Has the #MeToo movement become a witch-hunt to a significant degree?

[TheAmazingGrace]

As far as I’m concerned it doesn’t warrant serious discussion. I was just replying to a particular post.

Discuss away! (without me).

Does anyone know whether #metoo includes an unsolicited attempt to kiss, with the appropriate body movement, which was rejected? If so, then I am a culprit, and the lady a “victim”.

Oh, so now you wanna talk about it. I might just be troll-feeding at this point, but #MeToo covers sexual harassment, assault, and rape. I would advise you to think of the sexual assault survivors who might be reading your comments: being flip about a topic like this is rude and hurtful in the extreme.

 

[Edmundus1581]

Please just answer the question.

 

[TheAmazingGrace]

Please just answer the question.

Use your brain.

 

[Edmundus1581]

Edmundus1581:

Please just answer the question.

Use your brain.

I prefer to use the definition, and the facts of the case. Both of which you have.

 

[TheAmazingGrace]

I prefer to use the definition, and the facts of the case. Both of which you have.

I don’t have the facts of the case. Who was the woman in question? Was she your wife? Girlfriend?
Date? Random girl on the street? Was the rejection playful, or were your actions causing discomfort? What led up to this unsolicited attempt at snogging? Were you gracious about the rejection?

 

[Edmundus1581]

Edmundus1581:

I prefer to use the definition, and the facts of the case. Both of which you have.

I don’t have the facts of the case.

Who was the woman in question? Was she your wife? Girlfriend?

Neither

Date? Random girl on the street?

My mom’s cleaning lady, a couple of years younger than me

Was the rejection playful, or were your actions causing discomfort?

The rejection was firm. I don’t know whether my actions caused discomfort

What led up to this unsolicited attempt at snogging?

We were in the house together. She wore a lacy blouse, with no bra (ie. nipples visible)

Were you gracious about the rejection?

Yes

So, is she a #metoo survivor? By what criteria?

 

[TheAmazingGrace]

I don’t have the facts of the case.

Who was the woman in question? Was she your wife? Girlfriend?

Neither

Date? Random girl on the street?

My mom’s cleaning lady, a couple of years younger than me

Was the rejection playful, or were your actions causing discomfort?

The rejection was firm. I don’t know whether my actions caused discomfort

What led up to this unsolicited attempt at snogging?

We were in the house together. She wore a lacy blouse, with no bra (ie. nipples visible)

Were you gracious about the rejection?

Yes

So, is she a #metoo survivor? By what criteria?

Um, YES. Why on earth would you try and give an unsolicited kiss to your mother’s employee? And why bring up her outfit? Bras can be very uncomfortable for some women. Her not wearing one was not an invitation for you to try and put your mouth on her.

 

[Edmundus1581]

Edmundus1581:

So, is she a #metoo survivor? By what criteria?

Um, YES. Why on earth would you try and give an unsolicited kiss to your mother’s employee? And why bring up her outfit? Bras can be very uncomfortable for some women. Not wearing one was not an invitation for you to try and put your mouth on her.

You’ve answer my question. That’s all I asked.

 

[TheAmazingGrace]

You’ve answer my question. That’s all I asked.

I hope you apologized to her. Don’t do stuff like that, dude.

 

[Edmundus1581]

Edmundus1581:

You’ve answer my question. That’s all I asked.

I hope you apologized to her. Don’t do stuff like that, dude.

I apologized at the time.

We remained very good friends and still are. The incident didn’t bother her at all, in the long run, or maybe even at the time. She repeatedly invited me on dates, so I guess she didn’t think I was too aweful. She continued to be sexually provocative with me.

 

[TheAmazingGrace]

She continued to be sexually provocative with me.

I don’t know if that’s actually true, or if that’s just your perception. According to both Catholic and secular standards, it’s not appropriate to try and give unsolicited kisses to women you’re not romantically involved with. Also, clothing does not constitute an invitation. You’re Catholic, right? Why are you acting like it’s okay to let someone else’s “provocative” clothing dictate your actions?

 

[Edmundus1581]

Edmundus1581:

She continued to be sexually provocative with me.

