God doesn't speak Latin

  • Thread starter Thread starter Isa_Almisry
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
Dauphin said:
Let’s remember, too, that nobody’s forcing you to attend the Extraordinary Form. You, and any potential converts, are perfectly entitled to attend the Ordinary Form if you are so averse to the Church’s most ancient traditions.
Click to expand...
Dauphin,

You have been incredibly discouraging for several of us here in this forum today.

I may not be able to express myself as well as I would like, however I do understand exactly what is going on throughout the Mass, as does my 9 year old.

The attitude that you have had here with me and with several other posters is not that of a Christian. That word means to be “Christ like” , to take up your cross and follow him. Go ahead and mess with that one too.

Since I started attending the Catholic RCIA classes last September, I have created a chain reaction… I started telling everyone that I knew about the faith with excitement. At Easter a total of 6 of us entered together. This September we have brought 3 more into the RCIA and 1 more that comes to Mass.

Our attitude is the one to have. How many people are you bringing to Christ with the attitude you have? How can your arguements be benificial to anyone other than your self? You are posting for what appears to be self gratification and not to discuss but to argue.

I am a very good hearted and good natured person who is leaving now for Mass… I will be praying for you and your heart there.

Pam
 
I can’t believe you all had time from late morning to late afternoon to discuss this.

The lawns of the United States and Canada are looking pretty shaggy!😉
 
pyropam said:
Dauphin,

You have been incredibly discouraging for several of us here in this forum today.

I may not be able to express myself as well as I would like, however I do understand exactly what is going on throughout the Mass, as does my 9 year old.

The attitude that you have had here with me and with several other posters is not that of a Christian. That word means to be “Christ like” , to take up your cross and follow him. Go ahead and mess with that one too.

Since I started attending the Catholic RCIA classes last September, I have created a chain reaction… I started telling everyone that I knew about the faith with excitement. At Easter a total of 6 of us entered together. This September we have brought 3 more into the RCIA and 1 more that comes to Mass.

Our attitude is the one to have. How many people are you bringing to Christ with the attitude you have? How can your arguements be benificial to anyone other than your self? You are posting for what appears to be self gratification and not to discuss but to argue.

I am a very good hearted and good natured person who is leaving now for Mass… I will be praying for you and your heart there.

Pam
Click to expand...
The tone of my writing is often very harsh and bureaucratic. I apologize. I’m actually alot more friendly in person. Often, it’s difficult to convey your tone accurately in writing. (even now, I know that I wouldn’t be talking like this to a person sitting in front of me - I’d talk much more informally.)
 
Walking_Home said:
Isa Almisry;2725760:
I was speaking in general. Our programs that bring converts in should make it a priority to give a good understanding of the core beliefs of our Faith.

Lets keep this civil–or is this an Orthodox trait.
Click to expand...
I think her posts have demonstrated that she understands well enough.

That her son understands well enough (I assume taught by her).

She might not be able to argue the fine points of transubstantiation versus consubstantiation or the Orthodox objections to the teaching of transubstatiation. But I see that her son pointing out WHO, not WHAT, is on the altar suffices.

Now, I’m a product of the University of Chicago, a Nobel (most prizes anywhere) place. Whatever you can do, we can do meta.

I’ve been told that I’m the only one to convert to Orthodoxy through the Encyclopedia Britannica.

And I’m about as elitist as they come. BUT

my civility runs very thin when I see the simple gift of faith being belittled. Think of it! She’s not even one of ours, but a new catch of yours! And you sneer at her humble (and on analysis I believe, correct) grasp of the Faith. But I’ll let iamrefreshed teach you. I am not so humble nor gentle, nor as much in the right.
Click to expand...
 
Dauphin said:
Really? The Traditional Latin Mass was abrogated, was it?
Click to expand...
The Traditional Latin Mass has BEEN in the vernacular before, in other historical times! It was approved to be offered as such in China by the Jesuits.

Honestly :rolleyes: , “the Traditional Latin Mass was abrogated, was it?” You’re engaging in polemics. I never said that. I said the homilist’s argument citing the iconostasis and how we’d been “lead” beyond it was faulty and illogical. The Church distinguishes between the positive Will of God and the permissive will of God. You’ve no idea that the Holy Spirit is exercising His positive Will in regard to Latin anymore than I know He’s exercising His positive Will in regard to the vernacular. The difference is, I would never propose that it was other than His permissive will.
 
Wow. I think what I’m getting from all this is a bunch of hair pulling. The condescending tone used here by a few is distracting me from whatever point you are trying to make. Some people seem to get nasty when someone offers a different view point other than their own. I guess it doesn’t matter if you behave “Christ like” just so long as you prefer Latin.

By the way, picking on a new convert and trying to distort what they post in order to make yourself look smart is troublesome. And even more troublesome is being called out on it and refusing to apologize for it. But hey, I’m just a new convert too, so what do I know.
 
AngelsAmongUs said:
Wow. I think what I’m getting from all this is a bunch of hair pulling. The condescending tone used here by a few is distracting me from whatever point you are trying to make. Some people seem to get nasty when someone offers a different view point other than their own. I guess it doesn’t matter if you behave “Christ like” just so long as you prefer Latin.

