterosexual is vulnerable to abuse. Ask someone who was sexually abused as a child. They thought this was normal and OK because this seemingly kind person introduced them to the sexual activity…

Thus what the Russians are doing sounds cruel to advocates of normalizing homosexual relations but is focused on protecting minors who are vulnerable to predatory adults. If we are to err in zeal, then it should be on the side of protecting the vulnerable, NOT in protecting the sexual desires of adults who should know better than to prey upon children

Lisa

 

[Tucker_R]

100% correct… i’m tired of them actually.

Honestly, I am glad Russia is doing this. At least one country has the cojones to stand up against these bullies wanting to brainwash us into accepting their natural lifestyle as something normal. Don’t let them deceive you these people will attack like a pit-bull if you even hint that you disagree with their lifestyle.

 

[Tucker_R]

Minor attracted ppl ? Wow… I always thought they were pedophiles.

So much gold in your post I’d like to respond to, Tarpeian, but I’m going to stick with the link and quote here from that page, because it’s so vitally important that people SEE this:

The following was taken from the Principles and Practices page of a group called B4U-ACT. This ought to be chilling, and I find it particularly appalling when held up against a person here who keeps insisting there’s no ‘logical’ connection.

And will we one day have businesses and vacation plans catering toward child moles…excuse me ‘minor-attracted people?’

The scary thing is, this is all STRAIGHT OUT OF THE PLAY BOOK. Word for word. This is exactly where we’re headed, if something doesn’t change.

 

[Slavonic]

Don’t trivialize what? That if Joe and Bob grope each other in public they may be fined? Do I think this is a significant human rights breach? No. It’s so ironic that because we have so few REAL attacks on our rights that we react in high dudgeon when some trivial activity may be restricted. There was just a report on a huge sex trafficking case with over 150 sex slaves rescued. Women in many countries, even occasionally in our own, are tortured, beaten, or even killed for minor or even trumped up infractions against Islam. Christians are being slaughtered all over the middle east, including a Syrian Priest who was beheaded recently.

If those issues are more important why waste your time in this thread?

As to same sex attraction being disordered, from a strictly biological basis, it is. From a theological basis it has been deemed so and from a historical basis as well. That the attraction and more importantly the activity is disordered seems to also manifest itself in the disordered desire to make one’s sexual activity the basis for identity as well as demanding public acceptance if not congratulations. I mean truly President Obama thought it important to call and congratulate the first openly homosexual basketball player in the NBA…pathetic. How much do we know (or care) about NBA players sex lives? Why should we? Yet there seems to be this burning desire for public acclaim by announcing that we like boys instead of girls. What other sexual activity produces this crowing and self congratulation?

Sexual acts are not the basis of LGBT identity, sexual orientation is. Sexual orientation describes the primary affections and attractions one feels towards either one or both genders.

As to telling children about homosexual activity, this should be on a need to know. The vast majority of children are going to be normally oriented toward opposite sex relationships. There is simply no reason that all children should be told about homosexual activity on the off chance that child might have an inclination to SSA. This is not a characteristic to be nurtured and promoted as if the child showed early artistic or musical talent. Again it is the selfish and disordered approach that the homosexualist activist group insists that all should be a part of this would be private part of life.

And those children a going to grow up in a world with children who are going to be normally oriented towards same-sex relationships. The fact you call and inclination that could possibly nurtured and ‘promoted’ shows you have a fundamental misunderstanding of LGBT people and human sexuality as a whole.

And it should never be made to seem “normal” or “an equal but alternate lifestyle.”

As children come to understand what homosexuality is, it should be reinforced that this is abnormal behavior; that loving Christian people do not abuse one another in this manner - that it is a selfish, hedonistic activity that produces nothing of value to the family or to society, and indeed can often be a source of public disease.

It’s not a lifestyle, but a life like anyone else’s.

 

[InSearchofGrace]

Population decline is a ridiculous reason. It simply rests on the silly idea that pro-gay means anti-straight. Nothing could be farther from the truth. It’s a lazy pseudo-argument for for those who hold anti-gay sentiments.

