I don't feel like like I'm welcome in the Catholic community

[ConfusedLucy]

Therapy can’t change a situation so I don’t blame you for not wanting to spend money on it. I’ve seen it with several people I know in bad situations, talking therapy just made them feel worse and when they got out of the bad situation they recovered very quickly.

I really hope you can hold it together for now. Do you have a long term plan?

 

[DarkLight]

Yes, but my long-term plan relies on me being able to get another job. There just isn’t a way for me to support myself on the job I have. The pay by itself isn’t bad, but the insurance is absolutely terrible. That’s what’s killing me. If I’m spending 6 or 7 thousand a year on medical bills between deductibles and copays, that’s going to pretty effectively kill my ability to support myself. But it makes it almost impossible to get assistance because the vast majority of programs look at AGI and not total expenses.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

DarkLight, do you perhaps have social media friends or can you set up such a network? I have to say that some hobby forums and Livejournal/Facebook greatly expanded my friend circle. Although most of what I post these days is benign (cat memes, etc), we have all used it from time to time to share when we needed support. This has included everything from people in caregiving situations with elderly parents, people dealing with losing loved ones to cancer, heroin or suicide, and people who are having difficulty finding a job or health care or relationship. It’s like an extended family. We may only see each other in person once or twice a year, but I know I can find understanding and caring people in my online circle if I need them, and I’m happy to “be there” for them as well.

 

[DarkLight]

Glad to know I’m not alone, I suppose.

I think a good bit of the frustration is that I really am in a bad situation with my mother. The unfortunate truth is it takes 2 to make a relationship work and 1 to ruin it. Unfortunately I seem to be in a situation where any expression of dissatisfaction or any push towards having boundaries for myself is met with threats of being kicked out (and on multiple occasions actually being kicked out for the night). Or simply ignored.

Their official line is that I’m only expected to be respectful. Unfortunately it’s become clear that all disagreement is considered disrespect, no matter the approach. There are a lot of other issues as well, but that seems to be the overarching problem. When any attempt to work things out is met with indignation and threats, nothing can be resolved.

It frustrates me, and it frustrates me more when I get treated like I’m insufficiently grateful for being frustrated and upset by this. It’s not even being treated like a child, because frankly a child shouldn’t be treated like that either.

 

[christofirst]

all disagreement is considered disrespect,

I’m 55 and my mom’s 91. While I don’t live with her, I do spend several hours or more every day at her house making sure she’s well and doing those things she can no longer do. What you said about disagreement being taken for disrespect doesn’t change no matter how old some parents get. My mom, God bless her, has always been a master emotional manipulator, often playing me and my siblings against each other, in order to make things go the way she intends. I have to keep reminding myself she’s older and weaker now, even though she can still press my buttons as well as ever.

My son lived with me until he was in his early 30s, and I thought that was fine, considering the difficult job market thanks to the Great Recession of 2008 and the very high cost of living around here. He’s out on his own now and doing well, but if he was ever down on his luck and in need I would gladly welcome him back.

 

[Xanthippe_Voorhees]

Glad to know I’m not alone, I suppose.

I think a good bit of the frustration is that I really am in a bad situation with my mother. The unfortunate truth is it takes 2 to make a relationship work and 1 to ruin it. Unfortunately I seem to be in a situation where any expression of dissatisfaction or any push towards having boundaries for myself is met with threats of being kicked out (and on multiple occasions actually being kicked out for the night). Or simply ignored.

Their official line is that I’m only expected to be respectful. Unfortunately it’s become clear that all disagreement is considered disrespect, no matter the approach. There are a lot of other issues as well, but that seems to be the overarching problem. When any attempt to work things out is met with indignation and threats, nothing can be resolved.

It frustrates me, and it frustrates me more when I get treated like I’m insufficiently grateful for being frustrated and upset by this. It’s not even being treated like a child, because frankly a child shouldn’t be treated like that either.

Perhaps getting to know some older people might help because someone might have a room to rent.

Therapy will always be frustrating like you’ve mentioned until you can get in a place to heal. That can’t begin until you’re out of the house.

Really, nothing in your life can be solved until that happens.

Unfortunately, there’s not much that can be done in your circumstance. Nothing anyone tells you about how bad your parents are behaving is going to change their behavior. If professionals lack words, so will laity.

That said, the lack of support to both young families and “older than college” young adults is abysmal. There is no excuse for it. It seems one does not matter from early 20’s until one has children old enough for CCD. That feeling seems pretty universal around these parts.

 

[ConfusedLucy]

Doing someone a favour doesn’t give them a license to then treat that person badly. If there is anyone in your life telling you that you should be ok with your mothers treatment of you because you are lucky to live in her house they need to be tuned out.

Also tune out anyone who tells you if you really wanted to move out you would “make it happen”.

Praying that you hold it together and that you will eventually find the right job to apply for.

 

[Spyridon]

It seems to me you’re applying political issues to the Church.

The Church is your spiritual Mother, not your political micromanager.

 

[TheLittleLady]

Scripture says “bear one another’s burdens and fulfil the law of Christ”.

