Genesis of social justice

[athair_siochain]

When throwing the blame at the results of a failed policy you run the risk of never correcting that failed policy in the first place, the moral hazard is still there.

A couple wonderful lectures on the importance of sound money and why the federal reserve creates the problem you describe.

mises.org/media/4126 - Thomas Woods Jr, A great Catholic defender of the free markets.

mises.org/media/4840

Feel free to search the site on other topics, they have an ample amount of information.

Thanks . I have been to those sites many times to look through the eyes of those people giving lectures, they all seem to be involved in promoting blind greed. nearly all of the lectures start with a explanation on how cave men bartered /traded one thing for another, they never tell you that there was no values put on items in those days , and there were no middle men,

Back in those days there was no shortage of food, no polution. people lived for the day, not tomorrow, when lazy cavemen started to use others to collect the fruits of the forest !!!. " remember this world was a paradise " the collectors of the fruits of the forest believed the lazy people should collect their own food, so began the system that exists today.

The lazy people were strong so they fenced of the fruits trees would not allow others to pick fruit unless they picked fruit for the lazy people . this is how working for a living began,

soon the lazy people owned all the fruits of the forst, they did not work so they had a pleasurable lifestyle, soon the lazy people became greedy wanted to be sole owner of the fruits of the forest, they began to fight with each other, and forced the workers who were picking fruit to fight for them,

I am sure you can add to this story,

Very soon there were Kings/ Queens with armies who lived in fortifided castles the workers slept outside the walls in shelters.

The lazy people were always thinking of ways to become richer, so what could they do,to change this world forever, they taxed the workers . and charged them rent for the ground they were sleeping on, the creation of the greedy landlord, over the years many things have changed , but the greed of the landlord remains, and those who pick the fruits of the forest are fleeced by those greedy parasites " the landlords and moneylenders,"

The lectures on the sites are all propagander, I have been to many lectures about money, soon you realise , once you learn their ( collectors ) language it is easy to dismantle their argument,

 

[TenBobNote]

Thanks . I have been to those sites many times to look through the eyes of those people giving lectures, they all seem to be involved in promoting blind greed. nearly all of the lectures start with a explanation on how cave men bartered /traded one thing for another, they never tell you that there was no values put on items in those days , and there were no middle men,

Back in those days there was no shortage of food, no polution. people lived for the day, not tomorrow, when lazy cavemen started to use others to collect the fruits of the forest !!!. " remember this world was a paradise " the collectors of the fruits of the forest believed the lazy people should collect their own food, so began the system that exists today.

The lazy people were strong so they fenced of the fruits trees would not allow others to pick fruit unless they picked fruit for the lazy people . this is how working for a living began,

soon the lazy people owned all the fruits of the forst, they did not work so they had a pleasurable lifestyle, soon the lazy people became greedy wanted to be sole owner of the fruits of the forest, they began to fight with each other, and forced the workers who were picking fruit to fight for them,

I am sure you can add to this story,

Very soon there were Kings/ Queens with armies who lived in fortifided castles the workers slept outside the walls in shelters.

The lazy people were always thinking of ways to become richer, so what could they do,to change this world forever, they taxed the workers . and charged them rent for the ground they were sleeping on, the creation of the greedy landlord, over the years many things have changed , but the greed of the landlord remains, and those who pick the fruits of the forest are fleeced by those greedy parasites " the landlords and moneylenders,"

The lectures on the sites are all propagander, I have been to many lectures about money, soon you realise , once you learn their ( collectors ) language it is easy to dismantle their argument,

I’m sorry, but I don’t see how you could come to the conclusion that it is the landlords that cause any problem, besides*, as a direct result of the following claim. If you have spent time on Austrian economic sites such as you claim, you will see how it is with lack of competition that any sole organization or individual would be able to take advantage of a market such as rental housing(note that I refute your claim and do not see how rental costs are extraordinary in any way in the current U.S. Marketplace). You will also see how it is government regulations that are the sole cause of any market destabilization.

*The only way the landlords would be able to take advantage of renters is through government regulations to inhibit competition. This goes the same for any market.

