Interfaith marriage/relationship advice needed, please!

[HappyCatholic01]

Sorry for the long post, but I wanted to get some advice and value the opinions I have seen on here.

I have recently starting dating my ex girlfriend again. We dated for about 15 months, and stopped for about 3 months. Back when we first met, I made it clear when we began dating that I wanted to marry a Catholic woman, and would be raising my family Catholic. She (a Lutheran), was onboard, and said she had no problem converting. I repeated this assertion again as the relationship developed, and she again had no problem. We attend mass weekly, and she has expressed her sadness at times at not being able to receive the Eucharist. She makes the sign of the cross, says the prayers, she pretty much does everything but receive the Eucharist. I am 30, and she is 25, fyi.

A year into our relationship, she told me she realized after attending a Christmas service at her old church with her family that she really wanted to get married in that church, as she grew up there. This really disappointed me, but we didn’t break up. She has said she has no problem becoming Catholic as soon as we are married, she just wants to be able to be married in her church. This has frustrated me, as both she and her family rarely attend that church. When we were not dating this summer, she attended mass a number of times with her aunt who converted to Catholicism.

I was originally open to a dispensation (more so from fear of losing her), but the more I have thought about it, I don’t think I want to do that. Catholicism means everything to me. From my perspective, her plan is one of selfishness and not taking things very seriously. Marriage is serious business. She agrees to convert and become Catholic, and raise the children Catholic, and we attend Mass weekly now while we are just dating, yet we are going to start our lives together in the Lutheran Church? That doesn’t make any sense.

I have been thinking that I want to tell her I can’t see getting married in another Church, and I really want her to attend RCIA with me. I want to tell her before we get too serious again. She resisted RCIA before (I think because she feels like if she attended, and converted, she wouldn’t then be able to get married in her church. Again, this seems silly and immature to me.) I know some people who refuse to take a stand for the faith, and I hate that, but I don’t want to be blindly obstinate and lose everyone around me who doesn’t fit the mold I want. She is conservative, moral, we have discussed the importance of NFP, etc., and is a great girl, and I do love her a lot. I just wonder if that is enough.

Am I being unfair or too harsh in making this stand? I don’t want us to get too serious and have this train wreck occur down the road, but I don’t want to impose unfair stipulations either. Any advice is greatly appreciated; I have lost much sleep mover this.

Thanks much!

 

[Orionthehunter]

HappyCatholic01:

Sorry for the long post, but I wanted to get some advice and value the opinions I have seen on here.

I have recently starting dating my ex girlfriend again. We dated for about 15 months, and stopped for about 3 months. Back when we first met, I made it clear when we began dating that I wanted to marry a Catholic woman, and would be raising my family Catholic. She (a Lutheran), was onboard, and said she had no problem converting. I repeated this assertion again as the relationship developed, and she again had no problem. We attend mass weekly, and she has expressed her sadness at times at not being able to receive the Eucharist. She makes the sign of the cross, says the prayers, she pretty much does everything but receive the Eucharist. I am 30, and she is 25, fyi.

A year into our relationship, she told me she realized after attending a Christmas service at her old church with her family that she really wanted to get married in that church, as she grew up there. This really disappointed me, but we didn’t break up. She has said she has no problem becoming Catholic as soon as we are married, she just wants to be able to be married in her church. This has frustrated me, as both she and her family rarely attend that church. When we were not dating this summer, she attended mass a number of times with her aunt who converted to Catholicism.

I was originally open to a dispensation (more so from fear of losing her), but the more I have thought about it, I don’t think I want to do that. Catholicism means everything to me. From my perspective, her plan is one of selfishness and not taking things very seriously. Marriage is serious business. She agrees to convert and become Catholic, and raise the children Catholic, and we attend Mass weekly now while we are just dating, yet we are going to start our lives together in the Lutheran Church? That doesn’t make any sense.

