How Do You Understand Church Teaching About Our Blessed Mother?

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How Do You Understand Church Teaching About Our Blessed Mother?

Out of the love for our Lord, let’s do our best to be very charitable on on-topic on this thread.

I’m trying to explore more about what the Church teaches about our Blessed Mother, the Queen of all things, so as to grow in love for Jesus Christ.

Please feel free to share how you personally understand the mystery of the Mother of God. Simple expressions of piety are welcome.

Also welcome are–for example–quotations from the saints or the Magisterium.

To me personally, Mary is my unspeakably wonderful Mother.

Here is a beautiful passage, also, from Pope Pius 9th’s “Ineffabilis Deus” (“Ineffable God”), which dogmatically defined the doctrine of the Immaculate Conception:

Our soul overflows with joy and our tongue with exultation…All our hope do we repose in the most Blessed Virgin – in the all fair and immaculate one who has …brought salvation to the world…

Let all the children of the Catholic Church, who are so very dear to us, hear these words of ours… Let them fly with utter confidence to this most sweet Mother of mercy and grace in all dangers, difficulties, needs, doubts and fears. Under her guidance, under her patronage, under her kindness and protection, nothing is to be feared; nothing is hopeless. Because, while bearing toward us a truly motherly affection and having in her care the work of our salvation, she is solicitous about the whole human race. And since she has been appointed by God to be the Queen of heaven and earth…and even stands at the right hand of her only-begotten Son, Jesus Christ our Lord, she presents our petitions in a most efficacious manner. What she asks, she obtains. Her pleas can never be unheard.
papalencyclicals.net/Pius09/p9ineff.htm
 
Mary is an important part of our faith. Through her “yes” to God, God became man and dwelt among us.

That said, no matter how much you try, the Church does not and has never taught that personal devotion to Mary is a requirement of salvation.

Please seek help from a competent spiritual director.
 
Yes. This^^.

Nice quote, BUT…
**FWIW, there is a ban on “agenda posting” here at CAF. **
Which this definitely falls under that category.
There have now been 3 threads closed because of beating this drum, along with posters arguing with a genuine theologian and retired seminary professor priest. Enough.

It’s a very good thing to love Our Lady. Wonderful. Beautiful.
However, I doubt she enjoys being used as a hammer with which to criticize others.
Charity begins with oneself.
peace
 
Oneofthewomen said:
Mary is an important part of our faith. Through her “yes” to God, God became man and dwelt among us.

That said, no matter how much you try, the Church does not and has never taught that personal devotion to Mary is a requirement of salvation.

Please seek help from a competent spiritual director.
Click to expand...
Dear Oneof the women,

Yes, I also believe that Mary is a very important part of our Catholic faith. As you suggest, she said “Yes” to God.

I believe that she continues to bring us the gifts of eternal salvation.

From your perspective, how did you come to the conclusion that personally loving her is not necessary?

As I understand Church teaching, all the faith is a matter of salvation for those with psychological freedom and access to the truth.

Here is something I read from an encyclical of Pope Leo 13th:

2. The recourse we have to Mary in prayer follows upon the office she continuously fills by the side of the throne of God as Mediatrix of Divine grace;… in the Rosary all the part that Mary took as our co-Redemptress comes to us…
  1. Now may God, “Who in His most merciful Providence gave us this Mediatrix,” and “decreed that all good should come to us by the hands of Mary” (St. Bernard), receive propitiously our common prayers and fulfi. our common hopes…
    w2.vatican.va/content/leo-xiii/en/encyclicals/documents/hf_l-xiii_enc_08091894_iucunda-semper-expectatione.html
 
patricius79 said:
Dear Oneof the women,

From your perspective, how did you come to the conclusion that personally loving her is not necessary?
Click to expand...
This is a complete twisting of what I said and you know it!:mad:

I agree with Clare, you have an agenda and are doing a great disservice to Catholics, this forum and any one who is coming here to learn more about the Catholic faith.