Well, you could believe that. It may be more rationalization than a good articulation of a reason offered by the Russian policy makers, but it is undeniable that gays do not contribute to the population. I understand Putin is really concerned about the steep decline in population, bad for Russia, so his eyes are set on growing the citizenry.

This law effectively shuts down the mechanism by which LGBT Russians could bring about positive-change in their society. It muzzles their ability to counter long-held ‘traditional’ misconceptions of LGBT people. You are correct that such social movements cannot be easily exported. The fight is one that must be fought by LGBT Russians themselves. They should be allowed to fight it. And I hope they continue to fight it despite the government’s attempt to stop them.

And Russian leadership would like to address the country’s LGBT issues without the interference of the U.S., the UK and any other supposedly progressive country that has embraced free and open homosexual expression. We are not talking about preventing a segment of the population to pursue learning, to work, socialize, etc.

The Russian government does not have to play dead or be enablers to the expansion of gay rights beyond decriminalization of homosexuality. Yes, they need to address abuses against homosexuals and penalize the abusers, as already mentioned.

The "Think of the children’ sentiment is also bogus. If a child can handle knowing straight people exist, they can handle knowing LGBT people exist. The child I’d be concerned for is the child that one day, between the ages of 13-18, realizes he or she is LGBT and they are stuck in a Russia where there was no LGBT movement to make a better world for him or her.

I disagree that the concern for children is a bogus sentiment. The government is looking to a better Russia for everyone, not just for the LGBTs.

It’s clear you endorse this relatively new social experiment born from the gay movement. Would society in the long run be better off when the gay youth in America or in the UK for example are prodded to go ahead to live full expression of homosexuality, that it would bring about healthier and more fulfilled lives?

We can look at the Dutch experience. Consider that homosexual acts have been legal there since 1811, and the Dutch were first in providing protections to homosexuals in employment, in provision of goods and services, indirect discrimination through hate speech (always decided in favor of homosexuals), same sex “marriage” since April 2001, joint and step adoption of kids by same sex couples, service in the military, right to change legal gender, access to IVF for lesbians, etc. There are even designated places in public parks there where gays can have sex as long as they throw the used condoms properly! Yet, suicidal ideation in adult Dutch homosexuals remains to be a problem, even as the public widely supports tolerance and equal rights for LGBT people.

The concern for Olympians is a minor concern, but some may wish to do something for their LGBT brethren in Russia. I, and I assume many others, are concerned not so much for visitors, but for LGBT people in Russia. Russia is there country too. They need to have the ability to stand up for themselves. To relate to your story, imagine a Christian in Saudi Arabia who had to spend his or her entire life there. Being a visitor and being a native are two different things.

Well, the discussion started from the news about the new Russian law that could and should serve as a trip advisory for gay athletes and visitors who would be attending the Sochi Olympics.

True, Russian LGBT groups need to work out the liberties they can exercise given the political and social climate in their country. It has been mentioned in this thread that homosexuality has been decriminalized 20 years ago and there is need by the government to address existing problems of abuse against homosexuals. However, do you know that LGBTs in Russia have partnered with P***y Riot (a vulgar name, but that is the name of the in-your-face activist feminist group in Russia). You can google it. PR and LGBTs taunt the ROC and the government. That certainly puts the Russian gays in not the best negotiating angle with the Putin administration and I imagine future administrations.

As with more repressive countries like SA in the Middle East, gays indeed have little freedom and are persecuted in worse ways. Perhaps Obama and Cameron and all well meaning LGBT pressure groups in the West should better address that first, instead of selling gay “marriage” to the world like there are vast regions and cultures which would be receptive to such a radical social experiment.
,

 

[LisaA]

If those issues are more important why waste your time in this thread?

Sexual acts are not the basis of LGBT identity, sexual orientation is. Sexual orientation describes the primary affections and attractions one feels towards either one or both genders.

And those children a going to grow up in a world with children who are going to be normally oriented towards same-sex relationships. The fact you call and inclination that could possibly nurtured and ‘promoted’ shows you have a fundamental misunderstanding of LGBT people and human sexuality as a whole.