I have been thinking that I want to tell her I can’t see getting married in another Church, and I really want her to attend RCIA with me. I want to tell her before we get too serious again. She resisted RCIA before (I think because she feels like if she attended, and converted, she wouldn’t then be able to get married in her church. Again, this seems silly and immature to me.) I know some people who refuse to take a stand for the faith, and I hate that, but I don’t want to be blindly obstinate and lose everyone around me who doesn’t fit the mold I want. She is conservative, moral, we have discussed the importance of NFP, etc., and is a great girl, and I do love her a lot. I just wonder if that is enough.

Am I being unfair or too harsh in making this stand? I don’t want us to get too serious and have this train wreck occur down the road, but I don’t want to impose unfair stipulations either. Any advice is greatly appreciated; I have lost much sleep mover this.

Thanks much!

Frankly, the wedding is only a day. (And for some reason THIS day is more imporant to females than males if the weddings of my daughter and son are representative) A marriage lasts an eternity. Assuming that your Priest concurs and there is not something theologically significant that I’m overlooking, if I could marry the person for whom God made for me, have her convert (your primary obligation as a husband is to help your wife get to heaven) and all I had to do was allow the ceremony be held in a cow pasture, I’d get dispensation and start shoveling the **** to make room for an altar. After all, it is a Lutheran church that nurtured your fiance’s budding love of Christ and not home plate at a baseball game.

 

[YinYangMom]

A couple of things come to mind in reading your story…

first, you mention how she’s open to becoming a Catholic but resists RCIA.

I think that will be your first hurdle, and one which will determine whether or not you should continue on this path of marriage talk with her.

Explaining that Catholicism is not going through the motions for you, or following this rule or that, but that it’s an entire way of life which means everything to you - that you want her to experience the fullness of the Church as well, especially since she will be the mother of your children and as such, would need to be able to answer their questions and teach them properly.

If she attends RCIA with you then midstream or afterward you can continue plans for marriage - the Holy Spirit will be working with her and when she goes through the vigil service at Easter, that day will mean so much to her, she will probably want her marriage to be in that same church at that point.

If she doesn’t attend RCIA with you, then she’s not ready to commit to your faith, and thus, not ready to commit to you in a sacramental marriage.

Second, every girl has dreams of her wedding. I hung onto the dream of marrying in the Cathedral of my university, but when I met my husband, we were living in a different city and it meant more to me to marry in the church of the parish we would call home to us and our future children, than in the church of my youth and my parents’ life or that gorgeous Cathedral. With love and commitment, location isn’t that big of a deal.

I suspect her real hesitation is in converting from Lutheran to Catholic, and that really is something worth walking away from for you. The expressed reservations you’ve made will continue to nag at you throughout your marriage, so I agree with you, in that this issue needs to be resolved before you walk down the aisle. Your instincts are guiding you and I don’t believe you are being harsh or unfair.

Your feelings for the woman are clouding your judgement a little, getting you to consider compromising your longterm goals out of fear of losing her. Keep thinking about your children…that will give you the clarity of purpose you need to see this through the proper course.

Be patient, too, though…she sounds like a sweet lady who loves you and is struggling herself about how much of her long term goals she’s willing to compromise out of fear of losing you. I hope you can get her to open up about whether or not her hanging on to the dream of marrying in ‘that’ church is based on her core religious beliefs of the ceremony performed there itself, or just living out a lifelong fantasy. If she listens to “Marriage and the Eucharist” by Christopher West, she may long for the Catholic meaning of marriage over the Lutheran and it may nudge her over to RCIA to learn more.

 

[cargopilot]

Ahhh! Love makes simple decisions so hard.

A part of you is whispering in your ear that this is not right. Just listen to yourself. It seems you may have just answered your own question. So, why not just stall, drag your feet and use every delay tactic in the book? Who knows? There could be a fine Catholic girl just waiting for someone like you. In fact, I’d bet you a steak dinner there is.

You can’t force your GF to become Catholic, and you really wouldn’t want her to convert under duress, would you?

