If There Is No Heaven Will You Still Love God?

[Realcatholicgk]

Peace of Christ to everyone who visits this thread!

A priest once gave this one liner homily (can’t remember now what the readings were) for the faithful to ponder upon.

I have asked the same question of a few friends and got some good and some quite angry reactions. One said the question was stupid.

The question of course is purely hypothetical and every Christian knows there is a heaven.

But hypothetically, if there is no heaven, if this life here on earth is the only life that God is giving us, would you still love God and follow His commands?

Looking forward to some interesting responses.

Hi Ben,

On my way to church to have supper with my Lord and savor!

Short answer, of course!

In theology class one time. The question was asked if they “found Jesus’ body” (several nuts Protestant groups current support the lie that His tomb was found where the followers hid His body) would you still believe Jesus was God.

Both questions actually ask: “Do you have Faith in God!”

My only answer must be Yes!

God Bless

 

[benedictus2]

In theology class one time. The question was asked if they “found Jesus’ body” (several nuts Protestant groups current support the lie that His tomb was found where the followers hid His body) would you still believe Jesus was God.

Both questions actually ask: “Do you have Faith in God!”

My only answer must be Yes!

God Bless

My take on that would be if you actually believe that they found Jesus body, then you don’t believe in Jesus at all because it would mean that He lied about His resurrection.

And if some protestants actually believed that then so much for being so called :christian.".

That is why everytime they come with some stupid archeological conclusions regarding Jesus I brush them off.

The Truth will out and the Resurrection is the Truth.

 

[VociMike]

If the revelation, the knowledge of God that we have received, is so in error, then how could we love a God we actually know nothing about? Why would we even believe that God exists? If the revelation was wrong about heaven (that is, about our being created for God to be united with him), then why couldn’t it be wrong about his very existence, or his fundamental nature?

 

[Snerticus]

But hypothetically, if there is no heaven, if this life here on earth is the only life that God is giving us, would you still love God and follow His commands?

Absolutely! I have already tasted His love and let me tell you, nothing on this earth compares to it, not even human love.

If His love were all I got on this earth, only for a split second, and then no heaven afterwards, it would all have been worth it.

God’s love is nothing short of a miracle.

 

[benedictus2]

Absolutely! I have already tasted His love and let me tell you, nothing on this earth compares to it, not even human love.

If His love were all I got on this earth, only for a split second, and then no heaven afterwards, it would all have been worth it.

God’s love is nothing short of a miracle.

I think so too! :heaven:

Funny but somehow I thought you would say that.

 

[ASD]

I think that’s a good question. It’s certainly relevant to the history of our religious tradition.

• The first thing that comes to my mind is the Abraham stories. I’m not a Bible scholar, but AFAIK heaven is not part of the equation when Abraham raises the knife, right? So, to give a simple answer to the question: Yes, I would try to be like Abraham.
• To be perfectly honest, most of the imagery, metaphors, etc, used to describe heaven aren’t very appealing to me. So, although I realize we have only imperfect metaphors, etc, heaven doesn’t bear much on my own religious experience, day-to-day.
• I recently had a discussion that touched on an old problem, which seems similar: Ultimately, people say, Christianity is self-centered or self-seeking. Christians go to Mass, manage a little charity, etc, only to get a payoff for themselves in the end. I think that view of what Christians are doing is simplistic. Selfish vs. selfless doesn’t really work because they can’t be separated. The core of Christianity is Love. When love guides our actions, then self-sacrifice, self-giving, self-forgetting, etc, are inextricably tangled up with our own strongest desires, the things we long for the most. The selflessness can’t be separated from the selfishness, so to speak.

ASD​

Traditional Latin Mass: Translation and Grammar

 

[benedictus2]

I think that’s a good question. It’s certainly relevant to the history of our religious tradition.

• The first thing that comes to my mind is the Abraham stories. I’m not a Bible scholar, but AFAIK heaven is not part of the equation when Abraham raises the knife, right? So, to give a simple answer to the question: Yes, I would try to be like Abraham.
• To be perfectly honest, most of the imagery, metaphors, etc, used to describe heaven aren’t very appealing to me. So, although I realize we have only imperfect metaphors, etc, heaven doesn’t bear much on my own religious experience, day-to-day.
• I recently had a discussion that touched on an old problem, which seems similar: Ultimately, people say, Christianity is self-centered or self-seeking. Christians go to Mass, manage a little charity, etc, only to get a payoff for themselves in the end. I think that view of what Christians are doing is simplistic. Selfish vs. selfless doesn’t really work because they can’t be separated. The core of Christianity is Love. When love guides our actions, then self-sacrifice, self-giving, self-forgetting, etc, are inextricably tangled up with our own strongest desires, the things we long for the most. The selflessness can’t be separated from the selfishness, so to speak.

