I left the Church

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Here is an idea on how to reorient yourself. For a while I suffered from mild scrupulosity. But there is a ridiculously simple cure for it. If you focus on sin, that’s all you think about. All day. Period. Sin sin sin. Everything you do is a sin. Everything everyone else does is a sin. Pretty soon, sin dominates your vision. You basically develop tunnel vision to anything that’s not sin. You become judgemental and worrisome and miserable.

Or, you can focus on the opposite. God. Pray unceasingly. Are you enrolled in the Brown Scapular? If not, get a scapular (there are places online that you can get free ones from if I’m not mistaken) and start the daily recitation of the Little Office of the Blessed Virgin Mary. If you forget a day, IT IS NOT A MORTAL SIN. Our Mother understands if you just sleep in and forget your morning prayers. Just don’t be so uptight. Instead of trying to prevent sin by identifying it constantly, focus on God. Only on God. Only on things of God. Only on His Holy Ones. You seem to be of an intellectual bent (like me), so put that gift to good use. Rather than constantly reaching inward to see how horrible you are (which you’re not horrible at all, just a tad uptight), reach out. Read apologetic works. G.K. Chesterton is a good one to start with, as is St. Augustine. Karl Keating also has some nice books, including Catholicism and Fundamentalism–the book that made me a better Catholic. Peter Kreeft’s book Fundamentals of the Faith is also very awesome.

Basically, you need to not listen to what your emotions are telling you. I’m young too, so I can tell you your emotions are going to be a pretty sorry indicator of right and wrong. Rather, try for an intellectual reception of the faith. Bombard your thought processes with good things–not bad. If you think about sin, pretty soon that’s all you think about. If you think about God, pretty soon, he’s all that’s there.

Lastly, you need to worry less about your own sufferings and more about the sufferings of those around you. This is a lesson I learned first from the Boy Scouts and the Order of the Arrow and had it elaborated by what I’ve learned from the Church. The less YOU occupy your own thoughts, the more other people do–and the more you care about other people, the more they’ll take care of you.

I hope this helps you. Please pray for strength and grace. And for heaven’s sake…calm down. 😛

Pax tecum
-ACEGC
 
Paris,

Perhaps this analogy will be beneficial (it is one that I heard as a Protestant, but it applies fully to Catholic faith, too).

Our spiritual life is like a train. The engine represents fact, the coal car represents faith, and the caboose represents emotions. (Faith, by the way is not an emotion. It is a decision to trust something you have objectively determined to be trustworthy) Because of the facts revealed in Sacred Scripture and Tradition, we place our faith in such fact. The train willl run with just the engine and the coal car—it can run with or without the caboose.

However, pulling the train with the caboose is exactly what you have been attempting to do for a very long time. If you try to pull the train with the caboose, you’ll be all over the map and you’ll be exhausted. You won’t proceed in any continuous direction. (This will continue to be true regardless of what faith you decide to join.)

The only way for you to become steady in your faith is to put fact first and let it drive your faith. Your emotions are just there along for the ride. Sometimes they will align with fact, sometimes they won’t. Either way, it doesn’t really matter. The fact that you are and should be Catholic doesn’t depend upon whether you feel zealous or desire the Eucharist. Those are just emotions. Everyone has emotional fluctuations. Some people may have wider swings than others, due to brain chemistry. But none of us can afford to define our faith by emotion.

You should be Catholic for one reason: that it is true. The truth of Catholicism is the train engine. Place your faith in that. Emotions can be pleasant or unpleasant, but they should not determine where you place your faith. Della and others are right—your fluctuations are not normal and suggest a medical problem, rather than an error on the part of the Church.

There is no shame in having a medical problem. But you need to get professional help from psychiatrist to treat it. Your faith can remain strong in spite of the wide emotional fluctuations (the train can run regardless of the caboose), but getting help will certainly improve your quality of life.

You are in my prayers.
 
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montanaman:
You know something? Now I’m getting mad. You’ve spent hundreds of hours on this forum, started up over three hundred threads, most of which deal exclusively with “ME, ME, ME,” have been given thousands of man-hours of sympathy, support and instruction, and have been so coddled over every minute detail of your spiritual formation, and now mere WEEKS after becoming Catholic, you’re trying so hard to throw it all away, to find some little loophole you can crawl through because it’s harder than you thought.

This latest tantrum and grasp for attention just throws all the goodness these people have given you back in their faces. It’s disgusting.
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I’m with you, Mr. Montana. What the heck is this thread doing here in “Apologetics”? Miss Paris, if you would just look at all this great advice and all the prayers you are getting from people out of the goodness of their hearts… :mad: …

I agree Satan may be involved with your actions, but I fear he is playing to your weakness for vanity more than your supposedly wavering faith. You seem to drink in attention as if it’s the elixir of The Gods. Then, when you are called on it—it reminds me of Miss Piggy…“Who, moi ??”

