How justify abortion in case of rape or incest?

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HomeschoolDad

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Many people who call themselves Christians are willing to accept abortion in cases of rape or incest, even when they otherwise oppose it. The Catholic Church is very explicit about not accepting this, as murder is murder regardless of the tragic circumstances that brought about the pregnancy.

But what of other Christians? Do they accept the error of “the end justifies the means”, do they find scriptural support for their acceptance, or do they have another reason for it?

Or is it more of a political thing, to try to attract support for the pro-life stance in secular society by allowing for exceptions in “hard cases”?

I have specifically omitted “life of the mother” because that is a somewhat different case — while we, as Catholics, also view this as an unacceptable case of “the end justifies the means”, an argument can be made that it is a life threatening another life, and there is at least a coherent internal logic to it. No such logic exists for abortion in cases of rape or incest.

I would especially welcome answers from non-Catholics on CAF.
 
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The moral reasoning is clear on behalf of the innocent child.

What these moral issues really are is difficult, excruciatingly so. But, human beings are not evaluated by “degree of difficulty” like Olympic divers.
We are all difficult, and we are all human and deserving of respect. In fact the more vulnerable among us ought to merit more radical consideration, not less.

And before someone even gets started:
you shouldn’t speak about the rights of human beings if you’re not prepared to acknowledge the prior right to live, because without living human beings, human rights are just absurd talking points.
 
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Personally, I can understand the exception for rape. For me, the thought of someone that has already be violated having to carry the product of experience for months afterwards. All those happy milestones that would normally accompany a pregnancy would be another reminder. In a lot of cases, the woman would probably not be in a good place mentally and not doing all the things a pregnant woman would do (or avoid). I just can’t see a positive result in the end, although not impossible. There are two innocent lives involved and I know that we all have crosses to bare, but this is one cross I wouldn’t want to “force” anyone to carry.
I’ve never understood the exception for incest. It’s either an “accidental” pregnancy (consensual) or rape (non-consensual).
 
The people I have met justify their “pro abortion if the father has committed a criminal act” position via partisan politics. The party loyalty is more important.
 
Fortunately I’ve never been involved with an abortion.

No one can blame a lady or child of abortion in the circumstances above.

God is about love , peace , freedom and of course forgiveness.

If you break any of the 10 commandments you have sinned in the eyes of God.

One is no less than the other so before anyone casts any stones.

Take a good look at the commandments and how many have each and everyone of us broken.

All ten are equal.
 
Abortion hurts women and under this circumstance it would be like adding salt to a wound.A women in my parish had a baby conceived through rape who is now in her forties with children of her own. She is a lovely woman as is her mother
 
At the same time the commandments and the moral law in general do not exist to condemn us, nor merely to point out how difficult life is.
The moral law leads to goodness and fulfillment. God’s love, peace, forgiveness are at the end of the moral law, not as an aside to it, or not as an excuse to it.

(FYI I speak as someone who has failed quite a bit, and still falls a lot. But there is no other way but to follow the path of goodness and help others to do that).
 
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englands123 said:
Take a good look at the commandments and how many have each and everyone of us broken.

All ten are equal.
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I doubt that. Murder is a bit more heftier than missing mass. I’m not discounting the seriousness of honouring the Lord’s Day, but that separates only me from God. Murder affects another human being.
 
We cannot speak for others Christians.

There are as many Prostestants as individuals and theses questions are not ruled by a Church like us. So, many think and act as the rest of society and accept abortion in all cases or at lest in some cases.
 
jrgmercado said:
Personally, I can understand the exception for rape. For me, the thought of someone that has already be violated having to carry the product of experience for months afterwards. All those happy milestones that would normally accompany a pregnancy would be another reminder. In a lot of cases, the woman would probably not be in a good place mentally and not doing all the things a pregnant woman would do (or avoid). I just can’t see a positive result in the end, although not impossible. There are two innocent lives involved and I know that we all have crosses to bare, but this is one cross I wouldn’t want to “force” anyone to carry.
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I am truly sorry that the heinous crime of rape sometimes results in an unwanted pregnancy. Agreed, no woman should “have to” carry that kind of cross. But there are only two possibilities, either carrying the child to term, or to murder the child. Having a traumatic pregnancy, without, as you put it, the “happy milestones”, putting the mother in a “bad place mentally”, and having the mother possibly neglect her health due to the trauma, all of these are bad things. In a rightly ordered society, every possible resource would be available to mitigate these problems.

