Help me to learn to pray the LOTH

[mercygate]

I know the psalms of Sunday II can be used at any time- but don’t the Saturday texts come usually from the weekday (i.e. Sunday I?)

I don’t have my Breviary in the office today (prayed the little hours this a.m. – under a dispensation from my spiritual director to pray those hours whenever I CAN rather than always at the preferred time. The obligation to pray the Office supersedes the preference of praying the hours at the appropriate times). But check it out. And I probably mis-typed that. If it wasn’t he memorial of Our Lady for Saturday, maybe it was the Office for the Dead.

And yes: You can say compline from Sunday I or Sunday II every day of your life if you want to!

Well look at it this way: the Common has all the parts so the “if not Common then weekday” wouldn’t make much sense?

Touche.

But I agree with you, on the Common texts especially the antiphons for the Gospel Canticles because the psalter ones simply make use of a text form the canticle itself . I’ve recently started experimenting with using the Evening Prayer I antiphons instead of EP II too add some variety. “Priest of the Most High God” sounds better for the Popes and Bishops.

That’s a little too out-there for me. I have an obligation to pray the office, which I take to mean coming as close to the standard as my little pea-brain will take me.

 

[ricmat]

In Christian Prayer, there’s a section called “Two-Year Cycle of Scriptural Passages for the Office of Readings”.

I’m assuming that this is a list for an additional (not included) reading beyond the psalms/canticle, scriptural reading, and non-scriptural reading that actually are printed in Christian Prayer.

My problem is that when I check some on-line LOTH sites to verify this, they seem to have different readings than are listed for either year 1 or 2 in Christian Prayer.

What’s the deal here?

[Yes, I know the 4 volume set is better.]

 

[Philothea53]

Reverend Mother mercygate, here: get DODOS. Right now! You’ll be praying the Office with ease in 3 months or less.

I second Porthos observation that not getting it right isn’t the same as getting it wrong. We all slip up. My last boo-boo was in praying the Memorial of Our Lady on a Saturday when I took compline from the weekday instead of from Sunday II. I don’t think I’ll go to Hell for that, but it won’t happen again (unless I forget!).

But I quibble about obligatory memorials: the reading, responsory and antiphon on the Gospel canticle should be taken from the common if they’re not in the proper.

penitents.org/giftshopdodos.html We apologize. Due to a problem with the company that was printing The Divine Office for Dodos, this book has not yet been reprinted. We are exploring our options regarding printing. We expect to reprint Dodos but may have to locate a new company. Hence, we do not know when the book will be available. Those who have ordered copies of Dodos will have their money refunded and will be informed when the book is available. We are sincerely sorry for this trying and unexpected development.

 

[porthos11]

In Christian Prayer, there’s a section called “Two-Year Cycle of Scriptural Passages for the Office of Readings”.

I’m assuming that this is a list for an additional (not included) reading beyond the psalms/canticle, scriptural reading, and non-scriptural reading that actually are printed in Christian Prayer.

My problem is that when I check some on-line LOTH sites to verify this, they seem to have different readings than are listed for either year 1 or 2 in Christian Prayer.

What’s the deal here?

[Yes, I know the 4 volume set is better.]

The two-year cycle you see is that of the Office of Readings. However, this two-year cycle was never published in Breviary form; all we have is the one-year cycle published in the Liturgy of the Hours.

Christian Prayer does not have the complete Office of Readings, only the Psalter. If you want to use Christian Prayer, you can use the Psalter printed there, and a Bible for the two-year cycle of readings, but you won’t have a complete set of hagiographical or Patristic readings for the Second Reading.

Hence, I second your observation: the 4-volume is better for this.

 

[porthos11]

penitents.org/giftshopdodos.html We apologize. Due to a problem with the company that was printing The Divine Office for Dodos, this book has not yet been reprinted. We are exploring our options regarding printing. We expect to reprint Dodos but may have to locate a new company. Hence, we do not know when the book will be available. Those who have ordered copies of Dodos will have their money refunded and will be informed when the book is available. We are sincerely sorry for this trying and unexpected development.