ASD​

Traditional Latin Mass: Translation and Grammar

That is really wonderful! Very well thought out.:clapping:

I think it is like since Christ dwells in all of us, it will be the Christ in us seeking the Christ in others so in loving others we love ourselves.

It also comes back to you cannot give what you don’t have.

 

[jkiernan56]

Peace of Christ to everyone who visits this thread!

A priest once gave this one liner homily (can’t remember now what the readings were) for the faithful to ponder upon.

I have asked the same question of a few friends and got some good and some quite angry reactions. One said the question was stupid.

The question of course is purely hypothetical and every Christian knows there is a heaven.

But hypothetically, if there is no heaven, if this life here on earth is the only life that God is giving us, would you still love God and follow His commands?

Looking forward to some interesting responses.

I would hope I would still love God and follow His commands since ALL I AM AND HAVE come from God as His gift totally undeserved (Grace).

Second, I would hope I would love doing what is right (ie - Gods commands) for the pure sake of goodness even if Heaven did not exist. I would want to love what is Good for the simple reason -that it is Good. Loving what is Good and doing what is right has its own inherent reward.

I also know that loving God and doing His commands are also His Gifts that I do not deserve and that I cannot do without His Grace moving me in this direction.

 

[MariaG]

Actually that is what someone else said to me. That is why I said that this is hypothetical.

I think the question goes to the heart of the act of contrition: 'not because I fear hell or dread the loss of heaven, but because I have offended you Oh My God".

Can we love Him if there is no reward of Heaven or the punishment of hell.

Can we love Him just because He is God? For the simple reason that we have been created and given a chance to share in His Love even if this is just on this earth?

You are absolutely right. It does go straight to the heart of the act of Contrition.

Apparently so far, I am one of the few who has gone to confession sometimes because I fear the pains of hell more than I love God who is all deserving of my love.

Which I find interesting. Since sometimes I hear people say that Protestants could rarely get to heaven since perfect contrition is so rare. Yet so far, more people have perfect contrition than not. Or at least think they would still have perfect contrition without the hope of heaven or the pains of hell.

Apparently, perfect contrition is more common than those people want to admit. Either that or people are not thinking about all the implications of the question and conviently forgeting anytime they went to confession out of fear, or duty than love.

I certainly hope it is the first although it does severely humble me that out of this group, I am about the only one that, at times, fears God more than I love Him, or at least the fear drives the confession rather than the love. That always hurts when I cannot love Him more than I fear hell, but to deny that aspect of oneself is to delude yourself and soon one will find oneself calling out Lord Lord and He will not know me.

 

[wina]

I would hope I would still love God and follow His commands since ALL I AM AND HAVE come from God as His gift totally undeserved (Grace).

Second, I would hope I would love doing what is right (ie - Gods commands) for the pure sake of goodness even if Heaven did not exist. I would want to love what is Good for the simple reason -that it is Good. Loving what is Good and doing what is right has its own inherent reward.

I also know that loving God and doing His commands are also His Gifts that I do not deserve and that I cannot do without His Grace moving me in this direction.

That’s what I think too. But after I notice there’s IF which I should think more deeply whether I’m trully really love God with all my whole heart? What I mean because I’ve been taught that we should have faith, hope and love to reach eternal life( which means heaven), so do I trully really love God because of I accept God’s love and love Him back or because what I have been taught before?

 

[MariaG]

That’s what I think too. But after I notice there’s IF which I should think more deeply whether I’m trully really love God with all my whole heart? What I mean because I’ve been taught that we should have faith, hope and love to reach eternal life( which means heaven), so do I trully really love God because of I accept God’s love and love Him back or because what I have been taught before?

Have you always had perfect contrition, being sorry because you love God so much, more than your hope of heaven and pains of hell?

I know I have not always had perfect contrition and that is the heart of the question in my opinion, which is why I answered that I would hope that I would still love Him, but know that sometimes it is the fear of the Lord that can spur on confession which is not perfect contrition. Nor would it allow one to Love Him without the hope of heaven or the fear of hell.

Thank you Lord for the sacrament of Penance!!!

And for the big IF of the questions

 

[fhansen]

Absolutely! I have already tasted His love and let me tell you, nothing on this earth compares to it, not even human love.

If His love were all I got on this earth, only for a split second, and then no heaven afterwards, it would all have been worth it.

