Has Eternal Life?

[petra]

This has been extremely enlightening, Petra and Japhy. Thank you both!

Hi Socrates,

I’m glad this has been enlightening! This discussion has been beneficial to me, as well. It helped me to organize my thoughts and better articulate my own understanding.

Me, before i came here, held position number (2). I agreed with Mother Theresa that once someone sees truth, he cannot unsee it. I could not imagine anyone having become aware of the unbelievable love of God ever wanting to live without it. A person would have to be insane to give it up, or somehow not a Christian in the first place.

I agree it is hard to imagine rejecting God after knowing the depths of His love. However, sometimes people lose their faith when tested. If they endure great loss and injustice and wonder where God was in their time of need, it can be a turning point for some people. The allure of the world can also be very deceptive, and it is sobering to realize the extent to which we can rationalize our sin. Jeremiah 17:9 says, “The heart is more deceitful than all else and is desperately sick; Who can understand it?” More often than not, people fall away from God gradually. First neglect of one’s spiritual life, then a developing love of the world, then grave sin.

Perhaps this idea about what point a person receives eternal life is what St. Augustine called a non-essential of the faith? If someone does not believe the same as you do, i do not think that means the person is damned for his belief.

As far as I know, the point about whether eternal life is received now or in the future is not dogma and Catholics can differ in their opinion on this. If I’m mistaken, I welcome correction.

I wonder if this is the same for believing a person cannot lose his salvation. If a Catholic has that belief, is she eternally condemned?

The doctrine of “once saved, always saved” is definitely contrary to Catholic doctrine and dogma. Many Catholics (or all Christians, for that matter) occasionally have doubts or struggle with certain doctrines. The struggle itself is not a sin. However, what we do with that doubt could turn into an occasion for sin. The proper response to doubt and struggle is to pray, read the scriptures, and avail ourselves to the sacraments.

The improper response is to cause scandal and publicly defy the Church’s infallibility on issues of faith and morals. It would be wrong to throw the baby out with the bathwater, so to speak, jettisoning things we know to be true just because of a few points of contention. It would be wrong to leave the Church.

Is this person eternally condemned, you ask? Well, first of all, people are not condemned until they are judged to be separated from Christ after this life. As long someone lives, there is always hope of reconciliation.

Secondly, there are 3 conditions that must be met for someone to fall into mortal sin:

1. The action must be objectively grave.
2. The individual must have sufficiently understood what he/she was doing.
3. The individual must have acted freely and without coercion.

Doubting is not a grave matter. If a Catholic finds herself doubting that salvation can be lost, no, she is certainly not condemned. Not a single condition of mortal sin is met. However, doubting can be the start to walking down a path wherein salvation could be jeopardized. Only God is the judge of when that line is crossed.

 

[japhy]

In another, simpler approach to John 17:3, if eternal life is God, then if one “has” eternal life, one “has” God, or one is in God. As petra stated, it’s not your possession of the life which is eternal, but rather, eternity is a quality of that life, and as long as you are a partaker in that life, you are a partaker in eternity. You can lose (or deny) that knowledge of God, and thus be apart from it, but that doesn’t change the fact that the eternal life is God.

 

[guanophore]

Will you tell me, then, at what point in time do we start living the eternal life God gives to us (before we close our eyes for the last time in this life or when we open our eyes for the first time in the next?

Clearly Jesus intended to announce and begin eternal life (Kingdom of Heaven) immediately. He told the woman at the well that he would give her living water. This is in the present tense.

"From that time Jesus began to preach, saying, “Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.” Matt 4:17

" And preach as you go, saying, ‘The kingdom of heaven is at hand.’ Matt 10:6-7

“From the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven has suffered violence, and men of violence take it by force.” Matt 11:12

“But if it is by the Spirit of God that I cast out demons, then the kingdom of God has come upon you.” Matt 12:28-29

“Truly, I say to you, there are some standing here who will not taste death before they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom.” Matt 16:28

“Truly, I say to you, the tax collectors and the harlots go into the kingdom of God before you.” Matt 21:31

“Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born anew, he cannot see the kingdom of God.” John 3:3

" For the kingdom of God is not food and drink but righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit; " Rom 14:16-18

“He has delivered us from the dominion of darkness and transferred us to the kingdom of his beloved Son, 14 in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.” Col 1:13-14

"To him who loves us and has freed us from our sins by his blood 6 and made us a kingdom, priests to his God and Father,"Rev 1:5-

What do you think Jesus meant?