Anyway, so what was the problem you encountered the last time?

And by way of anticipation, August 24 is the Feast of St. Bartholomew, and it has the rank of, er, Feast. As per rubrics, everything is taken from the Proper, anything missing from the Proper is from the Common of Apostles.

 

[mercygate]

penitents.org/giftshopdodos.html We apologize. Due to a problem with the company that was printing The Divine Office for Dodos, this book has not yet been reprinted. We are exploring our options regarding printing. We expect to reprint Dodos but may have to locate a new company. Hence, we do not know when the book will be available. Those who have ordered copies of Dodos will have their money refunded and will be informed when the book is available. We are sincerely sorry for this trying and unexpected development.

AAAAAHHHHH!!! Catastrophe! This is the best handbook EVER for learning to pray the Divine Office!

 

[smithec]

Well I’d like to share with you all a few things that I hope does not bore, but inspires those who have participated in this thread. It was a pure chance that I found this thread Wednesday morning. I had been having a horrible week (Both my office and Home had some flooding from all the rain here in Pennsylvania). I had also spoken with one of my priests this weekend during confession about difficulty maintaining my prayer life and he made some suggestions; deciding that it had been too long since I had used a proper devotional I went to my local Catholic book store to look for something. I am very fortunate that the wonderful St Francis De Sales store that some have posted above IS my local store. The girl working that afternoon was very kind and suggested Christian Prayers to me as a good devotional to start with. Wow, I am so glad she did. I then began reading this thread more and started using the book. All I can say is Thank you so much for all the wonderful advice, tips and encouragement the members of this thread have offered.

I would like to ask if I did Morning prayers correctly (this is with edition 406 of Christian Prayers for 8/24/2007):
So this morning I began on Page 686 with the Invitatory “Lord open my lips Using the antiphon on pg 1392 (Common of Apostles) for Psalm 95.

Moving into the Morning Prayer I began with “God come to my assistance (was this right, or do you skip this when you use the Invitatory?) I then recited (did not sing as I was in my cube at work already) Hymn 169 as per the commons of the Apostles. I then did antiphon 1 pg 1392 followed by psalm 63 pg 707 from Sunday week 1, followed by the Glory Be/Doxology Then the Psalm Prayer on pg 708 and then antiphon 1 again from pg 1392. I proceeded on in the same form for the canticle and second psalm except that I did not do the doxology/glory be after the canticle as per the instruction on pg 709.

I then did the reading from Ephesians on pg 1392 (common of the Apostles), the responsory from pg 1393 and then the Canticle of Zechariah pg 691 (Ordinary) with the antiphon from pg 1393 following the form antiphon, canticle, doxology, antiphon (I did not see a psalm prayer for the canticle was this in the proper of seasons, was there no psalm prayer today?). I used the Intercessions from pg 1393, recited the Our Father, the Prayer for 8/24 – St. Bartholomew from pg 1236, and then I concluded with the dismissal “May the Lord bless us . . .” from pg 694.
I’ve been doing this now for only two days now, but it has been very enjoyable and refreshing. Morning prayer this morning took me about 20 minutes, which seems to be fast compared to some times I’ve seen listed on here. That is what led me to first wonder if I’m missing something. I used the same basic pattern using the Common of Virgins for Rose of Lima yesterday, was that correct or should yesterday have used the weekday psalter, or can I choose which to use?

I understand that I don’t need to do this perfectly (a desire that turns into a fault for me sometimes), but I would like to get at least as close to correctly as I can reasonably do. Anyway, thank you all again for a great thread and for any help or insight you can provide to newbie like myself.

-Ed

 

[mercygate]

I would like to ask if I did Morning prayers correctly (this is with edition 406 of Christian Prayers for 8/24/2007):

OK. I use the 4 volume LOH but let me see if I can help.

So this morning I began on Page 686 with the Invitatory “Lord open my lips

Yup.

