Is Hell Eternal?

[Anna_Scott]

HEAVEN, HELL AND PURGATORY
Pope John Paul II

Hell is the State of Those who Reject God

At the General Audience of Wednesday, 28 July 1999, the Holy Father reflected on hell as the definitive rejection of God. In his catechesis, the Pope said that care should be taken to interpret correctly the images of hell in Sacred Scripture, and explained that “hell is the ultimate consequence of sin itself… Rather than a place, hell indicates the state of those who freely and definitively separate themselves from God, the source of all life and joy”.

1. God is the infinitely good and merciful Father. But man, called to respond to him freely, can unfortunately choose to reject his love and forgiveness once and for all, thus separating himself for ever from joyful communion with him. It is precisely this tragic situation that Christian doctrine explains when it speaks of eternal damnation or hell. **It is not a punishment imposed externally by God **but a development of premises already set by people in this life. The very dimension of unhappiness which this obscure condition brings can in a certain way be sensed in the light of some of the terrible experiences we have suffered which, as is commonly said, make life “hell”.

In a theological sense however, hell is something else: it is the ultimate consequence of sin itself, which turns against the person who committed it. It is the state of those who definitively reject the Father’s mercy, even at the last moment of their life.
Hell is a state of eternal damnation

1. To describe this reality **Sacred Scripture uses a symbolical language **which will gradually be explained. In the Old Testament the condition of the dead had not yet been fully disclosed by Revelation. Moreover it was thought that the dead were amassed in Sheol, a land of darkness (cf. Ez. 28:8; 31:14; Jb. 10:21f.; 38:17; Ps 30:10; 88:7, 13), a pit from which one cannot reascend (cf. Jb. 7:9), a place in which it is impossible to praise God (cf. Is 38:18; Ps 6:6).

The New Testament sheds new light on the condition of the dead, proclaiming above all that Christ by his Resurrection conquered death and extended his liberating power to the kingdom of the dead.

Redemption nevertheless remains an offer of salvation which it is up to people to accept freely. This is why they will all be judged “by what they [have done]” (Rv 20:13). By using images, the New Testament presents the place destined for evildoers as a fiery furnace, where people will “weep and gnash their teeth” (Mt 13:42; cf. 25:30, 41), or like Gehenna with its “unquenchable fire” (Mk 9:43). All this is narrated in the parable of the rich man, which explains that hell is a place of eternal suffering, with no possibility of return, nor of the alleviation of pain (cf. Lk. 16:19-3 1).
The Book of Revelation also figuratively portrays in a “pool of fire” those who exclude themselves from the book of life, thus meeting with a “second death” (Rv. 20:13f.). Whoever continues to be closed to the Gospel is therefore preparing for 'eternal destruction and exclusion from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might" (2 Thes 1:9).

1. *The images of hell that Sacred Scripture presents to us must be correctly interpreted. They show the complete frustration and emptiness of life without God. Rather than a place, hell indicates the state of those who freely and definitively separate themselves from God, the source of all life and joy. **This is how the Catechism of the Catholic Church summarizes the truths of faith on this subject: “To die in mortal sin without repenting and accepting God’s merciful love means remaining separated from him for ever by our own free choice. This state of definitive self-exclusion from communion with God and the blessed is called ‘hell’” (n. 1033).

**“Eternal damnation”, therefore, is not attributed to God’s initiative because in his merciful love he can only desire the salvation of the beings he created. **In reality, it is the creature who closes himself to his love. Damnation consists precisely in definitive separation from God, freely chosen by the human person and confirmed with death that seals his choice for ever. God’s judgement ratifies this state.

We are saved from going to hell by Jesus who conquered Satan

1. Christian faith teaches that in taking the risk of saying “yes” or “no”, which marks the human creature’s freedom, some have already said no. They are the spiritual creatures that rebelled against God’s love and are called demons (cf. Fourth Lateran Council, DS 800-801). What happened to them is a warning to us: it is a continuous call to avoid the tragedy which leads to sin and to conform our life to that of Jesus who lived his life with a “yes” to God.

Eternal damnation remains a real possibility, but we are not granted, without special divine revelation, the knowledge of whether or which human beings are effectively involved in it. The thought of hell — and even less the improper use of biblical images — must not create anxiety or despair, but is a necessary and healthy reminder of freedom within the proclamation that the risen Jesus has conquered Satan, giving us the, Spirit of God who makes us cry “Abba, Father!” (Rm. 8:15; Gal. 4:6).