19Jesus gave them this answer: "I tell you the truth, the Son can do nothing by himself; he can do only what he sees his Father doing, because whatever the Father does the Son also does. 20For the Father loves the Son and shows him all he does. Yes, to your amazement he will show him even greater things than these. 21For just as the Father raises the dead and gives them life, even so the Son gives life to whom he is pleased to give it. 22Moreover, the Father judges no one, but has entrusted all judgment to the Son, 23that all may honor the Son just as they honor the Father. He who does not honor the Son does not honor the Father, who sent him.

24"I tell you the truth, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be condemned; he has crossed over from death to life. 25I tell you the truth, a time is coming and has now come when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God and those who hear will live. 26For as the Father has life in himself, so he has granted the Son to have life in himself. 27And he has given him authority to judge because he is the Son of Man. 28"Do not be amazed at this, for a time is coming when all who are in their graves will hear his voice 29and come out—those who have done good will rise to live, and those who have done evil will rise to be condemned. 30By myself I can do nothing; I judge only as I hear, and my judgment is just, for I seek not to please myself but him who sent me.
(John 5:19-30)
[/INDENT]

I guess I don’t understand the question. He meant what He said, of course? I don’t understand the point of the dispute. It sounded to me like you were making a case that baptism was not essential? I guess you are using these passages as “proofs” to that?

 

[guanophore]

Does anyone know the answer?

Socrates, I really don’t understand the question. You keep asking what Jesus meant…he meant what He said! I guess you are saying there are different ways of understanding His words? I am not sure why you are asking the question, or what you hope to find in the way of an “answer”.

 

[petra]

I think the Scriptures point to eternal life as an inheritance that we must come in to, in order to actually “have” or “receive” it. Here’s a look through Scripture; this isn’t exhaustive, but contains passages which I believe point to the “inheritance” idea, as well as some which are less certain

I have no disagreement that eternal life is something we hope for in the future. I do not disagree with any of the scriptures you cited. However, they do not preclude that a specific quality of eternal life can be experienced now. Scriptures and the Catechism support this.

It is both. We can have eternal life now, and it is also our future inheritance if we remain in Christ.

Peace,

petra

 

[guanophore]

Sorry, i missed this reply. If what you say is true, then i’m having difficulty understanding.

Lets say you, Rocky, have eternal life right now (and i hope you do)! Lets say you, a year from now, suffer a tragedy in your life where you blame God and you leave the church and become an evangelist of atheism (God forbid)! Lets say, which sounds improbable but not impossible, that you continue in this state, leading many away from Christ, committing one mortal sin after another, until you die and find yourself in hell. (It’s fiction, i know, please bear with me).

Given these circumstances, you will end up with eternal death (or eternal damnation) not eternal life. How, then, can the life you were living prior to leaving Jesus have been eternal? It could not, for it did not last, and eternal means forever.

No, i think the only alternatives that do not contradict Christ are:

(1) Eternal life does not begin until after death.

(2) Once a person receives eternal life, he begins living it in the present, and God makes some change in him so that he will never want to walk away.

Please correct me if i’m wrong and try to explain why.

Ok, I understand this question better. It is neither of the above. I think it is a difference in how eternal life is understood? Think of it as a river of Life. When we are justified (saved), our souls become open to the river. We can get in the river, and travel upon it. However, at any point we choose, we can get out of the river and walk back into the desert from whence we came. The river doesn’t change, and we can return to it whenever we are ready (if we live long enough!).

 

[petra]

In another, simpler approach to John 17:3, if eternal life is God, then if one “has” eternal life, one “has” God, or one is in God. As petra stated, it’s not your possession of the life which is eternal, but rather, eternity is a quality of that life, and as long as you are a partaker in that life, you are a partaker in eternity. You can lose (or deny) that knowledge of God, and thus be apart from it, but that doesn’t change the fact that the eternal life is God.