Using the antiphon on pg 1392 (Common of Apostles) for Psalm 95.

Yup.

Moving into the Morning Prayer I began with “God come to my assistance (was this right, or do you skip this when you use the Invitatory?)

You skip it. You introduce every office of the day with “God come . . .” EXCEPT for the first office that you pray. I think that instruction is in the Ordinary. One demerit from the Breviary Police!

I then recited (did not sing as I was in my cube at work already) Hymn 169 as per the commons of the Apostles.

That’s fine. You could also skip the hymn entirely when praying this alone.

I then did antiphon 1 pg 1392 followed by psalm 63 pg 707 from Sunday week 1, followed by the Glory Be/Doxology Then the Psalm Prayer on pg 708 and then antiphon 1 again from pg 1392.

Cool.

I proceeded on in the same form for the canticle and second psalm except that I did not do the doxology/glory be after the canticle as per the instruction on pg 709.

Right.

I then did the reading from Ephesians on pg 1392 (common of the Apostles), the responsory from pg 1393 and then the Canticle of Zechariah pg 691 (Ordinary) with the antiphon from pg 1393 following the form antiphon, canticle, doxology, antiphon (I did not see a psalm prayer for the canticle was this in the proper of seasons, was there no psalm prayer today?).

This was right. There is never a psalm prayer for the canticle because the canticle is not a paslm. :newidea:

I used the Intercessions from pg 1393, recited the Our Father, the Prayer for 8/24 – St. Bartholomew from pg 1236, and then I concluded with the dismissal “May the Lord bless us . . .” from pg 694.

Are you sure you’re just a beginner? You did really well.

I’ve been doing this now for only two days now, but it has been very enjoyable and refreshing. Morning prayer this morning took me about 20 minutes, which seems to be fast compared to some times I’ve seen listed on here.

Saying the office privately wouldn’t take 20 minutes. If you had your markers in place (as we do who pray the office daily) and were familiar with the flipping, it takes about 10 minutes to pray the office.

That is what led me to first wonder if I’m missing something. I used the same basic pattern using the Common of Virgins for Rose of Lima yesterday, was that correct or should yesterday have used the weekday psalter, or can I choose which to use?

For an optional memorial, you take the antiphons & psalms and intercessions from the weekday. You can take the hymn, reading, and responsory from the Common. The prayer is from the Proper.

I understand that I don’t need to do this perfectly (a desire that turns into a fault for me sometimes), but I would like to get at least as close to correctly as I can reasonably do. Anyway, thank you all again for a great thread and for any help or insight you can provide to newbie like myself.

-Ed

Right. Don’t WORRY about getting it “right.” I liked the observation made by someone on this thread that “not doing it right doesn’t mean you are doing it wrong.” This comes with practice. The attitude I take exception to is that it doesn’t matter AT ALL whether you do it right. This isn’t rocket science. Ordinary people can get this right with a little practice, and as the prayer of the Church, it is a good thing to be meticulous – which isn’t the same thing as scrupulous. For example, if you find yourself starting the office from the beginning because in midstream you realize you have used the wrong antiphons, then you need to get a life! Just pick up and keep on goin’, correcting yourself as you go.

Congratulations! You done good.

 

[smithec]

Are you sure you’re just a beginner? You did really well.

Thanks for the quick Reply. Yep, I’m just starting, I can’t take any credit for it through. Much of the help came from my local bookstore and you folks on the boards here.

Saying the office privately wouldn’t take 20 minutes. If you had your markers in place (as we do who pray the office daily) and were familiar with the flipping, it takes about 10 minutes to pray the office.

Excellent, 10 minutes in the am 10 in the pm and a few for night prayer are certainly easy for me to set asside.

I agree that it’s better to do it as best you can than to give up in frustration and not do it all. I think I’ve put off doing something like this for a while because I was afraid I wouldn’t be able to give it the time I needed to learn it all properly (three kids and a full time job, and part time work on top of that, plus a wife who needs/deserves attention in the evening too). However, as I said it’s only been a few days and I can already see the major parts falling into place, thanks in large part to many of the posts on this board. I’m sure I’ll make mistakes as I go but I’d rather be imperfect and trying than just give up.