I don’t know if that’s actually true, or if that’s just your perception. According to both Catholic and secular standards, it’s not appropriate to try and give unsolicited kisses to women you’re not romantically involved with. Also, clothing does not constitute an invitation.

Thanks for your clarification of #metoo.

 

[Xantippe]

So, is she a #metoo survivor? By what criteria?

Her employer’s son tried to kiss her while she was at work at a job she couldn’t afford to lose. shudder

That’s really bad. How would you feel if it was your daughter in the cleaning lady’s position? Wouldn’t you feel like the kid was taking advantage?

 

[TheAmazingGrace]

Really disappointed in the posts of many of the Catholic men here. So far on this thread, I’ve seen CAF guys:

1. Claim that modern promotion of sexual freedom is the reason we’re witnessing so many instances of sexual abuse, ignoring the fact that power structures in human society have historically supported the dominance of men over women, and made women feel responsible for unwanted advances/actions inflicted upon them. Not to mention that a huge chunk of sexual abuse cases involve victims who were incapable of giving consent at the time of their abuse (i.e. minor children).
2. Try to deflect attention away from the problem of sexual abuse by insisting on bringing up false accusations, even though most of the peer-reviewed research done on the subject indicates that false accusations make up less than 10% of sexual abuse allegations. Yes, false accusations are a crime, and no man deserves to experience that. However, acting like that issue warrants the same amount of attention as sexual abuse is utterly irresponsible.
3. Say that the way a woman dresses justifies unsolicited sexual advances.

Of course, there are plenty of lovely men on CAF whose posts bespeak sincere respect for women and concern for the challenges we face. However, I’ve also seen way too many guys here whine about how modern women suck, and wouldn’t make good wives, while at the same time spewing the nasty stuff that I’ve paraphrased above. I don’t want to marry a man who espouses such awful attitudes toward women, and I know that many of my fellow Catholic ladies feel the same way.

 

[Theo520]

Sexual harassment and rape were still problems in the more “conservative” eras preceding the Sexual Revolution and our “decades of perdition.” It’s fallacious to assume that there’s a correlation between social acceptance of casual sex and the incidents of sexual abuse, or that Catholics are less likely to engage in such abuse.

ROFL

Sexual harassment and assault are part of the human nature, they are/were predominantly everywhere, obviously including what you call ‘conservative’ areas.

The sexual revolution greatly increased the likelihood of sexual harassment, at leas how it is now viewed.

 

[TheAmazingGrace]

Sexual harassment and assault are part of the human nature, they are/were predominantly everywhere, obviously including what you call ‘conservative’ areas.

Malarkey. I’m human, and I’ve never sexually assaulted anyone, nor have I been tempted to do so.

The sexual revolution greatly increased the likelihood of sexual harassment, at leas how it is now viewed.

According to whom?

 

[Xantippe]

. Yes, false accusations are a crime, and no man deserves to experience that. However, acting like that issue warrants the same amount of attention as sexual abuse is utterly irresponsible.

As others have pointed out, it’s more likely for a man to have been a victim of sexual abuse than for him to be falsely accused of sexual misconduct.

Wikipedia says in the article “Child sexual abuse that” 8% of men in the US and Canada say that they were sexually abused as children.

 

[TheAmazingGrace]

Wikipedia says in the article “Child sexual abuse that” 8% of men in the US and Canada say that they were sexually abused as children.

Right. MRAs deny the seriousness of sexual abuse to their own detriment.

 

[Theo520]

We’ve had sexual assault since we’ve had caves to live in, and probably before.

Conservative mores are an obvious attempt to limit this behavior, but people don’t always and consistently adhere to mores they might profess.

As a shocker, there are also people living in what you call traditionally conservative areas that don’t even ascribe to those mores.

 

[DarkLight]

Malarkey. I’m human, and I’ve never sexually assaulted anyone, nor have I been tempted to do so.

I think “part of human nature” is likely accurate. That’s not to say that every human has been tempted to it, but that the fundamental problem is sinful human attitudes, and always has been. I suspect, like many “big” sins, it’s a slide - something that’s much more likely to be a temptation to a person who has already allowed selfishness and entitlement to take root.

(I’d say murder, for example, is part of human nature too, even though most of us aren’t tempted to murder. But I suspect all of us are capable of starting down the pat that would push us there.)