You, Sir, should be ashamed of yourself.
 
Oneofthewomen said:
This is a complete twisting of what I said and you know it!:mad:
.
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Dear Oneofthewomen,

I apologize if I misunderstood your meaning.

I believe you stated that the Church does not teach that personal devotion to her is a requirement of salvation.

How did you come to that conclusion?

Here is another quotation from the Popes–Pope St. Pius 10th–which I find beautiful. I, personally, agree with Him that all graces come through our Mother:

12… When the supreme hour of the Son came, beside the Cross of Jesus there stood Mary His Mother, not merely occupied in contemplating the cruel spectacle, but rejoicing that her Only Son was offered for the salvation of mankind, and so entirely participating in His Passion, that if it had been possible she would have gladly borne all the torments that her Son bore (S. Bonav. 1. Sent d. 48, ad Litt. dub. 4). And from this community of will and suffering between Christ and Mary she merited to become most worthily the Reparatrix of the lost world (Eadmeri Mon. De Excellentia Virg. Mariae, c. 9) and Dispensatrix of all the gifts that Our Savior purchased for us by His Death and by His Blood.
w2.vatican.va/content/pius-x/en/encyclicals/documents/hf_p-x_enc_02021904_ad-diem-illum-laetissimum.html
 
patricius79 said:
Dear Oneofthewomen,

I apologize if I misunderstood your meaning.

I believe you stated that the Church does not teach that personal devotion to her is a requirement of salvation.

How did you come to that conclusion?
Click to expand...
Because she dose not. You have been told this time & time again. Mary is an important part of our faith but practicing any personal devotion to her, under any guise, IS NOT REQUIRED!

The onus is on you to prove the Church is saying what you think she is.
 
Here is another quotation from the Popes–Pope St. Pius 10th–which I find beautiful. I, personally, agree with Him that all graces come through our Mother:

12… When the supreme hour of the Son came, beside the Cross of Jesus there stood Mary His Mother, not merely occupied in contemplating the cruel spectacle, but rejoicing that her Only Son was offered for the salvation of mankind, and so entirely participating in His Passion, that if it had been possible she would have gladly borne all the torments that her Son bore (S. Bonav. 1. Sent d. 48, ad Litt. dub. 4). And from this community of will and suffering between Christ and Mary she merited to become most worthily the Reparatrix of the lost world (Eadmeri Mon. De Excellentia Virg. Mariae, c. 9) and Dispensatrix of all the gifts that Our Savior purchased for us by His Death and by His Blood.
w2.vatican.va/content/pius-x/en/encyclicals/documents/hf_p-x_enc_02021904_ad-diem-illum-laetissimum.html
 
:banghead::banghead::banghead::banghead::banghead:

Aaaaggggghhhhh!!
Mods please do something!!!
 
Oneofthewomen said:
Because she dose not. You have been told this time & time again. Mary is an important part of our faith but practicing any personal devotion to her, under any guise, IS NOT REQUIRED!

The onus is on you to prove the Church is saying what you think she is.
Click to expand...
Dear Oneofthewomen,

I think we’re just discussing how we understand what the Church teaches. I don’t know how others determine that.

In various ways, I’ve concluded that devotion to our Mother and Helper–the Mother of God-- is central to our faith, all of which is a matter of salvation.

For example, in “Mother of the Redeemer”, Pope St. JPII says that there is a “profound link between Marian devotion and worship of the Eucharist”. And Vatican II said similarly.
 
Lots of Pope’s say lots of things. Not everything is part of the deposit of faith.
You are free to believe what you want, you are not free to say that what you believe is Church teaching or not. Period. :mad:
 
Oneofthewomen said:
Lots of Pope’s say lots of things. Not everything is part of the deposit of faith.
You are free to believe what you want, you are not free to say that what you believe is Church teaching or not. Period. :mad:
Click to expand...
Right. Priests, theologians, Bishops, and Popes say many things.

How do we determine what is part of the deposit of faith about our Blessed Mother?

