Had vasectomy - so where does it leave me

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cheese_sdc said:
You’re absolutely right. The kids aren’t the problem. Rather the problem are those people who have given up their own common sense and discernment to a body of people who’s life experiences are complete foreign to stresses of marriage and childrearing in our present time.

There are consequences to everything, including false piety and a saccharine spirituality that seems sweet, but leaves a bitter aftertaste. When a family has more stress than it can bear - and each individual has to determine wear that limit is, then children suffer.

And before one of y’all pulls out some quote about suffering for the sake of the kingdom BS, that kind of suffering is for adults. Adults whose life choices knowingly bring suffering to their offspring are contemptible.

Which is what happens when a family system is stressed beyond the capacity of the parents support it, mentally, financially, or emotionally.

And you may think I don’t have a clue, but I was raised Catholic, and attended seminary, graduated with honors from the minor seminary summa cum laude (top 3 in my class).

So I understand the Church’s position. I just find it wrong.
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Working every day to follow the teachings of Holy Mother Church is not giving up one’s common sense and discernment.

Those who fall due to struggles, and repent, are forgiven (thank God).

That does not make immoral choices moral, it just makes them forgiven.
 
newbetx said:
So because of your experience, you believe you are more credible than the church’s biblical scholars, Popes and scripture writers?
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and, I’ll add this CONFESSORS…

you know, the ones who hear both sides of the stories, the heartache, the sources of pain, the destruction. They know more about family life than the families do.

If one would actually read what John Paul has written, well, some would be shocked that a celibate man has such a handle on the sexes and humanity.
 
newbetx said:
So because of your experience, you believe you are more credible than the church’s biblical scholars, Popes and scripture writers?
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I believe that the only person who can make a decision about my family is my wife and myself.

Popes and priests and anyone else can say “This is right.” or “This is wrong.” However, if after doing the research and study I still disagree, then I refuse to appear before Divinity and say, “You know, I thought it was wrong, but everyone else said it was okay…”

I’d much rather appear before Divinity and say “I did what I thought was right.”
 
cheese_sdc said:
I’d much rather appear before Divinity and say “I did what I thought was right.”
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So, than, Hitler dies and goes before God and says that. What happens? I understand completely that there is a difference between a vascetomy and Hitler! Just trying to show you what a slippery slope it can be sometimes!

By the way, your screen name and religion made me chuckle.
 
You need to be sorry for you sin in order to receive forgiveness. It does not seem like you regret your sin. Sometimes it takes awhile to see how wrong a sin truly is. How much it hurt God, others, even yourself. One day, hopefully, you will regret your sin. Once you do feel sorry for what you have done, God will be waiting with open, loving arms to forgive you in the confessional. And your sin will be no more. In the mean time keep studying your faith and trying your best to live and practice the Catholic teachings.
 
agapewolf said:
and, I’ll add this CONFESSORS…

you know, the ones who hear both sides of the stories, the heartache, the sources of pain, the destruction. They know more about family life than the families do.

If one would actually read what John Paul has written, well, some would be shocked that a celibate man has such a handle on the sexes and humanity.
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I read a lot of military history. A lot. I’ve given lectures on World War II at museums. I have friends who are deployed, or have been deployed overseas. I have worked with people who have served in three different wars.

I lived near a military base and had friends whose dad’s were soldiers.

Does any of that make me a soldier? Or a combat vet? 😉
 
Rascalking said:
So, than, Hitler dies and goes before God and says that. What happens? I understand completely that there is a difference between a vascetomy and Hitler! Just trying to show you what a slippery slope it can be sometimes!
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Godwins Law. 🙂 As a Catholic, you should know that the Church teaches that we cannot know with any degree of certainty what the final resting place of Hitler is.
By the way, your screen name and religion made me chuckle.
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Me too. 🙂
 
cheese_sdc said:
Godwins Law. 🙂 As a Catholic, you should know that the Church teaches that we cannot know with any degree of certainty what the final resting place of Hitler is.

Me too. 🙂
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Um, yes. I know this. What’s your point? You never addressed my comment. What WE think is right may not be.
 
cheese_sdc said:
I read a lot of military history. A lot. I’ve given lectures on World War II at museums. I have friends who are deployed, or have been deployed overseas. I have worked with people who have served in three different wars.

I lived near a military base and had friends whose dad’s were soldiers.

Does any of that make me a soldier? Or a combat vet? 😉
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Your wink smilie doesn’t make your point…you see, priests ARE family men. They have thousands of spiritual children. They have to get up at night to take care of them, while still having to wake early to celebrate mass and their obligatory hours…which is like the phone call home to the wife. The priest woos her bride at the ambo to the marriage bed at the altar.

