How much did Adam and Eve know about God?

[iohannes13]

Nope, He told them about it before the Fall. It was the most important tree there, ignored like so many important things in life.

How do you know that God told them about the second tree? Where does it say that?

 

[iohannes13]

That’s a misconception you have about Jehovahs witnesses… But I’d like to just give a brief over view of how we see this whole thing…

God’s original purpose was for perfect humans to live forever in paradise in a perfect world, if Adam and Eve didn’t sin then everyone else would of been perfect on earth now… Hence the Bible says “through one man sin entered into the world and death through sin”, if there was no sin there would be no death… God wanted humans to live forever on earth. Also if Adam didn’t sin then there would be no need for Jesus to come to earth because Jesus came to die for our sins if we were perfect and didn’t sin it wouldn’t be necessary for Jesus to do that… Since a perfect man Adam sinned God had to send someone perfect as a ransom so as to buy our sins back an that was Jesus. Perfect man for perfect man…
We also believe that God’s original purpose for perfect humans to live on a paradise earth forever has not changed, that is why we believe not everyone is going to heaven because it nullifies God’s original purpose for humans. Also before Adam an Eve sinned God warned them that if they eat from the tree they would “positively die”… He didn’t warn them about being thrown into hell and burning forever… Or that their souls will live on forever… That’s another reason we don’t in believe in hell.

But that’s it in a nutshell… The majority of Jehovah’s Witnesses is looking forward to living on earth forever as perfect humans… Most of us don’t have a desire to go to heaven

That’s some plan. Let A happen otherwise B can’t happen. Why was Jesus coming to earth so important?

 

[ChosenOne7]

My experience has been that the JW evangelist pays for the reading materials that they pass out up front. Otherwise the Watchtower does not deliver them. The JW evangelist hands them out and at least for the hard cover books, asks for a donation. The donation requested is “whatever we want to give.” So they don’t even ask the cost of the book for the donation. So this person pays for the difference of the cost of the book. What happens to the collected donation for the book? Does it get forwarded to the Watchtower? If so, that means the JW evangelist is paying 100% of the reading materials they had out.

Also, JWs don’t believe in Hell because they don’t believe in a soul. And there is no point arguing theology with JWs using our Bibles. The Watchtower modified their Bible to match their teachings. So I’m sure there is no mention of Hell in them. And JWs won’t even look at your Bible because they have been lead to believe that your Bible has been corrupted by the Devil. You have to use the old Watchtower pamphlets. In the early 1900’s, the JW pamphlets taught that Jesus was God. Now they teach that He is St. Michael. Who was right, the people writing in the early 1900’s or the pamphlet authors today? Which one was leading your people astray to absolute death?

We don’t have to give or are not obliged to give… We give voluntary donations… But it doesn’t mean that if no one gives money for the literature we produce that we have to… I personally can’t remember when was the last time I gave a contribution even though I work with the literature in the congregation and I preach every weekend. It must come from your heart… Isnt it similar with Catholics?

Interesting how you seem to know so much about a religion you not in hey… Who told you we don’t believe in a soul? That’s a lie. We don’t believe in people being torture forever yes, original words sheol and hades has been changed in many bibles with the word hell - that makes it confusing for people to grasp the true meaning. We modified our bibles? Interesting claim… So what if I told you I can show you from your own Bible would you still doubt? What Bible do you use let me use the one with you and show you that we do and can use any Bible too.

Can you give me references that we believed Jesus is God? I’d appreciate that thanks

 

[iohannes13]

We don’t have to give or are not obliged to give… We give voluntary donations… But it doesn’t mean that if no one gives money for the literature we produce that we have to… I personally can’t remember when was the last time I gave a contribution even though I work with the literature in the congregation and I preach every weekend. It must come from your heart… Isnt it similar with Catholics?

Interesting how you seem to know so much about a religion you not in hey… Who told you we don’t believe in a soul? That’s a lie. We don’t believe in people being torture forever yes, original words sheol and hades has been changed in many bibles with the word hell - that makes it confusing for people to grasp the true meaning. We modified our bibles? Interesting claim… So what if I told you I can show you from your own Bible would you still doubt? What Bible do you use let me use the one with you and show you that we do and can use any Bible too.