It’s not a lifestyle, but a life like anyone else’s.

I’m “wasting time” on this issue because I want to disabuse you and anyone else of the notion that ginning up hysteria over whether Joe and Bob can wear their rainbow tee shirts or hold hands at the Olympics is anything but trivial. That you and other homosexual apologists try to make this far more significant than it is, is the reason I want to provide the counter position.

And yes it IS about sexual ACTIVITY not orientation. If someone were simply attracted to the same sex but determined to live a chase life and not succumb to this desire he/she would not be marching in “Gay Pride” parades. It’s all about what you want to do, not what you are thinking. This disordered desire manifests itself in the obsession with making one’s sex life a public issue. I suspect there are many people in any crowd that have shall I say non-traditional sexual thoughts and desires. A man sees an attractive young woman in a skimpy bikini and I suggest his thoughts are probably sexual with respect to that young woman. On the other hand he is not marching in a parade waving a sign that says “I want to have sex with the pretty girls on the beach!”

Thus if a person with SSA simply had those thoughts, he/she would not be suing private businesses, demanding protective legislation, demanding “rights” that inure to traditional male/female couples.

It’s all about what you DO not what you think. Please get real here.

And I find it fascinating that you have such powers of perception that you can conclude what I know or don’t know about human sexuality. You don’t. What I do know however is that there is absolutely no reason to demand that all children be indoctrinated by schools regarding sexuality in thought or in practice. That is something for the parents to deal with. Oh and please don’t go to the “but what about teen pregnancy…” meme because REPRODUCTION can easily be handled in health or biology class. This is science. Telling children that they can marry a boy or a girl someday is not.

Lisa

 

[holyrood]

Thus if a person with SSA simply had those thoughts, he/she would not be suing private businesses, demanding protective legislation, demanding “rights” that inure to traditional male/female couples.

It’s all about what you DO not what you think. Please get real here.

Excellent post. Might I add, it’s not only about what members of this group are doing themselves, including public actions (what happened to privacy of the bedroom?), but that they’re now trying to force others to ACT as they have deemed others must act.

 

[meltzerboy]

I’m “wasting time” on this issue because I want to disabuse you and anyone else of the notion that ginning up hysteria over whether Joe and Bob can wear their rainbow tee shirts or hold hands at the Olympics is anything but trivial. That you and other homosexual apologists try to make this far more significant than it is, is the reason I want to provide the counter position.

And yes it IS about sexual ACTIVITY not orientation. If someone were simply attracted to the same sex but determined to live a chase life and not succumb to this desire he/she would not be marching in “Gay Pride” parades. It’s all about what you want to do, not what you are thinking. This disordered desire manifests itself in the obsession with making one’s sex life a public issue. I suspect there are many people in any crowd that have shall I say non-traditional sexual thoughts and desires. A man sees an attractive young woman in a skimpy bikini and I suggest his thoughts are probably sexual with respect to that young woman. On the other hand he is not marching in a parade waving a sign that says “I want to have sex with the pretty girls on the beach!”

Thus if a person with SSA simply had those thoughts, he/she would not be suing private businesses, demanding protective legislation, demanding “rights” that inure to traditional male/female couples.

It’s all about what you DO not what you think. Please get real here.

And I find it fascinating that you have such powers of perception that you can conclude what I know or don’t know about human sexuality. You don’t. What I do know however is that there is absolutely no reason to demand that all children be indoctrinated by schools regarding sexuality in thought or in practice. That is something for the parents to deal with. Oh and please don’t go to the “but what about teen pregnancy…” meme because REPRODUCTION can easily be handled in health or biology class. This is science. Telling children that they can marry a boy or a girl someday is not.

Lisa

I think though that for some gay people marching in a gay pride parade is a statement of affirmation about their presence and their human right to exist without being harassed or discriminated against by individuals or society. This basic human right was and still is hard fought. It is not necessarily for all a public display aimed at flaunting their behavior.