As I understand it, Vatican II said that devotion to Mary is intrinsic to Christian worship. That would be official Church teaching.

Here is from an Encyclical by Pope Benedict 15th:

“He[St. Dominic] knew, on the one hand, Mary’s authority with her Son to be such that whatever graces he confers on men she has their distribution and apportionment. On the other hand, he knew that she is of a nature so kind and merciful that, seeing that it is her custom to succor the miserable of her own accord, it is impossible she should refuse the petitions of those who pray to her. Accordingly the Church, which is wont to salute her “the Mother of Grace and the Mother of Mercy,” has so found her always, but especially in answer to the Rosary. Wherefore the Roman Pontiffs have let pass no occasion of commending the Rosary and have enriched it with Apostolic Indulgences.”
w2.vatican.va/content/benedict-xv/en/encyclicals/documents/hf_ben-xv_enc_29061921_fausto-appetente-die.html
 
patricius79 said:
How do we determine what is part of the deposit of faith about our Blessed Mother?

As I understand it, Vatican II said that devotion to Mary is intrinsic to Christian worship. That would be official Church teaching.

Here is from an Encyclical by Pope Benedict 15th:

"He[St. Dominic] knew, on the one hand, Mary’s authority with her Son to be such that whatever graces he confers on men she has their distribution and apportionment. On the other hand, he knew that she is of a nature so kind and merciful that, seeing that it is her custom to succor the miserable of her own accord, it is impossible she should refuse the petitions of those who pray to her. Accordingly the Church, which is wont to salute her “the Mother of Grace and the Mother of Mercy,” has so found her always, but especially in answer to the Rosary. Wherefore the Roman Pontiffs have let pass no occasion of commending the Rosary and have enriched it with Apostolic Indulgences."
w2.vatican.va/content/benedict-xv/en/encyclicals/documents/hf_ben-xv_enc_29061921_fausto-appetente-die.html
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It means we are supposed to regard her with reverence, that is, one befitting our utmost respect. IT DOES NOT MEAN WE ARE TO PRACTICE PRIVATE DEVOTION TO HER! :mad:
 
patricius79 said:
Dear Oneofthewomen,

I think we’re just discussing how we understand what the Church teaches. I don’t know how others determine that.

In various ways,** I’ve concluded that devotion to our Mother and Helper–the Mother of God-- is central to our faith, all of which is a matter of salvation**.

For example, in “Mother of the Redeemer”, Pope St. JPII says that there is a “profound link between Marian devotion and worship of the Eucharist”. And Vatican II said similarly.
Click to expand...
I could be wrong but that sounds dangerously close to heresy to me, to put Mary in the centre of our faith when her place is beside her Son, directing us to him.

Our Lady is an important aspect of our faith, and the more I learn about her the more I can appreciate just how important she is. But as Oneofthewomen says, Marian devotion is not a requirement for salvation. Your quote from St. John Paul II doesn’t include instructions that we must have such a devotion.
 
seagal said:
I could be wrong but that sounds dangerously close to heresy to me, to put Mary in the centre of our faith when her place is beside her Son, directing us to him.

.
Click to expand...
That’s the sense in which I mean it–that–as John Paul II said–“Mary is indissoluble from the mystery of Christ”

I know that our Mother’s role is entirely subordinate to Jesus Christ

As St. JPII says, the more we entrust ourselves to Mary as her children, the closer we draw to Jesus Christ, the Eucharist.
 
seagal said:
I could be wrong but that sounds dangerously close to heresy to me, to put Mary in the centre of our faith when her place is beside her Son, directing us to him.

Our Lady is an important aspect of our faith, and the more I learn about her the more I can appreciate just how important she is. But as Oneofthewomen says, Marian devotion is not a requirement for salvation. Your quote from St. John Paul II doesn’t include instructions that we must have such a devotion.
Click to expand...
That’s right. The centre of our faith of course is God, but in terms of our pilgrimage on earth, what is central to the Christian life is the Mass. That is what every devotion, prayer and act of charity would lead to, and from which all of these draw their strength and power, hence, the term “source and summit of the Christian life.” If one keeps Mary or anything else as the “centre” of his faith life, there is a problem because what should be central for ALL Catholics is the Eucharist.