Yeah, if you’re askin’ me, I’d say don’t get married just yet. Just rip off those blinders and find a good Catholic girl. Dude, they’re the best. Trust me on this one, don’t try to substitute for the real thing.

I know. Twenty-some years ago, I was going to marry a non-Catholic. She was great and all, but something just wasn’t quite right. I couldn’t put my finger on it. Then it happened. God put my wife right in front of me. I literally tripped over her. I knew right then and there I was going to marry this girl. There was no stopping it, no reservations, no doubt whatsoever. All these years later, I’d marry her all over again. The funny thing is, it just so happened that I had been praying for God to help me decide what to do. Turns out, he had already decided.

 

[bapcathluth]

I must agree with Cargo Pilot. If Catholicism is this important to you than you must marry a Catholic. I think your girlfriend might have reservations about converting. Are you sure she is on board with NFP? I know this would be a hurdle that most Protestants I know would be unwilling to jump over–even for love.

I think you would both be happier with people of your own faiths.

 

[Orionthehunter]

bapcathluth:

I must agree with Cargo Pilot. If Catholicism is this important to you than you must marry a Catholic. I think your girlfriend might have reservations about converting. Are you sure she is on board with NFP? I know this would be a hurdle that most Protestants I know would be unwilling to jump over–even for love.

I think you would both be happier with people of your own faiths.

With a great deal of respect, I must disagree with Cargo and bapcathluth and essentially agree with Ying. None of can be confident about who God has made for us but I think the OP is the most likely thatGod will tell. I think that this relationship has a great deal of blessings in that some very important issues are on the table and being dealt with. I think there would be less divorces if every couple contemplating marraige were dealing as openly as this one is.

Some of are called to marry fellow Catholics and some are called to marry non-Catholics. The two important issues are that these issues are resolved to the mutual benefit and understanding of both parties and that the resolution doesn’t become a hindrance to the success of the marriage or to either gaining eternal Salvation.

Finally, there is nothing wrong with her having reservations about converting. As someone who is involved in RCIA, it is usually the one who struggles the most with the decision is the one who puts the most work into it once they become confirmed. As opposed to the one who just agrees because it is the path of least resistance, the one who struggles ends up being the most committed to the decision and ultimately the more devout Catholic.

If the OP prays for guidance, the answers will become clear. My point is to not let where the wedding takes place obfuscate the resolution of the more important issues described above or the guidance given to him by God.

 

[pipoluojo]

If you are a die-hard Catholic, you won’t be patient enough to allow your wife to grow over time into the matured Catholic that you are. You are then likely to be a happier husband of a cradle Catholic woman. Go and seek your ‘lost rib’ in Catholic youth forums.

If you have the teaching spirit and are yourself well grounded in your faith, all you need from her is the desire to convert (by willingly undergoing the RCIA). You would have a wonderful ‘student’ to teach how to be a complete Christian.

If you could visualise what and how you would like to be when forty and can see her being by your side, to make you the happy and fulfilled Catholic husband, then with Jesus, Mother Mary and St. Joseph guiding you, go ahead. Marriage is fun when your spouse dances to your style. You’ve got to work at it, teaching her with love, patience and prayer.

 

[HappyCatholic01]

Thanks for the (name removed by moderator)ut.

The problem I run into is, if I simply get married in another Church (through a dispensation), I roll the dice in assuming the person will grow at all. Very likely they will, but religion is the second biggest problem in marriage statistically (behind finances).

She is a wonderful girl, and may do certain things now out of love for me, but will that be enough to continue this trend for the next 30-50 years? I doubt it. And there are no guarantees; she could change her mind about converting later (though I doubt it), and then what? Being Catholic is a full-time job; it is a lifestyle, and not an easy at that.

I feel like if she isn’t willing to even explore RCIA for information, she is 1) hiding something she is afraid of, or, 2) being selfish so she can have the wedding in the church she wants, even though she rarely ever attends services there and I on the other hand attend Mass (with her), adoration, and confession weekly.