This prospect, rich in hope, prevails in Christian proclamation. It is effectively reflected in the liturgical tradition of the Church, as the words of the Roman Canon attest: “Father, accept this offering from your whole family … save us from final damnation, and count us among those you have chosen”.

Provided Courtesy of:
Eternal Word Television Network
5817 Old Leeds Road
Irondale, AL 35210
www.ewtn.com​

 

[Third_Day]

Third Day,

What if a person has heard the Gospel, but does not understand it and dies having heard it? What happens to that soul?

Anna

If someone hears the gospel but they do not understand it then they are less cupable for their ignorance. They must have invincible ignorance which means their ignorance could not be penetrated by reason.
There are Jews, Moslems, Hindus etc. who have heard the gospel but they truly cannot accept it because of their own life experiences. God alone knows their heart.God alone knows how they cooperated with the grace He sent them.

A couple of scriptures to consider.

“For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Is it not those inside the church whom you are to judge? God judges those outside.” 1 Cor. 5:12

“If you were blind you would have no guilt but now that you say, “We see” your guilt remains.” John 9:41

"If I had not come and spoken to them, they would not have sin but now they have no excuse for their sin. " John 15:22

“When gentiles who have not the law do by nature what the law requires, they are a law to themselvess…they show that what the law requires is written on their hearts, while their conscience also bears witness and their conflicting thoughts accuse or perhaps excuse them on that day when , according to my gospel, God judges the secrets of men by Jesus Christ.” Romans 2:14-16

This of course doesn’t mean they are saved automatically. The Church sent missionaires into hostile lands to bring the faith and baptize as many as possible. Being judged by the natural law is not a ticket to heaven. The closer one is to the Church and Her sacraments the better the chance to be saved.

 

[Richard_Kastner]

This from another thread

It may be that God could destroy the wicked merely by ceasing His life giving force but that is not how He is going to do it and I know this because He says how He is going to do it in His word.
Rev.21
8But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

There is no doubt that the wicked are destroyed. Rom. 6:23 they suffer death Job21:30 doom (destruction) “shall perish” Ps.37:20"perish"

Mal.4:1For, behold, the day cometh, that shall burn as an oven; and all the proud, yea, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble: and the day that cometh shall burn them up, saith the LORD of hosts, that it shall leave them neither root nor branch. Burned up sounds like there won’t be much left.

Ps.37:38"shall be destroyed together" Ps.37:20 will “vanish away” Ps.37:9 “shall be cut off” Ps.62:3 “shall be slain” Ps.145:20 God shall “destroy” them Ps.21:9 "fire shall devour them

 

[Anna_Scott]

If someone hears the gospel but they do not understand it then they are less cupable for their ignorance. They must have invincible ignorance which means their ignorance could not be penetrated by reason.
There are Jews, Moslems, Hindus etc. who have heard the gospel but they truly cannot accept it because of their own life experiences. God alone knows their heart.God alone knows how they cooperated with the grace He sent them.

A couple of scriptures to consider.

“For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Is it not those inside the church whom you are to judge? God judges those outside.” 1 Cor. 5:12

“If you were blind you would have no guilt but now that you say, “We see” your guilt remains.” John 9:41

"If I had not come and spoken to them, they would not have sin but now they have no excuse for their sin. " John 15:22

“When gentiles who have not the law do by nature what the law requires, they are a law to themselvess…they show that what the law requires is written on their hearts, while their conscience also bears witness and their conflicting thoughts accuse or perhaps excuse them on that day when , according to my gospel, God judges the secrets of men by Jesus Christ.” Romans 2:14-16

This of course doesn’t mean they are saved automatically. The Church sent missionaires into hostile lands to bring the faith and baptize as many as possible. Being judged by the natural law is not a ticket to heaven. The closer one is to the Church and Her sacraments the better the chance to be saved.

Third Day,
I appreciate your post. I know that God is merciful and He alone knows the hearts of all people. I just need to remember that, when despair approaches.

Peace,
Anna

 

[SteveVH]

Cristiano,

Now we’re getting into a rather complicated area. How does one define “not capable” when it comes to hearing and understanding the Gospel?

My son has heard the Gospel; but has never been Baptized. Sadly, most of his exposure to Christianity was in the Baptist Church, which I should have left long before I did. The Baptist Church did a lot of damage, and my son turned away from organized religion-eventually deciding Jesus was a good man with good parables, but not the Son of God. We’ve had many long talks and this is tearing me apart. He seems, at this point, “incapable” of understanding the fact that Christ is the Son of God.