But you know what?—here’s another person who will be praying for you. Hopefully, this thread will be moved soon into a more appropriate venue. Is there a Teen Life subforum somewhere?
 
Viktor Belenko, the Soviet pilot who made a sensational defection by bringing over a MiG-25 along, experienced the same thing. He was in this new world, and he didn’t know what to do. It’s the same thing you’re experiencing: you just had a long journey, and now you’re suddenly in this new world. You are, shall we say, an immigrant in the Catholic world. Everything is new to you, and you’re not sure where to go next. You feel anxiety: if I do this, is it a sin? If I do that, will it affect my salvation? You are anxious. At this point, you need to talk to a spiritual advisor about it. I would suggest going to your parish priest, telling him what you feel. He can give you advice on how to go about things. Above all, learn to relax. Many of us have been Catholics here, all through life. We’re here to help as well. 👍
 
This is up on Catholic Exchange. I think it’s wonderfully pertinent to the discussion at hand:

By Mark Shea

When C.S. Lewis was approached by a publisher and invited to write a book about the problem of pain, he asked to be allowed to write it anonymously, since, he said, “If I were to say what I really thought about pain, I should be forced to make statements of such apparent fortitude that they would become ridiculous if anyone knew who made them.” The publisher said no to anonymity, but gave Lewis the exhilarating option of writing a preface explaining that he did not live up to his own principles.

I’m the Worst!

I am in pretty much the same boat here, writing brashly about something called “personal holiness” as if I were St. Francis. To be honest, I am not particularly holy. That is to say, I don’t usually act holy, understand holiness much, think holy thoughts, or say holy things. I moan and groan, yell at my kids, live half my life by the motto “Me First,” mistrust God and generally schlep along the Road to Zion when I could be enjoying a brisk walk. I am, in short, a poor specimen of the new creation.

Why then, should you bother reading any further? There’s only one reason: You are in pretty much the same boat, too. So was St. Peter — the one Jesus called “Satan” once. So was St. Thomas — the one who snorted at Lazarus’s resurrection and then, after seeing that with his own eyes, went on to snort at the Resurrection of Christ. So was St. Augustine — whose prayer for years was “O Lord, make me chaste, but please don’t do it just yet.” And so, if we dare to look, were all the folks Jesus has called down the ages. To paraphrase our Lord, the Son of Man came to seek the washouts, oddballs, dweebs, wimps and factory rejects. No one knew this better than St. Paul who, after a lifetime of apostolic service could still say, “Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners. Of these I am the worst” (1 Tm 1:15).

Jesus Is What Holiness Looks Like

So the plain truth is that none of us is holy. By and large, while the high and heroic calling of Jesus is nothing less than the Supper of the Lamb, the might of the Holy Spirit and the Beatific Vision, our lives often consist of Big Macs, flab and television. What then, can we do?

By ourselves, nothing. So it’s no use trying to fake holiness to impress God. The Great Physician has already examined us and the diagnosis is as follows: Due to a dominant family trait known as Original Sin, we are suffering from acute holiness deprivation. The prescription calls for intensive remedial holiness therapy. We need to see what holiness looks like. We need to breathe, eat and wash in holiness. We need a program of holiness exercises to build up our holiness muscles and hone our holiness skills. We need a way to get holiness into our bones, not a doctored X-ray and a phony bill of health.

Jesus is what holiness looks like. And it is surprising what we see when we look. Holiness is not piously ethereal and gooey. It is not necessarily nice and safe and polite, though it is always good. Holiness can pop up among the cow flops of Bethlehem. It can do a good day’s work hauling lumber around the hillsides of Nazareth or refrain from work on the Sabbath. It can yuk it up at a good joke or grieve over Lazarus; chow down at supper time or fast in the wilderness; drink a hearty health to the bride and groom at Cana or drink the cup of death at Calvary. Is holiness then a mass of contradictions? No, it is one huge affirmation. For holiness undergirds all its works with a fundamental “yes” to God and His Creation. Such a fundamental “yes” to God is the very essence of holiness.

Pray and Work

That gives us a toehold on our therapy because we now have a role-model. Indeed, our holiness exercise program can be summed up nicely in Christ’s words, “Follow Me” and in St. Paul’s words (echoed by all the saints), “Imitate me as I imitate Christ.” Yet, despite what many people think, modeling holiness is not all Jesus does for us. For one week’s stab at imitating Jesus shows clearly that merely having someone to imitate is not enough. We need to be holy inside, not merely do holy-looking stuff. To try to copy Jesus without somehow having His holiness inside us is just to doctor the X-rays again. So what else do we need?
 