Now I probably have the hardest part ahead of me, in the words of my favorite tomato, Bob, I just need to “keep on keeping on.”

Thanks again.

-Ed

 

[mercygate]

Thanks for the quick Reply. Yep, I’m just starting, I can’t take any credit for it through. Much of the help came from my local bookstore and you folks on the boards here.

Excellent, 10 minutes in the am 10 in the pm and a few for night prayer are certainly easy for me to set asside.

I agree that it’s better to do it as best you can than to give up in frustration and not do it all. I think I’ve put off doing something like this for a while because I was afraid I wouldn’t be able to give it the time I needed to learn it all properly (three kids and a full time job, and part time work on top of that, plus a wife who needs/deserves attention in the evening too). However, as I said it’s only been a few days and I can already see the major parts falling into place, thanks in large part to many of the posts on this board. I’m sure I’ll make mistakes as I go but I’d rather be imperfect and trying than just give up.

Now I probably have the hardest part ahead of me, in the words of my favorite tomato, Bob, I just need to “keep on keeping on.”

Thanks again.

-Ed

Maybe your wife would like to join you for Evening Prayer (or even the kids?). As the spiritual head of your home, it might be something to think about and work toward. I know a single mom who prays Morning Prayer, Evening Prayer and Compline (aka Night Prayer) with her three children. The youngest is 8 and he asked for his own copy of Christian Prayer for his birthday!

 

[MaryB23]

AJV - Thanks for your reply. It is very helpful.

Too bad I’ve been doing the wrong thing on Memorials though!

I was doing the same exact thing until my brother fixed me.

BTW, in the front of my Christian Prayer book, it has the different guidelines for feasts, memorials, regular days, Solemnities, etc. I don’t have the book in front of me so I can’t tell you what page but it’s very near the front - maybe right after the “calendar pages” that tell what to celebrate each day?

 

[mercygate]

AAAAAHHHHH!!! Catastrophe! This is the best handbook EVER for learning to pray the Divine Office!

The author of THE DIVINE OFFICE FOR DODOS has a big Catholic publisher interested in re-issuing the book but they want it shortened and made more serious. This is the 4th edition, and it has been expanded with each edition because the shorter versions did NOT work. DODOS works.

If you have experience with this book and can send a testimony of how it has worked for you to copenitents@yahoo.com, we would all be most grateful.

DODOS is lighthearted, fun, and easy to use.

BTW: I think you can still get it from Amazon.

 

[porthos11]

Okay, now I have a question.

I’m in the Philippines, and as of this time, I’ve already completed the Office of Readings and Morning Prayer for the Beheading of St. John the Baptist.

It’s ranked as a memorial, but I’m noticing something interesting in the Proper rubric. While most Memorials usually say:

From the Common of one martyr, page nnn.

this one had,

From the Common of one martyr page nnn, except for the following:

It’s the except for the following the caught my attention for the Office of Readings (no problem for Morning Prayer; everything is Proper). I didn’t know whether the except for the following commands us to turn to the Common psalms except for Weekday, and to use the Common first reading instead of the Weekday first reading.

I decided to follow the usual rubric for Memorials and used the Weekday psalms/first reading, Proper second reading.

How does one deal with except for the following on Memorials?

 

[AJV]

Okay, now I have a question.

I’m in the Philippines, and as of this time, I’ve already completed the Office of Readings and Morning Prayer for the Beheading of St. John the Baptist.

It’s ranked as a memorial, but I’m noticing something interesting in the Proper rubric. While most Memorials usually say:

From the Common of one martyr, page nnn.

this one had,

From the Common of one martyr page nnn, except for the following:

It’s the except for the following the caught my attention for the Office of Readings (no problem for Morning Prayer; everything is Proper). I didn’t know whether the except for the following commands us to turn to the Common psalms except for Weekday, and to use the Common first reading instead of the Weekday first reading.