Furthermore, it is on these sites such as Mises.org that the morality of economics is explained in that it is the only way to look at economics in a moral way, Austrian Economics is the most moral way to accomplish economics as it is simply true.

 

[royal_archer]

The sole statement “bank profit is immoral” would be false, however, current day banks have colluded with the federal reserve, or more specifically the federal reserve and the banks have colluded with the government for certain advantages in the market. Such as having 10 times the amount of dollars in credit (given to them by the federal reserve) than the bank has in the depositor’s savings accounts. The immoral part(s) about this is that the banks are able to collect much more interest, as they have much more money available to them than the free market would normally allow, thanks to the federal reserve printing money, effectively reducing the value of the dollar in your pocket, or savings account. Furthermore, this newly created money that is just now being introduced into the market gives the banks even more of a government created edge, because the market has not seen the increase in the supply of dollars, so the extra money they have is able to purchase things as if the money had not been created, buying more for less.

Looting the people, in the name of a “more stable economy”, even though research into Fractional reserve banking or the Austrian business cycle theory would prove otherwise.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Austrian_Business_Cycle_Theory

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fractional-reserve_banking

lewrockwell.com/rothbard/frb.html

So you acknowledge the fault of the government in this matter, so do you advocate taking this power away from the government instead of allowing the politicians to take more power?

 

[royal_archer]

If you put your hard earned money in a bank for safety it could, earn interest that is less than the rate of inflation,
The moneylenders will make ten times that amount., take credit cards for instance, 27% interest, plus fees. do you believe this is good for society, ?

Do you have a choice about your money going into a bank,? “NO YOU DONT” does your pay cheque go into a bank.? mine does… so I have to pay bank fees, NEED a bank card TO ACCESS my money—again I stress most of our politicians and lawyers are landlords or moneylenders, does this not send a message , their sole purpose for being in control, is to ensure rents and property prices keep rising., this lowers the buying ability of ones earnings,
I am not ranting, just expressing views, that have been put together, over 15yrs of investigating blind greed, I am sure Christ is happy with what I am doing.

My argument is about social justice, and the fact that landlords and moneylenders are the only activities that effect every thing on the planet, we dont need them,

Without them this world would change for the better we do not need a socialist/capitalist dictator to turn workers into slaves,

Everyone who puts money in a bank is a money lender.

You don’t need to keep your money in the bank.

Also, there is no need to pay bank fees if you have direct deposit.

 

[TenBobNote]

So you acknowledge the fault of the government in this matter, so do you advocate taking this power away from the government instead of allowing the politicians to take more power?

Take your pick:

1. uhhh…(looks around…)… ya.(nods head with quick jolt, in a tone of “come on dude” )
2. duhhh! (exuberantly!)
3. :thumbsup:YES! ( Yes, correct, with both thumbs by my face, saying “YES!”)

 

[cdeterma]

You don’t have to get a credit card, and some people with them get good rates. Mine are less then 10%. Even so I don’t have to have one. The reason capitalism is good is because it preserves the freedom of choice. If you don’t like moneylenders and landlords don’t use them. Save your money at home and buy with cash. Our grandparents did it. Mine still do. The ones that are not with God that is. Yeah you might have a problem with an apartment or house without a landlord or moneylender. But I am sure a principaled person good live in their parent’s house until the save the money.

 

[tqualey]

Hi, AthairSiochain,

There was a recent meeting at the Vatican concerning the world wide finacial crisis. This appeared to day in the National Catholic Register:ncregister.com/blog/getting_a_handle_on_the_economic_crisis?utm_source=NCRegister.com&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=415a96a789-RSS_DAILY_EMAIL#When:20:42:39Z

I suggest everyone take a look at what the Vatican has to say.

God bless

Tom

If you put your hard earned money in a bank for safety it could, earn interest that is less than the rate of inflation,
The moneylenders will make ten times that amount., take credit cards for instance, 27% interest, plus fees. do you believe this is good for society, ?

Do you have a choice about your money going into a bank,? “NO YOU DONT” does your pay cheque go into a bank.? mine does… so I have to pay bank fees, NEED a bank card TO ACCESS my money—again I stress most of our politicians and lawyers are landlords or moneylenders, does this not send a message , their sole purpose for being in control, is to ensure rents and property prices keep rising., this lowers the buying ability of ones earnings,
I am not ranting, just expressing views, that have been put together, over 15yrs of investigating blind greed, I am sure Christ is happy with what I am doing.