To me, this is playing games with something serious, if that was the case. I do not understand the hesitation of a person who attends Mass, wishes to be able to receive communion, yet wouldn’t go through RCIA to see if it was the right place to be.

It can only help the person, if she just becomes Catholic and later realizes it isn’t what she thought, how unhappy will she be? I’d rather the person know what they were getting into. I AM very patient, and love teaching her about the faith and help bringing her along.

I think she feels like since she is willing to convert, it isn’t asking too much for me to get married in the church of her choice. I however, have been very up front with her about this from day one; it was she who changed the equation.

I just fear that I am being too obstinate with regards to “my Catholic way or the high way”, never meet someone, and look back later and ay “if only I had bent a little.” Most of my Catholic friends don’t think it is unreasonable; I have seen many a couple in love convert before marriage because it was best for the couple. I guess I am just looking for reassurance that I am not being unreasonable with my requests.

Thanks for the advice and thoughts; they are greatly appreciated.

 

[ProudArmyWife]

I was one of those wives who was very hesitant to convert. I went to Mass, learned the prayers, etc., but still it was very difficult for me. It’s scary to throw away everything you have learned for the past 20 years - And face the new world of marriage. Then to top it she is having the man who she loves threaten to leave if she doesn’t make the decision - talk about stress!!!

I, too, had no problem raising our future children Catholic. Yet, it still took me years to convert (after the first child was born!). My husband was very patient with me - never pushing me to the faith, but gently leading me there through his words and actions. Now it is a joke in his family that I know more about the Faith than they do.

Also, why does she exactly want to get married there? I know I crossed off some of the churches because I didn’t like the way they looked inside. Sounds trival to many, but to me, at the time, it was important.

My advice: Be patient with her and give her the loving support to convert. Be married in her Church choice - as she is on her way to converting, just not there yet. Enroll with her in RCIA. Have a special Catholic Marriage Blessing Mass - it will mean much more to you both if you both understand the faith. Otherwise, her getting married in a Catholic church will mean nothing more than signing the paperwork at a town hall.

 

[YinYangMom]

HappyCatholic01:

I feel like if she isn’t willing to even explore RCIA for information, she is 1) hiding something she is afraid of, or, 2) being selfish so she can have the wedding in the church she wants, even though she rarely ever attends services there and I on the other hand attend Mass (with her), adoration, and confession weekly.

To me, this is playing games with something serious, if that was the case. I do not understand the hesitation of a person who attends Mass, wishes to be able to receive communion, yet wouldn’t go through RCIA to see if it was the right place to be.

This is the part that sounds like she’s ‘going through the motions’ of being Catholic…dipping her toes into the water without really getting wet and keeping one foot solidly on ground in case the water’s too cold.

It can only help the person, if she just becomes Catholic and later realizes it isn’t what she thought, how unhappy will she be? I’d rather the person know what they were getting into. I AM very patient, and love teaching her about the faith and help bringing her along.

This is a good point…to marry you, with the promise to convert, but not being able to go through with the conversion later seems risky, and how happy would she really be? Would she then be converting under duress? Our of love for her you wouldn’t want her to do that, then - or now.

I think she feels like since she is willing to convert, it isn’t asking too much for me to get married in the church of her choice. I however, have been very up front with her about this from day one; it was she who changed the equation.

This is where you explain that the Catholic church is not just a building to you. It’s not the building you object to, it’s the fact that if you marry in her building, the marriage will not be a Catholic sacramental one. Asking you to ‘settle’ for a “Catholic blessing” because a building has sentimental value to your wife and her family places perspective of the committment in a different light. How could a woman who loves you so much, knows how much the Catholic sacrament of marriage means to you, ask you to settle for less?

Explain also, that by insisting on the Catholic sacrament your marriage, as a couple, has a better chance of surviving over the years and growing. It’s important to start the committment off on the right foot and if she isn’t willing to do that, it speaks volumes about her faith in you and in the two of you as a couple. Perhaps she’s harboring doubts about the long term ramifications of the union, just as you are harboring some too.

