I left Mass as one angry Catholic today...

[Student09]

This LifeTeen junk needs to stop. It is disrespectful to the Mass, IMO. Should I contact the pastor about this?

No.

 

[PatriceA]

OP, how traditional is your parish in the other masses on a Sunday?

I’ve been to horrible LifeTeen masses and I’ve been to ones that I just loved. The worst offenders were in the parishes that had many liturgical abuses I came to find out later. A LifeTeen mass is only going to be as good as the people in charge of the program. I wouldn’t say the program itself is bad, when its done correctly its a mass I would gladly attend again.

 

[benedictgal]

They didn’t sing the Doxology. Only the priest did.

Thanks for clarifying that. As for talking to the pastor, you have every right to address this issue. According to Redemptionis Sacramentum:

11.] The Mystery of the Eucharist “is too great for anyone to permit himself to treat it according to his own whim, so that its sacredness and its universal ordering would be obscured”.27 On the contrary, anyone who acts thus by giving free rein to his own inclinations, even if he is a Priest, injures the substantial unity of the Roman Rite, which ought to be vigorously preserved,28 and becomes responsible for actions that are in no way consistent with the hunger and thirst for the living God that is experienced by the people today. Nor do such actions serve authentic pastoral care or proper liturgical renewal; instead, they deprive Christ’s faithful of their patrimony and their heritage. For arbitrary actions are not conducive to true renewal,29 but are detrimental to the right of Christ’s faithful to a liturgical celebration that is an expression of the Church’s life in accordance with her tradition and discipline. In the end, they introduce elements of distortion and disharmony into the very celebration of the Eucharist, which is oriented in its own lofty way and by its very nature to signifying and wondrously bringing about the communion of divine life and the unity of the People of God.30 The result is uncertainty in matters of doctrine, perplexity and scandal on the part of the People of God, and, almost as a necessary consequence, vigorous opposition, all of which greatly confuse and sadden many of Christ’s faithful in this age of ours when Christian life is often particularly difficult on account of the inroads of “secularization” as well.31

[12.] On the contrary, it is the right of all of Christ’s faithful that the Liturgy, and in particular the celebration of Holy Mass, should truly be as the Church wishes, according to her stipulations as prescribed in the liturgical books and in the other laws and norms. Likewise, the Catholic people have the right that the Sacrifice of the Holy Mass should be celebrated for them in an integral manner, according to the entire doctrine of the Church’s Magisterium. Finally, it is the Catholic community’s right that the celebration of the Most Holy Eucharist should be carried out for it in such a manner that it truly stands out as a sacrament of unity, to the exclusion of all blemishes and actions that might engender divisions and factions in the Church.32

The Holy Sacrifice of the Mass belongs to the Church. While there are different ecclesial movements within the Church, they do not have the right to toy with the Sacred Rites. When they do that, they cause confusion among the faithful.

 

[Student09]

:crying::crying::banghead:

I’d write to the Bishop if I were you.

I’m thinking about it … however, I am hesitant because this is not my parish church and I don’t usually attend Mass there. I’m not sure what the rules are on that.

If I were in your position, I would not complain but would save it for something worse that may come along. In an ideal world, we would address the least liturgical abuse. However, in this world, the reality is that we often have to pick our battles.

 

[coolduude]

OP, how traditional is your parish in the other masses on a Sunday?

I’ve been to horrible LifeTeen masses and I’ve been to ones that I just loved. The worst offenders were in the parishes that had many liturgical abuses I came to find out later. A LifeTeen mass is only going to be as good as the people in charge of the program. I wouldn’t say the program itself is bad, when its done correctly its a mass I would gladly attend again.

Somewhat traditional. I mean the priest has the altar servers ‘escort’ him when he goes to the ambo to read the Gospel. They then stand on either side for the rest of the Gospel reading, all the while holding candles. I hope you get what I mean

Only bad things we do are hold hands during the Our Father and sing bad music. Otherwise, we’re pretty traditional.