My argument is about social justice, and the fact that landlords and moneylenders are the only activities that effect every thing on the planet, we dont need them,

Without them this world would change for the better we do not need a socialist/capitalist dictator to turn workers into slaves,

 

[athair_siochain]

Hi, AthairSiochain,

There was a recent meeting at the Vatican concerning the world wide finacial crisis. This appeared to day in the National Catholic Register:ncregister.com/blog/getting_a_handle_on_the_economic_crisis?utm_source=NCRegister.com&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=415a96a789-RSS_DAILY_EMAIL#When:20:42:39Z

I suggest everyone take a look at what the Vatican has to say.

God bless

Tom

I have great respect for Professor Raga. his article in the Nation Catholic Register does not add up, we do have low birth rates and a aging population… low birth rates can be linked with greed and selfishness,and the murder of the unborn child— they can also be linked to the fact people realise there is a shortage of food and shelter,
The crisis in world economies is linked to the greed of landlords and moneylenders.

“Too many??? old people in the world, young people will rebel against them” this again is a statement created in a mind blinded by greed…

What most people dont realise is many world powers are involved in activities . preparing for a biological de/population of the world, so if you can afford to pay for protection from the virus you have no worries,

So who will be the new Noah and who will enter his Ark , LANDLORDS AND MONEYLENDERS

I suggest you type in “depopulate the world” do a search you will find over one million links , also Bill Gates has his say,

Can society stop this happening? I say “yes we can” but first we have cure those who are blinded by greed “make the blind see”

I never believe a politician, because they look after their extended family first , they make sure their gravy train is not derailed. — have a nice day everyone

 

[athair_siochain]

So you acknowledge the fault of the government in this matter, so do you advocate taking this power away from the government instead of allowing the politicians to take more power?

The problem is the landlords and moneylenders.

governments ensure they are free to charge what ever they want, they tell you prices are created in the market place, the market place is owned by landlords and moneylenders, they also own the voice of the people, ( politicians / lawyers)

 

[royal_archer]

The problem is the landlords and moneylenders.

governments ensure they are free to charge what ever they want, they tell you prices are created in the market place, the market place is owned by landlords and moneylenders, they also own the voice of the people, ( politicians / lawyers)

 

[tqualey]

Hi, Royal Archer,

I can’t believe you do **NOT **see the obvious connection to Landlords…and the recent morph of Bankers into Moneylenders…to all the problems in the world! All other problems simply orbit around these two sides of the same coin… Oooooooops, I used a money metaphor…

Once some people have ‘…made the blind see…’ I would guess that anything else is really possible - except maybe coming up with something besides a rant!

God bless

Tom

 

[cdeterma]

Gee why would I want to bring more children into a world where the government steals from them the moment they are born, controls how I raise them, and how I educate them. Really, my choice in the matter is taken from me the moment I decide to have a child. So I choose not to.

 

[tqualey]

I think you have made a wise decision.

God bless

Tom

Gee why would I want to bring more children into a world where the government steals from them the moment they are born, controls how I raise them, and how I educate them. Really, my choice in the matter is taken from me the moment I decide to have a child. So I choose not to.

 

[royal_archer]

I think you have made a wise decision.

God bless

Tom

Actually that is an unfortunate reality. The working class is getting taxed into “extinction”. Think about it. The working class can’t afford to pay their taxes and raise kids and are having to spend more time working to make ends meet leaving less time to raise a family. The welfare class is not burdened with the cost of having kids and is even financially rewarded for having more. The welfare class also has a lot of free time to enjoy spending with their families. As a result, it seems like the working class families are dwindling while the welfare families are not dwindling. As a result there is more and more burden being put on the working class families causing what is starting to look like unsustainable birth rates. Obviously, we would have a war, revolution, or collapse of the monetary system before total “extinction”.