No one wishes to judge or “cast stones” at a mother who takes advantage of our society’s ability to address the problem with abortion. That is not the point. Being willing to tolerate the murder of the child is the issue here.
 
jrgmercado said:
I’ve never understood the exception for incest. It’s either an “accidental” pregnancy (consensual) or rape (non-consensual).
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The situation with incest in somewhat different. In many situations, an incestuous situation was taken place for a lot a time, or many years before the woman fall pregnant. Usually it had stated during childhood, so it may not bconsidered as “rape”, because it seels the victim does not defend herself, but it is an abusive situation.
Not all countries forbid in their criminal code laws incest, that’s another thing…
 
So do people choose which commandments are essential to one’s self ?

The Ten Commandments​

  1. You shall have no other Gods but me.
  2. You shall not make for yourself any idol, nor bow down to it or worship it.
  3. You shall not misuse the name of the Lord your God.
  4. You shall remember and keep the Sabbath day holy.
  5. Respect your father and mother.
  6. You must not commit murder.
  7. You must not commit adultery.
  8. You must not steal.
  9. You must not give false evidence against your neighbour.
  10. You must not be envious of your neighbour’s goods. You shall not be envious of his house nor his wife, nor anything that belongs to your neighbour.
They are all equal.
Example:
So if a person beats a wife up and cheats on her.
He is not as sinful as the man who worships other idols or stolen ?

Yes I tell you they are equal and must repent.
If you have abused your parents in some way is this not equal to abortion ? Yes I tell you it’s equal.

The 10 commandments are all equal in sight of God. Break one anyone and you will need to repent and pray for his forgiveness.
 
jrgmercado said:
Personally, I can understand the exception for rape. For me, the thought of someone that has already be violated having to carry the product of experience for months afterwards.
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OTOH, if she aborts the child, she will have to carry that experience for a lifetime.
 
englands123 said:
So do people choose which commandments are essential
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No, why would you say that?
englands123 said:
So if a person beats a wife up and cheats on her.
He is not as sinful as the man who worships other idols
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Why is he not as sinful? And what does this have to do with abortion? Probably best to stay on topic
englands123 said:
The 10 commandments are all equal in sight of God. Break one anyone and you will need to repent
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But then why did you suggest someone who beats up his wife not as sinful?
 
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englands123 said:
The 10 commandments are all equal in sight of God.
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How do you know this. Does a weighted measurement exist in scripture that tells me they are equal. I know that they equally separate us from God in that they are mortal sins. But the ones that involve others - to me - carry more weight then the ones that involve only my relationship with God. I do not believe that God weighs missing mass on Sunday the same way he might weight me killing my neighbour with an ax.
 
englands123 said:
…
If you have abused your parents in some way is this not equal to abortion ? Yes I tell you it’s equal.

The 10 commandments are all equal in sight of God. Break one anyone and you will need to repent and pray for his forgiveness.
Click to expand...
None of the moral law is optional, but offenses vary in gravity. This ought to be obvious.
 
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All I can say is that the mother is the one to make the decision, possibly with neutral and informed support. This is not innately fair to the baby of course, but this baby was created by an act of violence or at least violation and that was a black mark cast on him or her by the father. The likely best solution it to adopt out the baby. It takes an incredible woman to raise such a child as any other. Even carrying the baby to term is a near endless reminder of how she was treated as best as an object of sexual pleasure or more likely one of abuse and worthlessness. One must also consider the long term impact of this scenario on people in this woman’s life; this never a simple equation.

Personally I think no man can really comment or consult on this matter; it is an experience beyond any man. Even the culture of beauty an objectification is beyond most men. Men don’t generally get “checked out” or in my case propositioned for paid sex in the grocery store just recently.
 
I am not Catholic, and I am 100% pro-choice.

But even if I weren’t 100% pro choice, I would argue that in “cases of rape and incest” , “life of the mother” also applies.

Many women who experience rape and/or incest lose the will to live. Add the burden of an unwelcome pregnancy, birth, and child on top of that and the life of the mother is very much at risk. She may have other children she is caring for, and the undue stress may break her in many ways. Everyone has their breaking point. Everyone is different. But that is the point for us pro-choicers. It is a very personal and individual thing. It is why we believe each woman should make this choice for herself.
 
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