I just fear that I am being too obstinate with regards to “my Catholic way or the high way”, never meet someone, and look back later and ay “if only I had bent a little.” Most of my Catholic friends don’t think it is unreasonable; I have seen many a couple in love convert before marriage because it was best for the couple. I guess I am just looking for reassurance that I am not being unreasonable with my requests.

Nope, not too obstinate at all, imo. As a Catholic you get ONE shot at marriage (God willing and nothing happens to your spouse). As a protestant, I don’t think she gets that. You just need to communicate better the reason why it’s so important to you, but truly allow her to choose your way or the highway, so that you’d lovingly let her go if need be because you really only want her to be happy and it might be obvious at that point that converting would not make her happy.

Thanks for the advice and thoughts; they are greatly appreciated.

 

[Orionthehunter]

The problem I run into is, if I simply get married in another Church (through a dispensation), I roll the dice in assuming the person will grow at all. Very likely they will, but religion is the second biggest problem in marriage statistically (behind finances).

I am neither advocating that you marry her or not. But it isn’t about what you want. God calls some of us to the vocation of marriage and He selects our life mate. You need to take this to prayer for insight into God’s plan for you. Your call may include being married to a cradle Catholic, a convert, or a Lutheran. After you accept the mate God has chosen for you, all you need her to promise to live out her marriage vows, support your faith, be open to life, and allow and encourage your children as you raise them in the Church. The rest is in God’s hands (granted your love and support of her according to God’s plans may include your prayers, and gentle advice and prodding for her conversion)

Your discussions about RCIA and marriage especially in the context of your marriage preparation may indicate that she is not the mate God has chosen for you.

She is a wonderful girl, and may do certain things now out of love for me, but will that be enough to continue this trend for the next 30-50 years? I doubt it.

If you don’t think she will do things out of love for you, you need to find a new mate. This is what being married is all about. At the same time, you should not confuse anything as personal and critical as her faith decision as a sign of her love for you. I wouldn’t leave my faith just because my loving wife asked me to and she shouldn’t either. It needs to be part of her own faith journey.

Being Catholic is a full-time job; it is a lifestyle, and not an easy at that.

LOL Tell me about it.

I feel like if she isn’t willing to even explore RCIA for information, she is 1) hiding something she is afraid of, or, 2) being selfish so she can have the wedding in the church she wants, even though she rarely ever attends services there and I on the other hand attend Mass (with her), adoration, and confession weekly.

The previous poster talked about the patient love that her husband gave her until she was ready may be appropos here. My brother-in-law went through RCIA three times over 10 years before he finally was confirmed. Conversion happens on God’s time and not ours.

I do not understand the hesitation of a person who attends Mass, wishes to be able to receive communion, yet wouldn’t go through RCIA to see if it was the right place to be.

Because the Church puts so much emphasis on the conversion process (as opposed to a Lutheran just needs to go down the street to the Methodist church to become Methodist), we sometimes don’t fully grasp how intimidating the process is for a cradle Protestant and the need for time and patience.

I AM very patient, and love teaching her about the faith and help bringing her along.

Real patience may require a lifetime which is what marriage is about- Lifetime.

I think she feels like since she is willing to convert, it isn’t asking too much for me to get married in the church of her choice.

From my perspective, if I had to make a compromise on one day (a day that is alot more important to my wife than to me) in exchange for a lifetime of shared faith, I’d take this deal every time.

I however, have been very up front with her about this from day one; it was she who changed the equation.

Get used to it buddy. Changing minds is something that happens all the time in marriage.

I

just fear that I am being too obstinate with regards to “my Catholic way or the high way”, never meet someone, and look back later and ay “if only I had bent a little.”

Only in Prayer will you find the answer. I wish you the best.

I guess I am just looking for reassurance that I am not being unreasonable with my requests.

While some might give you reassurance, you won’t get it from me. Love and marriage requires patience, tolerance, compassion and forgiveness that is sometimes so difficult that it is only attainable with God.