 

[holyrood]

I think though that for some gay people marching in a gay pride parade is a statement of affirmation about their presence and their human right to exist without being harassed or discriminated against by individuals or society. This basic human right was and still is hard fought. It is not necessarily for all a public display aimed at flaunting their behavior.

If people weren’t telling everyone what they like to do sexually, how would anyone know?

However, I’ve noticed many posts here, and heard the same from plenty of other people, including having plenty of personal experience, to suggest that most people really didn’t care that much, even if they knew someone was homosexual. I can tell you in high school and college both, in the 80s, you got extra Cool Points for announcing you were gay or bisexual.

Read up on some famous figures. Suits Me Fine about Billie Tipton, the jazz saxophonist, talks about life in the 20s–everyone knew she was having affairs with other women while dressing like a man, everyone knew she was a woman, and nobody cared. I’ve heard much the same story of plenty of other historical figures who were gay. Plenty of people knew, and nobody cared.

 

[gam197]

Originally Posted by HansTrappist View Post
Russian ‘anti-gay propaganda law’ won’t be enforced at Sochi 2014 Olympics:
“The Olympics is a major international event. Our task is to be as politically correct and tolerant as we can be. That’s why we made the decision not to raise this issue during the Games,” Interfax news agency cites said Igor Ananskikh, the head of the Russian Duma Committee on physical training, sports and youth, as saying.

Ananskikh’s statement contradicts comments made by Russian Sports Minister Vitaly Mutko on Thursday, who said no concessions would be made to foreign athletes and visitors to the Sochi Olympics.

“No one is forbidding an athlete with non-traditional sexual orientation from coming to Sochi, but if he goes onto the street and starts propagandizing it, then of course he will be held accountable,” Mutko said.

The less stringent approach voiced by the Russian lawmaker is more in line with a previous statement by the International Olympic Committee, saying that it had “received assurances from the highest level of government in Russia that the legislation will not affect those attending or taking part in the Games.” rt.com/news/russia-olympics-gay-law-948/

I am sure this will be repeated over and over again for the next 6 months.

Can’t find but looking for the two, 1 hour YouTube videos of Anita Bryant when she was on the Phil Donahue Show. It might help give everyone a clearer view of what was actually said during this time and might surprise some.

 

[edwest2]

The 24/7 advocates of normalizing this behavior are much larger than the actual number of homosexuals.
Gay is a convenient wedge issue for a much larger drive to fundamentally change human sexuality and human sexual relations.

On that last statement - no. Orgies have always been going on, along with pedophilia, necrophilia, bestiality, etc. I don’t believe the first statement is factual. The sheer number of national, international and country-specific gay/LGBT organizations rules that out.

People worship the god change. We know that. Otherwise, they might fall into the secular sin called boredom.

Peace,
Ed

 

[Trigonometric]

Sexual acts are not the basis of LGBT identity, sexual orientation is

Something tells me the average LGBT event isn’t exactly friendly to chastity. Moreover, even if it were solely about orientation and nothing else, the orientation is disordered (although not sinful if not acted upon.) Again, from the Catechism (bolding mine)

tradition has always declared that “homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered.” They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity.\B] Under no circumstances can they be approved.
.

Now, what I don’t get is why you insist on promoting the inclination towards a sin. I understand it’s not sinful unless acted upon, but why would you identify yourself based on this? For instance, I’m inclined towards sloth and pride, but I’m not offended when someone says those are disordered inclinations. In fact, I’m quite grateful for, for instance, anti-laziness messages, as these items help me overcome my sins.

 

[Lochias]

I’m “wasting time” on this issue because I want to disabuse you and anyone else of the notion that ginning up hysteria over whether Joe and Bob can wear their rainbow tee shirts or hold hands at the Olympics is anything but trivial. That you and other homosexual apologists try to make this far more significant than it is, is the reason I want to provide the counter position.

