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tafan2
Guest
So now you are trying to convince me Trump is not a bad choice?
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1cthlctrth
Guest
Of course. I would think that most faithful Catholics would jump at the chance to vote for President Trump, now that we’ve seen all that he’s done for us during the last 4 years.
And, not voting for Trump is kind of like a vote for Biden because not voting would do nothing to help Trump.
And, not voting for Trump is kind of like a vote for Biden because not voting would do nothing to help Trump.
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Dlee
Guest
This is a rather silly statement - in my opinion. No Pope is ever going to support abortion.
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1cthlctrth
Guest
Can anybody name 2 or 3 things that Joe Biden has done in 47 years in politics that most helped America? Does anybody know anyone who can name even one thing?
LeafByNiggle
Well-known member
- oversaw implementation of the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act in 2009, then the biggest economic recovery plan in our country’s history.
- helped rebuild the American economy and save the American auto industry, lifting us out of the Great Recession
- helped pass Obamacare (Affordable Care Act), guaranteeing health coverage for Americans with pre-existing conditions and 20 million who were previously uninsured. (Obamacare is, despite the claims to the contrary, seen as favorable by more than 50% of American adults.)
- sponsored the original Violence Against Women Act in 1994, leading to a major decline in intimate partner violence, from 2.1 million victims in 1994 to 907,000 in 2010
- secured the passage of arms limitation agreements in 1979 between the United States and the Soviet Union, reducing the risk of global nuclear disaster
- served as primary sponsor of the PROTECT Our Children Act of 2008, helping law enforcement agencies to investigate and prosecute child predators
- sponsored and introduced the Criminal History Background Checks Pilot Extension Act of 2008, allowing volunteer organizations – such as children’s sports groups – to obtain national and state criminal history background checks on their volunteers
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1cthlctrth
Guest
Just as I suspected. Not very impressive. That 2009 Reinvestment Act “stimulus bill” was a disaster, mostly a waste of almost a $-trillion. And, too many Americans lost their doctor, and premiums and deductibles substantially increased between 2008 (pre-Obama) and 2016.
But I applaud the effort. You have more courage than those who saw my question but failed to respond.
But I applaud the effort. You have more courage than those who saw my question but failed to respond.
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Billy76
Guest
Not to mention Obamacare 
. What an utter disaster.
. What an utter disaster.
LeafByNiggle
Well-known member
And yet more than half of American adults see it as a positive.Not to mention Obamacare
I didn’t expect you would find it impressive, as I do not find your lists impressive. But others may see it differently.
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Jeanne_S
Guest
Geez Trump has accomplished as much in 47 months as Biden has in 47 years,it’s really Is true!
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Billy76
Guest
I would argue Trump has accomplished more! What’s funny is Joe entering the presidency has revealed that his entire family is corrupt and one could only hope he receives justice.
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Naga
Guest
To answer the question in the topic title: Through a lack of well informed reasoning.
The USCCB has called abortion the preeminent issue of our time. While it can be argued that the bishops’ conference doesn’t have any authority outside of that held by the individual bishops, the fact remains that this declaration should be seriously considered by all American Catholics.
Joe Biden has among his policies ending the Hyde Amendment and the Mexico City Policy. This would, in effect, force American taxpayers to finance more abortions. As I have explained before on this forum, ultimately, the only way a government can enforce its will is through violence. If a person doesn’t want to pay taxes to avoid financing these abortions, agents of the state will come to arrest the person. If he resists, he will be killed. Voting for Biden is, at the very least, showing material support for this possibility. This template can be applied to any governmental policy. Having considered the possibilities with this template in mind, I have arrived at the conclusion that there are superior alternatives to Biden, with respect to both minimizing the damage done and to maximizing the good done.
Recently, I was listening to a discussion with Dr. Ray Guarendi, in which he was talking about a recent call-in show he did about the upcoming election. In the discussion, he said something along the lines of “I used to think people could be reasoned with. I no longer believe that.” His tone of voice greatly surprised me, as he said it in a very resigned way, which is very different from the tone I am used to. He explained that when Pope John Paul II discussed reasons for voting for candidates, it was implied that they must be good reasons, not simply reasons. I believe this sort of situation is what we are seeing. In another discussion I listened to within the past couple of weeks, Fr. George Rutler described this election as being between the most anti-Catholic ticket in living memory and the most pro-Catholic ticket in living memory. Having reviewed the available information pertaining to the two major candidates, including their accomplishments and objectives (both good and bad), I can see why he said this.