By the way, picking on a new convert and trying to distort what they post in order to make yourself look smart is troublesome. And even more troublesome is being called out on it and refusing to apologize for it. But hey, I’m just a new convert too, so what do I know.
Click to expand...
I apologize.
 
Dauphin said:
The tone of my writing is often very harsh and bureaucratic. I apologize. I’m actually alot more friendly in person. Often, it’s difficult to convey your tone accurately in writing. (even now, I know that I wouldn’t be talking like this to a person sitting in front of me - I’d talk much more informally.)
Click to expand...
Hey don’t worry about it cos I’m not offended. Humour doesn’t come over well in posting either. But as I said above, Latin is fine perhaps if you understand it or even if you have been brought up with it. However, if the Church wants to grow and convert people then it has to have vernacular Mass too otherwise people will not convert due to lack of understanding. If all Masses were in Latin, it would be an injustice to those who might otherwise have converted. (Like me)
 
JKirkLVNV said:
The Traditional Latin Mass has BEEN in the vernacular before, in other historical times! It was approved to be offered as such in China by the Jesuits.

Honestly :rolleyes: , “the Traditional Latin Mass was abrogated, was it?” You’re engaging in polemics. I never said that. I said the homilist’s argument citing the iconostasis and how we’d been “lead” beyond it was faulty and illogical. The Church distinguishes between the positive Will of God and the permissive will of God. You’ve no idea that the Holy Spirit is exercising His positive Will in regard to Latin anymore than I know He’s exercising His positive Will in regard to the vernacular. The difference is, I would never propose that it was other than His permissive will.
Click to expand...
I’m sorry. I think enjoy polemics a bit too much…
 
Linnyo said:
Hey don’t worry about it cos I’m not offended. Humour doesn’t come over well in posting either. But as I said above, Latin is fine perhaps if you understand it or even if you have been brought up with it. However, if the Church wants to grow and convert people then it has to have vernacular Mass too otherwise people will not convert due to lack of understanding. If all Masses were in Latin, it would be an injustice to those who might otherwise have converted. (Like me)
Click to expand...
Absolutely! The Holy Spirit has guided the church to the use of the vernacular. We have to recognize, though, that Latin also has great value.
 
Caesar said:
The issue of understanding goes far beyond language. You can have all the vernacular Masses you want, but they mean nothing without proper doctrinal and liturgical formation. Furthermore, language has no bearing on the spirituality of the Mass.
Click to expand...
I’m happy to be able to concur with you, Caesar.
 
Dauphin said:
I’m sorry. I think enjoy polemics a bit too much…
Click to expand...
Me or you? I don’t enjoy them at all. I’m simply defending the idea of the vernacular. You’re the one saying suggesting that I stated that the TLM had been abrogated. Honestly.

Consider this as a scenario: what if, after the council, the Tridentine has simply been allowed to be tranlated into
English and simplified (somewhat)? Do you think we’d have the liturgy wars we’re having now?
 
Dauphin said:
Are Panem and Panis synonymns? Could you provide a translation, here? I can only find a reference to panem meaning “part of”.
Click to expand...
Panis, -is m. bread

nom. panis
gen. panis
dat. pani
acc. panem
abl. pane

Panem nostrum quotidianum da nobis hodie.

Give us today our daily bread (Our Father).

Panem coelestem accipiam, et nomen Domini invocabo.

I will take the Bread of heaven, and call upon the Name of the Lord. (Communion of the Priest).
 
Isa_Almisry said:
Walking_Home;2725775:
I think her posts have demonstrated that she understands well enough.

That her son understands well enough (I assume taught by her).

She might not be able to argue the fine points of transubstantiation versus consubstantiation or the Orthodox objections to the teaching of transubstatiation. But I see that her son pointing out WHO, not WHAT, is on the altar suffices.

Now, I’m a product of the University of Chicago, a Nobel (most prizes anywhere) place. Whatever you can do, we can do meta.

I’ve been told that I’m the only one to convert to Orthodoxy through the Encyclopedia Britannica.

And I’m about as elitist as they come. BUT

my civility runs very thin when I see the simple gift of faith being belittled. Think of it! She’s not even one of ours, but a new catch of yours! And you sneer at her humble (and on analysis I believe, correct) grasp of the Faith
Click to expand...

. But I’ll let iamrefreshed teach you. I am not so humble nor gentle, nor as much in the right.​

Can you please show me where I sneered at her humble grasp of Faith.
Click to expand...
 
JKirkLVNV said:
Me or you? I don’t enjoy them at all. I’m simply defending the idea of the vernacular.
Click to expand...
Me. I’ve picked up a few of the traits of Canadian politicians. They tend to scream over eachother on national television, making broad generalizations. I was a political junkie for quite a while.
Consider this as a scenario: what if, after the council, the Tridentine has simply been allowed to be tranlated into
English and simplified (somewhat)? Do you think we’d have the liturgy wars we’re having now?
Click to expand...
Yes. The Ordinary form of the Mass is very solid and orthodox, when done properly. The problem was that modernists took Vatican II as a cue to unleash all sorts of havoc on the liturgy. This wouldn’t have changed.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top