And yes it IS about sexual ACTIVITY not orientation. If someone were simply attracted to the same sex but determined to live a chase life and not succumb to this desire he/she would not be marching in “Gay Pride” parades. It’s all about what you want to do, not what you are thinking. This disordered desire manifests itself in the obsession with making one’s sex life a public issue. I suspect there are many people in any crowd that have shall I say non-traditional sexual thoughts and desires. A man sees an attractive young woman in a skimpy bikini and I suggest his thoughts are probably sexual with respect to that young woman. On the other hand he is not marching in a parade waving a sign that says “I want to have sex with the pretty girls on the beach!”

Thus if a person with SSA simply had those thoughts, he/she would not be suing private businesses, demanding protective legislation, demanding “rights” that inure to traditional male/female couples.

It’s all about what you DO not what you think. Please get real here.

And I find it fascinating that you have such powers of perception that you can conclude what I know or don’t know about human sexuality. You don’t. What I do know however is that there is absolutely no reason to demand that all children be indoctrinated by schools regarding sexuality in thought or in practice. That is something for the parents to deal with. Oh and please don’t go to the “but what about teen pregnancy…” meme because REPRODUCTION can easily be handled in health or biology class. This is science. Telling children that they can marry a boy or a girl someday is not.

Lisa

Well said, indeed. Agree 100%.

 

[holyrood]

why would you identify yourself based on this? For instance, I’m inclined towards sloth and pride, but I’m not offended when someone says those are disordered inclinations. In fact, I’m quite grateful for, for instance, anti-laziness messages, as these items help me overcome my sins.

Exactly.

Why is it that saying smoking is unhealthy is considered righteous and caring, while saying that a behavior that has a long track record of diseases (not to mention the associated mental health issues) is considered hateful. The last statistics I read showed that gay men on average have a far shorter life span than the average smoker.

And identifying based on what you do sexually…where’s the scratching the head icon. I simply can’t imagine people having parades to celebrate that they masturbate. Or maybe that’s still coming.

 

[LisaA]

I think though that for some gay people marching in a gay pride parade is a statement of affirmation about their presence and their human right to exist without being harassed or discriminated against by individuals or society. This basic human right was and still is hard fought. It is not necessarily for all a public display aimed at flaunting their behavior.

But their right to exist goes without saying, particularly by we in the Church who affirm the dignity of every human person from conception until natural death. That is far different than proclaiming our demands that the world acknowledge our private lives (whether or not you believe homosexuality is sinful) and accept if not affirm them.

I think Holyrood posted something that was also my experience, in that homosexuals have been part of humanity for as long as history has been recorded, if not before. For the most part no one cared, and partly because few knew or had a need to know about someone’s private lives.

In saying this, I believe homosexuals like everyone else have the same constitutional rights as I do. Thus the unfortunate persecution, raiding of “gay bars” and other harassment was and still is inexcusable. I believe in free speech (other than the few exceptions…yelling fire in a crowded theater) and if gays want to parade that is their right. But make no mistake about it, this isn’t a parade against the thought police but a parade to proclaim a particular sexual activity as their self identification.

I say to gay and Lesbian persons, you are so much more than what you do with your genitalia. Why the focus on such a confining label?

Lisa

 

[edwest2]

Thank you, Lisa. Here’s another perspective about gay pride.

catholicnewsagency.com/news/firefighters_forced_to_participate_in_gay_pride_parade_win_lawsuit/

Peace,
Ed

 

[SMGS127]

Something tells me the average LGBT event isn’t exactly friendly to chastity.

Depends. If you go to the club events, absolutely not. If you go to the festivals, they’re quite clean and just celebrate LGBT culture and the dignity of the human person. Parades tend to gather the extremes of both, though only the club extreme is shown on the media.

Now, what I don’t get is why you insist on promoting the inclination towards a sin. I understand it’s not sinful unless acted upon, but why would you identify yourself based on this? For instance, I’m inclined towards sloth and pride, but I’m not offended when someone says those are disordered inclinations. In fact, I’m quite grateful for, for instance, anti-laziness messages, as these items help me overcome my sins.

