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distracted
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The pope is never wrong when teaching on faith and morals and ex cathedra… for all the Church to believe…
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distracted
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The first Church is the one Jesus referred to… because it is the only one… and the Cahtolic Church is that Church (St. Matthew 16:18, Tim 3:15).
There was no other “church” until 1521 (thereabouts)… and there is still only one… although there are about 33,000 that claim to be churches…
they can… if they reject truth… If they reject the Catholic Church after knowing it is the true Church…
but insofar as they believe as Christ’s True Church teaches, they can be saved… they can be saved if they believe something contrary to what the Church teaches, yet do so out of sheer ignorance… Anyone who follows truth can be saved… It is just easier to be saved if one is Catholic (truly Catholic…as opposed to, say, John Kerry )…
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Ruthie
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ckempton,
I think I missed it; would you re-state where in the Bible it says we should not bow to men? The actual prohibition?
Thank you,
Ruthie
I think I missed it; would you re-state where in the Bible it says we should not bow to men? The actual prohibition?
Thank you,
Ruthie
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Rolltide
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Yes, but there is a difference between him teaching infallibly through the ordinary Magesterium and by invoking infallibility ex cathedra…
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Lapell
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Thanks!
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distracted
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and that is…?
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ChristianKnight
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KJV version: And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.Jesus said to Peter “thou art Peter [rock] and on this rock i will build my Church…” (St. matthew 16:18)… Was Jesus jsut talking to himself… and wanting to confuse people by making it look like he was talking to peter.??
hmmm…
my NIT says same thing.
It doesn’t say Peter is the rock, it says this rock, which could be a random rock on the ground, couldn’t it?
Although later on in chapter 19 he says he will give Peter the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever he binds on earth will be binded on heaven, that right?
Sorry, I have been a Christian for about 2 years, but this is the first time I have ever got into scripture, about time I must say.
btw: Yall remember how I was talkin about bread and wine, and how I don’t get it? I was watching a christian channel, and seen a Catholic priest or whatever you guys call em, Robert Fox, and he gave a verse that told of it, and I was like, hey scripture backs that up lol
oh man, I lost the scripture it was in, jez.
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Rolltide
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This question is asked so commonly on this forum that Catholic Answers has put together an excellent and very thorough response here:KJV version: And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
my NIT says same thing.
It doesn’t say Peter is the rock, it says this rock, which could be a random rock on the ground, couldn’t it?
Although later on in chapter 19 he says he will give Peter the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever he binds on earth will be binded on heaven, that right?
Sorry, I have been a Christian for about 2 years, but this is the first time I have ever got into scripture, about time I must say.
catholic.com/library/Peter_and_the_Papacy.asp
Here is my response on the Real Presence, using sources from the Early Church Fathers from Catholic Answers:
forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?p=3854198#post3854198
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Rolltide
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A teaching of ordinary and universal magisterium is a teaching of which all Bishops of the Church (including the Pope) universally agree on, and is also considered infallible. (and yet, it doesn’t have to be proclaimed as such.) So, he might be reiterating the point, but it’s not his proclamation that made it infallible, its the universal agreement of the bishops (outside of a council).
An infallible ex-cathedra statement of the pope could be issued to settle an issue or to end debate about a particular topic (although that doesn’t have to be the reason one is issued).
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distracted
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Jesus changed Peter’s name from Simon… whenever a name change was done in the OT, it meant a totally new identity… and the giving of authority… (kingship, usually). Peter, in Greek, means “rock”… also, rock is used somehow in the OT as the word for God…
He made Peter the head of the Church on Earth… Christ is Head in Heaven… (and Earth, through St. Peter & his successors, the popes/bishops/priests)…
What is your spiritual background… meaning how were you raised, approximately how old are you? What kinds of things have you been taught about the Church?? what do you believe about the Church… or do you know what to believe???
:coffeeread:
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ChristianKnight
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lol feel like im being investigatedJesus changed Peter’s name from Simon… whenever a name change was done in the OT, it meant a totally new identity… and the giving of authority… (kingship, usually). Peter, in Greek, means “rock”… also, rock is used somehow in the OT as the word for God…
He made Peter the head of the Church on Earth… Christ is Head in Heaven… (and Earth, through St. Peter & his successors, the popes/bishops/priests)…
What is your spiritual background… meaning how were you raised, approximately how old are you? What kinds of things have you been taught about the Church?? what do you believe about the Church… or do you know what to believe???