Thanks for the advice and thoughts; they are greatly appreciated.

 

[cheddarsox]

Here is what I think.

The situation about which church to get married in is a perfect example of what life between a Catholic and non Catholic is about.

A Catholic CANNOT compromise on matters of faith or religion.

Compromise is a big deal in marriage, and it can be extremely trying on a marriage when no compromise is allowed in this important area. And many people of other faiths do not understand that their Catholic spouse CANNOT compromise. They think that they will not compromise and that it is a personal issue.

If the Catholic faith is as important to you as you say, if it is critical to you that your kids are raised strong Catholics, I think you would be better off finding a partner that is solidly Catholic.

Catholicism is unique in many ways and people of other faiths often don’t and often can’t understand it, and can’t fully accept its no compromise stand.

If your friend is resisting these things now, I would have concern for the future.

cheddar

 

[Aesq]

Resistance to RCIA may not be resistance to the Church.

This may seem quite odd to those of you who did not convert as adults. I converted as an adult and not until I was 35. I may have a little different view.

I can tell you that I was drawn to the Church for many years. I studied the doctrines of the Church and many other demoninations as well. I truely feel that God called me to His Church. However, I can say that RCIA was a very bad experience for me and others in my class. RCIA has a tendency to deny or look down upon other faith histories. It is not intentional. But you have to keep in mine that RCIA is actually intended for those who are not baptized, effectively the unchurched folks in the world. It may be used for conversion of those from other faith histories but that is not what it was created to do. With this in mind it can seem from the view of the non-catholic person with an extensive faith history as a non-catholic that the Church does not respect that faith history. I saw this a lot in my class. I had many discussions with my sponsor about this and he finally can to understand. (after about six months of explaining it)

This is just my two cents. I think it is hard for those raised Catholic to understand this sometimes.

In light of the above, I would say slow down. If this is someone you are considering spending the rest of your life with, you can slow down and work on this. Talk about it and be respectful of her faith history. It is not meaningless. That faith history may well be one of the things pulling her toward the Church. Conversion is not quite as simple as it may seem to those already on the inside shall we say. What is the hurry? Ask why RCIA is a problem or a concern.

 

[Orionthehunter]

I can say that RCIA was a very bad experience for me and others in my class. RCIA has a tendency to deny or look down upon other faith histories. It is not intentional. But you have to keep in mine that RCIA is actually intended for those who are not baptized, effectively the unchurched folks in the world. It may be used for conversion of those from other faith histories but that is not what it was created to do. With this in mind it can seem from the view of the non-catholic person with an extensive faith history as a non-catholic that the Church does not respect that faith history. I saw this a lot in my class. I had many discussions with my sponsor about this and he finally can to understand. (after about six months of explaining it)

I am really sorry your experience wasn’t positive. RCIA is designed to fit the needs of both the unchurched and those of different faith traditions. Sometimes if the class is predominently of one type of Candidates/Catechumens, I’m sure the class has a focus that isn’t ideal for the other but it is inadvertent. Also, the RCIA program at our parish and as far as I know throughout our diocese is very respectful of the other faith traditions. While some theological issues dividing the Christian community can be very wide, the Church respects that many Protestant Christians have a sincere love and desire for Christ. After five years of being in RCIA, I’m come to appreciate that converts from different denominations have brought new charisms into our parish that has enhanced us all. I’m sure that you did the same for your parish.

 

[HappyCatholic01]

Thanks again for the thoughts everyone, I really do appreciate the insight and thoughts.

I understand that people convert on God’s time (if at all), not ours, and that is where am torn. I know many people who converted prior to mariage because they wanted to share the common faith with their spouse, and to me this makes sense. Many other people on here have said they married their spouse and it took years to convert. To me, that just seems like such a big gamble. Perhaps I am cynical, but she initially said she would convert for us to be married, etc., then she realized she was not ready to. I daresay she would have said pretty much anything to me when we were starting our relationship; not because she was lying per se, but because of the feeling"there isn’t anything I wouldn’t do for this person!" Then, the reality sets in, and sometimes we realized maybe we over promised. That is not at all uncommon in relationships I see.