I identify very heavily with my SSAs. It’s not because I believe I should act on them, but rather because they are the single biggest struggle I will go through in my entire life, and they are a lifetime struggle. In addition, by identifying with my SSAs, I am able to help kids (and by kids I mean high schoolers and college kids) who struggle with SSAs to realize that their sexual orientation isn’t the end-all-be-all of life. It also keeps me up-to-date on these kids, many of whom have horrible parenting.

But their right to exist goes without saying, particularly by we in the Church who affirm the dignity of every human person from conception until natural death. That is far different than proclaiming our demands that the world acknowledge our private lives (whether or not you believe homosexuality is sinful) and accept if not affirm them.

The problem is that you believe this rosy view of what Catholics believe. My friend lives in a small town of about 1,000 people, where 1/3 of the town is Catholic and 1/3 Baptist. The “Catholics” join the Baptists in denouncing gay people as less-than-human and not deserving of being on this Earth. Is this what the Church teaches? Absolutely not. But to make the case that people recognize the right of gay people to EXIST is a very rosy outlook indeed, especially when considering hardcore religions like the Southern Baptists, Pentecostals, Muslims, and Mormons.

I think Holyrood posted something that was also my experience, in that homosexuals have been part of humanity for as long as history has been recorded, if not before. For the most part no one cared, and partly because few knew or had a need to know about someone’s private lives.

In saying this, I believe homosexuals like everyone else have the same constitutional rights as I do. Thus the unfortunate persecution, raiding of “gay bars” and other harassment was and still is inexcusable. I believe in free speech (other than the few exceptions…yelling fire in a crowded theater) and if gays want to parade that is their right. But make no mistake about it, this isn’t a parade against the thought police but a parade to proclaim a particular sexual activity as their self identification.

I say to gay and Lesbian persons, you are so much more than what you do with your genitalia. Why the focus on such a confining label?

Lisa

Honestly, I think that the gay “propaganda” movement actually doesn’t do that much. I’ve only met one person in my entire life who had a parent that espoused proper Catholic teaching who did any homosexual behavior in their life, and she’s straight and merely tried it out once. I would actually propose the idea that the entire reason most gay people act on their inclinations is their parents.

Most of the people I met either had laissez faire parents or (the majority of the time) had parents that were so ruthlessly harsh that they scared their childen. My friend works at a summer camp and doesn’t advertise her sexuality, but of course the other counselors talk about it and the 8th graders at camp overhear. She’ll have, every year, one or two kids come up to her and talk about how upset they are that they’re gay, and that they want to talk to her about it because their “parents will kill them.”

Now let me ask you something. Is that the fault of my lesbian friend, or is that the fault of the parents of these children who provide such an antagonistic home for their children that they can’t be open about their struggles? The most intolerant, antagonistic, don’t-disagree-with-me gay people I’ve ever met had parents who treated them like absolute dirt as kids for their SSAs. Their hearts are hardened to our message not through any gay ‘propaganda’ but through the horrible parenting job of their parents.

To be honest, we need to be worried more about how the Church can get INVOLVED with stuff like the “It Gets Better Project” to make it more Catholic-oriented, not ban the only recourse many of these kids have to feel like suicide isn’t their only option.

In closing, let me quote you a pro-SS’M’ song, and I question you as to why we don’t see lines like these in our Catholic newspapers, only anger towards gay people:

“If I was gay, I would think hip-hop hates me
Have you read the YouTube comments lately?
“Man, that’s gay” gets dropped on the daily
We become so numb to what we’re saying
A culture founded from oppression
Yet we don’t have acceptance for 'em
Call each other f*****s behind the keys of a message board
A word rooted in hate, yet our genre still ignores it
Gay is synonymous with the lesser”

“When kids are walking 'round the hallway plagued by pain in their heart
A world so hateful some would rather die than be who they are”

“No law is gonna change us
We have to change us
Whatever God you believe in
We come from the same one
Strip away the fear
Underneath it’s all the same love
About time that we raised up”

~ Same Love by Macklemore

 

[meltzerboy]

Depends. If you go to the club events, absolutely not. If you go to the festivals, they’re quite clean and just celebrate LGBT culture and the dignity of the human person. Parades tend to gather the extremes of both, though only the club extreme is shown on the media.

