Hugo Chavez, fiery Venezuelan leader, dies at 58

[Cor_Cordis]

No I don’t know the meaning behind the name tea bagger…I innocently assumed it was because of the name Tea Party and so it sounds fairly innocuous. If it has another ruder meaning it’s been lost on me and yes, it’d be bad to use it.
I deliberately didn’t mention the health and gay marriage thing, sorry, I really don’t want to go there.

Oh, so you don’t know what “Tea Bagger” means, although you didn’t want to mention the health and gay marriage thing.

So apparently you DO have some idea of what the term means.

Or am I supposed to believe that you didn’t Google it?

Really?

I suggest you look into it. Because the rules of this forum prevent me from explaining it. Yeah, it’s that vulgar. Ain’t liberals nice?

The bottom line is; we’ve all got to find some way of living together haven’t we? What about other religions? They also come into the equation. We can’t live safely and peacefully if we’re all consumed with hatred, suspicion and intolerance. You’ve got your bloodless civil war now, the far right is putting in another appearance in parts of Europe, we’re going to extremes…not good.

Yeah, you Brits and your socialist system are doing a fine job. You should really lecture us angry hateful American right-wingers a little more:

Anti-Christian Britain — A Disturbing Trend Emerging

Is this the most anti-Christian Government in British history?

3/4s of British Christians say anti-Christian discrimination is on the rise: Poll

Christianity ‘Under Attack’ in Britain

Christianity in schools: why we’re losing our religion

Unholy War: Christians Under Attack in Britain

UK: “Fast Growing Islamic Community” Seeks More Influence On…. Everything!

 

[Cor_Cordis]

They might be still be upset that private gun ownership is why the Union Jack doesn’t fly over the “Colonies” today.

Yep.

We angry hateful colonists are an independent lot.

 

[Walcot]

Oh, so you don’t know what “Tea Bagger” means, although you didn’t want to mention the health and gay marriage thing.

So apparently you DO have some idea of what the term means.

Or am I supposed to believe that you didn’t Google it?

Really?

I suggest you look into it. Because the rules of this forum prevent me from explaining it. Yeah, it’s that vulgar. Ain’t liberals nice?

Yeah, you Brits and your socialist system are doing a fine job. You should really lecture us angry hateful American right-wingers a little more:

Anti-Christian Britain — A Disturbing Trend Emerging

Is this the most anti-Christian Government in British history?

3/4s of British Christians say anti-Christian discrimination is on the rise: Poll

Christianity ‘Under Attack’ in Britain

Christianity in schools: why we’re losing our religion

Unholy War: Christians Under Attack in Britain

UK: “Fast Growing Islamic Community” Seeks More Influence On…. Everything!

I make no secret of being non-Christian. You can search for anti -Christian propaganda and you will of course find it, but the truth is that MOST of us in Britain, Christian, and non Christian rub along together very well in our local communities. I probably wouldn’t recognise the country through those eyes.
I am not anti-Christian, I seek understanding and tolerance, which means debate…which sometimes gets heated. Never forget that I have just as much passion in some beliefs as you do. We can stand and shout each other down and get absolutely nowhere or even further apart, or we can seek a ‘way forward’.
The Islamic community here, I don’t have much experience of, except the people who run our local Indian restaurant. I have discussed Islam with visiting scholars though. There is a lack of integration between cultures in our big cities, probably due to a combination of culture and prejudice on both sides but there’s a lot of community building work going on. Trouble is, it happened so quickly. But they have a right to their religion just the same as you do. The reason people have different religions is largely down to accident of birth. They are largely striving for the same thing. You have freedom of worship, so must they.
The anti-religion ranting that I HAVE heard here is mostly aimed at the extremism of those sects who preach violence or want to teach young earth creationism as science.
I can’t ‘lecture’ a whole country! I CAN say that I love visiting the US and come home and tell people how good some things are, like the almost unfailing politeness and cheerfulness of people in shops. The feeling is so positive -
‘yeah, we can help you and enjoy doing it too!’ We could do with a bit more of that! I went out with a policeman on his patrol on my last visit and we had a great debate about gun control! Didn’t fall out…made our points!
What I can say is that things have changed over there and there’s more extreme feelings. Opposing ‘sides’ are becoming entrenched. My good friend is seriously depressed about it and feels somewhat helpless, it’s serious. This affects the whole world, not just you. What happens in the States has global influence in modern times, it affects us all. We DO all have to live together, locally and globally. We can choose war or we can strive to find other ways. It’s never been black and white.
As for tea baggers, well, no actually I didn’t know its other meaning and I didn’t google it…honestly! I still haven’t! I really thought it was just about tea bags!! You can believe me or not as you wish. I’m not sure I WANT to know now…oh dear…no it’s not on to use vulgar names and it’s a symptom of how bad it’s getting.
This isn’t a lecture, it’s an answer to your accusations. (We don’t have a socialist government in at the moment by the way, and even our last one I wouldn’t call properly socialist- look how it got on so well with Mr Bush!)
The jibe about the union flag not flying over the colonies any more is silly. You had a war of independence from an increasingly irrelevant and remote country on another continent which was inevitable. It has nothing to do with trying to control the ownership in the home, of high performance weapons designed for rapid fire and mass killing. We have gun ownership in UK…it’s just controlled and I hear no-one complaining about it here. I know your culture is different but no-one’s suggesting a gun ban.