(Cont’d)

Simply this: as we work, we must receive the Holy Spirit Jesus gives. He wants to make us holy from the inside out and work His Holy Spirit into our guts and bones as we trust Him and do the works of holiness. The full therapy treatment involves not only the exercises of holiness, but the good food, fresh air, cleanliness and healthy, loving relationships Christ provides. That is what the sacraments, the gifts of the Spirit and the Church are all about. In Baptism, we got washed up and filled inside with the holiness (that is, the Holy One) we couldn’t manufacture for ourselves. In Confirmation, we received more of that same Holy Spirit, yet (as they say in the vitamin commercials) especially formulated for the unique needs of adults. In Reconciliation, we receive strength and healing for the dings and broken bones we give and get along the way. In the Eucharist, we receive the Life of Lives, the Holy One Himself in all His fullness into our very blood, soul and spirit. And in fellowship we join in Christ’s joyous and painful work of holiness in others as well. All this is what St. Paul is getting at when he says, “Work out your salvation with fear and trembling, for it is God who works in you both to will and do His good pleasure” (Phil 2:12-13).

“Personal holiness” then, is paradoxical. For strictly speaking we have no “personal holiness.” Yet if we will submit to God and His free gift of the Holy Spirit, He will create in us the unbridled “yes” to life which is the stamp and seal of His own holiness, and He will make it so much a part of us (for we will have chosen it freely) that we will indeed be holy to our fingertips. And He will do it all through Jesus, Who is both God’s “yes” to us and our “yes” to God, the Holy One of Israel.

Mark Shea is Senior Content Editor for Catholic Exchange. You may visit his website at www.mark-shea.com check out his blog, Catholic and Enjoying It!, or purchase his books and tapes here.
 
Paris Blues:
Well, what am I suppose to say? The best sinner?:confused:
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Just say you are a sinner. If you start saying your the best sinner or the worst sinner, chances are pride could be there. There are lots of people, I doubt you are exceptional in any way regarding sinning, but really quite normal.
 
Paris Blues:
I didn’t want to do this but had to and wow, now the burden’s gone. I’m rather in shock (but not really 'cause I’m the type that is a “jump-to” like different religions or something kinda person)
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Do you have trouble with Church teachings or specific people? if it’s about people, I can say I disagree with lots of things Pope Benedict XI does. as none of those involves Church’s teaching, I’m still extremely satisfied with Church’s teaching. There’s no other church whose doctrine is more correct than Catholic Church’s

Maybe while you’re out, you can compare doctrines of different churches and realize Catholic Church is still the best. Amen
 
I understand how you feel. I’ve had times in my life where I felt the same way. I’m older now and it seems to come easier than when I was young. My advice would be to get involved with other Catholics. Help others and that will take your mind off yourself. I think life is too easy for us these days, so we become preoccupied with ourselves and that is a dangerous thing.

For me? I have to stay busy and pray! Pray! Pray! It sounds like you are putting too much thought into how you feel and how you think you should feel.

Our Lord said: “Be Still And Know That I Am God”!!! Try it! It works!
 
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montanaman:
You know something? Now I’m getting mad. You’ve spent hundreds of hours on this forum, started up over three hundred threads, most of which deal exclusively with “ME, ME, ME,” have been given thousands of man-hours of sympathy, support and instruction, and have been so coddled over every minute detail of your spiritual formation, and now mere WEEKS after becoming Catholic, you’re trying so hard to throw it all away, to find some little loophole you can crawl through because it’s harder than you thought.

This latest tantrum and grasp for attention just throws all the goodness these people have given you back in their faces. It’s disgusting.
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Ay Montana… lemme just say, I dun really think it’s good for you to get mad here. This is a forum on the internet. You don’t have to read Paris’ posts and you don’t have to post replies… so you can’t really get mad at someone for posting a thread, instead, if you’re sick of Paris not using your advice, you could just stop giving advice. You must know that sometimes when you give out of love, the other person won’t fully appreciate what you’ve given and won’t always use what you’ve given. This doesn’t mean, though, that you get less treasure in heaven for the love you gave or anything. This is a case where it’s best to bear your sufferings quietly (so that you don’t lose your reward), and if you can, continue to give love in patience - but it’s not like anyone would blame you for giving up if you think it has gotten too hard, considering that you don’t actually have a duty to post replies.

Having said all that… Paris, is wouldn’t hurt you to take a bit to heart what people have said, and try showing some love back to us - sometimes, this means that you too need to bear your sufferings quietly. If we can help you then by all means ask for help here. But if you’re just looking for a shoulder to cry on, think twice about it. Cry on God’s shoulder instead because he has a lot more patience than anyone you will encounter on these forums!
 
