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Memaw
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Someone has a very gooood imagination!!, God Bless, Memaw
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Memaw
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I’m more interested in the monkey heads that were transplanted and a follow-up on what happened to them??I have always suspected that the brain is the seat of the soul, and that free will is hidden beneath the randomness component of quantum behavior, as that affects chemical reactions in the brain comprisi9ng thought.
Supposedly, during the French Revolution, the reason why the executioner held up the severed head of the guillotined nobles after their beheading was the assumption at that time that the head remained ensouled, as life drained out of it, and so the head was held up to force it to watch audience appreciation of their death.
I just read that in the 1970s monkey’s heads were in fact successfully transplanted. If this were done to a person, presumably the soul and free will would follow the head.
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GEddie
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The scientists were not able to reconnect the spinal cords, so the heads remained alive, briefly, on completely immovable bodies.I’m more interested in the monkey heads that were transplanted and a follow-up on what happened to them??
There was speculation at the time that this would one day be done on human beings (therefore that movie, which title escapes me, where someone’s head is attached on another man’s body next to his own head). That idea has been dropped because of the less than desirable results (to put it mildly) of such a process.
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Memaw
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They should have known it wouldn’t work before they even wasted the poor monkeys.The scientists were not able to reconnect the spinal cords, so the heads remained alive, briefly, on completely immovable bodies.
There was speculation at the time that this would one day be done on human beings (therefore that movie, which title escapes me, where someone’s head is attached on another man’s body next to his own head). That idea has been dropped because of the less than desirable results (to put it mildly) of such a process.
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StAnastasia
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I’m not clear on why the “soul” is necessary to breathing, since animals breathe as well.There is. But even in anencephaly there is enough of the brain left to keep body barely alive (the breathing, again). Without that remnant of the brain, body would not hold the soul (i.e. die). There is not enough of the brain for mental operations or for sustained life, so the “soul” departs relatively quickly.ICXC NIKA
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GEddie
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Yes they do. And they also have a soul; that is why we call them animals. “Anima” = “soul” in Latin.I’m not clear on why the “soul” is necessary to breathing, since animals breathe as well.
The only difference is that the animal soul is less “developed” than a human one. The human soul (when in a working head) expresses a cognitive mind; the purely animal soul does not. But both keep their respective bodies alive.
(Also, the Church seems to teach that animal souls are not sustained after death; I am not sure why.)
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StAnastasia
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It’s sort of arbitrary.(Also, the Church seems to teach that animal souls are not sustained after death; I am not sure why.)ICXC NIKA
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Schn
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So the soul is the brain stem?Yes they do. And they also have a soul; that is why we call them animals. “Anima” = “soul” in Latin.
The only difference is that the animal soul is less “developed” than a human one. The human soul (when in a working head) expresses a cognitive mind; the purely animal soul does not. But both keep their respective bodies alive.
Because no one fears an animal’s death as much as their own.(Also, the Church seems to teach that animal souls are not sustained after death; I am not sure why.)
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Memaw
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Because their soul is not immortal like Man’s soul.Yes they do. And they also have a soul; that is why we call them animals. “Anima” = “soul” in Latin.
The only difference is that the animal soul is less “developed” than a human one. The human soul (when in a working head) expresses a cognitive mind; the purely animal soul does not. But both keep their respective bodies alive.
(Also, the Church seems to teach that animal souls are not sustained after death; I am not sure why.)
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StAnastasia
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How do you know that? And on what evidence dp you base this claim? Is it just some group’s arbitrary decision?Because their soul is not immortal like Man’s soul.
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GEddie
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No, soul is a process that resides in a living body. The brain stem allows body to hold life, (briefly) and so the soul remains. Disable the brain stem, (i.e. by a hangman fracture) and the soul will depart at once. But it is the living body, not parts of it, that is important.So the soul is the brain stem?
Nonsequiutur. Philosophical concepts aren’t driven by personal anxieties.Because no one fears an animal’s death as much as their own.
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StAnastasia
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GEddie, I’m not sure what you mean by “the soul will depart.” Where does it go? Up, down, or sideways? Are there male and female souls? What makes the gender of a soul? Where does the soul reside when it “departs”?No, soul is a process that resides in a living body. The brain stem allows body to hold life, (briefly) and so the soul remains. Disable the brain stem, (i.e. by a hangman fracture) and the soul will depart at once. But it is the living body, not parts of it, that is important.ICXC NIKA
Interesting questions.
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GEddie
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Not where, when. The day you can’t breathe, your soul will move right out of time and meet up with your “Spiritual Body” in eternity. Like our LORD said, “This day you will be with me in Paradise.”GEddie, I’m not sure what you mean by “the soul will depart.” Where does it go? Up, down, or sideways?
If a human soul has gender, it is the gender of that soul’s human body.Are there male and female souls? What makes the gender of a soul?
In Paradise, in eternity, and in a new Spiritual Body (1Co15, 2Co 5)Where does the soul reside when it “departs”?