I am 15, Baptist, my church or the Catholic Church? I don’t believe anything about it that I can’t find in the bible, the bible is the only good source of information I got, and to be frank, the only one I trust atm.
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Rolltide
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Two questions:lol feel like im being investigated
I am 15, Baptist, my church or the Catholic Church? I don’t believe anything about it that I can’t find in the bible, the bible is the only good source of information I got, and to be frank, the only one I trust atm.
- How precisely was the Bible compiled? (Not the scriptures themselves, but the compilation of books that is now known as the Bible.)
- How were Christians able to decide what to believe before the compilation of the Bible (or even decide upon what scriptures were legit)?
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ChristianKnight
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- No clue
- No clue
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mark_a
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If you read a little further, you’ll see that the “rock” Jesus spoke to was also given the keys to the kingdom.KJV version: And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
my NIT says same thing.
It doesn’t say Peter is the rock, it says this rock, which could be a random rock on the ground, couldn’t it?
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DixiesFinest
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He most likely referenced to St. John 6
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distracted
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you are right to reverence the Bible… the Word of God. But Jesus Christ Himself is the Word of God… and He is a person… and no person, much less the Son of God Himself, can be put into a mere book… not all of Him anyway…lol feel like im being investigated
I am 15, Baptist, my church or the Catholic Church? I don’t believe anything about it that I can’t find in the bible, the bible is the only good source of information I got, and to be frank, the only one I trust atm.
Have you been to a Catholic Mass? At the Mass, all the angels and saints in Heaven participate… the Presence of Christ is There… He is nowhere else, to speak of… when i was outside the Church, i had head knowledge about Jesus… and i had given my heart to Him… to the best of my ability… but once i started backsliding, i fell away from intimacy with Jesus… Then, i got really messed up in the head (as all those who fall away from Him do). It literally took an act of God to get me back to him… (so glad God did that for me…). It was the Catholic Church taht brought me to full intimacy with Jesus… and only the Catholic Church can do that because it is the Church Christ established on Earth… the ONLY ONE… God did not wnat 33,000 different “churches” teching 33,000 different belief systems… He prayed for unity (St. John 17)…
A Protestant did this study once… He went from one “church” to another, recording the time the pastor spent in scripture… at one church (?) it was 6% of the time, in another it was 2%… 6% was the longest any Protestant church spent in reading Scripture, Word for Word, from the Bible… He went to the Catholic Chruch… There it was 26%…
So who loves the Bible most???
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ChristianKnight
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If you would have read a little further on my post you would see I covered that
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distracted
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It was about 40 years after Christ left this world that any New Testament writings wre put down on “paper” (papyrus, i believe it was)… So, needless to say, no one had a copy except the higher ups in the Church…
So how was the Word spread before the New Testament was written (and the Word - the Bible - was not widely distributed until probably the 16th century, if then, becasue the printing press wasnt invented until 1440 and it was very expensive to make even one or two Bibles…)…
The Word was spread through preaching. Jesus told the Apostles… not to write a book… or to write anythihng. He told them to go to the far ends of the earth and preach the Word… and baptize in the name ofthe father, the son and the Holy spirit… (soryr, capital key doesn’t wnt to work…)…
this is what is referred to as 'tradition" and it is, obviously, not a bad thing… It was only HUMAN, vain, traditions that Jesus condemned… not God-given traditiion, such as i have just spoken of…
Don’t feel bad… i wasn’t taught any of this stuff when young either… The biggest thing wrong with the Chruch is its inability to teach even its own members its exact (true) teachings… but at least it wasn’t difficult to find them out, once i made up my mind to… I just went to RCIA classes… and listened to Catholic radio… and etc…
God bless…
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ChristianKnight
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So, the bible wasn’t put into print until a long time after the stuff was taught, right?
How come that their are books excluded from my “protestant” bible? I mean, I never heard of other books lol, Genesis begining, Revelations ending
How come that their are books excluded from my “protestant” bible? I mean, I never heard of other books lol, Genesis begining, Revelations ending
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distracted
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Technically, the Bible as we know it didn’t come into existence until about 1500 years after Christ was resurrected… and “went Home”…So, the bible wasn’t put into print until a long time after the stuff was taught, right?
How come that their are books excluded from my “protestant” bible? I mean, I never heard of other books lol, Genesis begining, Revelations ending
7 books were removed from the Bible by Martin Luther and/or associates… Martin Luther also wanted to remove James, Revelation, Hebrews and… can’t recall the other one… I think it was 1 or 2 Peter… because they did not fit his belief of once saved always saved…
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