 

[liturgyluver]

You know, I’m growing extremely tied of you Brits (and Europeans in general) who keep coming in here with these same ridiculous and hypocritical claims.

You might want to read this:

It’s up to Americans what they do about their guns and the European and US mindset will never be as one on this issue. Even in those European countries with slightly higher gun ownership there is no concept that guns would be used for defensive purposes which is the most common justification that one sees on this forum.

But disingenious commentators often give partial facts in support of no further restrictions on guns. For example the article you quoted talks about a rise in crime and the muder rate in the UK. This began from the 1970s and then reached a peak in around 2000 but has since fallen back to the same levels in the early 1970s. The same is true in most European countires.

telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/9411649/Graphic-how-the-murder-rate-has-fallen.html

guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/2011/jul/14/crime-statistics-england-wales

London has a population of nearly 8million and last year there were 99 murders - the lowest rate since 1967.

standard.co.uk/news/crime/murder-rate-hits-42yearlow-in-london-8462974.html

The restrictions on handguns in Europe had no discernable effect simply because law-abiding people (to use the US term) have never had a history of gun ownership, and besides both gun crime and the murder rates are minisule when compared to the US.

If you are going to quote statistics, far safer to quote those from the US and not from Europe.

 

[Cor_Cordis]

But disingenious commentators often give partial facts in support of no further restrictions on guns. For example the article you quoted talks about a rise in crime and the muder rate in the UK. **This began from the 1970s and then reached a peak in around 2000 but has since fallen back to the same levels in the early 1970s. ** The same is true in most European countires.

What could have happened after 2000 to cause a decrease?

Well for starters 9/11 happened. In fact on the surface the timeline correlates Britain’s supposed decrease with the 9/11 security measures quite nicely thank you very much. Those security measures in your diminutive nanny-state with it’s sea-locked borders could easily explain the decline in overall crime, as opposed to the much larger U.S with it’s more diverse population, unsecured borders, and daily onslaught of illegal immigrants including South American drug cartels flooding the nation (due mainly to the liberal-progressive socialist open-border policies that dominate here).

But did overall crime really diminish in the Britain due to gun control?

Well let’s see if the declining murder rate is really attributed to gun control or uhm… something else; Like an increase in violent crime survival rates, shall we?

The declining murder rate has been attributed to a combination of successful crime prevention work and the response of paramedics and other medical staff treating stabbing and shooting victims.

In the past, the role of paramedics was to collect the victim and transport them straight to hospital.

But they are now trained to deal with injuries at the scene and begin treatment as soon as they reach the victim’s side.

Where previously victims would be taken to the nearest casualty ward as a matter of course, they can now be taken to major trauma centers where expert clinicians treat patients around the clock, boosting their survival rate.

London’s air ambulance is also able to transport victims to hospital speedily and blood transfusions can now be performed by medics at the crime scene.

And what do those crime prevention measures mainly consist of?