Can you give me references that we believed Jesus is God? I’d appreciate that thanks

For starters, all the references to Jesus being divine have been changed to support the teaching that He is St. Michael. The key are the Watchtower pamphets/booklets. Look up hard copies of these booklets dating back to early 1900s - when they use to write that Jesus was God. When did they stop teaching this? Then find a Watchtower Bible from those eras and compare to find the changes to what you have now. If you are a seeker of truth, then you won’t wait for me to produce this evidence. Anyways, if I produced them, they would be tainted by the devil most likely and your elders would tell you to stop communication with me.

 

[iohannes13]

For starters, all the references to Jesus being divine have been changed to support the teaching that He is St. Michael. The key are the Watchtower pamphets/booklets. Look up hard copies of these booklets dating back to early 1900s - when they use to write that Jesus was God. When did they stop teaching this? Then find a Watchtower Bible from those eras and compare to find the changes to what you have now. If you are a seeker of truth, then you won’t wait for me to produce this evidence. Anyways, if I produced them, they would be tainted by the devil most likely and your elders would tell you to stop communication with me.

You believe in a soul? When did that change? I was always told by JW evangelists that there is no soul and at death we just cease to exist. This follows the old Hebrews view that the body had no soul.

Tell me about the 144,000 that will be saved? I imagine that you are not part of that since there have been a number of JW greater than 144,000 since Russell started this movement. Or are you part of the 144,000? If so how do you know?

So if JW’s worshipped Jesus prior to the 1960’s what does that mean?

 

[iohannes13]

We don’t have to give or are not obliged to give… We give voluntary donations… But it doesn’t mean that if no one gives money for the literature we produce that we have to… I personally can’t remember when was the last time I gave a contribution even though I work with the literature in the congregation and I preach every weekend. It must come from your heart… Isnt it similar with Catholics?

Interesting how you seem to know so much about a religion you not in hey… Who told you we don’t believe in a soul? That’s a lie. We don’t believe in people being torture forever yes, original words sheol and hades has been changed in many bibles with the word hell - that makes it confusing for people to grasp the true meaning. We modified our bibles? Interesting claim… So what if I told you I can show you from your own Bible would you still doubt? What Bible do you use let me use the one with you and show you that we do and can use any Bible too.

Can you give me references that we believed Jesus is God? I’d appreciate that thanks

Hey, how do you translate this verse: John 28 Thomas said to him, “My Lord and my God!”

Based on what other JW’s have answered me, I have an idea how your going to respond. Can you write on here how this is written in the WatchTower Bible? I’m curious.

 

[iohannes13]

That’s a misconception you have about Jehovahs witnesses… But I’d like to just give a brief over view of how we see this whole thing…

God’s original purpose was for perfect humans to live forever in paradise in a perfect world, if Adam and Eve didn’t sin then everyone else would of been perfect on earth now… Hence the Bible says “through one man sin entered into the world and death through sin”, if there was no sin there would be no death… God wanted humans to live forever on earth. Also if Adam didn’t sin then there would be no need for Jesus to come to earth because Jesus came to die for our sins if we were perfect and didn’t sin it wouldn’t be necessary for Jesus to do that… Since a perfect man Adam sinned God had to send someone perfect as a ransom so as to buy our sins back an that was Jesus. Perfect man for perfect man…
We also believe that God’s original purpose for perfect humans to live on a paradise earth forever has not changed, that is why we believe not everyone is going to heaven because it nullifies God’s original purpose for humans. Also before Adam an Eve sinned God warned them that if they eat from the tree they would “positively die”… He didn’t warn them about being thrown into hell and burning forever… Or that their souls will live on forever… That’s another reason we don’t in believe in hell.

But that’s it in a nutshell… The majority of Jehovah’s Witnesses is looking forward to living on earth forever as perfect humans… Most of us don’t have a desire to go to heaven

What about the Watchtower’s claim that all the other Bibles have been corrupted by the Devil. Do you deny that the Watchtower pamphlets/booklets state this?

 

[iohannes13]

That’s a misconception you have about Jehovahs witnesses… But I’d like to just give a brief over view of how we see this whole thing…

God’s original purpose was for perfect humans to live forever in paradise in a perfect world, if Adam and Eve didn’t sin then everyone else would of been perfect on earth now… Hence the Bible says “through one man sin entered into the world and death through sin”, if there was no sin there would be no death… God wanted humans to live forever on earth. Also if Adam didn’t sin then there would be no need for Jesus to come to earth because Jesus came to die for our sins if we were perfect and didn’t sin it wouldn’t be necessary for Jesus to do that… Since a perfect man Adam sinned God had to send someone perfect as a ransom so as to buy our sins back an that was Jesus. Perfect man for perfect man…
We also believe that God’s original purpose for perfect humans to live on a paradise earth forever has not changed, that is why we believe not everyone is going to heaven because it nullifies God’s original purpose for humans. Also before Adam an Eve sinned God warned them that if they eat from the tree they would “positively die”… He didn’t warn them about being thrown into hell and burning forever… Or that their souls will live on forever… That’s another reason we don’t in believe in hell.

But that’s it in a nutshell… The majority of Jehovah’s Witnesses is looking forward to living on earth forever as perfect humans… Most of us don’t have a desire to go to heaven

Are you a cradle JW or a convert?

 

[iohannes13]

But that’s it in a nutshell… The majority of Jehovah’s Witnesses is looking forward to living on earth forever as perfect humans… Most of us don’t have a desire to go to heaven

Ooooohhhh, so what your saying is that regular JWs will stay on earth. But what about the 144,000. I’m sure that you are taught that they will go to heaven. Who are the 144,000 that will go to Heaven? Why aren’t you included?

 

[iohannes13]

Can you give me references that we believed Jesus is God? I’d appreciate that thanks

ChosenOne7 what does Zion’s Watchtower 1898 Jul 15 p 216 say about Jesus being worshipped?

The Watchtower prophesized that the end of the world would arrive in 1914; 1925; more and more dates, and as most recent as 1975 and/or 1978. Was this not taught by the Watchtower booklets?

So are you going to seek the truth? What will you do if your elders tell you to ignore me?

 

[iohannes13]

But that’s it in a nutshell… The majority of Jehovah’s Witnesses is looking forward to living on earth forever as perfect humans… Most of us don’t have a desire to go to heaven

Hey Chosen, if death is the punishment and we stop existing after death, why would God bring us back at the end of days we if are damned? Why not just resurrect the saved? Will He do that just to rub it in that we aren’t saved? Not cool bro.

 

[fhansen]

How do you know that God told them about the second tree? Where does it say that?

Well, I know it because that’s what it says-and it’s not at all particularly hard to find. Read Gen 2:8-16 in conjunction with Gen 3:22-24.

 

[iohannes13]

Well, I know it because that’s what it says-and it’s not at all particularly hard to find. Read Gen 2:8-16 in conjunction with Gen 3:22-24.

Oh yeah it’s mentioned there. But He doesn’t tell them what the tree does in camera does he? But he didn’t prohibit it.

 

[fhansen]

Oh yeah it’s mentioned there. But He doesn’t tell them what the tree does in camera does he? But he didn’t prohibit it.

Somebody told them-or there’d be no need for God to ban them from it.

 

[iohannes13]

Well, I know it because that’s what it says-and it’s not at all particularly hard to find. Read Gen 2:8-16 in conjunction with Gen 3:22-24.

Hey, the tree of life would let them live forever? But I was always taught that Adam and Eve were immortal but their fall caused death to enter the world. But knowing that life had existed millions of years before man existed meant that death existed. That Adam could eat any animal in the garden meant that he had to kill them first to eat them. Soo… any idea what the tree of life did?

See now it’s sounding like what kept them immortal was the fruit of the tree of life and that sounds like the fruit the Olympians ate to keep them going forever.

 

[iohannes13]

Somebody told them-or there’d be no need for God to ban them from it.

I meant did God tell them what the tree of life did but it was not written. But nevertheless, he didn’t ban them from eating from that tree.