Orion had mentioned being willing to be married anywhere it meant getting the girl God intended. The problem i have is, I wonder if anyone is telling her the same thing. I.e., marry this guy in his church (or convert) if he means that much to you. The problem is, I feel as though I am perceived as stubborn to many Protestants (her family) since to them, many of the faiths are interchangeable for marriage (no offense intended). Her family rarely attends services, and I know more about Martin Luther and the Lutheran Church than anyone in their family. Not a knock, just an observation. I could respect the request to be married in the lutheran faith if it was something that touched her soul, but the fact is, she attends mass and is far from a devout Lutheran. It just seems unfair to me to request that. I’d let her have any Catholic Church in the world; I’d give in on any other issue at all - the flowers, the bridal party, the honeymoon, but it just seems like an unfair request to me. Maybe I am the one being selfish, and if so, i’d hate to lose the girl over my selfishness.

I do not expect her conversion to happen on my time, but it doesn’t seem to me to be unreasonable to at least attend RCIA with me. It may be a wake up call for her that being Catholic is something she could NEVER do, or is something she WANTS RIGHT NOW. Either way, it should provide some good insight, no?

I understand marriage is about sacrafice and compromise, but it doesn’t seem like attending RCIA to learn more info is asking too much for someone who supposedly loves me so much. I would never mandate converting, but being married in the church she and I ATTEND WEEKLY does not see like too much to ask. it just seems illogical to me. We attend mass in the Catholic Church every week while dating and engaged. Then, for a day, we are married in the Lutheran Church. Then the next day, we are back in our Church for ther rest of our lives? Seems odd.

I also fear that if I give in on being married in her church, it may set a precedent. That is, I said I wanted to be married in the Catholic church, she eventually balked, and I relented.

What do I do if she balks on converting at some point (again, her choice, not mine)? On raising the children catholic? On attending Mass with us? On using NFP? I honestly don’t think she would do this, but to be honest, many of the stories I have read on here about marital strife has scared the dickens out of me in terms of marriage!

 

[BLB_Oregon]

It is natural that if you love her you want the best for her and of course want to share your faith with her. Of course you want every assurance that you will be able to give your children the gift of faith that has been given to you. She has not accepted the Catholic faith herself. Unless she intends to deep-six her own conscience whenever it conflict with yours, she cannot guarantee you that.

You have to realize that she deserves better than to be treated as a “fixer upper.” Do not try to fool yourself, or her. That is not a conditional acceptance. That is a rejection.

If you would not have her as your wife as she is today, do not marry her.

 

[Orionthehunter]

BLB_Oregon:

It is natural that if you love her you want the best for her and of course want to share your faith with her. Of course you want every assurance that you will be able to give your children the gift of faith that has been given to you. She has not accepted the Catholic faith herself. Unless she intends to deep-six her own conscience whenever it conflict with yours, she cannot guarantee you that.

You have to realize that she deserves better than to be treated as a “fixer upper.” Do not try to fool yourself, or her. That is not a conditional acceptance. That is a rejection.

If you would not have her as your wife as she is today, do not marry her.

There is alot of wisdom in this post. If you prayerfully are confident that she is called to be your mate and you are called to be her mate, my advice is to just trust God on the details. Talk to your Priest (usually my advice on about everything) about this. I think he will tell you that the place of the marriage is of marginal importance. The sacrament of Marriage is not dependent on the place but only depends on you and your fiance’ (I think the words are “form and substance” or something like that for it to be sacramentally valid.

While trusting in God doesn’t mean you shouldn’t use your mind and emotions to judge the situation. Personally, I think it is reasonable for you to expect her to do RCIA if for no other reason to better understand your faith and the faith of your children. If she won’t do this, it might be time to move on. Her conversion is her option.

 

[YinYangMom]

You know, 16 posts later, many filled with good advice, you’re still rather hesitant in your posts responding to ours. I think that reveals something.