Let’s look at London:

The number of police on the capital’s streets will have risen from 31,398 in 2008 to 32,320 by the end of this month while the number of special constables has risen from 2,500 to 5,000 - a figure Mr Johnson hopes to double if re-elected next month when Londoners go to the polls to choose their mayor.

So Britain is spending an exorbitant amount of tax dollars on police in their “police state” and they’ve improved their overall emergency medical response treatment at the scene and they’ve decreased transportation travel times by air,

but at what overall expense to the nation?


Britain’s Army Will Be Slashed To Smallest Size Since Napoleonic Wars, Experts Warn

Oh, and Britain’s overall healthcare system is a miserable failure thanks to the cost-control measures that end up prioritizing people’s right to life by the Draconian determinants of age, survivability, and mostly … financial status:

“More than 30 years after founding the NHS, an official task force discovered little evidence that it had equalized healthcare access across the board. Another study done 20 years later concluded that “access had become even more unequal in the years between the two studies. High profile patients enjoy more frequent services, shorter wait times and greater choices of specialists.” National Review Online, Socialized Failure.”

Oh but wait! Now that we’ve filtered out murder survivals, and an increased police presence, let us now take a look at the overall violent crime rates in Britain shall we?

The Most Violent Country In Europe: Britain Is Also Worse Than South Africa And U.S.

"Official crime figures show the UK also has a worse rate for all types of violence than the U.S. and even South Africa - widely considered one of the world’s most dangerous countries.

But it is the naming of Britain as the most violent country in the EU that is most shocking. The analysis is based on the number of crimes per 100,000 residents.

In the UK, there are 2,034 offences per 100,000 people, way ahead of second-placed Austria with a rate of 1,677.

The U.S. has a violence rate of 466 crimes per 100,000 residents, Canada 935, Australia 92 and South Africa 1,609

So yes, let’s talk about disingenuous commentators who often give partial facts, shall we?

 

[Cor_Cordis]

It’s up to Americans what they do about their guns and the European and US mindset will never be as one on this issue. Even in those European countries with slightly higher gun ownership there is no concept that guns would be used for defensive purposes which is the most common justification that one sees on this forum.

That’s blatantly false:

Switzerland relies on private gun ownership as their primary means of national defense. And Switzerland has one of the highest gun ownership rates in the world with 45.7 guns per 100 residents (ranking ahead of the U.S. Serbia, and Yemen).

As for gun-related crime in general, a 2001 BBC article reported that in Switzerland “the gun crime rate is so low that statistics are not even kept.”

 

[Cor_Cordis]

It’s up to Americans what they do about their guns and** the European and US mindset will never be as one on this issue**. Even in those European countries with slightly higher gun ownership there is no concept that guns would be used for defensive purposes which is the most common justification that one sees on this forum.

Yes. And thank God for that.

As to date: Unlike Europe, America has never lived under the crushing class-system of an Imperial Crown, or instituted a Theocratic “Church Of England” or produced tyrannical dictators like a Napoleon or the socialist monsters in Mussolini, Hitler, or Stalin.

The most souls America ever lost was when she fought a horrendous Civil War and spilled the blood of brothers solely in the name of Equal Rights For All. And that war of human equality raged as Britain steadily supplied arms and slave trade assistance to the defiant slave holders of the Confederate South.

But after two World Wars America has yet to acquire the battle-won lands of her enemies in an Imperialistic hunger to expand her Empire. In fact, America has been unique in her long established pattern of assisting her enemies in rebuilding their war-torn countries into free Democracies of human accomplishment and a common good for all, thank you very much.

We yanks leave the particular little nightmare of Imperial dominance to the Europeans with their bloody history of Imperial Wars, gulags, and concentration camps. We simply clean up the mess after Europe soils their continent and lectures the rest of us over their high ideals of socialist failures.

So most of us colonists will keep our guns, and our Bibles, and our unquenchable thirst for human freedom, along with our insatiable desire for religious liberty. After all, we common folk have always understood that the unalienable Rights that make us all equal and free come exclusively from the Creator and that the Creator is manifest most Uncommonly and most profoundly in the Common Goodness of the Common Man and not by kings and tyrants who deem themselves gods nor by the current crop of political-elite-socialist-tyrants who fancy themselves the kings of all kings and the gods of all the small gods.

Now, praise God and pass the ammo.

 

[liturgyluver]

What could have happened after 2000 to cause a decrease?

Well for starters 9/11 happened. In fact on the surface the timeline correlates Britain’s supposed decrease with the 9/11 security measures quite nicely thank you very much. Those security measures in your diminutive nanny-state with it’s sea-locked borders could easily explain the decline in overall crime, as opposed to the much larger U.S with it’s more diverse population, unsecured borders, and daily onslaught of illegal immigrants including South American drug cartels flooding the nation (due mainly to the liberal-progressive socialist open-border policies that dominate here).

But did overall crime really diminish in the Britain due to gun control?

Well let’s see if the declining murder rate is really attributed to gun control or uhm… something else; Like an increase in violent crime survival rates, shall we?

And what do those crime prevention measures mainly consist of?

Let’s look at London:

So Britain is spending an exorbitant amount of tax dollars on police in their “police state” and they’ve improved their overall emergency medical response treatment at the scene and they’ve decreased transportation travel times by air,

but at what overall expense to the nation?


Britain’s Army Will Be Slashed To Smallest Size Since Napoleonic Wars, Experts Warn

Oh, and Britain’s overall healthcare system is a miserable failure thanks to the cost-control measures that end up prioritizing people’s right to life by the Draconian determinants of age, survivability, and mostly … financial status:

Oh but wait! Now that we’ve filtered out murder survivals, and an increased police presence, let us now take a look at the overall violent crime rates in Britain shall we?

So yes, let’s talk about disingenuous commentators who often give partial facts, shall we?

Ah the oft-quoted argument of Americans about unsecured borders, illegal immigrants, Mexicans…any excuse except taking responsibility for their OWN homicide rates that are literally off the scale in the western world.

And of course the telegraph article that gun rights advocates love to quote. Pity that it is out of date and quotes innacurate data - if you bother to look at the statistics linked to the report you will see that of the five indicators rape and assault and homicide were actually lower in the UK than in the US. And what about the other European countries that also have low gun ownership and low crime levels.

And I see the predictable attack on the NHS, even though healthcare in the UK was rated by the WHO as 19th in the world wheras the US is at a platry 38 despite spending more on healthcare as a percentage of GDP than anyone else in the world

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Health_Organization_ranking_of_health_systems

telegraph.co.uk/health/healthnews/8877412/NHS-among-best-health-care-systems-in-the-world.html

And the number of police has actually been cut:
standard.co.uk/news/london/police-numbers-drop-by-900-in-just-six-months-8441250.html

So please stick your scrutiny to the US, and its relentless cycle of death - and when you feel safe enough not to own a gun becaue you don’t fear your fellow citizens or your government - perhaps then you can come back and lecture us Europeans.

 

[liturgyluver]

That’s blatantly false:

Switzerland relies on private gun ownership as their primary means of national defense. And Switzerland has one of the highest gun ownership rates in the world with 45.7 guns per 100 residents (ranking ahead of the U.S. Serbia, and Yemen).

As for gun-related crime in general, a 2001 BBC article reported that in Switzerland “the gun crime rate is so low that statistics are not even kept.”

People in Switzerland do not talk about using guns to protect themselves from their neighbours or from criminals in the way that Americans do. The murder rate by guns in Switzerland is the highest in Western Europe but their overall murder rate is low.

 

[liturgyluver]

Yes. And thank God for that.

As to date: Unlike Europe, America has never lived under the crushing class-system of an Imperial Crown, or instituted a Theocratic “Church Of England” or produced tyrannical dictators like a Napoleon or the socialist monsters in Mussolini, Hitler, or Stalin.

The most souls America ever lost was when she fought a horrendous Civil War and spilled the blood of brothers solely in the name of Equal Rights For All. And that war of human equality raged as Britain steadily supplied arms and slave trade assistance to the defiant slave holders of the Confederate South.

But after two World Wars America has yet to acquire the battle-won lands of her enemies in an Imperialistic hunger to expand her Empire. In fact, America has been unique in her long established pattern of assisting her enemies in rebuilding their war-torn countries into free Democracies of human accomplishment and a common good for all, thank you very much.

We yanks leave the particular little nightmare of Imperial dominance to the Europeans with their bloody history of Imperial Wars, gulags, and concentration camps. We simply clean up the mess after Europe soils their continent and lectures the rest of us over their high ideals of socialist failures.

So most of us colonists will keep our guns, and our Bibles, and our unquenchable thirst for human freedom, along with our insatiable desire for religious liberty. After all, we common folk have always understood that the unalienable Rights that make us all equal and free come exclusively from the Creator and that the Creator is manifest most Uncommonly and most profoundly in the Common Goodness of the Common Man and not by kings and tyrants who deem themselves gods nor by the current crop of political-elite-socialist-tyrants who fancy themselves the kings of all kings and the gods of all the small gods.

Now, praise God and pass the ammo.

I suppose your desire for world peace must be the reason for you having military bases across the world. Keep your guns and your bibles and your delusional perception of your “freedom” - quite frankly none of us buy it, and wish you would keep your debased culture to yourselves.

 

[Walcot]

That’s blatantly false:

Switzerland relies on private gun ownership as their primary means of national defense. And Switzerland has one of the highest gun ownership rates in the world with 45.7 guns per 100 residents (ranking ahead of the U.S. Serbia, and Yemen).

As for gun-related crime in general, a 2001 BBC article reported that in Switzerland “the gun crime rate is so low that statistics are not even kept.”

All healthy Swiss men aged between 18 and 34 are required to do military service and are expected to keep the weapons they are issued with at home. So that explains that.

 

[Cor_Cordis]

Ah the oft-quoted argument of Americans about unsecured borders, illegal immigrants, Mexicans…any excuse except taking responsibility for their OWN homicide rates that are literally off the scale in the western world.

And you’ve cited nothing that counters those relevant factors.

And of course the telegraph article that gun rights advocates love to quote. Pity that it is out of date and quotes innacurate data - if you bother to look at the statistics linked to the report you will see that of the five indicators rape and assault and homicide were actually lower in the UK than in the US. And what about the other European countries that also have low gun ownership and low crime levels.

This wasn’t the Telegraph, it was the Daily Mail: The most violent country in Europe: Britain is also worse than South Africa and U.S.

From the article:

The UK has the second highest overall crime rate in the EU.

It has a higher homicide rate than most of our western European neighbours, including

France, Germany, Italy and Spain.

The UK has the fifth highest robbery rate in the EU.

It has the fourth highest burglary rate and the highest absolute number of burglaries in the EU, with double the number of offences than recorded in Germany and France.

But it is the naming of Britain as the most violent country in the EU that is most shocking. The analysis is based on the number of crimes per 100,000 residents.

**In the UK, there are 2,034 offences per 100,000 people, way ahead of second-placed Austria with a rate of 1,677.

The U.S. has a violence rate of 466 crimes per 100,000 residents, Canada 935, Australia 92 and South Africa 1,609. **

And I see the predictable attack on the NHS, even though healthcare in the UK was rated by the WHO as 19th in the world wheras the US is at a platry 38 despite spending more on healthcare as a percentage of GDP than anyone else in the world

Really?

Let’s look closer, shall we?

This WHO ranking is curious because the actual life expectancy of the average American differs very little from that of the average European. At birth, average life expectancy in the European Union is 78.7. For the average American it is 78. And this doesn’t adjust for factors that can affect the averages which are unrelated to health care, such as lifestyle choices, accident rates, crime rates, and immigration. Health isn’t entirely about longevity but it certainly is a major component.

What is not mentioned by Moore, or others citing the WHO report, are the measures being used to rate the various countries and who is doing the measuring. There are many ways to nudge ratings in one direction or another that are not directly related to the actual item being measured.

And:


Ten reasons why America’s health care system is in better condition than you might suppose

1. Americans have better survival rates than Europeans for common cancers. Breast cancer mortality is 52 percent higher in Germany than in the United States and 88 percent higher in the United Kingdom. Prostate cancer mortality is 604 percent higher in the United Kingdom and 457 percent higher in Norway. The mortality rate for colorectal cancer among British men and women is about 40 percent higher.

6.** Americans spend less time waiting for care than patients in Canada and the United Kingdom.** Canadian and British patients wait about twice as long—sometimes more than a year—to see a specialist, have elective surgery such as hip replacements, or get radiation treatment for cancer. All told, 827,429 people are waiting for some type of procedure in Canada. In Britain, nearly 1.8 million people are waiting for a hospital admission or outpatient treatment.

1. People in countries with more government control of health care are highly dissatisfied and believe reform is needed.** More than 70 percent of German, Canadian, Australian, New Zealand, and British adults say their health system needs either “fundamental change” or “complete rebuilding.”**

So please stick your scrutiny to the US, and its relentless cycle of death - and when you feel safe enough not to own a gun becaue you don’t fear your fellow citizens or your government - perhaps then you can come back and lecture us Europeans.

Point of fact, it was you European’s in here who originally scrutinized the U.S.

So please, try to refrain from casting any more stones from your socialist glass-house.

 

[Cor_Cordis]

And the number of police has actually been cut:
standard.co.uk/news/london/police-numbers-drop-by-900-in-just-six-months-8441250.html

uhm, those cuts happened recently. So they hardly co-align with the overall timeline of your crime/gun stats. But even after the cuts, numbers are still higher than they were 5 years ago. And the authorities are worried about the cuts:

She added: “Home Secretary Theresa May and the Mayor of London have cut 1,700 police officers from the Met since the May 2010 election. Despite all the promises they have made, the front line has been heavily hit and Londoners are being expected to pay the price.

“Ms May needs to urgently change course and rethink the scale of next years cuts before it is too late.”

Boris Johnson’s aides admitted that police numbers had fallen but insisted they were still above the level he inherited five years ago of 30,659 warranted officers.

 

[Cor_Cordis]

People in Switzerland do not talk about using guns to protect themselves from their neighbours or from criminals in the way that Americans do. The murder rate by guns in Switzerland is the highest in Western Europe but their overall murder rate is low.

They don’t have to mention the fact that they use their guns for personal protection, because it’s already understood in their society.

Oh and, about those murder rates by guns:

Swiss Gun Murders Lower Than Reported

Whenever international comparisons of homicide rates are studied, it is mandatory to consider Switzerland. Not only does Switzerland have very low homicide rates, it has one of the highest levels of gun ownership in the world.

As I attempted to find out what the gun homicide rate for Switzerland was,** I ran into a curious phenomena. The most commonly quoted figures for gun homicides were for both gun homicides and attempted gun homicides.** In one source, this led to the startling conclusion that gun homicides for a given year were greater than total homicides. At the site gunpolicy.org, the total homicides for 2009 are listed as 51. The total gun homicides are listed as 55.

Though a little research, I found that what most writers are seeing is the composite figure for both attempted and fatal gun homicides. As the attempted gun homicides outnumber the fatal gun homicides, this has a large impact on the number of total gun homicides claimed and on the rate of firearm homicides claimed in Switzerland.

They are lower than the rates of Australia and Canada, both of which have much more restrictive gun control schemes. They are slightly higher than France and Sweden, though the overall homicide rate (after all this is the more important number) is slightly higher in those countries, again, with much more restrictive gun control.

 

[Cor_Cordis]

I suppose your desire for world peace must be the reason for you having military bases across the world. Keep your guns and your bibles and your delusional perception of your “freedom” - quite frankly none of us buy it, and wish you would keep your debased culture to yourselves.

It’s precisely those U.S. military bases around the world that’s protected you and the rest of Europe since WWII. And it’s precisely why Britain and the rest of Europe doesn’t spend much on their Armed Forces. Because the U.S. IS their military.

Who do you think protected Western Europe from the Soviets during the cold war? The Europeans? LOL:extrahappy:

 

[Cor_Cordis]

All healthy Swiss men aged between 18 and 34 are required to do military service and are expected to keep the weapons they are issued with at home. So that explains that.

Yes. I know.

 

[Walcot]

Yes. And thank God for that.

As to date: Unlike Europe, America has never lived under the crushing class-system of an Imperial Crown, or instituted a Theocratic “Church Of England” or produced tyrannical dictators like a Napoleon or the socialist monsters in Mussolini, Hitler, or Stalin.

