Given the principles of evolution, natural selection, survival of the fittest, etc, do you think belief in the supernatural will die out or become a m

  • Thread starter Thread starter IWantGod
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
Eric_Hyom said:
There is one God the creator of all that is seen and unsseen, is this the truth you are relating to
Click to expand...
I suspect that what ANV is pointing out is that people are beginning to realize that their religious beliefs are not consistent with current scientific theories and are therefore either rejecting certain aspects of their faith or they are rejecting religion entirely.

However their are many people who believe in God or the supernatural that do not subscribe to organised religion… I think a belief in something other than the physical is natural to human-beings and that’s why they subscribe to religion in the first place. Metaphysical Naturalism is an anomaly.
 
edwest2 said:
And what would be the practical, real world consequences if that is the case?

Ed
Click to expand...
Catholics have scripture and the Catechism as part of the tradition which through the grace of the Holy Spirit guides us to the Truth that is Jesus Christ. He reveals God to us and brings us to eternal communion in Him. Atheists, Deists and confused Christians, believing truth to be a social phenomenon, have to bring everybody on board their version of reality. In the “real” world of survival of the fittest, the fear is that their truth loses out. In the actual real world the Truth is a living truth, eternal and revealed to us in Jesus. The consequences of being a young earth creationist, I may have met half a dozen in my life, are positive in that the person has likely been led to God through their belief. The real world consequences of not intellectually evolving beyond the primitive modern scientific understanding of our creation, of not growing a relationship with God, can be dire
 
Aloysium said:
Catholics have scripture and the Catechism as part of the tradition which through the grace of the Holy Spirit guides us to the Truth that is Jesus Christ. He reveals God to us and brings us to eternal communion in Him. Atheists, Deists and confused Christians, believing truth to be a social phenomenon, have to bring everybody on board their version of reality. In the “real” world of survival of the fittest, the fear is that their truth loses out. In the actual real world the Truth is a living truth, eternal and revealed to us in Jesus. The consequences of being a young earth creationist, I may have met half a dozen in my life, are positive in that the person has likely been led to God through their belief. The real world consequences of not intellectually evolving beyond the primitive modern scientific understanding of our creation, of not growing a relationship with God, can be dire
Click to expand...
Romans 1:20

New International Version
For since the creation of the world God’s invisible qualities–his eternal power and divine nature–have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that people are without excuse.

New Living Translation
For ever since the world was created, people have seen the earth and sky. Through everything God made, they can clearly see his invisible qualities–his eternal power and divine nature. So they have no excuse for not knowing God.

English Standard Version
For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse.

Ed

But the excuses will continue. There is no God, just “natural” forces.
 
edwest2 said:
Why would anyone worry? Objective reality must include God. That is what the Church teaches.

Ed
Click to expand...
Holding on to erroneous beliefs about the universe and presenting these beliefs as God’s teaching will turn reasonable people away from the church. The whole creationist versus evolution war has damaged a lot of peoples faiths and has lead people to believe that the Catholic faith and Christianity in general is false.

Young earth creationists have undermined the Christian faith and therefore undermined the message of Jesus Christ.

Are Atheists the real enemy?
 
Charlemagne_III said:
You are speaking as if the Creationists believe in Creationism and nothing else.

sorry, that won’t fly here. You are still trying to divide and conquer Catholics by demonstrating disunity inside the Church. Sometime long ago you decided this was a brilliant strategy. Well, you Protestants ought to know, because you have divided and conquered Christianity thousands of times since Luther. 🤷
Click to expand...
It is ironic that the Reformation has led to the deformation of Christianity with thousands of dissenting sects, all of which reject the words of Jesus:

“You are Peter and on this rock I will build my church”

but He added:

“The gates of hell shall not prevail against it.”

Pope Francis, on the other hand, has impressed people throughout the world with his humility and compassion for everyone regardless of what they believe.
 
IWantGod said:
Holding on to erroneous beliefs about the universe and presenting these beliefs as God’s teaching will turn reasonable people away from the church. The whole creationist versus evolution war has damaged a lot of peoples faiths and has lead people to believe that the Catholic faith and Christianity in general is false.

Young earth creationists have undermined the Christian faith and therefore undermined the message of Jesus Christ.

Are Atheists the real enemy?
Click to expand...
That’s one view. But it can be the other way around as well. Who was Jesus Christ? Just a human being with some good ideas? Or more? What was the message of Jesus Christ?

Atheists are not the enemy per se, but since they don’t believe in God/gods, some advocate against religion. Some ignore it while others actively work to convince others that, for example, Jesus Christ, like other historical figures (Plato, Socrates), were just men with good/useful ideas.

Then we have militants who actively work to rid religious ideas from the minds of the public. Or that Christianity, in general, is false.

If I may add, based on comments I’ve read in various places, science has replaced God/gods for some and that is a good thing. I don’t think that helps lead people to Christianity.

