Glenn Beck says to run away from churches who preach social justice?

[catharina]

I actually use that site because it peels back the layers and follows the money and have found no other that matches it, and the man that started it has lived the life of the organizations it exposes.

Hmmm…Great college, but the same Georgetown U which covered all references to Christ to gain the honor of Obama speaking there. Wow. Catharina already referenced UNICEF support of abortion.

Let’s see what the Thomas Merton center is doing today pittsburghendthewar.org/

Saturday, March 20

The Thomas Merton Center Antiwar Committee is joining with several local and national coalitions and networks in urging an all-out March 20 bi-coastal mobilization of all opponents of the U.S. wars and occupations. We urge support for these critical demands:
…
Co-sponsored by the Thomas Merton Center AWC, Pitt SDS (Students for a Democratic Society), Code Pink, WILPF, IVAW, and others – please let us know if your group will help build and publicize these actions and if your group should be listed as a co-sponsor.

Just 2 clicks got me there and I don’t need to research SDS, Code Pink, I already know about them. BTW, if someone wants to protest the war, so be it, but my point is all of us should watch with whom we align ourselves; they may have different goals and may end up perverting our good intentions. Good institutions could unknowingly support a group that goes against Church principles. That’s why I think it’s important to do research-‘shoddy’ or not, and remember even a stopped watch is right twice a day.

RWMorris stated my main point better than I could

FYI

One more time, (FOURTH time) I quote the Code of Canon Law:

Canon 222 §2. **They are also obliged to promote social justice **and, mindful of the precept of the Lord, to assist the poor from their own resources. 


Commentary

**Christians are bound by a double obligation of promoting social justice by which the systemic injustices in society are addressed and of meeting the practical needs of the poor.** The latter obligation is specifically tied in the canon to a precept of the Lord.

 

[Via_Dolorosa]

I will repeat, and enlarge for effect:
If you are promoting a personal devotion to social justice, then you are virtuous. But if you are promoting a government program as a way of providing social justice, there is no virtue in such actions.[/quo

Once again I will remind that GB said to run away from CHURCHES or PRIESTS who preach Social Justice. We are not debating whether government should be involved. Or are we?

 

[catharina]

RWMorris;6422148:

I will repeat, and enlarge for effect:
If you are promoting a personal devotion to social justice, then you are virtuous. But if you are promoting a government program as a way of providing social justice, there is no virtue in such actions.

[/quo

Once again I will remind that GB said to run away from CHURCHES or PRIESTS who preach Social Justice. We are not debating whether government should be involved. Or are we?

Yet it seems that some on this thread are saying that,
as in ‘don’t support gov’t programs.’

 

[kbkam]

Catharina and whoever might be interested,

Maybe I’m being obtuse, but the Canon law quotes you’ve cited, don’t seem to go against the points I’ve been trying to make. I simply object to taking on partnerships with people/groups who may have other motives, and I’ve referred to situations in which that happens.
All government programs are not evil in my mind, but I agree with Pope John Paul II

This is why Pope John Paul II took the “social assistance state” to task in his 1991 encyclical Centesimus Annus. The Pontiff wrote that the Welfare State was contradicting the principle of subsidiarity by intervening directly and depriving society of its responsibility. This “leads to a loss of human energies and an inordinate increase of public agencies which are dominated more by bureaucratic ways of thinking than by concern for serving their clients and which are accompanied by an enormous increase in spending.”