Yes, I get a sense that the people leading LifeTeen at my parish are pretty out there, if you know what I mean. This only goes to reaffirm my belief that youth groups offer shaky theology…

 

[benedictgal]

I’m thinking about it … however, I am hesitant because this is not my parish church and I don’t usually attend Mass there.

Be that as it may, it is still wrong. Just becasue it is not your parish, that does not justify their ilicit practices.

 

[Student09]

Be that as it may, it is still wrong. Just becasue it is not your parish, that does not justify their ilicit practices.

I actually didn’t know if it was allowed for me to complain about a parish that was not my own. Actually, this parish is the local cathedral …

 

[HCC]

I actually didn’t know if it was allowed for me to complain about a parish that was not my own. Actually, this parish is the local cathedral …

Classic!

 

[benedictgal]

I actually didn’t know if it was allowed for me to complain about a parish that was not my own. Actually, this parish is the local cathedral …

Actually, the local cathedral should be setting the standards for proper celebration of the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass.

 

[SalesianSDB]

It was my parish’s first LifeTeen Mass. What a disaster. Heres what I remember:

• Priest used different words in the opening. He said something like “let us welcome each other” or something.
  …
• The priest said something to the LifeTeen members before dismissal and they responded

So my question, at my parish after the priest walks in he says a brief welcome maybe talk about something that has recently happened and bring God into it. Very nice man. Then before the final blessing and dismissal he gives a “vocation cup” where every week a family has it to pray for vocations and then he gives us some encouragement for the week. Is this allowed? It doesn’t really seem bad.

 

[coolduude]

So if I’m going to contact the pastor, what specific abuses occured that I can point out?

This LifeTeen stuff is so… :whacky:

 

[benedictgal]

So my question, at my parish after the priest walks in he says a brief welcome maybe talk about something that has recently happened and bring God into it. Very nice man. Then before the final blessing and dismissal he gives a “vocation cup” where every week a family has it to pray for vocations and then he gives us some encouragement for the week. Is this allowed? It doesn’t really seem bad.

After the brief introductory rites (the greeting, and by this, I don’t mean “Good morning”, but, the greeting the Church gives us “The Lord be with you”) the celebrant may briefly introduce the Mass of the day. The “Vocations cup”, since it is not part of the Mass, would be placed before the final blessing and dismissal as the Roman Missal states that brief announcements may occur at this time.

However, he cannot, on his own authority, make any changes to the parts of the Mass (with the exception of thos areas where the Roman Missal states “these or similar words.”

 

[SalesianSDB]

After the brief introductory rites (the greeting, and by this, I don’t mean “Good morning”, but, the greeting the Church gives us “The Lord be with you”) the celebrant may briefly introduce the Mass of the day. The “Vocations cup”, since it is not part of the Mass, would be placed before the final blessing and dismissal as the Roman Missal states that brief announcements may occur at this time.

However, he cannot, on his own authority, make any changes to the parts of the Mass (with the exception of thos areas where the Roman Missal states “these or similar words.”

Thanks. He doesn’t change any of the words. He’s a good paint inside the lines priest.

 

[Student09]

Actually, the local cathedral should be setting the standards for proper celebration of the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass.

They should. They don’t. They tend to cycle through priests there but there is a pattern of liturgical abuse from their priests. The last one was bad enough to complain about but he was only there for two months so it didn’t seem like much point. This one committed the worst abuses I’ve seen there, but I have never seen him before, don’t know his name or whether he will be staying. The monsignor also likes to play “fast and loose” with the liturgy although not to the extent of what I mentioned above … more minor changes … but still very irritating.

I don’t know what to do.

Cooldude, I’m sorry if I’m hijacking your thread …

 

[benedictgal]

Here is what I would list:

Priest used different words in the opening. He said something like “let us welcome each other” or something.