That is a great summary!

 

[guanophore]

When did he receive it? After death. When was he promised it? When he was in the grace of God.

The Catholic Church teaches that we receive eternal life at the moment of baptism. However, the point has been made that God Himself is not bound my that sacrament. That is the “normative” way that God has provided that people enter into eternal life. However, some people enter through another method. Those are also expected to be baptized. Catholicism teaches that grace is imparted at baptism, and the soul is regenerated, and made capable of entering eternal life.

 

[japhy]

However, they do not preclude that a specific quality of eternal life can be experienced now. Scriptures and the Catechism support this.

It is both. We can have eternal life now, and it is also our future inheritance if we remain in Christ.

Ah, we find agreement. Yes, I agree with you now. The bolded part of your response clears things up for me, especially in light of 1 Tim 6:12 (Fight the good fight of the faith; take hold of the eternal life to which you were called when you made the good confession in the presence of many witnesses.)

Amen, peace. I’ll include you all in my Night Prayers, which it is just about time for. Good night all.

 

[guanophore]

Yes, i can see how that can be true. So, i take it you, Japhy, disagree with Petra, who thinks (3) is true, and you think (1) is true?

(1) Eternal life does not begin until after death.

(2) Once a person receives eternal life, he begins living it in the present, and God makes some change in him so that he will never want to walk away.

(3) Eternal life begins at the moment we enter the state of God’s grace and continues after death, unless we fall out of God’s grace.

None of the above (again). I feel like I am on some sort of riddle hunt here. No one can “fall” out of God’s grace, or be snatched out of it.

" My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me; 28 and I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish, and no one shall snatch them out of my hand. 29 My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father’s hand. 30 I and the Father are one."
John 10:27-30

The only way to get lost is to deliberately and repeatedly JUMP out!

 

[guanophore]

Guano, Guano, you are on edge about so many things!

How does not understanding your question get interpreted as “on edge”. I guess if that means this is frustrating, then yes. I have the feeling you are attempting to lead me to discovery of truth, a baby step at a time.

Only one thing is needed, to listen to what Jesus has to say to us on this, and to see what his followers think he was trying to say about this.

I’m not here to beat you over the head with the Bible and prove you wrong.

Then what are you doing? I have the sense that you do believe I need to be “proved wrong”, however, it seems like you would prefer that I beat myself over the head with my own bible insead!

What good does it do to win a debate and lose the truth? I’m looking for answers.

For what purpose? I think you already have the answers you want, and what you are looking for is that I find them too.

I’m taking it slow and asking one specific question at a time. In this discussion thread i’m seeking the answer to only one question, which i will repeat for your benefit:

Do you believe eternal life can be a present possession while still in our current form of existence?

Ok, well I gave you my answer to this in the previousl post. However, you did not start out with this question. In fact, it took about two days and twenty posts for you to state it.

I just want to know how Jesus is answering this question in John 5:24:

“I tell you the truth, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be condemned; he has crossed over from death to life.”

I don’t think that we have a disagreement about the “when” having already occurred when the word is heard, and belief occurs.

I’m not looking for some kind of debate about whether Protestantism or Catholicism is true. If you want to put your boxing gloves on and duke that one out, please consider starting another discussion thread.

Perhaps that is not your agenda. I know you have one, I am just not sure what it is. If you prefer to keep it hidden, that is certainly your perogative. In the end, whatever interpretational differences we have will eventually fall into one category or the other.

 

[guanophore]

I suppose what we have to do is define what “eternal life” means. I understand it to mean eternity in Heaven, in my resurrected body. It’s contrasted with “eternal death” or “eternal damnation” which is eternity in Hell, in my resurrected body.

I’m not in Heaven or Hell right now. I might have eternal life, but I’m not currently living an “eternal life” right now. I’m living a temporal life. When I pass from this temporal life into death, I pray that I will pass from death into eternal life.

Perhaps it makes sense to think of eternal life as being “payable on death”, or in some CD bank account that you can only “withdraw” from after you’ve run out of this temporal life.