Go through the thread and re-read your posts…the underlying message from you seems to be saying, “Don’t marry the girl right now - if at all”.

The issue is not about whether or not to have the wedding in the Lutheran building.

Seems like one of those things where we ‘know’ the answer but don’t think we do, until we start saying things out loud - and then it just becomes so clear.

 

[HappyCatholic01]

Orionthehunter:

There is alot of wisdom in this post. If you prayerfully are confident that she is called to be your mate and you are called to be her mate, my advice is to just trust God on the details. Talk to your Priest (usually my advice on about everything) about this. I think he will tell you that the place of the marriage is of marginal importance. The sacrament of Marriage is not dependent on the place but only depends on you and your fiance’ (I think the words are “form and substance” or something like that for it to be sacramentally valid.

While trusting in God doesn’t mean you shouldn’t use your mind and emotions to judge the situation. Personally, I think it is reasonable for you to expect her to do RCIA if for no other reason to better understand your faith and the faith of your children. If she won’t do this, it might be time to move on. Her conversion is her option.

Well, thanks again for the (name removed by moderator)ut friends, and feel free to post any other pearls of wisdom or opinions as well as they come up, this has been very helpful

I have spoken to Priests I trust, and they have indicated that the location is not the pivotal point, so long as she agrees to raising the children Catholic, etc. The question is for the individual Catholic in question, is this enough. They do wonder why she has such reticence about RCIA, conversion, or being married in the Church if she attends mass wekkly. That is something only she knows, though again, I suspect it is because she wants the wedding as she views it, and to be Catholic prior to marriage would eliminate this possibility (marriage in her child hood church, with her Pastor, making her family happy, etc.)

The question i have is, knowing what the Church means to me, how could the person ask me to not be married in it? So I guess I am saying I am more saddened by the request of marriage in her church than the prospect itself. Could I do it? Yes. Should I be asked to? IMO, no.

Admittedly I am hesitant about marriage, but much of that is cynicism from the marriages I see and hear about. Even this site, which I love, has many horror stories that have scared me, a would be husband and father one day, at times!! I feel like unless I cover all my bases, and leave nothing to chance with a mate, the marriage will be fraught with trouble (which is inevitable, but at least you have tried to eliminate areas of major concern!)

I guess I just wanted some (name removed by moderator)ut on whether or not asking her to attend RCIA is too much to ask. Conversion, while ideal, needs to be on her time. But attending RCIA isn’t too much to ask, I don’t think.

If she isn’t ready to do that, I can understand that (and respect it, if she is sincere), but that probably means she isn’t ready to marry me either.

 

[YinYangMom]

HappyCatholic01:

I guess I just wanted some (name removed by moderator)ut on whether or not asking her to attend RCIA is too much to ask. Conversion, while ideal, needs to be on her time. But attending RCIA isn’t too much to ask, I don’t think.

If she isn’t ready to do that, I can understand that (and respect it, if she is sincere), but that probably means she isn’t ready to marry me either.

And there you have it.
No, asking her to attend RCIA is not too much to ask, especially since one doesn’t necessarily have to convert after finishing the program, but at least she would have a more full understanding and appreciation for what raising her children as Catholics would mean. She would have the information she would need to be able to make that committment to you and to the church, there would be no surprises later.

And you’re right…if she isn’t ready to take the courses, informationally only (without promising to convert afterwards), then she isn’t ready to marry you because she isn’t ready to really get to know you - what motivates you.

I don’t know how to explain it, but honestly, when you find THE one, you just ‘know’ completely…there is no second guessing, no gut instinct pulling you away. That’s not to say marriage to this woman won’t last, sure it would, because you are so committed to it, but it will be more work than if you didn’t have the hurdles to overcome first. Even with the ‘ideal’ mate, work is required as each person grows and changes in maturity and life circumstances change, but because the faith is strong it’s just easier to let go of a lot of that to God and trust He will see you through it as a couple.