How To Get To Heaven When You Die

[xfrodobagginsx]

FrodoBaggins, welcome to the board. You don’t seem to have any idea of what Catholics believe. Apparently you’ve been misinformed by someone with an anti-Catholic agenda. We believe in salvation by Jesus’ grace, not by working our way to heaven. We don’t believe that praying to Mary gets us to heaven. And we don’t believe we are saved by the Church — we are saved BY Jesus THROUGH the Church.

Stick around to learn what we really believe — then tell us what you think.

…and all this time, I thought I was saved by grace through faith in what Jesus Christ did for me on the cross.

Eph 2:8 (NKJV) For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; [it is] the gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast.

What does the above verse mean?

 

[xfrodobagginsx]

Honestly, I can’t vote for just one.

Its a combination…

1. You have to trust Christ, and believe in his words Completely
2. You have to be obedient to the Church HE founded. Believing in His Church means you Believe in him. The two aren’t separable. Following His church means you are following Him. It is not a follow him OR the church, because the two are inseparable.
3. Well, extrapolating, we are commanded to pray for one another. It shows our love. If I have faith enough to move mountains, but not love, my faith is useless. So, I don’t limit asking for and and praying for to Just Mary. Thats Like saying am I not allowed to pray for you? Are you not allowed to pray for me?
4. Being Good - This alone is impossible, but you have to be obedient in combination with your belief. “Why do you call me Lord Lord and Not do as I say?!”

Its not an exclusionary deal…
All of it is needed.

In Christ

So is this guy going to hell?

1Jo 5:13 These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life, and that you may [continue to] believe in the name of the Son of God.

I put my faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation because that’s what the bible says to do.

Who does the bible say to put your faith in? Show me ONE VERSE where it says to put your faith in the church for salvation.

By the way, the true church is NOT a denomination. It is made up of true believer’s from all denominations. There are catholics going to hell and protestents going to hell because they don’t truly accept what Jesus Christ did for them on the cross to get them to heaven; there are catholics going to heaven and protestants going to heaven because they TRULY place their faith in Jesus Christ for salvation.

If we could get to heaven any other way, then Christ died on the cross in vain:

Ga 2:21 (NKJV) “I do not set aside the grace of God; for if righteousness [comes] through the law, then Christ died in vain.”

What is grace?

 

[Linkowski]

I’m one of the people that voted for “the Church”. I believe that everything the Church stands for is the truth, and yes, this includes Jesus Christ Himself. It’s kind of hard to say one or the other when, to me, they both mean the same.

That depends on whether or not you believe in praying TO Mary (which is what Catholicism teaches)…or in the sense of mortal sin that I see preached…or in Purgatory…or transubstantiation…I do not and so I cannot attend your church (nor do I “trust in” your Church). But, I can say that my life was change when I was born agian by the Word of God in finding that I could not merit salvation but needed to humbly bow to Christ as Lord and Savior…the Holy Spirit came in and my life changed and rearranged. Glory all goes to God!

 

[BeeSweet]

…and all this time, I thought I was saved by grace through faith in what Jesus Christ did for me on the cross.

Eph 2:8 (NKJV) For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; [it is] the gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast.

What does the above verse mean?

Eph 2:8 means that nothing we do of ourselves saves us, we are saved by the grace of God through our Lord Jesus Christ.

Furthermore, being that Jesus Christ is truly present body, blood, soul and divinity in the church, then we are saved through the church. It is through the church that we receive His word, and we receive Him. The church is Christ’s gift to us.

 

[djrakowski]

1. If you are willing to receive Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior please pray this right now, from your heart to God,

“Dear LORD JESUS, I believe that YOU died on the Cross and Rose from the dead for my sins. I ask you to come into my heart and forgive me for my sins, take me to heaven when I die. I now receive You as my Lord and Savior. Thank You for saving me. In Jesus holy name, Amen.”

I can’t find this prayer in the Bible. Do you have a chapter/verse reference?

If you prayed that prayer from your heart to God, and meant it with all of your heart, you are now a child of God and will go to heaven when you die.

I used to be an evangelical Christian, and once prayed something very much like this. Now that I’m a Catholic, does this prayer still act as my ‘golden ticket’ to heaven?

Now that you are on your way to heaven, you should attend a bible believing church and follow in baptism.

I would never presume to claim more than a moral assurance of eternal salvation. I haven’t yet persevered to the end (Matthew 10:22, 24:13; Mark 13:13), and thus there’s no way to tell whether I will do so until I’m there.

At any rate, I’ve placed my trust in Jesus - once as an evangelical, by praying a ‘sinner’s prayer,’ and once again as a Catholic, when I was confirmed (at which time I promised to keep the entire word of God, not just that which was committed to writing in the form of sacred scripture). Thus, I’m a member of the First Apostolic Full Gospel Church of Jesus Christ, Unreformed, Roman Branch. It doesn’t get more Bible-believing than that!

 

[xfrodobagginsx]

Eph 2:8 means that nothing we do of ourselves saves us, we are saved by the grace of God through our Lord Jesus Christ.

Furthermore, being that Jesus Christ is truly present body, blood, soul and divinity in the church, then we are saved through the church. It is through the church that we receive His word, and we receive Him. The church is Christ’s gift to us.

Chapter and verse please? Where does it say by trusting in His church? It is by grace through FAITH.

Heb 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.
(KJV)

 

[djrakowski]

But, I can say that my life was change when I was born agian by the Word of God in finding that I could not merit salvation but needed to humbly bow to Christ as Lord and Savior…the Holy Spirit came in and my life changed and rearranged. Glory all goes to God!

Amen, Brother Craig! Fortunately, the Catholic Church doesn’t teach that we can merit our own salvation, and thus, we’re on the same page!

Praised be Jesus Christ, Now and Forever!

 

[HailMary]

ARE YOU 100% SURE THAT IF YOU DIED TODAY THAT YOU WOULD GO TO HEAVEN?

100% moral assurance, yes, but not what most Protestants suggest today: absolute assurance.

what about Romans 13:11:
“…salvation is nearer to us now than when we first believed”,
a reference to future salvation. By being “saved”[in the “born again”, protestant sense] we would have nothing to hope for anymore because we KNOW Heaven is ours. This is wrong and unbiblical because our salvation is founded upon the hope of something says St. Paul. “
"For in hope we were saved. Now hope that sees for itself is not hope. For who hopes for what one sees? ”Romans 8:24].

this verse is crystal clear: if you SEE heaven [ie: if you have an
absolute assurance of salvation because you are “saved”] your hope is seen and therefore according to St. Paul, is not hope
at all and cannot bring about salvation.

 

[xfrodobagginsx]

I can’t find this prayer in the Bible. Do you have a chapter/verse reference?
I used to be an evangelical Christian, and once prayed something very much like this. Now that I’m a Catholic, does this prayer still act as my ‘golden ticket’ to heaven?
I would never presume to claim more than a moral assurance of eternal salvation. I haven’t yet persevered to the end (Matthew 10:22, 24:13; Mark 13:13), and thus there’s no way to tell whether I will do so until I’m there.

At any rate, I’ve placed my trust in Jesus - once as an evangelical, by praying a ‘sinner’s prayer,’ and once again as a Catholic, when I was confirmed (at which time I promised to keep the entire word of God, not just that which was committed to writing in the form of sacred scripture). Thus, I’m a member of the First Apostolic Full Gospel Church of Jesus Christ, Unreformed, Roman Branch. It doesn’t get more Bible-believing than that!

If you truly accepted Jesus Christ into your heart, it doesn’t matter what church you go to, you will get to heaven. If you haven’t truly done that from your heart, you won’t get there no matter which one you belong to. It’s not about a church. There is no where in the bible that says it’s about a church. When you accept Jesus Christ into your heart, you belong to the true church. The true church is the bride of Christ. That isn’t a building or denomination, it is made up of all true believers, even some catholics and protestants.

 

[KephasAugustine]

I chose “other” because I didn’t see ‘by the Grace of God’ as one of the choices.

Seriously. We can trust all we want in whatever we want. God’s Grace is what saves us.

 

[Linkowski]

Amen, Brother Craig! Fortunately, the Catholic Church doesn’t teach that we can merit our own salvation, and thus, we’re on the same page!

Praised be Jesus Christ, Now and Forever!

Mine did…and so do 99.9% of the Catholics that I talk to in door to door evangelism…why?

 

[djrakowski]

If you truly accepted Jesus Christ into your heart, it doesn’t matter what church you go to, you will get to heaven. If you haven’t truly done that from your heart, you won’t get there no matter which one you belong to. It’s not about a church. There is no where in the bible that says it’s about a church. When you accept Jesus Christ into your heart, you belong to the true church. The true church is the bride of Christ. That isn’t a building or denomination, it is made up of all true believers, even some catholics and protestants.

I truly accepted Jesus into my heart, and I completed the promises of my baptism when I was received into the Catholic Church.

I believe, as the Bible says, that baptism is necessary for salvation. Am I still a ‘saved’ Christian?

I believe, as the Bible says, and as the consistent tradition of Catholicism (and Orthodoxy) have taught from the beginning, that Jesus Christ is substantially present in the Holy Eucharist. Am I still a ‘saved’ Christian?

I believe, as the Bible says, that faith without works is dead. Am I still a ‘saved’ Christian?

I believe, as the Bible says, that the church is the pillar and ground of truth. Am I still a ‘saved’ Christian?

I believe, as the Bible says, that a person cannot be saved without obeying the commands of Jesus Christ. Am I still a ‘saved’ Christian?

In other words, do I have to throw away any of my Catholic (and Biblical) beliefs to be considered a ‘saved’ Christian, or am I going to hell for holding them?

 

[Teflon93]

…and all this time, I thought I was saved by grace through faith in what Jesus Christ did for me on the cross.

Eph 2:8 (NKJV) For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; [it is] the gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast.

What does the above verse mean?

It means that God grants us grace which leads to our faith. The real question is what you think faith means.

And since I answered your question, why don’t you answer mine?

What does this one mean (James 2):

14: What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?
15: If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,
16: And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?
17: Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
18: Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.

 

[djrakowski]

Mine did…and so do 99.9% of the Catholics that I talk to in door to door evangelism…why?

Mine doesn’t. My priest speaks of the daily need to pick up your cross and follow Him. He speaks of needing the grace of Jesus Christ, of needing Him in your heart as ‘personal Lord and Savior.’ And, the Catholic Church doesn’t have any doctrine remotely close to works-salvation.

So, I have to take your word for the fact that “99.9%” of the Catholics you encounter in evangelism don’t understand it. Are they regular churchgoers, actively engaged in a study of their faith? Have they read the Catechism, or do they watch EWTN/listen to Catholic radio? If your sample includes such people, your answers will be vastly different than what you’ve reported (as you know from the interactions we’ve had over the past several months).

And, did your former Catholic church teach works-salvation, or is that how you understood it? Was it taught from the pulpit, or in religious ed, or by poorly-formed Catholic parents? It’s hard to know how to interact with this statement without some background.

But I can say for certain that the Catholic Church defeated the heresy of Pelagianism (that the work of salvation is entirely up to the individual) many, many centuries ago.

 

[Linkowski]

I truly accepted Jesus into my heart, and I completed the promises of my baptism when I was received into the Catholic Church.

I believe, as the Bible says, that baptism is necessary for salvation. Am I still a ‘saved’ Christian?

I believe, as the Bible says, and as the consistent tradition of Catholicism (and Orthodoxy) have taught from the beginning, that Jesus Christ is substantially present in the Holy Eucharist. Am I still a ‘saved’ Christian?

I believe, as the Bible says, that faith without works is dead. Am I still a ‘saved’ Christian?

I believe, as the Bible says, that the church is the pillar and ground of truth. Am I still a ‘saved’ Christian?

I believe, as the Bible says, that a person cannot be saved without obeying the commands of Jesus Christ. Am I still a ‘saved’ Christian?

In other words, do I have to throw away any of my Catholic (and Biblical) beliefs to be considered a ‘saved’ Christian, or am I going to hell for holding them?

I do not think that anyone pronounced condemnation on you, did they?

Do you pray to Mary?

Oh Immaculate Heart of Mary,
I give you my heart.
I want to love you.
I want to love Jesus,
the Father,
the Holy Spirit,
and this world through your holy heart.
My dear mother,
I place myself in your heart,
I know you will care for me in all my needs.
I give myself to you,
Mary, my mother.
I love you so much!

Amen

 

[Linkowski]

Mine doesn’t. My priest speaks of the daily need to pick up your cross and follow Him. He speaks of needing the grace of Jesus Christ, of needing Him in your heart as ‘personal Lord and Savior.’ And, the Catholic Church doesn’t have any doctrine remotely close to works-salvation.

So, I have to take your word for the fact that “99.9%” of the Catholics you encounter in evangelism don’t understand it. Are they regular churchgoers, actively engaged in a study of their faith? Have they read the Catechism, or do they watch EWTN/listen to Catholic radio? If your sample includes such people, your answers will be vastly different than what you’ve reported (as you know from the interactions we’ve had over the past several months).

And, did your former Catholic church teach works-salvation, or is that how you understood it? Was it taught from the pulpit, or in religious ed, or by poorly-formed Catholic parents? It’s hard to know how to interact with this statement without some background.

But I can say for certain that the Catholic Church defeated the heresy of Pelagianism (that the work of salvation is entirely up to the individual) many, many centuries ago.

Basically, you are saying that most Catholics are completely uninformed and are not true disciples. They spend much more time with the world and dabbling in the affairs of the world rather than doing all to the glory of God. Why is that?

I can tell you this…you have no excuse whatsoever in my church to not know the gospel from dozens of angles while growing up there. It took going to a Baptist Church.

 

[djrakowski]

I do not think that anyone pronounced condemnation on you, did they?

It was more of a rhetorical question, Craig. I want ‘frodo’ to explain what I need to jettison from my Catholic belief system in order to be regarded as genuinely Christian. If it’s nothing, then there’s no need for him (or anyone else) to evangelize me or any other Catholic

Do you pray to Mary?

On occasion, I do request the intercession of Mary, but it isn’t a cornerstore of my private devotions.

 

[Gamera]

…and all this time, I thought I was saved by grace through faith in what Jesus Christ did for me on the cross.

Eph 2:8 (NKJV) For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; [it is] the gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast.

What does the above verse mean?

How is that different than what I wrote? Go back and read my post again — that’s exactly what I said.

 

[Linkowski]

It was more of a rhetorical question, Craig. I want ‘frodo’ to explain what I need to jettison from my Catholic belief system in order to be regarded as genuinely Christian. If it’s nothing, then there’s no need for him (or anyone else) to evangelize me or any other Catholic
On occasion, I do request the intercession of Mary, but it isn’t a cornerstore of my private devotions.

But you do not “give yourself to Mary” as Pope John Paul II’s prayers insinuate?

 

[djrakowski]

Basically, you are saying that most Catholics are completely uninformed and are not true disciples. They spend much more time with the world and dabbling in the affairs of the world rather than doing all to the glory of God. Why is that?

No, YOU’RE saying that - and I don’t take too kindly to people putting words in my mouth. I’m saying that you have a particular sampling of Catholics that you consider 100% representative, and I’m challenging that assertion. Unless you’ve surveyed all the 1,000,000+ Catholics in the Archdiocese of Detroit (and in fact, all 1,000,000,000+ Catholics in the world), your opinion as to the relative ignorance of my brother and sister Catholics is rather meaningless.

Craig, you KNOW what the Catholic Church teaches, and that it is NOWHERE NEAR works-salvation. Why do you care about the opinions of errant Catholics who’ve not taken the personal initiative to inform themselves what their faith really teaches?