Here ya go Socrates! You have an improperly catechised Catholic to work on!

 

[guanophore]

Me, before i came here, held position number (2). I agreed with Mother Theresa that once someone sees truth, he cannot unsee it. I could not imagine anyone having become aware of the unbelievable love of God ever wanting to live without it. A person would have to be insane to give it up, or somehow not a Christian in the first place.

No, scripture clearly teaches that a Christian can give it up. Or, do you think that Judas never believed?

Even Paul wasn’t sure of his own salvation:" Every athlete exercises self-control in all things. They do it to receive a perishable wreath, but we an imperishable. Well, I do not run aimlessly, I do not box as one beating the air; but I pommel my body and subdue it, lest after preaching to others** I myself should be disqualified. **(1 Cor 9:25-27) Paul admits he constantly fights against his body (that is, his fleshly impulses).

The letter to the Hebrews stresses that we must pay the closer attention to what we have heard, lest we drift away from it (Heb 2:1).

Peter’s second letter refers to the possibility of **being led astray **by false teachers who contort Scripture: "And count the forbearance of our Lord as salvation. So also our beloved brother Paul wrote to you according to the wisdom given him, speaking of this as he does in all his letters. There are some things in them hard to understand, which the ignorant and unstable twist to their own destruction, as they do the other scriptures. You therefore, beloved, knowing this beforehand, beware lest you be carried away with the error of lawless men and lose your own stability. (2 Pet 3:15-17)

You are also correct about not being able to return to ignorance after becoming enlightened. Although an apostate can still see the truth, they willfully ignore it.

Heb 6:4-8
4 For it is impossible to restore again to repentance those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, and have become partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5 and have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6 if they then commit apostasy, since they crucify the Son of God on their own account and hold him up to contempt. 7 For land which has drunk the rain that often falls upon it, and brings forth vegetation useful to those for whose sake it is cultivated, receives a blessing from God. 8 But if it bears thorns and thistles, it is worthless and near to being cursed; its end is to be burned. "

Perhaps this idea about what point a person receives eternal life is what St. Augustine called a non-essential of the faith? If someone does not believe the same as you do, i do not think that means the person is damned for his belief.

I wonder if this is the same for believing a person cannot lose his salvation. If a Catholic has that belief, is she eternally condemned?

According to Catholic teaching, it is essential to be baptized. Baptism is the normative method of entry into eternal life. Therefore, I do not think it would be considered “non-essential” as defined by Augustine. You are also correct that a person is not condemned for ignorance. Each person will be judged in the light of what they know. Only God can see the heart, so the Church does not pronounce judgement on whether a person is saved, or not.

 

[guanophore]

I have no disagreement that eternal life is something we hope for in the future. I do not disagree with any of the scriptures you cited. However, they do not preclude that a specific quality of eternal life can be experienced now. Scriptures and the Catechism support this.

It is both. We can have eternal life now, and it is also our future inheritance if we remain in Christ.

Peace,

petra

Yes, it is present and future, but also a past event.

Luke 18:14
14 I tell you, this man **went down to his house justified **rather than the other; for every one who exalts himself will be humbled, but he who humbles himself will be exalted."

It has already occurred in the past, based on the work Jesus did on the cross.
Rom 3:22-25
For there is no distinction; 23 since all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 they are justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption which is in Christ Jesus, 25 whom God put forward as an expiation by his blood, to be received by faith.

For believers, an event that began eternal life already has been completed in the past:

1 Cor 6:11
But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.

Rom 5:1-2
Therefore, since we are justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ. 2 Through him we have obtained access to this grace in which we stand, and we rejoice in our hope of sharing the glory of God.

Justified by blood, and will be saved (a past event, occurring in the present, will be completed in the future)

Rom 5:9-10
9 Since, therefore, we are now justified by his blood, much more shall we be saved by him from the wrath of God. 10 For if while we were enemies we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, now that we are reconciled, shall we be saved by his life.

 

[Bishopite]

Yes, it is present and future, but also a past event.

Luke 18:14
14 I tell you, this man **went down to his house justified **rather than the other; for every one who exalts himself will be humbled, but he who humbles himself will be exalted."