And may I correct you: GB did not say to run away from all churches/priests who preach social justice; he said to run away if they are caught up in the progressive/socialism partnerships. When asked if he meant run away from churches he answered ‘yeah if it’s the Trinity Church of Jeremiah Wright’ in Chicago-which preaches black liberation theology based on the beliefs of James Cone.
In case one is unfamiliar with the theology: A description from a column by Rod Dreher

The insanity of “black liberation theology”
Monday March 17, 2008
Categories: Culture, Democrats, Religion (general)

The more you know about Jeremiah Wright, the more appalling he is. Spengler today digs up a televised interview between Wright and Sean Hannity in which Wright upbraided Hannity for not having read the black liberation theologian James Cone, with whom Wright identifies. Who is James Cone? He’s the theologian who wrote this:

Black theology refuses to accept a God who is not identified totally with the goals of the black community. If God is not for us and against white people, then he is a murderer, and we had better kill him. The task of black theology is to kill Gods who do not belong to the black community ... Black theology will accept only the love of God which participates in the destruction of the white enemy. What we need is the divine love as expressed in Black Power, which is the power of black people to destroy their oppressors here and now by any means at their disposal. Unless God is participating in this holy activity, we must reject his love.

Wow. Either God wants to destroy white people, or He is not worthy of worship. This is racist idolatry.

(Please ignore the Hannity reference-it was just one of many shows he was on at the time.) Substitute any race-wouldn’t you run from that? This is what GB meant and I previously gave the link to the conversation in which he states just that.

It seems that people have gotten off track and decided to ‘kill the messenger’ just because they don’t care for his style or his politics. It doesn’t mean he’s wrong. I’ve gotten involved here, because of an email I got from Catholic Answers listing this forum and saw that people were making all sorts of conclusions based on half or non-truths. As a believer in the truth and one who feels obligated to correct non-truth when I run across it, here I am, posting for the first time because I felt it necessary.

So my conclusions are;

1. FACT: GB was half quoted.
2. FACT: Some people based their opinions on out of context or misquotes.
3. OPINION: Some people are comfortable in basing their opinions on soundbites.
4. OPINION: Some people just won’t hear the message because of the messenger.
5. OPINION: And some people just like the progressive message and don’t want to know with what type of people they might be involved, or just don’t care.

That’s it- BTW, I support the social justice group in my parish, but I’ll keep my sneakers on just in case I find that they are willing to get involved with the likes of George Soros and his gang. Because of GB’s warning, I will continue to be informed and prepared to run if necessary.

Thanks for giving me the time.

 

[Convert66]

About 13-14 or so years ago my niece went out for her HS basketball team. The “triangle offense” was all the rage thanks to the Chicago Bulls, Michael Jordan, Phil Jackson, etc. We had a pickup game at a family reunion and she continuously shouted out to her teammates, “triangle, triangle”, as if they knew what it meant. They had a vague clue, and aligned themselves in a triangular shape, but they knew nothing about actually running the drifts and passing the ball. We beat them soundly. There is a lesson in there if you have eyes to see. Simply calling out a successful catch-phrase does not guarantee that others know what you mean or how it actually works.

It seems as if many in this thread are as hung up on the term “social justice” as Glenn Beck is, just like my niece was hung-up on “triangle.” That is, if they hear the words there is a Pavlonian response and they begin to drool, shut off all discernment, and are frustrated that anyone dares to question their meaning or their programmed response.

If, rather, Beck had said, “…if your Church or your Priest is advocating prayers for the dead, run” I assume the response would be similar. Some would say, “what a doofus, he isn’t worthy of anyone’s time” etc., ( and please add in as many epithets, without a shred of evidence to support them, as you like to fill in the analogy) while others would say he wasn’t speaking of the Catholic or even Mormon practice of “prayers for the dead” at all; but, rather what many occultists mean when they say “prayers for the dead.” What if “prayers for the dead” in this hypothetical referred to occultic rituals that were meant to conjure the dead, instead of to offer support to and for them?

Would the mantra “prayers for the dead” preclude any discernment like the phrase “social justice” obviously has? I would hope not, but given the hysterical obtuseness already presented here I am afraid that the results would be the same. Willful blindness and a hellish partnership borne of profound ignorance…

Social justice IS a virtue, as long as it is not contradictory and incompatible with the WHOLE of Catholic social teachings. For instance, do the “very conservative” folks who dutifully adorn themselves with blinders and align themselves with radical leftists in the name of “social justice” know that the Church sees both socialist welfare-states and lassez-faire capitalism as BOTH inherently materialistic and inherently incapable of meeting the fundamental needs of the human person?