We are commanded to give support to our brothers and sisters. This idea of the Church as a “Sacramental ATM” where you drive thru and then go about your real life is a sad, sad, deformity to the body of Christ.

As a disabled person who has had financial and job issues, who is now caring for a disabled spouse, I can relate to the crushing burden. I’m always in a state of awareness, just waiting for someone to be all judgy because I DARE spend $10 on some cosmetics when we have tens of thousands in unpaid medical bills.

Well meaning people who say “well, just get a second job” and you want to say “wow, I never THOUGHT of that!”

Sometimes I know that I am projecting my own insecurities onto others without giving them a chance. In general, in real life, people are not as harsh or condemning or “suck it up buttercup” as they are on the internet.

I’ve found that the most compassionate, supportive, loving people in the parish are those who are drawn to the ministries that are seen by politically minded people as “liberal”. Look to the people who man the food pantry, who organize the Angel Tree or Thanksgiving Food Baskets. This might be the time of year when you can volunteer to help them out and meet some real live Catholics with skin on.

Seriously, I am shocked by the Catholics here who say that the parish should not be a place of refuge and support.

 

[TheLittleLady]

I don’t need therapy to recover half as much as I need to hold myself in one piece long enough to get out.

As I put it, I just need to be able to surface and take a breath, then I can go back to fighting the crashing waves

 

[christofirst]

I think many people in a typical parish like mine are also just trying to keep their heads above water. They may look happy and successful, but many are likely struggling with their own health issues, family dysfunctions, addictions and the stress of life, just like the rest of us. Parishioners might initially seem stand-offish when they feel like they don’t have much more to give, but once you get you to know them, many will let their guard down. That’s why finding some way to spend time with others, like volunteering or joining the prayer group, is a good suggestion, if possible.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

It’s one thing to offer a kind word of encouragement, prayers, or even advice you might think is helpful (but is often not taken well) to a fellow parishioner.

It’s another thing when people, and I’m not referring to anyone on this thread but I have seen it elsewhere, just show up at church expecting everyone to pity and “support” them in exactly the way they want to be supported, such as no remarks they don’t want to hear, no “tough love”, just give me what I want.

People at church come from a variety of backgrounds. I may be able to relate very well to someone who had an experience I shared such as caring for an elderly parent who wasn’t always in great shape or a good mood. I may not be able to relate equally well to the single mom with 3 small kids, or the recovering addict. It doesn’t mean these people are bad, it just means I’m not so good at supporting them. If I mess up and say the wrong thing, or are less than forthcoming because perhaps I am focused on a problem I’m having myself or within my own family or friend circle, it comes back on the Church.

We are not allowed to say that we think someone should or could do something more, or something different, to help themselves because it gets taken wrong and it comes back on the Church. The Church let me down! So and so is not acting like a member of the Church should act! Etc.

When seeking sympathy or support or wherever, you have to keep in mind that not everybody is capable of offering the exact kind of support, help, remarks etc you need or want. Some may even think that giving you what you want is not the healthy or productive thing to do. Those involved in activities like St Vincent de Paul struggle with this all the time.

If it’s a listening ear that won’t say the “wrong” thing you’re after, as when people are temporarily stuck in a bad situation like the OP, that is why I would suggest social media or some kind of targeted group that tends to select people on the same page with the OP’s experiences. Not everyone in a large general church population is going to fit in that group, and they shouldn’t have to. Maybe their gift fits in with some totally different situation. Maybe all they can offer is their prayers. That should be okay.

 

[DarkLight]

I am not really sure what politics you are referencing here.

For people like me, the Church is the only real chance at a loving, supportive family that we get. I’m not asking for someone to fix things for me, just for a place where I can have the struggles I’m having without biting my tongue and holding back tears on a regular basis. For someone like me…the family is not safe, church is not safe…where will be when the burden is too much? I certainly don’t have friends that aren’t hundreds of miles away.

 

[DarkLight]

When it comes down to it…“targeted” groups don’t always exist like that, and many of us don’t really seem the same benefit from social media. (Or in my case, going to a targeted group IRL would be flat-out impossible while I still live there.) I know not everyone will know what to say, but I’d like to at least not feel constantly prejudged by those who don’t know the situation. I think that’s often the objection to advice - that people offer “advice” that in fact assumes the person is doing something wrong, and it is based on unwarranted negative assumptions about them.

I joked a little about “how to get along with her better” advice upthread, but that really isn’t the kind that bothers me. It’s more stuff like “well if it was really that bad you would find something, since you haven’t found a better job it must not be that serious” or “well she’s providing for you and not abusing you, so it’s just ungrateful and entitled of you to say anything bad about her.” It’s stuff like that where it seems rather that by being in the position I am, it’s not actually possible for me to be undergoing the pain I am.

 

[michaelArc]

In many ways I feel the way you do. I’ve had thoughts about leaving the church and joining another denomination because I feel like an outsider and just wanted some kind of fellowship.

Speaking to my priest is aggravating. I’ve had to constantly remind him about something I needed from him in the past, but he either forgets or purposely neglects. So I don’t even mention it anymore to him in passing. Sigh.