It has already occurred in the past, based on the work Jesus did on the cross.
Rom 3:22-25
For there is no distinction; 23 since all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 they are justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption which is in Christ Jesus, 25 whom God put forward as an expiation by his blood, to be received by faith.

For believers, an event that began eternal life already has been completed in the past:

1 Cor 6:11
But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God.

Rom 5:1-2
Therefore, since we are justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ. 2 Through him we have obtained access to this grace in which we stand, and we rejoice in our hope of sharing the glory of God.

Justified by blood, and will be saved (a past event, occurring in the present, will be completed in the future)

Rom 5:9-10
9 Since, therefore, we are now justified by his blood, much more shall we be saved by him from the wrath of God. 10 For if while we were enemies we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, now that we are reconciled, shall we be saved by his life.

No, you have not been saved until you endure to the end…
Mt 10:22 “he who endures to the end will be saved” therefore if you don’t endure to the end you won’t be saved.

Even though Jesus’ death on the cross is eternal and transends time that doesn’t mean that because He died we will automatically be saved or get a free ride. That falsely denies the reality of, and possibility of falling into mortal sin before death

1 Cor 6:9-11 "Do you not know that the unjust will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators nor idolaters nor adulterers nor boy prostitutes nor sodomites or thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor robbers will inherit the kingdom of God. That is what some of you used to be; but now you have had yourselves washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and in the Spirit of our God. "

1 John 5:16-17 "If anyone sees his brother sinning, if the sin is not deadly, he should pray to God and he will give him life. This is only for those whose sin is not deadly. There is such a thing as deadly sin, about which I do not say that you should pray.
All wrongdoing is sin, but there is sin that is not deadly. "
John 15:6-10
“I am the vine, you are the branches. Whoever remains in me and I in him will bear much fruit, because without me you can do nothing. Anyone who does not remain in me will be thrown out like a branch and wither; people will gather them and throw them into a fire and they will be burned. If you remain in me and my words remain in you, ask for whatever you want and it will be done for you. By this is my Father glorified, that you bear much fruit and become my disciples. As the Father loves me, so I also love you. Remain in my love. If you keep my commandments, you will remain in my love, just as I have kept my Father’s commandments and remain in his love.”

Jesus said if you remain in my word and “anyone who does not remain in me” will be thrown into a fire. And if you remain in me and my words" also if you keep my commandments, you will remain in my love. Lots of ifs which are conditional upon us doing our part. Jesus did His part now it is up to us to do our part and keep His commandments and reamain in Him by avoiding the “sin that leads to death.”

 

[Socrates4Jesus]

**Quote by Soc:**Perhaps this idea about what point a person receives eternal life is what St. Augustine called a non-essential of the faith? If someone does not believe the same as you do, i do not think that means the person is damned for his belief. Of course what is non-essential? Who decides? Individual?

We catholics (and orthodox and many protestant denominations) believe that Baptism is essential for salvation. Some protestants think it’s merely a symbol and is totally unnecessary.

**Quote by Soc:**I wonder if this is the same for believing a person cannot lose his salvation. If a Catholic has that belief, is she eternally condemned? No

Hey, White Wiz!

To answer your questions:

Essential doctrine = a belief which a person must hold in order to become or remain a ChristianNon-essential doctrine = a belief about which different people can disagree and still become or remain ChristiansAn essential doctrine is what might be called a truth a person must accept, or is required by God to accept, before she can become an adopted child of God. A non-essential doctrine is one that Christians can debate (in some cases even should debate) but over which they should never divide.

Perhaps this is what St. Augustine was saying when he wrote: “In essentials, unity. In non-essentials, liberty. In all things, charity.” This is what the Protestants whom i respect believe. I think this might be what you believe based on your reply.

An example might be the idea of predestination. From my limited understanding, there are Catholic Thomists (did i spell this correctly?) who believe God gives a special grace to certain people at the moment of their physical birth so that these people are guaranteed to live for Christ and enter heaven. They are saints from birth, these Thomists say. (BTW, this is similar to Protestant Calvinists and Reformed Theologians who take a more extreme view and believe the Bible to teach that all Christians are chosen before birth to become Christians by God.)

There are other Catholics, from what i understand, who disagree with the Thomists. They say that God’s grace is never irresistible and that anyone has the freedom to turn her back on Christ.

To answer your other question, namely, who determines what the essential doctrines are. Many Protestants would say the authors of the Bible make this determination. The Bible, for them, and for me, is the final court of arbitration.

I’m not saying the Roman Catholic church is wrong on the essentials; i’m only saying that for me to accept the Roman Catholic church is right on the essentials, a Catholic would have to show me how the New Testament agrees with the essential doctrines of the church.

 

[Socrates4Jesus]

You can use the little blue arrow next to the posters name to follow the messages backward.

Thanks for the tip, Guano!

 

[Socrates4Jesus]

… The doctrine of “once saved, always saved” is definitely contrary to Catholic doctrine and dogma. Many Catholics (or all Christians, for that matter) occasionally have doubts or struggle with certain doctrines. The struggle itself is not a sin. However, what we do with that doubt could turn into an occasion for sin. The proper response to doubt and struggle is to pray, read the scriptures, and avail ourselves to the sacraments.

The improper response is to cause scandal and publicly defy the Church’s infallibility on issues of faith and morals. It would be wrong to throw the baby out with the bathwater, so to speak, jettisoning things we know to be true just because of a few points of contention. It would be wrong to leave the Church.

Is this person eternally condemned, you ask? Well, first of all, people are not condemned until they are judged to be separated from Christ after this life. As long someone lives, there is always hope of reconciliation.

Secondly, there are 3 conditions that must be met for someone to fall into mortal sin:

1. The action must be objectively grave.
2. The individual must have sufficiently understood what he/she was doing.
3. The individual must have acted freely and without coercion.

Doubting is not a grave matter. If a Catholic finds herself doubting that salvation can be lost, no, she is certainly not condemned. Not a single condition of mortal sin is met. However, doubting can be the start to walking down a path wherein salvation could be jeopardized. Only God is the judge of when that line is crossed.

I find your comments informative and helpful. Thank you Rocky!

 

[Socrates4Jesus]

In another, simpler approach to John 17:3, if eternal life is God, then if one “has” eternal life, one “has” God, or one is in God. As petra stated, it’s not your possession of the life which is eternal, but rather, eternity is a quality of that life, and as long as you are a partaker in that life, you are a partaker in eternity. You can lose (or deny) that knowledge of God, and thus be apart from it, but that doesn’t change the fact that the eternal life is God.

Yes. I think you can see how Jesus is ambiguous in his teaching on exactly when eternal life begins for us. I can see how we can take his words to mean the same as your idea, that is, that eternal life begins after death. I can also see how the words of our Savior and Lord can be taken to mean the same as Petra, that is, that eternal life is God himself, and so God does not cease to be who he is if we leave him.

“Very truly I tell you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be judged but has crossed over from death to life.” (John 5:24)
Perhaps Jesus meant to be ambiguous so we would discover the enjoyment of learning from one another? For me, dialogs like this keeps Christianity from becoming boring and gives me a desire to learn more.

 

[Socrates4Jesus]

None of the above (again). I feel like I am on some sort of riddle hunt here. No one can “fall” out of God’s grace, or be snatched out of it.

" My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me; 28 and I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish, and no one shall snatch them out of my hand. 29 My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father’s hand. 30 I and the Father are one."
John 10:27-30

The only way to get lost is to deliberately and repeatedly JUMP out!

This “riddle hunt” is called the Socratic Method. It is a way of discussing the truth of a matter. In a Socratic dialog, as i understand it, we first agree on the definitions of terms (for example, what the words eternal life mean), we then move on to propose conclusions we can draw from those terms, we then attempt to discover which of those conclusions is closer to the truth.

For Socrates, the Socratic Method was a religious experience, i think. He taught that his God above all other gods was the source of all truth. By seeking to understand the truth on different matters, he believed he was becoming more like God. Perhaps Jesus would, in part, agree?

Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.”

(John 14:6)