You would have to be in the “Baptist” culture to understand the damage that can be done. It’s all about Hell and avoiding Hell to an extent that is nothing short of narcissistic. Creationism is often taught in a fanatical way, causing children to believe they must choose between science and Christ–and if you question a literal translation of the creation story in Genesis; you are told you have a faith issue. When I spoke with one of the ministers about being told I had a faith issue for not accepting Genesis as a literal account of creation; he told me evolution was “racist.” Many Baptists will also say that Catholics are not Christians, or anyone else who doesn’t pray the “sinner’s prayer” just right.

When my son got to college, there were fundamentalists who came to the campus to preach. Again, it was all about Hell. Then he met the son of the Financial Minister at one of the large non-denominational churches in our area–which did even more damage. The family basically got rich from the Church and the Financial Minister’s son treated his girlfriend with such disrespect, while giving that tragic “holier than thou” impression. My son was appalled. He finally said he could not find the teachings of Christ in the Church or in most who called themselves Christians.

That’s only the tip of the iceberg regarding my son’s encounters with Christians. It is so very sad when Christians drive people away from Christianity.

So, is my son, at this point, bound for eternal torment? Is he, at this point, “capable” of understanding the Gospel? I pray for him everyday. I pray that Christ will come to him. I pray that Christ will call him and that my son will answer His call and follow Him.

If it is as you said, that those who do not hear the Gospel during their life on earth will go to purgatory instead of Hell; then they may be the lucky ones. How sad is that?

Anna

 

[SteveVH]

Cristiano,

Now we’re getting into a rather complicated area. How does one define “not capable” when it comes to hearing and understanding the Gospel?

My son has heard the Gospel; but has never been Baptized. Sadly, most of his exposure to Christianity was in the Baptist Church, which I should have left long before I did. The Baptist Church did a lot of damage, and my son turned away from organized religion-eventually deciding Jesus was a good man with good parables, but not the Son of God. We’ve had many long talks and this is tearing me apart. He seems, at this point, “incapable” of understanding the fact that Christ is the Son of God.

You would have to be in the “Baptist” culture to understand the damage that can be done. It’s all about Hell and avoiding Hell to an extent that is nothing short of narcissistic. Creationism is often taught in a fanatical way, causing children to believe they must choose between science and Christ–and if you question a literal translation of the creation story in Genesis; you are told you have a faith issue. When I spoke with one of the ministers about being told I had a faith issue for not accepting Genesis as a literal account of creation; he told me evolution was “racist.” Many Baptists will also say that Catholics are not Christians, or anyone else who doesn’t pray the “sinner’s prayer” just right.

When my son got to college, there were fundamentalists who came to the campus to preach. Again, it was all about Hell. Then he met the son of the Financial Minister at one of the large non-denominational churches in our area–which did even more damage. The family basically got rich from the Church and the Financial Minister’s son treated his girlfriend with such disrespect, while giving that tragic “holier than thou” impression. My son was appalled. He finally said he could not find the teachings of Christ in the Church or in most who called themselves Christians.

That’s only the tip of the iceberg regarding my son’s encounters with Christians. It is so very sad when Christians drive people away from Christianity.

So, is my son, at this point, bound for eternal torment? Is he, at this point, “capable” of understanding the Gospel? I pray for him everyday. I pray that Christ will come to him. I pray that Christ will call him and that my son will answer His call and follow Him.

If it is as you said, that those who do not hear the Gospel during their life on earth will go to purgatory instead of Hell; then they may be the lucky ones. How sad is that?

Anna

Hi Anna.

I think there are many of us who can empathize with your thoughts when it comes to our children who seem to have no interest in “Church”. My kids all tell me they believe in God but they don’t believe they have to belong to a Church. One of my sons told me, though, that he didn’t know what he would do if I ever lost my faith. My faith was that important to him. I was blown away. I said “What about your faith?” He said he was working on it.

My point is this. God’s mercy is an ocean. When you think about how much you love your son, remember that we cannot even conceive of God’s love for your son. The last thing God wants is for anyone to be lost. Look at what He did to save us. I have to believe that hell is reserved for the absolute wicked. You also should remember that your prayers and tears for your son also make a difference. God will impart grace to your son because of your prayers and none of us know what effect that grace will have, maybe even just seconds before death; a choice.

That is what I love about the Catholic doctrine of purgatory. It is nothing more than the mercy of God which purifies us so that we may enter the wedding feast.