I decided to follow the usual rubric for Memorials and used the Weekday psalms/first reading, Proper second reading.

How does one deal with except for the following on Memorials?

I think that is right because there are other memorials which have the same direction but no Proper Lauds (like St. Augustine, yesterday). The best connection I could see (but it was not always) was that it occurred for those saints who had Proper Benedictus and Magnificat antiphons.

Also I think if it were from the Common they would have printed a direction like how they do for feasts to take the psalms and sometimes, first reading form the Common. .

 

[drforjc]

Okay, now I have a question.

I’m in the Philippines, and as of this time, I’ve already completed the Office of Readings and Morning Prayer for the Beheading of St. John the Baptist.

It’s ranked as a memorial, but I’m noticing something interesting in the Proper rubric. While most Memorials usually say:

From the Common of one martyr, page nnn.

this one had,

From the Common of one martyr page nnn, except for the following:

It’s the except for the following the caught my attention for the Office of Readings (no problem for Morning Prayer; everything is Proper). I didn’t know whether the except for the following commands us to turn to the Common psalms except for Weekday, and to use the Common first reading instead of the Weekday first reading.

I decided to follow the usual rubric for Memorials and used the Weekday psalms/first reading, Proper second reading.

How does one deal with except for the following on Memorials?

The Guide to the Liturgy of the Hours from CBP listed the page numbers for the psalms for MP which corresponded to the weekday… so I think that would be correct.

 

[mercygate]

Okay, now I have a question.

I’m in the Philippines, and as of this time, I’ve already completed the Office of Readings and Morning Prayer for the Beheading of St. John the Baptist.

It’s ranked as a memorial, but I’m noticing something interesting in the Proper rubric. While most Memorials usually say:

From the Common of one martyr, page nnn.

this one had,

From the Common of one martyr page nnn, except for the following:

It’s the except for the following the caught my attention for the Office of Readings (no problem for Morning Prayer; everything is Proper). I didn’t know whether the except for the following commands us to turn to the Common psalms except for Weekday, and to use the Common first reading instead of the Weekday first reading.

I decided to follow the usual rubric for Memorials and used the Weekday psalms/first reading, Proper second reading.

BINGO! That’s right!

How does one deal with except for the following on Memorials?In this case, with almost everythin Proper, you’re left with only the hymn from the Common. And even that isn’t obligatory. You can omit the hymn when praying privately or when the office is not sung or or you can select a hymn of your own choosing from an approved source.

 

[mercygate]

The Guide to the Liturgy of the Hours from CBP listed the page numbers for the psalms for MP which corresponded to the weekday… so I think that would be correct.

Hey! That’s cheating!

Thanks.

 

[drforjc]

Hey! That’s cheating!

Thanks.

That booklet has come in handy more times than I can remember.

 

[mercygate]

That booklet has come in handy more times than I can remember.

I think this has already been posted on this thread.

 

[AJV]

]In this case, with almost everythin Proper, you’re left with only the hymn from the Common.

And if they had translated the hymns we could have happily sung:

O more than blessed, merit high attaining,
Pure as the snow-drift, knowing no defilement,
Mightiest martyr, dweller in the desert,
Greatest of prophets.

O may the virtue of thine intercession,
Make our hearts ready, change their stony hardness,
Smooth the rough places, and the crooked straighten,
For Christ’s blest coming.

Thus may our gracious Maker and Redeemer,
Seeking a station for his hallowed footsteps,
Find it within us, pure and undefiled,
Meet for his coming.

Now, as the Angels celebrate thy praises,
God everlasting, Trinity, Co-equal,
Spare thy redeemed ones, as they bow before thee,
Pardon imploring. Amen.

Or even Praecessor almus gratiae which has a wonderful doxology for the feast

Sigh. At least the UK LOTH had a Proper hymn- I had to go without one when praying the Office of Readings from ICEL.