When you align yourselves with the likes of Reverend Wright, Jim Wallis, Code Pink, Planned Parenthood, et. al., you are shaking hands with the devil, I don’t care how many times you salivate involuntarily just because some behaviorist spouted the phrase “social justice” and you thought it was time to collect your virtue points like so much kibble.

This IS a war, a spiritual war, whether you like it or not. And whether you think that psycho-babble gobbledygook about “tolerance” “diversity” and “inclusiveness” or “social justice” makes one immune or not, you will still come down with a severe case of discernment-atrophy, which is abundantly obvious in this thread full of false witnesses about Mr. Beck.

Social Justice, prayers for the dead, baptism, faith, Son of God, Son of Man …all one has to do is look around these forums and see that many people use the terms without knowing that there is a profound difference between what the Magisterium says about them, and what the world says. Align yourselves with the world if you wish. But don’t pretend some moral high ground while you go skipping off to Sodom with Code Pink, Jeremiah Wright, George Soros, Barack Obama, Nancy Pelosi, Harry Reid, Jim Wallis and Hillary (early-twentieth century progressive) Rodham-Clinton.

All my best…

 

[Via_Dolorosa]

Catharina and whoever might be interested,

Maybe I’m being obtuse, but the Canon law quotes you’ve cited, don’t seem to go against the points I’ve been trying to make. I simply object to taking on partnerships with people/groups who may have other motives, and I’ve referred to situations in which that happens.
All government programs are not evil in my mind, but I agree with Pope John Paul II
And may I correct you: GB did not say to run away from all churches/priests who preach social justice; he said to run away if they are caught up in the progressive/socialism partnerships. When asked if he meant run away from churches he answered ‘yeah if it’s the Trinity Church of Jeremiah Wright’ in Chicago-which preaches black liberation theology based on the beliefs of James Cone.
In case one is unfamiliar with the theology: A description from a column by Rod Dreher

(Please ignore the Hannity reference-it was just one of many shows he was on at the time.) Substitute any race-wouldn’t you run from that? This is what GB meant and I previously gave the link to the conversation in which he states just that.

It seems that people have gotten off track and decided to ‘kill the messenger’ just because they don’t care for his style or his politics. It doesn’t mean he’s wrong. I’ve gotten involved here, because of an email I got from Catholic Answers listing this forum and saw that people were making all sorts of conclusions based on half or non-truths. As a believer in the truth and one who feels obligated to correct non-truth when I run across it, here I am, posting for the first time because I felt it necessary.

So my conclusions are;

1. FACT: GB was half quoted.Listen to the whole quote. It is posted.
2. FACT: Some people based their opinions on out of context or misquotes.I couldn’t agree with you more. this is especially true of Fox news viewers.
3. OPINION: Some people are comfortable in basing their opinions on soundbites. Yes, again
4. OPINION: Some people just won’t hear the message because of the messenger. The messenger most earn respect as an honest broker.
5. OPINION: And some people just like the progressive message and don’t want to know with what type of people they might be involved, or just don’t care. Too general to comment on

That’s it- BTW, I support the social justice group in my parish, but I’ll keep my sneakers on just in case I find that they are willing to get involved with the likes of George Soros and his gang. Because of GB’s warning, I will continue to be informed and prepared to run if necessary.

Thanks for giving me the time.

Thank you

 

[RWMorris]

One more time, (FOURTH time) I quote the Code of Canon Law: …

You can quote it till the cows come home. There is nothing in Canon Law that promotes government social programs. And that is exactly what Glenn Beck is talking about. I have heard enough Catholic and other church sermons/homilies, and read enough floatsam from the USCCB, and plenty of leftist Catholic claptrap on these forums, to not know that “social gospel”, in most cases, means progressive agenda. I will not pass the buck, I will not let any of us off the hook. It is everyone’s individual responsibility to carry out Jesus’ mission on earth. It is not the government’s responsibility.