The USCCB has called abortion the preeminent issue of our time. While it can be argued that the bishops’ conference doesn’t have any authority outside of that held by the individual bishops, the fact remains that this declaration should be seriously considered by all American Catholics.
Joe Biden has among his policies ending the Hyde Amendment and the Mexico City Policy. This would, in effect, force American taxpayers to finance more abortions. As I have explained before on this forum, ultimately, the only way a government can enforce its will is through violence. If a person doesn’t want to pay taxes to avoid financing these abortions, agents of the state will come to arrest the person. If he resists, he will be killed. Voting for Biden is, at the very least, showing material support for this possibility. This template can be applied to any governmental policy. Having considered the possibilities with this template in mind, I have arrived at the conclusion that there are superior alternatives to Biden, with respect to both minimizing the damage done and to maximizing the good done.
Recently, I was listening to a discussion with Dr. Ray Guarendi, in which he was talking about a recent call-in show he did about the upcoming election. In the discussion, he said something along the lines of “I used to think people could be reasoned with. I no longer believe that.” His tone of voice greatly surprised me, as he said it in a very resigned way, which is very different from the tone I am used to. He explained that when Pope John Paul II discussed reasons for voting for candidates, it was implied that they must be good reasons, not simply reasons. I believe this sort of situation is what we are seeing. In another discussion I listened to within the past couple of weeks, Fr. George Rutler described this election as being between the most anti-Catholic ticket in living memory and the most pro-Catholic ticket in living memory. Having reviewed the available information pertaining to the two major candidates, including their accomplishments and objectives (both good and bad), I can see why he said this.
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JimG
Guest
Worth emphasizing:
“Fr. George Rutler described this election as being between the most anti-Catholic ticket in living memory and the most pro-Catholic ticket in living memory. Having reviewed the available information pertaining to the two major candidates, including their accomplishments and objectives (both good and bad), I can see why he said this.”
“Fr. George Rutler described this election as being between the most anti-Catholic ticket in living memory and the most pro-Catholic ticket in living memory. Having reviewed the available information pertaining to the two major candidates, including their accomplishments and objectives (both good and bad), I can see why he said this.”
LeafByNiggle
Well-known member
But they stopped short of saying one could not vote for a Democrat. As for the preeminent statement, it appeared in the USCCB voter guide, along with:
USCCB_voter_guide:
which appears to clarify and qualify the meaning of preeminent in that document.
Many people think saving the nation from the reelection of the most corrupt and divisive President in modern times is a very good reason.
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JimG
Guest
Abortion is pretty divisive. That’s a given.
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1cthlctrth
Guest
No, President Obama cannot run for a 3rd term. At least we don’t have to worry about that. There’s a 2-term limit, as the 22nd Amendment states:
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Naga
Guest
These points are opinions, rather than facts that can be proven in an empirical sense. When considering societally significant issues, it is critical to take into account verifiable facts before opinions.
Joe Biden has verifiable financial connections to the Chinese government which he attempted to conceal via the use of proxies acting on his behalf. Given his stated goals, it is my informed opinion that he intends to use political power to personally benefit from this relationship. It is my personal opinion that this makes him more corrupt than Trump.
Joe Biden is the figurehead of the party which has been enabling the political violence which has been occurring in this country over the past year. It has done this by utilizing the powers of the state in the areas it controls to hamper the efforts of police to maintain order, to decline to prosecute criminals, and to maliciously prosecute those who attempt to stop the violence when the police fail to uphold their obligation as part of the social contract (i.e. to maintain the peace). It is my informed opinion that his party is doing this for political gain. It is my personal opinion that this makes him more divisive than Trump.
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1cthlctrth
Guest
I presumed that Leaf was referring to the Obama Administration as the most corrupt in modern times. I didn’t know which other living President or ex-President could fit that description.
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LeafByNiggle
Well-known member
One can take into account opinions when there are no proven facts.
Ha! Talk about opinions! Interesting how all the right-wing opinions are facts, but the left-wing opinions are just opinions.
Only your opinion is “informed” and those that disagree with you aren’t? You will not be surprised to find that those on the left think that right-wing opinions are far from “informed.”
You just go and say stuff, and that makes it a fact?
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TULIPed
Guest
I guess you’re one of the lucky few who either (a) doesn’t have pre-existing conditions; or (b) is well off enough to self insure. Well done.Not to mention Obamacare
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Dracarys
Guest
This is a disingenuous arguement. We all know that when Pope John Paul II said something he got almost unanimous support. This pope often has both bishops and priests speaking and writing against him. We have all seen it.
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