Have hope in God’s mercy, Anna and pray, pray, pray for your son. My priest told me that there are no prayers as powerful as a mother’s for her children. I know this may be a little too Catholic for you, right now, but also ask Jesus’ own mother, Mary, to pray for your son as well. Who would know better what you are feeling? And she has the inside track!

God bless you.

Steve

 

[Cristiano]

Thank you for understanding I do hope that few people are in hell and that we all get a chance for true contrition. I struggle with this because my Dad was killed in a car accident rather suddenly when I was 16 and we weren’t really a family that attended confession regularly, although we went to mass on Sundays. I worry a lot about him and his soul and the souls of others who don’t necessarily see death coming.

I also really have a hard time imagining being happy in heaven when my loved ones are suffering in hell, and I have a hard time imagining that God could be happy with His children in hell. I know that I can’t stand to see my son suffer for even a moment, and even if he hated me, it would tear me up.

I am sorry for your experience. You have to understand that a so called “sudden” death in a car accident in not instantaneous in God’s time, it takes a long time. It is plenty of time to recognize and accept the final opportunity that God’s mercy gives us even if the people around the dying are not aware of it. Do not despair and keep praying and have Masses said for the souls of purgatory, that is what they really need.

 

[Anna_Scott]

Hi Anna.

I think there are many of us who can empathize with your thoughts when it comes to our children who seem to have no interest in “Church”. My kids all tell me they believe in God but they don’t believe they have to belong to a Church. One of my sons told me, though, that he didn’t know what he would do if I ever lost my faith. My faith was that important to him. I was blown away. I said “What about your faith?” He said he was working on it.

My point is this. God’s mercy is an ocean. When you think about how much you love your son, remember that we cannot even conceive of God’s love for your son. The last thing God wants is for anyone to be lost. Look at what He did to save us. I have to believe that hell is reserved for the absolute wicked. You also should remember that your prayers and tears for your son also make a difference. God will impart grace to your son because of your prayers and none of us know what effect that grace will have, maybe even just seconds before death; a choice.

That is what I love about the Catholic doctrine of purgatory. It is nothing more than the mercy of God which purifies us so that we may enter the wedding feast.

Have hope in God’s mercy, Anna and pray, pray, pray for your son. My priest told me that there are no prayers as powerful as a mother’s for her children. I know this may be a little too Catholic for you, right now, but also ask Jesus’ own mother, Mary, to pray for your son as well. Who would know better what you are feeling? And she has the inside track!

God bless you.

Steve

SteveVH,

Your post brought me to tears. Thank you for reminding me of God’s great mercy and the power of a mother’s prayers. I’ve never asked the Virgin Mary for help. Maybe this is a good time to start. This situation with my son has been weighing so heavily on me. I can’t bear the thought of him spending an eternity without God, or continuing to live his life without knowing Christ and serving Him. I’m not usually so emotional. Love touches the deepest part of us, and at this moment I feel like I could cry a thousand tears.

Peace,
Anna

 

[SteveVH]

SteveVH,

Your post brought me to tears. Thank you for reminding me of God’s great mercy and the power of a mother’s prayers. I’ve never asked the Virgin Mary for help. Maybe this is a good time to start. This situation with my son has been weighing so heavily on me. I can’t bear the thought of him spending an eternity without God, or continuing to live his life without knowing Christ and serving Him. I’m not usually so emotional. Love touches the deepest part of us, and at this moment I feel like I could cry a thousand tears.

Peace,
Anna

As a father, I pray for my kid’s salvation every evening. I can’t tell you how many people in my own little parish are going through the same thing. In fact, we had about fifteen mothers who started a prayer group for this very purpose. They meet once a week and pray the rosary for their kids. Maybe you could start a prayer group in your own Church. I guarantee you that you’re not the only one there with these concerns.

St. Augustine’s mother prayed for 30 years for his conversion and look what happened to him!

Blessings.

Steve

 

[GaryTaylor]

As a father, I pray for my kid’s salvation every evening. I can’t tell you how many people in my own little parish are going through the same thing. In fact, we had about fifteen mothers who started a prayer group for this very purpose. They meet once a week and pray the rosary for their kids. Maybe you could start a prayer group in your own Church. I guarantee you that you’re not the only one there with these concerns.

St. Augustine’s mother prayed for 30 years for his conversion and look what happened to him!

Blessings.