Whenever I enter the church, I just try to remind myself why I’m there. I’m going not going for anyone but for God. I’m there to speak to him.

One suggestion I have is try doing some volunteer work. Even once a week for a few hours at a soup kitchen or something of the like. This could go a long way in alleviating some of these feelings.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

I know not everyone will know what to say, but I’d like to at least not feel constantly prejudged by those who don’t know the situation.

Your post serves as a good reminder to those of us who read here not to judge people and to just listen when we can. That’s a good thing.

However, what you are saying about other people’s reactions is not a problem with the Catholic Church or church people. It’s an issue with humanity in general. You can’t always get what you want, and that includes the desired response from other people. I saw my family members go through this and I’ve experienced some of it myself.

You’ve posted about this situation several times on here that you’re having with your health, job and family. I realize that not every suggestion made by somebody here is going to help you, but it seems that whatever people suggest, you usually respond that it won’t work. If that’s truly the case, then there is not much anyone can say or do except just tell you to keep on plugging until you get out of the bad situation. As for you saying you don’t get a benefit from social media, you’re kind of using this board as social media in discussing your situation and venting here. I don’t mean this in a critical way, I’m just giving you maybe a different perspective to see what you’re putting forth.

 

[DarkLight]

A better way to put it would be that I do get some benefit from social media, but it’s not the same benefit as someone in real life.

I’ve looked through a lot of ideas. You’re right about not finding much to help. What I’m trying to say is that I’m not really looking to have someone solve things right now. I would be overjoyed to have someone who would sit with me and say a prayer with me. Heck, I would gladly accept somewhere I could cry without being afraid to be seen or worried about coming up with some suitable excuse.

I know what I need to do, but that doesn’t mean it doesn’t hurt. At this point I’m honestly thinking a lot of my medical issues are actually getting worse because of the amount of stress I’m trying to bear alone. It often feels rather like sawing off your own leg to get out of a trap while being told you’re absolutely not allowed to make any sound or you’ll lose the saw.

Yes, the church community has the same issues as humanity in general. But the church is something to me that humanity as a whole is not. I would take comments in that spirit - as someone who loves the Church in a special way and wants to partake in her community specifically.

 

[Xanthippe_Voorhees]

as. You’re right about not finding much to help. What I’m trying to say is that I’m not really looking to have someone solve things right now. I would be overjoyed to have someone who would sit with me and say a prayer with me. Heck, I would gladly accept somewhere I could cry without being afraid to be seen or worried about coming up with some suitable excuse.

I know what I need to do, but that doesn’t mean it doesn’t hurt. At this point I’m honestly thinking a lot of my medical issues are actually getting worse because of the amount of stress I’m trying to bear alone. It often feels rather like sawing off your own leg to get out of a trap while being told you’re absolutely not allowed to make any sound or you’ll lose the saw.

Yes, the church community has the same issues as humanity in general. But the church is something to me that humanity as a whole is not. I would take comments in that spirit - as someone who loves the Church in a special way and wants to partake in her community specifically.

I go to a nice Charsmatic prayer group. They aren’t about meeting needs, just about praying. We sing some songs, Father gives a teaching, some offer their reflection, we pray a bit, then sing for the close. Anyone wanting more prayer can stay to be prayed with.

it might be a case of “finding your people”

I know you work nights, so it can be hard…but even going to a quilting or knitting group or bible study might give you the sense of community you are looking for. Where the focus is not your issues but something else.

 

[Gertabelle]

Going way back to your first post, you mentioned light chit-chat over coffee.

That is exactly the place to begin forming relationships! If you aren’t able to participate in regular ministry where you meet and get to know others (e.g., music, religious ed, food pantry), then just hanging out and talking with people is a great way to begin building friendships.

Find some young family to sit with and listen to their stories and concerns – the ones expressed, and the ones implied. Be the listener that you yourself need, though not projecting your experiences onto them of course.

Find some older folks to sit with and chat about your life and hear about theirs. As a single person at the coffee and donuts (my son’s never there the rare times I go), I’m surprised at how welcoming the seniors are to my joining them. They’re very sweet, and they can certainly understand physical difficulties and financial burdens.

Of course, don’t wait for someone to join you. Be proactive and ask people if you can join them.

Pray that God sends you the community you need, and the people who need YOU. I’ll pray with and for you as well.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

What I’m trying to say is that I’m not really looking to have someone solve things right now. I would be overjoyed to have someone who would sit with me and say a prayer with me. Heck, I would gladly accept somewhere I could cry without being afraid to be seen or worried about coming up with some suitable excuse.

I feel for you. What you wrote here sounds so much like what my own mother said so many times. I was different from her in that I’m the kind of person who, when faced with a problem, wants to solve it and then on to the next thing. All my careers have been problem-solving of one type or another. It took a long time before I could begin to understand or have patience with my mom, who I loved, but she just frustrated me so much because we couldn’t always just solve her problem. Sometimes she just wanted to sit and cry, as you said.

Maybe the churches need a cry room for grownups. I’d use it too sometimes.

I’ll pray for you. I hope things get better for you. Pax Christi