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StAnastasia
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How do you know the “soul” is detachable from the body? Jesus did not say “this day your soul will be with me in Paradise.” Are you reading a Greek dualist view into Jesus’ words?Not where, when. The day you can’t breathe, your soul will move right out of time and meet up with your “Spiritual Body” in eternity. Like our LORD said, “This day you will be with me in Paradise.”
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GEddie
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No, not really. “The soul” is the process of life, including the mind, and is designed to fill a human body. It does not “detach” from body and function independently, but it does survive, because soul’s survival is what makes a human eternity possible.How do you know the “soul” is detachable from the body? Jesus did not say “this day your soul will be with me in Paradise.” Are you reading a Greek dualist view into Jesus’ words?
Your human body does not go anywhere in death, except back into nature. Whatever in us “goes on” to new life would be an aspect of our soul. This would be true for our LORD’s death companion as well as for you or me.
And you are right, HE did not say “you soul will be.” HE said “you will be,” and humanly, that implies embodiedness, because “you” require a body to be. So “you” come back alive when your “soul” is fitted with a Spiritual Body on the other side of time. The soul survives, but is still designed to fill a body, and needs one for life.
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StAnastasia
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GEddie, I’m working (long range) on theology as if science mattered. I’m naturally interested – for my chapter on eschatology – on the future of the human person in terms of the “new creation.” On thing that troubles me is the overlay of Greek dualistic philosophical categories on the essentially Hebraic conception of the psycho-somatic unity. Immortality or a detachable “soul” seems foreign to the original Hebrew conception as reflected in the “Old Testament,” and seems foreign to the teaching of Jesus. The promise of resurrection of the whole person to new life appears more in keeping with His thought. What do you think?No, not really. “The soul” is the process of life, including the mind, and is designed to fill a human body. It does not “detach” from body and function independently, but it does survive, because soul’s survival is what makes a human eternity possible. Your human body does not go anywhere in death, except back into nature. Whatever in us “goes on” to new life would be an aspect of our soul. This would be true for our LORD’s death companion as well as for you or me. And you are right, HE did not say “you soul will be.” HE said “you will be,” and humanly, that implies embodiedness, because “you” require a body to be. So “you” come back alive when your “soul” is fitted with a Spiritual Body on the other side of time. The soul survives, but is still designed to fill a body, and needs one for life. ICXC NIKA
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GEddie
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Dear Anastasia (I know that isn’t your real name):GEddie, I’m working (long range) on theology as if science mattered. I’m naturally interested – for my chapter on eschatology – on the future of the human person in terms of the “new creation.” On thing that troubles me is the overlay of Greek dualistic philosophical categories on the essentially Hebraic conception of the psycho-somatic unity. Immortality or a detachable “soul” seems foreign to the original Hebrew conception as reflected in the “Old Testament,” and seems foreign to the teaching of Jesus. The promise of resurrection of the whole person to new life appears more in keeping with His thought. What do you think?
StAnastasia
I am a student of what you might call “human eschatology,” and for the most part agree with you. Perhaps we should converse some more on this topic in the private message area.
Certainly the “separable soul” idea is extremely unappealing if you think hard about it; and is no doubt part of what makes Christians no less fearful of death, in general, than the general society. We need our bodies! Still, our minds must be encoded spiritually in order for us to awaken from death at all.
See ya in the private forum?
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StAnastasia
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Sure – but it can wait. I’m giving a four-Wednesdays series in a parish during lent, and have a lot of preparation work for that.Dear Anastasia (I know that isn’t your real name): I am a student of what you might call “human eschatology,” and for the most part agree with you. Perhaps we should converse some more on this topic in the private message area. Certainly the “separable soul” idea is extremely unappealing if you think hard about it; and is no doubt part of what makes Christians no less fearful of death, in general, than the general society. We need our bodies! Still, our minds must be encoded spiritually in order for us to awaken from death at all. See ya in the private forum?
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mary1173
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The moment you no longer consist of a human brain, your soul is no longer with you. You no longer have a body.And you no longer have the mind that God has put into you so that you know how to behave.Brain death is the end of life. Even after death of the brain, your soul will remain…within God’s presence or not within God’s presence. Your job here is to pray that you can become closer to God, in how you behave, so that God will look favorably on you and reclaim your soul at the Final Judgement. Not so that you can ‘‘live on forever’’ as a robot.Let’s say I lose an arm and replace it with a robotic arm. Then I lose a leg and replace it with a robotic leg. Then I get a robotic heart after mine fails. Then a portion of my brain fails and I get a robotic part to replace it. Let’s say this goes on and on till my entire body is robotic. At what point is my soul not on earth anymore? How much of me can be a robot before I die?
So do as God commands…Keep His commandments, adhere to the laws of the land, and BEHAVE yourself!!
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Memaw
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I thought you posted your religion as Catholic??? Jesus didn’t come to die for doggie or kitty. He never speaks of them as having Eternal life. Maybe you need to get your head out of the dinosaur bones and put it in the Catechism of the Catholic church. God Bless, MemawHow do you know that? And on what evidence dp you base this claim? Is it just some group’s arbitrary decision?
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