I identify very heavily with my SSAs. It’s not because I believe I should act on them, but rather because they are the single biggest struggle I will go through in my entire life, and they are a lifetime struggle. In addition, by identifying with my SSAs, I am able to help kids (and by kids I mean high schoolers and college kids) who struggle with SSAs to realize that their sexual orientation isn’t the end-all-be-all of life. It also keeps me up-to-date on these kids, many of whom have horrible parenting.

The problem is that you believe this rosy view of what Catholics believe. My friend lives in a small town of about 1,000 people, where 1/3 of the town is Catholic and 1/3 Baptist. The “Catholics” join the Baptists in denouncing gay people as less-than-human and not deserving of being on this Earth. Is this what the Church teaches? Absolutely not. But to make the case that people recognize the right of gay people to EXIST is a very rosy outlook indeed, especially when considering hardcore religions like the Southern Baptists, Pentecostals, Muslims, and Mormons.

Honestly, I think that the gay “propaganda” movement actually doesn’t do that much. I’ve only met one person in my entire life who had a parent that espoused proper Catholic teaching who did any homosexual behavior in their life, and she’s straight and merely tried it out once. I would actually propose the idea that the entire reason most gay people act on their inclinations is their parents.

Most of the people I met either had laissez faire parents or (the majority of the time) had parents that were so ruthlessly harsh that they scared their childen. My friend works at a summer camp and doesn’t advertise her sexuality, but of course the other counselors talk about it and the 8th graders at camp overhear. She’ll have, every year, one or two kids come up to her and talk about how upset they are that they’re gay, and that they want to talk to her about it because their “parents will kill them.”

Now let me ask you something. Is that the fault of my lesbian friend, or is that the fault of the parents of these children who provide such an antagonistic home for their children that they can’t be open about their struggles? The most intolerant, antagonistic, don’t-disagree-with-me gay people I’ve ever met had parents who treated them like absolute dirt as kids for their SSAs. Their hearts are hardened to our message not through any gay ‘propaganda’ but through the horrible parenting job of their parents.

To be honest, we need to be worried more about how the Church can get INVOLVED with stuff like the “It Gets Better Project” to make it more Catholic-oriented, not ban the only recourse many of these kids have to feel like suicide isn’t their only option.

In closing, let me quote you a pro-SS’M’ song, and I question you as to why we don’t see lines like these in our Catholic newspapers, only anger towards gay people:

“If I was gay, I would think hip-hop hates me
Have you read the YouTube comments lately?
“Man, that’s gay” gets dropped on the daily
We become so numb to what we’re saying
A culture founded from oppression
Yet we don’t have acceptance for 'em
Call each other f*****s behind the keys of a message board
A word rooted in hate, yet our genre still ignores it
Gay is synonymous with the lesser”

“When kids are walking 'round the hallway plagued by pain in their heart
A world so hateful some would rather die than be who they are”

“No law is gonna change us
We have to change us
Whatever God you believe in
We come from the same one
Strip away the fear
Underneath it’s all the same love
About time that we raised up”

~ Same Love by Macklemore

Ah yes, parents: the root cause of so many of our problems as well as the good things about us. Say what you want about Freud, but he really nailed this one.

 

[EmperorNapoleon]

Depends. If you go to the club events, absolutely not. If you go to the festivals, they’re quite clean and just celebrate LGBT culture and the dignity of the human person. Parades tend to gather the extremes of both, though only the club extreme is shown on the media.

I think thats a reasonable assessment. Amusing that people think every LGBT person should be judged based on what happens at PRIDE events. Its like saying that heterosexuals should be judged based on what happens at Mardis Gras or Spring Break.

 

[edwest2]

Ah yes, parents: the root cause of so many of our problems as well as the good things about us. Say what you want about Freud, but he really nailed this one.

Freud has been discredited.

psychologistworld.com/psychologists/freud_1.php

Single moms are growing in number so who educates and influences their kids? The media, and the media is mostly bad - an unwelcome guest in our home. Dad is MIA.

Peace,
Ed