 

[Via_Dolorosa]

You can quote it till the cows come home. There is nothing in Canon Law that promotes government social programs. And that is exactly what Glenn Beck is talking about. I have heard enough Catholic and other church sermons/homilies, and read enough floatsam from the USCCB, and plenty of leftist Catholic claptrap on these forums, to not know that “social gospel”, in most cases, means progressive agenda. I will not pass the buck, I will not let any of us off the hook. It is everyone’s individual responsibility to carry out Jesus’ mission on earth.
It is not the government’s responsibility.

Who said it was? How does the government always get into the picture? And by the way, why did you need to be emailed to rescue this thread? Do you have information that most of us don’t have? Did you listen to GB remarks?

 

[Via_Dolorosa]

You can quote it till the cows come home. There is nothing in Canon Law that promotes government social programs. And that is exactly what Glenn Beck is talking about. I have heard enough Catholic and other church sermons/homilies, and read enough floatsam from the USCCB, and plenty of leftist Catholic claptrap on these forums, to not know that “social gospel”, in most cases, means progressive agenda. I will not pass the buck, I will not let any of us off the hook. It is everyone’s individual responsibility to carry out Jesus’ mission on earth. It is not the government’s responsibility.

Are you Catholic?

 

[Vasian]

O’REILLY: So Beck attacks organized religion on his radio program and causes – and causes all kinds of angst. Roll the tape.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BECK: I beg you. Look for the words “social justice” or “economic justice” on your church Web site. If you find it, run as fast as you can. Social justice and economic justice, they are code words.

Now, the idea – hang on. Stu is saying, am I advising people to leave their church? Yes, if I’m going to Jeremiah Wright’s church? Yes, leave your church.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

O’REILLY: All right. Now…

BECK: That’s the part that the media keeps leaving out. Thank you for actually airing it.

O’REILLY: You’re welcome. You’re welcome. I’m a Roman Catholic, and in my religion the people who do the social justice are called liberation theologians.

A lot of Jesuits do that. OK, they believe that Jesus commands that the religion, that the Catholic religion compels people to provide for the poor, to set up a system where everybody gets what they need, this and that. Now, you want me to leave the Catholic Church?

BECK: No, no, no, no. First of all, check into liberation theology. Liberation theology was a perversion of the Catholic doctrine.

O’REILLY: OK. Let’s not debate that. There are people, Catholic clerics who believe in liberation theology. What are they supposed to do?

BECK: That is a perversion of the gospel.

O’REILLY: But should I leave St. Mary’s where I go to church?

BECK: That’s up to you as an individual.

O’REILLY: No, I’m not going to…

BECK: You know who also is liberation theology? Jeremiah Wright. OK, that’s liberation theology.

But listen, here, if your pastor is telling you or your priest is telling you that Jesus commands you to be charitable, he’s absolutely right, and you stand firmly by his side. But if he’s saying Jesus said, if a man asks you for your shirt, give the coat that you’re wearing to the government and have them give the man pants.

O’REILLY: Right. Wasn’t that in Luke 4?

BECK: That is social justice. This is a perversion.

O’REILLY: OK. Look, the Catholic Church contains many different points of view on that. And I’ve never heard a priest say you have to do this. Sometimes they give an opinion on it, but they don’t say you have to do it.

BECK: Where they are preaching – I can’t believe that I have liberals coming after – progressives coming after me for saying separation of church and state. If your church is saying that you need to – that God is telling you that a big giant government controlling all of these things is charity, huh-uh.

O’REILLY: Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar’s.

BECK: Exactly right.

foxnews.com/story/0,2933,589649,00.html

 

[Convert66]

Some things are just not reducible to neat little bytes.