The most souls America ever lost was when she fought a horrendous Civil War and spilled the blood of brothers solely in the name of Equal Rights For All. And that war of human equality raged as Britain steadily supplied arms and slave trade assistance to the defiant slave holders of the Confederate South.

But after two World Wars America has yet to acquire the battle-won lands of her enemies in an Imperialistic hunger to expand her Empire. In fact, America has been unique in her long established pattern of assisting her enemies in rebuilding their war-torn countries into free Democracies of human accomplishment and a common good for all, thank you very much.

We yanks leave the particular little nightmare of Imperial dominance to the Europeans with their bloody history of Imperial Wars, gulags, and concentration camps. We simply clean up the mess after Europe soils their continent and lectures the rest of us over their high ideals of socialist failures.

So most of us colonists will keep our guns, and our Bibles, and our unquenchable thirst for human freedom, along with our insatiable desire for religious liberty. After all, we common folk have always understood that the unalienable Rights that make us all equal and free come exclusively from the Creator and that the Creator is manifest most Uncommonly and most profoundly in the Common Goodness of the Common Man and not by kings and tyrants who deem themselves gods nor by the current crop of political-elite-socialist-tyrants who fancy themselves the kings of all kings and the gods of all the small gods.

Now, praise God and pass the ammo.

1 You haven’t lived under an imperial crown or an institution like a theocratic Church of England etc etc because you’re such a young country. We in UK haven’t lived under them either for a very long time.
I really wouldn’t describe Mr Cameron as an elite-socialist-tyrant who fancies himself as a king or a god. Oh and our queen is a very nice lady and very much respected in England, and even a bit in Wales Scotland and N Ireland. Apart from Irish Republicans but that’s another story. Incidentally, IRA terrorist funding from America (not from government) dried up after 2001 when Americans realised what terrorism was really all about.
2 Are you implying that the American civil war was all about giving equal rights to slaves?
3 Does your religious liberty extend to American Muslims and other religions too?
4’ Praise God and pass the ammo’…Hmm…Are you going to tell us that you think this something that Jesus would have said??? Blessed are the peacemakers eh?

 

[Cor_Cordis]

Crime stats: Switzerland vs United Kingdom

Switzerland 18.2% Ranked 18th

Britain 26.4% Ranked 3rd (45% more than Switzerland)

 

[Cor_Cordis]

1 You haven’t lived under an imperial crown or an institution like a theocratic Church of England etc etc because you’re such a young country. We in UK haven’t lived under them either for a very long time.

Our country was specifically born out of Revolution against the British Crown. And we have an inherent understanding of the innate nature of personal freedom. And unlike most of Europe, we never depended upon the nanny-state to provide our personal success.

Or at least we didn’t before the socialists took over.

 

[Cor_Cordis]

12 Are you implying that the American civil war was all about giving equal rights to slaves?

Are you suggesting that that wasn’t the primary point of the conflict?

3 Does your religious liberty extend to American Muslims and other religions too?

Well let’s see, the HHS Mandate dictated by ObamaCare specifically targeted the Roman Catholic Church in America by forcing the Church to violate her timeless moral doctrines.

And all traditional Christian Churches (Especially the Catholic Church) have been attacked with legislature that has allowed same-sex marriage advocates to file an array of lawsuits against them. In fact, in my state and several others, the Catholic Church was forced out of the adoption business by state legislation. Because the Church refused to adopt children to same-sex couples.

Oh and… no such legislative action has been taken against the Islamic faith in this country. Funny that.

4’ Praise God and pass the ammo’…Hmm…Are you going to tell us that you think this something that Jesus would have said??? Blessed are the peacemakers eh?

St. Thomas Aquinas said, true Christian love of others means to “love the other as other”.

And to that end, how exactly does one keep the peace and protect his neighbors and loved ones from those who would do them harm, especially when seconds count and the police are minutes away - at best?

Allow me to quote an incomparably great Catholic Englishman on the topic of ‘peace makers’:

"The true soldier fights not because he hates what is in front of him, but because he loves what is behind him." - G.K.Chesterton