So, while you are comparing the analogy to traumatic experiences and lack of,

these men that FEEL the family hurting, and weep with them, and enter into their woundedness as deeply as if he were blood relative (read: adopted sons and daughters-same thing) actually become fathers. Yes, that makes them a father, thats why they are called that.
 
agapewolf said:
Your wink smilie doesn’t make your point…you see, priests ARE family men. They have thousands of spiritual children. They have to get up at night to take care of them, while still having to wake early to celebrate mass and their obligatory hours…which is like the phone call home to the wife. The priest woos her bride at the ambo to the marriage bed at the altar.

So, while you are comparing the analogy to traumatic experiences and lack of,

these men that FEEL the family hurting, and weep with them, and enter into their woundedness as deeply as if he were blood relative (read: adopted sons and daughters-same thing) actually become fathers. Yes, that makes them a father, thats why they are called that.
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Are you married?
 
Rascalking said:
Um, yes. I know this. What’s your point? You never addressed my comment. What WE think is right may not be.
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🙂

Good point. How do we know what is right? I would argue that the 10 Commandments gives a pretty good framework for how to live life in a community with your fellow men.

And it’s notably silent about things such as birth control.
 
cheese_sdc said:
🙂

Good point. How do we know what is right? I would argue that the 10 Commandments gives a pretty good framework for how to live life in a community with your fellow men.

And it’s notably silent about things such as birth control.
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Thanks. Not many people say, “good point” in a discussion. They just argue stupidly and make themselves look like idiots.

I would totally agree that the 10 Commandments are a pretty good framework. I go further and say that it’s God’s law.

As for the birth control thing, personally, I find it funny. People leave the church over that issue, they start online brawls, they curse, yell, scream-what’s worse-a married couple using condums or a a satanist? People would get angrier at the couple using condums!

It makes me laugh.
 
agapewolf said:
Your wink smilie doesn’t make your point…you see, priests ARE family men. They have thousands of spiritual children. They have to get up at night to take care of them, while still having to wake early to celebrate mass and their obligatory hours…which is like the phone call home to the wife. The priest woos her bride at the ambo to the marriage bed at the altar.

So, while you are comparing the analogy to traumatic experiences and lack of,

these men that FEEL the family hurting, and weep with them, and enter into their woundedness as deeply as if he were blood relative (read: adopted sons and daughters-same thing) actually become fathers. Yes, that makes them a father, thats why they are called that.
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AND they have to abstain from sexual intimacy…So if anyone should understand…it would be them.😉
 
agapewolf said:
Your wink smilie doesn’t make your point…you see, priests ARE family men. They have thousands of spiritual children. They have to get up at night to take care of them, while still having to wake early to celebrate mass and their obligatory hours…which is like the phone call home to the wife. The priest woos her bride at the ambo to the marriage bed at the altar.

So, while you are comparing the analogy to traumatic experiences and lack of,

these men that FEEL the family hurting, and weep with them, and enter into their woundedness as deeply as if he were blood relative (read: adopted sons and daughters-same thing) actually become fathers. Yes, that makes them a father, thats why they are called that.
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Sorry. Until you’ve lived the married life, you really don’t understand it.
 
agapewolf said:
And they live the married life. That’s the part you are missing.
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No. They don’t. Until you life with a family, 24/7, with no place to retreat to - having to sleep in the same bed as the person you’re incredibly angry with, you’re not married.

Until you’ve raised a child and had to care for it and discipline it, you have a theoretical knowledge of family… but you’re not a family man.
 
cheese_sdc said:
No. They don’t. Until you life with a family, 24/7, with no place to retreat to - having to sleep in the same bed as the person you’re incredibly angry with, you’re not married.

Until you’ve raised a child and had to care for it and discipline it, you have a theoretical knowledge of family… but you’re not a family man.
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Since your experience with your marriage is not my experience with my marriage, you can never truly understand my marriage, can you?

Well, of course you can, because we have learned things that are common to all Cristian marriages.

A priest who has been hearing confessions for a year or more probably knows more about the dark secrets and struggles that occur in marriage than you or I will ever know.
 
Y’all. Come on, now. This is getting funny.

If we were talking about any other profession - plumber, repair man, or business executive and someone were to say “You know, I’ve never been a plumber, but I talk to them everyday and I listen to them talk about their jobs… so that makes me a plumber and not only that, qualified to tell a real plumber how to do his job.” How would you react?

You’d laugh. For obvious reasons.
 
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