Paris: if you really are sincere, seek some help through a Priest and a cousnelor. If you are real, you got some issues you need to deal with.

If you are not authentic :eek: (and I suspect you are not. I have only been a member here for a few days and have seen your supposed wild ups and downs and don’t think it is real. I suspect you are either a protestant having fun with the Catholics here or a bored person wanting attention) Please do yourseld and the rest of the folks here a favor and join another web forum and have your fun there.

God Bless!
 
God is just waiting for you to say, “'m sorry, please forgive me”. He is always there waiting for us to make the decision to follow Him and His church. There was a time in my life when I felt abondoned. Then I started to pray again, I had nothing to lose and everything to gain. I stopped feeling sorry for myself and the situation I was in. God had not caused my situation, I did. I finally grew up…matured spiritually.

If you are waiting for the "burning in the bosom"feeling, to get you back to God, that probably won’t happen. I don’t believe you have left the Church or God because you know what you are doing is wrong, wrong, wrong. Usually those who leave God or don’t want Him in the first place, are those who don’t want to follow His commandments so they look for a way out and try to find a way to make God the root of all ones problems. Without God in ones life, the problems just pour in and we go in circles justifying our less than “holy” lives. Something tells me that you like the attention you get when you declare you have “quit” God and His Church. Those who are anti-Catholic love to hear this and those who love their religion are devasted. I do not mean to be unkind, but what have you to gain by making the statements you have made?? Do you want everyone to pray for your return or do you want us to be upset? The choice is yours. Your soul is yours. You hurt no one but yourself. That is not something to take lightly, but then you know that.

Love and peace

Mom of 5
 
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Flopfoot:
Ay Montana… lemme just say, I dun really think it’s good for you to get mad here. This is a forum on the internet. You don’t have to read Paris’ posts and you don’t have to post replies… so you can’t really get mad at someone for posting a thread, instead, if you’re sick of Paris not using your advice, you could just stop giving advice.
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I know I don’t have to read anything she posts, but when I do, I have every right to call her on “nonsense.” I believe I did it in a charitable way, and more than that, I think I may have helped her more than the pools of ink spilled trying to cheer her up. She’s 21–an adult. She needs to start thinking like an adult and to get off the “poor me” narcotic. I’ve been there, too.

I could have just passed on by, but I thought it was high time someone finally quit feeding the vanity. Maybe y’all like writing volumes of self-help advice for people who don’t take it into account, but I don’t.
You must know that sometimes when you give out of love, the other person won’t fully appreciate what you’ve given and won’t always use what you’ve given. This doesn’t mean, though, that you get less treasure in heaven for the love you gave or anything. This is a case where it’s best to bear your sufferings quietly (so that you don’t lose your reward), and if you can, continue to give love in patience
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For me this has nothing to do with rewards or punishments, and I hope I never reduce my own walk to picking up spiritual trinkets along the way. If there’s a reward waiting for me in Heaven, great. But for me spirituality and pragmatism intersect on the cross. I try to live the Life because it’s the right thing to do, not because I’m going to “get stuff” later.

Sometimes, yes, you give out of love and someone doesn’t appreciate what they’ve been given. So, rather than waste your time beating your head against the wall, simply remove what you’re giving. As anyone who’s ever lost someone knows, you don’t know what you had 'till it’s gone.
  • but it’s not like anyone would blame you for giving up if you think it has gotten too hard, considering that you don’t actually have a duty to post replies.
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I’ve actually refrained from responding to any of her posts thus far. I figured she was getting more than enough good advice and sympathy. It wasn’t “hard” in the least because I chose not to waste my time.

When she finally made it into the Church a month or so ago, I said to myself, “I’ll give it a year.” When I saw I was off by 11 months, that was it. Since the mods here ban people for what I think is some rather tame stuff, (considering the blistering I receive on another board) I fully expected her to be suspended for taking advantage of dozens of people by using them for attention and then throwing their faith back in their faces.

Whatever. This is why I’m not a counselor. However, if nobody had ever bothered to tell me in the past that I was “too whiney” at times, or “too fanatical” at other times, I still wouldn’t have found the nice balance and harmony of faith, reason and the world that I more-or-less enjoy now. Paris is suffering from “theology overload,” and maybe a vacation from the books will help calm her. I’m positive, however, that coddling, nurturing and encouraging her every little transitory emotion and not holding her accountable will only feed her vices. I don’t hate her. I just think she needs a little tough love.
 
Thanks to all who posted on this topic.
This thread is now closed.
 
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