It is undeniable that we have the obligation to transform social structures that promote injustice and maybe we can all agree here that statist collectivism and radical individualism (Smith’s “enlightened self-interest”) are likewise inherently materialistic and out of balance.

That is one beauty of Catholic thought, and among the things that drew me towards Catholicism in the first place. It isn’t either/or, but rather, both/and. That is, Catholic social justice is incarnated precisely where tensions between the individual and society threatens the good of either, and is bridged with a higher vision of both individual human dignity and the potential for a just society.

Yes, we have an absolute moral responsibility to work for social justice, but in the case where individual churches, or the parish Church lean away from the principle(s) of subsidiarity in the name of social justice they risk the underpinning safeguards of the Catholic view, which seeks to prevent a large, remote and powerful central political authority from imposing it’s Caesarian morality on individuals in the name of the collective state. In that instance, we likewise have an absolute moral obligation to oppose Caesar’s coin flip altogether, be it “heads” and Caesar wins, or “tails” and we lose.

The Lord did tell us to render to Caesar what is Caesar’s, but notice that what He implies by separating God from Caesar is that Caesar’s power is of an entirely different order than that of the power Jesus grants to the Church. It follows that the Church’s social justice is quite different from Caesar’s. Jesus also didn’t counsel that in so rendering to Caesar we should grant Caesar even greater authority to order our lives.

Our system is far different now, as is our culture, but the principle still holds and it comes from Wisdom Himself. The Church urges that wherever the social order is structurally opposed to the ideas of the Church regarding the dignity of the human person and a just social order we are to oppose them with steadfastness. This requires us to oppose on principle any attempts to cede subsidiary power to Caesar’s control, whether in the form, or in the name of “social justice”, “the children”, “security”, fairness, patriotic duty, or chocolate chip cookies, for that matter.

Ultimately, what Beck is saying is that the State is after the subsidiary power of individuals and the Church (notice that he prefaced all of his remarks with just such a warning), and that if your individual parish or church is leaning towards Caesar as a matter of course then you should check with the Priest or Bishop; or, in the case of Reverend Wright’s black-nationalist theology or Jim Wallis’ “inclusive theology”, simply run before the State does something like dictates who qualifies to adopt children in your parish and who does not; who can be ordained and not; or whether your local Catholic hospital can receive tax funds and still foreswear abortion procedures. Oh wait…they are doing or trying that already, while so many democrats, republicans and independents (and so many Christians) whistle the same-ole-same kumbayas.

I take Beck’s words as an urgent call for better discernment within the churches when it comes to social justice. If that ultimately leads to a greater division in the so-called Culture Wars, then so be it. Eschatologically speaking, let the wheat and the chaff fall where they may.

All my best…

 

[catharina]

1. The Vatican has clearly rejected any form of liberation theology since the 1980s. If anyone wants ‘to keep’ their sneakers on thanks to Glenn Beck, I say the warnings to reject liberation theology came much much earlier.
2. As for this type of thinking: :“Social justice IS a virtue, as long as it is not contradictory and incompatible with the WHOLE of Catholic social teachings. … etc.” skip that follow-up. Social justice is a VIRTUE, period. The end. There is NO social gospel. There has never been a social gospel.

If one believes that a citizen has no responsibility for governace and injustice, then one is living with blinders on,.  We have voting power here, unlike the inhabitants of Rome.  We are to convert the entire world to the Gospel of Jesus Christ and if we can goad the conscience of government to assist the poor, then we must do so.  

If one believes that the active practice of the virtue of social justice can be rejected according to one's personal  preferences, then one needs to recognize one's faith is in need of growth.  Yes, pray, give alms and lead by good example.  Good example does not include looking to an apostate for moral direction - although you can quote Glenn Beck 'til the cows come home.