 

[athair_siochain]

Actually that is an unfortunate reality. The working class is getting taxed into “extinction”. Think about it. The working class can’t afford to pay their taxes and raise kids and are having to spend more time working to make ends meet leaving less time to raise a family. The welfare class is not burdened with the cost of having kids and is even financially rewarded for having more. The welfare class also has a lot of free time to enjoy spending with their families. As a result, it seems like the working class families are dwindling while the welfare families are not dwindling. As a result there is more and more burden being put on the working class families causing what is starting to look like unsustainable birth rates. Obviously, we would have a war, revolution, or collapse of the monetary system before total “extinction”.

Why take it out on those who receive Social Security,
Social Security is there for everyone who needs help.

You have to move up to the top end of town to see the real bludgers, the idle rich,
on a recent trip . I saw a few signs on $100 000 motor homes,

" I am spending my children’s inheritance"

" My Tenants are paying for my trip,"

Why advertise blind greed…

 

[cynic]

Actually that is an unfortunate reality. The working class is getting taxed into “extinction”. Think about it. The working class can’t afford to pay their taxes and raise kids and are having to spend more time working to make ends meet leaving less time to raise a family.

I thought low-middling earners in the U.S didn’t pay particularly high rates of tax.

 

[TenBobNote]

I thought low-middling earners in the U.S didn’t pay particularly high rates of tax.

Indirectly my friend, indirectly. When the rich man is getting taxed, he will:
A. Take a loss in profit to compensate for his extra taxes.
B. Pass on the lost money due to his extra taxes to the products or services he sells.

Obviously, the answer is B, a real life analysis will conclude the same. Why do you think the creation of the middle class in the first place occurred from liberty? There were very low taxes. Of course, the politicians making the tax will declare differently…

Also, another tax which hurts the middle and lower classes is the inflation tax. Go to Mises.org if you would like to know the details of that.

 

[cynic]

Obviously, the answer is B, a real life analysis will conclude the same. Why do you think the creation of the middle class in the first place occurred from liberty? There were very low taxes. Of course, the politicians making the tax will declare differently…

Many views on what helped create a middle class exist, and a middle class exists in in Europe. Examples : the labour movement pushing up wages in the 19th/early 20th centuries ; working class children attend school. Another might be FDR’s funding of ww2 vets kids into college…You pick the free market as the one and only reason because it suites you.

 

[tqualey]

Hi, AthairSiochain,

Why take it out on those who receive Social Security,
Social Security is there for everyone who needs help.

This is not only a mis-statement of how one qualifies for SS Benefits, it is a perfect reflection of how you have distored the entire economic process in the US. SS Benefits only go to those who have contributed into the system (FICA taxes on your pay stub) when they are eligible in the form or disability or retirement or for disabled children of those who have contributed under particular conditions. It is NOT for everyone. Here is their website:ssa.gov/

You have to move up to the top end of town to see the real bludgers, the idle rich,
on a recent trip . I saw a few signs on $100 000 motor homes,

" I am spending my children’s inheritance"

" My Tenants are paying for my trip,"

Why advertise blind greed…

I know full-wll, AthairSiochain,that the ‘blind-greed’ answer you have identified as the only cause of economic problems will not give way to any other consideration - but, tell me, just how do people who have actually worked hard and saved their money get to enjoy the fruits of their labor - according to you? Your ‘offense’ at the signs on these motor coaches is interesting. You do realize that other people had to build them … and still others had to sell them … and yes, even others have to have the specialized knowledge to service them! This is an entire industry based on people supporting people through productive work. Should those with money bury it and then hang out signs that say…

“I’ve burried my children’s inheritance!” (Of course this means that the children would be driven by blind greed, too!)

“My Tenant’s rent is going straight into the ground!”

Please consider what you are advocating with your ‘blind-gree’ hypothesis.

God bless

Tom

 

[royal_archer]

Why take it out on those who receive Social Security,
Social Security is there for everyone who needs help.

You have to move up to the top end of town to see the real bludgers, the idle rich,
on a recent trip . I saw a few signs on $100 000 motor homes,

" I am spending my children’s inheritance"

" My Tenants are paying for my trip,"

Why advertise blind greed…

Why would you have a problem with people enjoying the money they earned earlier in their lives?