I watched a priest on TV who was with Penn Jillette. Atheism came up and the priest mentioned that he had friends who were atheists. He was cordial with Mr. Jillette, who added, “See, this is what I get the vast majority of the time. There was only one guy who gave me a hard time.”

Ed
 
Bradski said:
Because it tells us where we came from. How we got here. Why you are sitting there reading this. Why we feel what we feel and act as we do.

Would you want your children to be taught that everything was created in seven days or how it actually happened? Would you want your children to be taught that the earth is the centre of the universe or where we actually are in the grand scheme of things? Would you want you children to be taught that all life was created as we see it now or that it evolved?

Give your children as much knowledge of the world as you can and make sure they pass it on to their kids. It’s your responsability.
Click to expand...
Many people who believe God created us do not think the world was created in 7 days, the earth is the centre of the universe, we are the grand scheme of things, or that life was created as we see it now.

In terms of a knowledge of the world and why we think and act as we do I think I owe my children a lot more than telling them we evolved.

Evolution does not tell us where we came from. It tells us how life evolved once it got here.
 
inocente said:
Nah, creationists keep telling the rest of us we’re not Christians because we’re not anti-science. They tell me the opposite of Catholic scientists, Catholic schools, Catholic universities, Catholic theologians, Catholic philosophers and the Vatican!

Here’s a promise to all creationists - when you tell me the same as Catholic scientists, Catholic schools, Catholic universities, Catholic theologians, Catholic philosophers and the Vatican then I’ll stand together with you. Until then, I’m pretty certain I’m not the one dancing out of step.
Click to expand...
Sorry Charlie, but most Baptists ARE Creationists! What happened to you?
 
IWantGod said:
I suspect that what ANV is pointing out is that people are beginning to realize that their religious beliefs are not consistent with current scientific theories and are therefore either rejecting certain aspects of their faith or they are rejecting religion entirely.
Click to expand...
The Bible will still be inspiring people to turn to God in a thousand years, by that time the ToE will have died a death.
 
IWantGod said:
Really? What is your reasons for thinking this?
Click to expand...
Natural selection is a fine theory, it explains how life is constantly adapting to an ever changing environment. The problem arises when you throw random mutation into the equation, and use this to extrapolate back three and a half billion years to single cell life.

Take the evolution of the eye, there are seven very clear goals; that random mutation aspires towards in 1829 incremental steps. There is no way this can be random, even taking natural selection into account, see the link below.

don-lindsay-archive.org/creation/eye_time.html

The eye is designed by God.
 
Eric_Hyom said:
Natural selection is a fine theory, it explains how life is constantly adapting to an ever changing environment. The problem arises when you throw random mutation into the equation, and use this to extrapolate back three and a half billion years to single cell life.

Take the evolution of the eye, there are seven very clear goals; that random mutation aspires towards in 1829 incremental steps. There is no way this can be random, even taking natural selection into account, see the link below.

don-lindsay-archive.org/creation/eye_time.html

The eye is designed by God.
Click to expand...
Amen Eric. And there has never been any species to species evolution either.
 
CHRISTINE77 said:
Amen Eric. And there has never been any species to species evolution either.
Click to expand...
Would there be a problem if there was species to species evolution? I mean are you rejecting macro-evolution because you think the evidence is not there, or are you rejecting Macro-evolution because you think its contrary to the Catholic faith?

Are you a young earth creationist?
 
Eric_Hyom said:
Take the evolution of the eye, there are seven very clear goals; that random mutation aspires towards in 1829 incremental steps. There is no way this can be random, even taking natural selection into account, see the link below.
Click to expand...
Your comprehension skills need some work, Eric. It has already been pointed out to you that no-one has said that the eye needed specifically 1829 steps to form. The site to which you link said quite clearly (although not clearly enough), that IF the formation of the eye was broken down into 1% changes (a nice round figure that everyone can grasp), then THAT would result in 1829 steps (basic statistics) and would take around 350,000 generations (basic population genetics). A ridiculously short time.

The system is so efficient that we have any number of types of eyes that have evolved completely independently in a variety of organisms.

You should take some time out and read about all the inherent defects in the human eye and how it suffers in comparison (in most aspects) with the eyes of other creatures. If God did design it, then He did a woeful job.

Be sure to tell Him I said so.
 
CHRISTINE77 said:
Amen Eric. And there has never been any species to species evolution either.
Click to expand...
Let’s say that we have a fish that can last a short while out of water. Let’s say that we have a fish that can use its fins to move about out of the water. Let’s say that we have a fish that can live out of water for a week.

At what point do you stop calling something that doesn’t live in water, walks about on dry land, breathes air and climbs trees a fish?

Are horses and donkeys different species? They are more alike than a corgi and a Great Dane which are the same species.Is a grizzly and a polar bear the same? Can seals and sea lions breed? Do you realise that lions and tigers are different species?
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top