 

[Via_Dolorosa]

O’REILLY: So Beck attacks organized religion on his radio program and causes – and causes all kinds of angst. Roll the tape.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BECK: I beg you. Look for the words “social justice” or “economic justice” on your church Web site. If you find it, run as fast as you can. Social justice and economic justice, they are code words.

Now, the idea – hang on. Stu is saying, am I advising people to leave their church? Yes, if I’m going to Jeremiah Wright’s church? Yes, leave your church.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

O’REILLY: All right. Now…

BECK: That’s the part that the media keeps leaving out. Thank you for actually airing it.

O’REILLY: You’re welcome. You’re welcome. I’m a Roman Catholic, and in my religion the people who do the social justice are called liberation theologians.

A lot of Jesuits do that. OK, they believe that Jesus commands that the religion, that the Catholic religion compels people to provide for the poor, to set up a system where everybody gets what they need, this and that. Now, you want me to leave the Catholic Church?

BECK: No, no, no, no. First of all, check into liberation theology. Liberation theology was a perversion of the Catholic doctrine.

O’REILLY: OK. Let’s not debate that. There are people, Catholic clerics who believe in liberation theology. What are they supposed to do?

BECK: That is a perversion of the gospel.

O’REILLY: But should I leave St. Mary’s where I go to church?

BECK: That’s up to you as an individual.

O’REILLY: No, I’m not going to…

BECK: You know who also is liberation theology? Jeremiah Wright. OK, that’s liberation theology.

But listen, here, if your pastor is telling you or your priest is telling you that Jesus commands you to be charitable, he’s absolutely right, and you stand firmly by his side. But if he’s saying Jesus said, if a man asks you for your shirt, give the coat that you’re wearing to the government and have them give the man pants.

O’REILLY: Right. Wasn’t that in Luke 4?

BECK: That is social justice. This is a perversion.

O’REILLY: OK. Look, the Catholic Church contains many different points of view on that. And I’ve never heard a priest say you have to do this. Sometimes they give an opinion on it, but they don’t say you have to do it.

BECK: Where they are preaching – I can’t believe that I have liberals coming after – progressives coming after me for saying separation of church and state. If your church is saying that you need to – that God is telling you that a big giant government controlling all of these things is charity, huh-uh.

O’REILLY: Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar’s.

BECK: Exactly right.

foxnews.com/story/0,2933,589649,00.html

This is not the original quote. This is the backtack after people disagreed with him and after the fertilizer hit the windmill.

 

[RWMorris]

Are you Catholic?

Are you?

 

[Via_Dolorosa]

Are you?

Well let’s see.
Catholic grade school
Catholic high school
Catholic college
Catholic grad school
1 cousin who is a Catholic bishop
1 cousin who is a Catholic priest
1 uncle who was a Catholic priest (now deceased)
2 aunts who are Catholic nuns
1 son considering the priesthood
teach in a Catholic school.
I’m going to say yes.

 

[pnewton]

I just heard this the other day. I for one am done with him. He has entered my list of anticatholics and right-wing reactionaries who claim to love America while caring little or nothing for the majority of Americans.

On the bright side, Steven Colbert did an excellent job of subtley defending the idea of Catholic social justice in his latest show.

colbertnation.com/full-episodes/thu-march-18-2010-mary-matalin

Later in the show he showed he is not a fake Christian when interviewing Mary Matalin. This Republican strategist wore a cross, but quoted Jesus as saying, " Teach a man to fish."

Sometimes I cringe at being a Republican and being associated with such people. Then I remember that the Democrats have Michael Moore and Al Frankum.

 

[catharina]

This is not the original quote. This is the backtack after people disagreed with him and after the fertilizer hit the windmill.

Thanks for the clarification.

 

[Vasian]

Some things are just not reducible to neat little bytes.

It is undeniable that we have the obligation to transform social structures that promote injustice and maybe we can all agree here that statist collectivism and radical individualism (Smith’s “enlightened self-interest”) are likewise inherently materialistic and out of balance.