• When the congregation was shaking hands at the welcoming the LifeTeen choir played a verse of “All are Welcome”
• • EVERY SONG had a snare drum that was EXTREMELY loud (I believe that violates Musicam Sacram? pardon the spelling)
• When the priest kneeled at the altar after he consecrated the bread and wine the choir bowed at the waist, like Japanese people (they bowed twice).
• Instruments used by the choir were a snare drum, cymbals attached to the drum, cowbell, and piano
• The priest said something to the LifeTeen members before dismissal and they responded
• When the priest was doing the Communion Rite, he said “Jesus gave the bread to His friends and said…”. I thought it was disciples, not friends. Am I wrong?

The celebrant needs to use the text that the Church gives us, not make up stuff as he goes along.

 

[coolduude]

Here is what I would list:

The celebrant needs to use the text that the Church gives us, not make up stuff as he goes along.

Thanks BG

Do you know any documents I can use to really prove my case? You can just name them. I can do the research from there

I was thinking. Since they now have a LifeTeen Mass, I might have some leverage to get a Latin Mass started. “They got their LifeTeen Mass, why can’t I have my Latin Mass?”

 

[coolduude]

I don’t know what to do.

Cooldude, I’m sorry if I’m hijacking your thread …

Write. I would. Abuse like this should not be tolerated.

Don’t worry about 'jacking my thread. We’ve all done it at some point

 

[benedictgal]

Thanks BG

Do you know any documents I can use to really prove my case? You can just name them. I can do the research from there

I was thinking. Since they now have a LifeTeen Mass, I might have some leverage to get a Latin Mass started. “They got their LifeTeen Mass, why can’t I have my Latin Mass?”

Redemptionis Sacramentum is the best defense.

 

[SimonDodd]

Wow, I feel so sad, because when I read your post I just thought, “This doesn’t seem that bad …” I am so jaded already about liturgical abuse.

A few days ago I attended a Mass where the priest:

• skipped the Sign of the Cross at the beginning and also skipped the penitential rite completely
• said in his homily that divorce and birth control is okay, that “Catholics have a problem with guilt” and we should not go to Confession, and that everyone will go to heaven no matter what sins they commit
• changed pretty much all of the subsequent prayers except the actual words of consecration
• skipped the Agnus Dei and the “Behold the Lamb of God” completely - after the Our Father he said some totally unrecognizable phrase and then started distributing Communion

If this is right, he is not only wrong (never mind liturgical abuse, his point about confession may have crossed the line into heresy), he is leading his flock astray. You really have to do something about this. Nevertheless, I would hold off on writing to the bishop as coolduude suggested. Start local. Is there an audio recording of the homily? That would be ideal since then you have the exact words, rather than a paraphrase constructed from memory. List your objections, annotate them with the relevant provisions being violated (aside from the Catechism of Trent and the CCC, Denzinger’s Sources of Catholic Dogma may be a helpful resource), organize the material in a way that makes sense, then write to the priest and see what he says. Be careful how you write it—folks here can help if you want—but do write. Then you’ll be in a better position to involve the bishop should it be necessary.

 

[georgewithfaith]

Wow, I feel so sad, because when I read your post I just thought, “This doesn’t seem that bad …” I am so jaded already about liturgical abuse.

A few days ago I attended a Mass where the priest:

• skipped the Sign of the Cross at the beginning and also skipped the penitential rite completely
• said in his homily that divorce and birth control is okay, that “Catholics have a problem with guilt” and we should not go to Confession, and that everyone will go to heaven no matter what sins they commit
• changed pretty much all of the subsequent prayers except the actual words of consecration
• skipped the Agnus Dei and the “Behold the Lamb of God” completely - after the Our Father he said some totally unrecognizable phrase and then started distributing Communion

Please tell me that you will be reporting this priest to the Bishop. Report him and hold him to account that is unacceptable and this priest needs to understand that!