Steve

Yes Sir we all go through this. Not sure if it was this thread or another where I was talking about the teens here. Anyway as an adult I always insisted on doing the things different where I felt it imperative. As difficult as it was I refused to hit the kids, chose to keep an honest line of communication. I always wanted them to feel they could tell us anything.

I grew a bit different with a house of boys and Catholic Sisters at school, whom I was more scared of than my father.

The situation just prior to teen and early teen is where it becomes very trying. Which is why meals together are imperative. Its not the meal, its the conversation daily

The Rosary? I could talk about it all day. I watched my mother who’s 90 pray it daily as long as I can remember, she still does. My grandmother had an alter in her home, went to mass and prayed the rosary daily. She went to church dying with stage IV cancer daily. She lived right across the street from the church, so it was common for the Priests etc to be there for a meal etc.

I just couldn’t get to the Rosary. Not that I ever doubted for a moment the reality of the Blessed Mother. Though she appears late in Luke and John Her radiance shines through. I just assumed I could shoot a curve and go straight to God.

Though I can’t say the Lord wasn’t always there, I didn’t feel the presence as I do now, until I decided to make an honest effort with the recitation of the Rosary. From that point I felt as through I was being led and I believe I was. Instead of doing my will, I was then doing the will as instructed by the Blessed Mother for God. Everything made sense

More important is that God just like with Abraham looks down to see if there are enough good rightous men to repress evil and destruction. We are in a period such as this today. In Fatima and through the Blue Army and Confraternity of the Rosary hundreds of thousands have regained the ability to see God through the barriers of this world, thanks to what Mary chose to take on as a responsibility for the Holy Spirit. You might say the triumphs of the Blessed Mother are quiet, but they are nonetheless very real.

I’m convinced in this period we live, one of the most single important devotions you can take on is the Confraternaty of the Rosary. Its free, doesn’t cost a penny, if there is a more noble cause and plan for world peace I haven’t heard or read it.

rosary-center.org/

God Bless, Gary

 

[1voice]

Well, it’s not a popular theory, but “In itself, it is no rejection of Catholic dogma to suppose that God might at times, by way of exception, liberate a soul from hell.”

newadvent.org/cathen/07207a.htm

I wouldnt bet my life on it.

 

[SteveVH]

Yes Sir we all go through this. Not sure if it was this thread or another where I was talking about the teens here. Anyway as an adult I always insisted on doing the things different where I felt it imperative. As difficult as it was I refused to hit the kids, chose to keep an honest line of communication. I always wanted them to feel they could tell us anything.

I grew a bit different with a house of boys and Catholic Sisters at school, whom I was more scared of than my father.

The situation just prior to teen and early teen is where it becomes very trying. Which is why meals together are imperative. Its not the meal, its the conversation daily

The Rosary? I could talk about it all day. I watched my mother who’s 90 pray it daily as long as I can remember, she still does. My grandmother had an alter in her home, went to mass and prayed the rosary daily. She went to church dying with stage IV cancer daily. She lived right across the street from the church, so it was common for the Priests etc to be there for a meal etc.

I just couldn’t get to the Rosary. Not that I ever doubted for a moment the reality of the Blessed Mother. Though she appears late in Luke and John Her radiance shines through. I just assumed I could shoot a curve and go straight to God.

Though I can’t say the Lord wasn’t always there, I didn’t feel the presence as I do now, until I decided to make an honest effort with the recitation of the Rosary. From that point I felt as through I was being led and I believe I was. Instead of doing my will, I was then doing the will as instructed by the Blessed Mother for God. Everything made sense

More important is that God just like with Abraham looks down to see if there are enough good rightous men to repress evil and destruction. We are in a period such as this today. In Fatima and through the Blue Army and Confraternity of the Rosary hundreds of thousands have regained the ability to see God through the barriers of this world, thanks to what Mary chose to take on as a responsibility for the Holy Spirit. You might say the triumphs of the Blessed Mother are quiet, but they are nonetheless very real.

I’m convinced in this period we live, one of the most single important devotions you can take on is the Confraternaty of the Rosary. Its free, doesn’t cost a penny, if there is a more noble cause and plan for world peace I haven’t heard or read it.

rosary-center.org/

God Bless, Gary

 

[Thoughtfulone]

Christiano, thank you so much for your kindness on this thread. You have really helped me a great deal, especially what you said about what happens at the moment of death. This makes a lot of sense and gives me great comfort.

And Anna, bless you, and remember that Satan tries to tempt us to despair by making us doubt in God’s mercy. We must have faith in Him and continue to pray for our loved ones!