That is one beauty of Catholic thought, and among the things that drew me towards Catholicism in the first place. It isn’t either/or, but rather, both/and. That is, Catholic social justice is incarnated precisely where tensions between the individual and society threatens the good of either, and is bridged with a higher vision of both individual human dignity and the potential for a just society.

Yes, we have an absolute moral responsibility to work for social justice, but in the case where individual churches, or the parish Church lean away from the principle(s) of subsidiarity in the name of social justice they risk the underpinning safeguards of the Catholic view, which seeks to prevent a large, remote and powerful central political authority from imposing it’s Caesarian morality on individuals in the name of the collective state. In that instance, we likewise have an absolute moral obligation to oppose Caesar’s coin flip altogether, be it “heads” and Caesar wins, or “tails” and we lose.

The Lord did tell us to render to Caesar what is Caesar’s, but notice that what He implies by separating God from Caesar is that Caesar’s power is of an entirely different order than that of the power Jesus grants to the Church. It follows that the Church’s social justice is quite different from Caesar’s. Jesus also didn’t counsel that in so rendering to Caesar we should grant Caesar even greater authority to order our lives.

Our system is far different now, as is our culture, but the principle still holds and it comes from Wisdom Himself. The Church urges that wherever the social order is structurally opposed to the ideas of the Church regarding the dignity of the human person and a just social order we are to oppose them with steadfastness. This requires us to oppose on principle any attempts to cede subsidiary power to Caesar’s control, whether in the form, or in the name of “social justice”, “the children”, “security”, fairness, patriotic duty, or chocolate chip cookies, for that matter.

Ultimately, what Beck is saying is that the State is after the subsidiary power of individuals and the Church (notice that he prefaced all of his remarks with just such a warning), and that if your individual parish or church is leaning towards Caesar as a matter of course then you should check with the Priest or Bishop; or, in the case of Reverend Wright’s black-nationalist theology or Jim Wallis’ “inclusive theology”, simply run before the State does something like dictates who qualifies to adopt children in your parish and who does not; who can be ordained and not; or whether your local Catholic hospital can receive tax funds and still foreswear abortion procedures. Oh wait…they are doing or trying that already, while so many democrats, republicans and independents (and so many Christians) whistle the same-ole-same kumbayas.

I take Beck’s words as an urgent call for better discernment within the churches when it comes to social justice. If that ultimately leads to a greater division in the so-called Culture Wars, then so be it. Eschatologically speaking, let the wheat and the chaff fall where they may.

All my best…

And, there you have it:thumbsup:

 

[Vasian]

This is not the original quote. This is the backtack after people disagreed with him and after the fertilizer hit the windmill.

We all here at the Russia House sat and watched that very interview. I can tell you here, before our Lord, and you all that it is accurate enough that it conveys what the two talked about and that the subject matter is as it is stated herein.

Do I need to find the actual manuscript and post it as well?
Would that in fact, change your mind? Probably not.

Convet66’s writ hit the nail on the head:thumbsup:

 

[pnewton]

Some things are just not reducible to neat little bytes.

Ultimately, what Beck is saying is that the State is after the subsidiary power of individuals and the Church (notice that he prefaced all of his remarks with just such a warning), and that if your individual parish or church is leaning towards Caesar as a matter of course then you should check with the Priest or Bishop; or, in the case of Reverend Wright’s black-nationalist theology or Jim Wallis’ “inclusive theology”, simply run before the State does something like dictates who qualifies to adopt children in your parish and who does not; who can be ordained and not; or whether your local Catholic hospital can receive tax funds and still foreswear abortion procedures.

Interesting that you should mention sound bites and Reverend Wright ( I think we all remember those sound bites) in the same post. Could it be that Beck is being hoisted on his own petard? It is impossible for a person to always keep their prejudice from showing, as in the case of both Wright and Beck.