 

[fhansen]

I meant did God tell them what the tree of life did but it was not written. But nevertheless, he didn’t ban them from eating from that tree.

I didn’t say He banned them from eating it. IMO, to partake of the tree of life would’ve been to partake of Him, as we’re commanded to now with the New Covenant. It would be to seek God, to draw nearer, to covet the knowledge of God. Union with Him is the summit experience for man; its always been the goal-and the source of eternal life for us. Just as now; Adam & Eve were to choose life, not death. Adam & Eve just took a detour, onto a path that would ultimately lead to Jesus, back to the Tree of Life, fulfilled on earth by the Eucharist, fulfilled in heaven by complete union with God.

 

[ChosenOne7]

For starters, all the references to Jesus being divine have been changed to support the teaching that He is St. Michael. The key are the Watchtower pamphets/booklets. Look up hard copies of these booklets dating back to early 1900s - when they use to write that Jesus was God. When did they stop teaching this? Then find a Watchtower Bible from those eras and compare to find the changes to what you have now. If you are a seeker of truth, then you won’t wait for me to produce this evidence. Anyways, if I produced them, they would be tainted by the devil most likely and your elders would tell you to stop communication with me.

Okay I’m not denying your claim what I’m asking is that you give me reference or proof of it please… I have studied this religion through and through and have done extensive research on it, I can say that I have never seen nor heard anyone say that we believed Jesus is God, maybe I missed that in my research. What I can tell you though is that even if they have changed there teaching you would be able to find the old teaching, they have never hidden there teachings so you should easily be able to find what you are saying right?

People are given all these false information on the Internet that when people like you read it blindly follow it… Remember there is always 2 sides to a story, a wise person would find out both before making a conclusion. Do you really think many Jehovahs witnesses don’t know about all this that you mention? Do you really think many of them didn’t question it too? I know I have, but I have studied those claims made by non witnesses and by witnesses unlike most other people who has just accepted claims made by non witnesses.

But coming back to the question where or when did we believe Jesus is God?

 

[iohannes13]

Okay I’m not denying your claim what I’m asking is that you give me reference or proof of it please… I have studied this religion through and through and have done extensive research on it, I can say that I have never seen nor heard anyone say that we believed Jesus is God, maybe I missed that in my research. What I can tell you though is that even if they have changed there teaching you would be able to find the old teaching, they have never hidden there teachings so you should easily be able to find what you are saying right?

People are given all these false information on the Internet that when people like you read it blindly follow it… Remember there is always 2 sides to a story, a wise person would find out both before making a conclusion. Do you really think many Jehovahs witnesses don’t know about all this that you mention? Do you really think many of them didn’t question it too? I know I have, but I have studied those claims made by non witnesses and by witnesses unlike most other people who has just accepted claims made by non witnesses.

But coming back to the question where or when did we believe Jesus is God?

I know for a fact that the JWs that spoke to me never question anything from the watchtower. I imagine there are many more like that where they came from. Dude, so that it comes from you and not the Internet, show me a writing from the early 1900s from Russell himself showing that he taught that Jesus was St. Michael. This is your chance to show me your side of what I read is not true.

 

[iohannes13]

Okay I’m not denying your claim what I’m asking is that you give me reference or proof of it please… I have studied this religion through and through and have done extensive research on it, I can say that I have never seen nor heard anyone say that we believed Jesus is God, maybe I missed that in my research. What I can tell you though is that even if they have changed there teaching you would be able to find the old teaching, they have never hidden there teachings so you should easily be able to find what you are saying right?

People are given all these false information on the Internet that when people like you read it blindly follow it… Remember there is always 2 sides to a story, a wise person would find out both before making a conclusion. Do you really think many Jehovahs witnesses don’t know about all this that you mention? Do you really think many of them didn’t question it too? I know I have, but I have studied those claims made by non witnesses and by witnesses unlike most other people who has just accepted claims made by non witnesses.

But coming back to the question where or when did we believe Jesus is God?

Show me something from Russell himself saying that Jesus should not be worshipped too. But if you are like every other JW I’ve asked this info from, I expect to never receive this from you and probably never hear from you again.