Devotion to our Lady is indeed an integral part of Catholic worship. That’s why, for example, the Missal and Breviary has a section called “Common of the Blessed Virgin Mary”, her name is explicitly mentioned in the Confiteor and the Canon, and the Church keeps a multitude of solemnities, feasts and memorials in her honour, at least one of which is a Holy Day of Obligation. And we keep these feasts with appropriately, Mass and Office, the official, highest expressions of Catholic worship.

None of these mean people have to read St. Louis, perform a Total Consecration, wear a scapular or pray the Rosary. All of these, while approved, are private, optional devotions which people are free to adopt or pass over.
 
porthos11 said:
That’s right. The centre of our faith of course is God, but in terms of our pilgrimage on earth, what is central to the Christian life is the Mass. That is what every devotion, prayer and act of charity would lead to, and from which all of these draw their strength and power, hence, the term “source and summit of the Christian life.” If one keeps Mary or anything else as the “centre” of his faith life, there is a problem because what should be central for ALL Catholics is the Eucharist.
.
Click to expand...
I agree that the Eucharist is our center. Mary’s goal is to unite us to the Eucharist. And all our hope is in Christ. Yet that doesn’t stop Pope Pius 9th from saying that we place all our hope in our Mother, the Virgin (please see opening post)

As I understand Church teaching, since Mary is Mediatrix of grace, we receive the graces of the Eucharist through her, our Mother.

Here is a quotation from Pope Pius 12th which is beautiful. I would think that since Mary our Mother and Queen reigns with her son, the King, she is in that secondary sense, central.

111. May she, then, the most holy Mother of all the members of Christ,[220] to whose Immaculate Heart We have trustfully consecrated all mankind, and who now reigns in heaven with her Son, her body and soul refulgent with heavenly glory - may she never cease to beg from Him that copious streams of grace may flow from its exalted Head into all the members of the Mystical Body. May she throw about the Church today, as in times gone by, the mantle of her protection and obtain from God that now at least the Church and all mankind may enjoy more peaceful days.
w2.vatican.va/content/pius-xii/en/encyclicals/documents/hf_p-xii_enc_29061943_mystici-corporis-christi.html
 
Here’s another quotation from St. JPII’s encyclical Mother of the Redeemer which illustrates what I mean about our Queen, the Mother of the Eucharist, being “central”.

But my main point was simply that Mary is very important to the Catholic faith, to put it mildly, and that the whole Catholic faith must be lovingly received to be saved (to the extent one is psychologically free and has access to truth).

Here is St. John Paul II:

*In her exultation Mary confesses that she finds herself in the very heart of this fullness of Christ. She is conscious that the promise made to the fathers, first of all “to Abraham and to his posterity for ever,” is being fulfilled in herself. She is thus aware that concentrated within herself as the mother of Christ is the whole salvific economy, in which “from age to age” is manifested he who as the God of the Covenant, “remembers his mercy.” *
w2.vatican.va/content/john-paul-ii/en/encyclicals/documents/hf_jp-ii_enc_25031987_redemptoris-mater.html
 
It must be stressed that The Blessed Virgin Mary was preserved
from original sin and sin the rest of her life out of Divine not Merited Favor.
It was for her benefit and everyone else’s benefit who chooses Salvation.
I truly believe some things attributed to her are because of her office
of Queen or as a Symbol of The Church.
~
I honor her because it gives Glory to God and His Son Jesus Christ.
I cherish her Clement intercession for God’s Mercy in her special role.
But I also cherish the intercession of St. Joseph the Foster Father of Jesus Christ
and all The Holy Angels and Saints.
~
God Bless.
Peace.
 
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