God’s love is nothing short of a miracle.

This sounds alright at first but I’m not sure-somehow I’d think there’s something already at odds with a God Who 1) is Love, but 2) would annihilate us from existence.

 

[Socrates4Jesus]

Heaven is not a place, it’s a person. Since that person Jesus is God, the answer is no, i would not love Jesus if i knew He did not exist.

 

[jkiernan56]

You are absolutely right. It does go straight to the heart of the act of Contrition.

Apparently so far, I am one of the few who has gone to confession sometimes because I fear the pains of hell more than I love God who is all deserving of my love.

Does a person really love God when their actions are motivated by fear? (True “fear of the Lord” does not involve punishment).

Like oil and water, can fear and love coexist? I don’t think so.

 

[MariaG]

Does a person really love God when their actions are motivated by fear? (True “fear of the Lord” does not involve punishment).

Like oil and water, can fear and love coexist? I don’t think so.

And yet the Catholic Church calls this fear a gift of God.

**1453 **The contrition called “imperfect” (or “attrition”) is also a gift of God, a prompting of the Holy Spirit. It is born of the consideration of sin’s ugliness or the fear of eternal damnation and the other penalties threatening the sinner (contrition of fear). Such a stirring of conscience can initiate an interior process which, under the prompting of grace, will be brought to completion by sacramental absolution. By itself however, imperfect contrition cannot obtain the forgiveness of grave sins, but it disposes one to obtain forgiveness in the sacrament of Penance

 

[jkiernan56]

This sounds alright at first but I’m not sure-somehow I’d think there’s something already at odds with a God Who 1) is Love, but 2) would annihilate us from existence.

Very good point.

Just to throw a wrench into the question - is Heaven really something that “starts” after death? Or is loving God and doing His will already a participation in Heaven? I believe it is.

“May your Kingdom come on earth as it is in Heaven.” Doing God’s will out of love is a part of Heaven here and now.

 

[jkiernan56]

And yet the Catholic Church calls this fear a gift of God.

**1453 **The contrition called “imperfect” (or “attrition”) is also a gift of God, a prompting of the Holy Spirit. It is born of the consideration of sin’s ugliness or the fear of eternal damnation and the other penalties threatening the sinner (contrition of fear). Such a stirring of conscience can initiate an interior process which, under the prompting of grace, will be brought to completion by sacramental absolution. By itself however, imperfect contrition cannot obtain the forgiveness of grave sins, but it disposes one to obtain forgiveness in the sacrament of Penance

Contrition is different than fear. I asked can fear and love coexist - not can contrition and love coexist? Contrition is a part of love in my opinion. True fear of the Lord and contrition spring from the same reality. Contrition that springs from “fear of hell” IS NOT real Contrition …ie - Love. Therefore “fear of hell” and love CANNOT coexist - while “fear of the Lord” springs from love - thus real contrition. Running to confession out of a fear of punishment is not real contrition.

I will never love God out of fear of punishment. That kind of fear cannot coexist with real love.

 

[MariaG]

Contrition is different than fear. I asked can fear and love coexist - not can contrition and love coexist? Contrition is a part of love in my opinion. True fear of the Lord and contrition spring from the same reality. Contrition that springs from “fear of hell” IS NOT real Contrition …ie - Love. Therefore “fear of hell” and love CANNOT coexist - while “fear of the Lord” springs from love - thus real contrition. Running to confession out of a fear of punishment is not real contrition.

I will never love God out of fear of punishment. That kind of fear cannot coexist with real love.

I never said fear of hell is perfect contrition. The Catholic Church has a name for it, which I even quoted. Imperfect contrition or attrition. And imperfect contrition is a gift of God.

I am happy that you have never had an occassion where fear of hell has motivated you more than your love of God. But the teaching of the Church is clear, the fear of hell is truly a gift of God, that can in turn be brought to fruition in the sacrament of Penance.

 

[Snerticus]

This sounds alright at first but I’m not sure-somehow I’d think there’s something already at odds with a God Who 1) is Love, but 2) would annihilate us from existence.

If you’ve felt it, you’d know.

 

[John_Russell_Jr]

that caught my attention - that question. thx for your peace too,. If there was no heaven there’d be no God because God is heaven, heaven is God. When in grace we have God within us and that means heaven is within us. God is in us in the form of grace and we can’t do any good without Gods grace. So to my reckoning I would not be capable of loving God if there was no heaven because I would have no grace.

I’m not a theologian or philosopher though. Do you think this makes sense?

God bless all:thumbsup: