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VanitasVanitatum
Guest
For the most part, small decisions like that are for the most part trivial and don’t change much of anything in society.
Is lack of the ability to procreate the sole reason homosexual activity is a sin?
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o_mlly
Guest
The proliferation of human acts ordered only to pleasure precede the decline of all great civilizations. Sexual perversion and hedonic eating lead the list. Societies that attempt to normalize these perversions only hasten their decline. How many food channels on your local TV? Can anyone watch a movie w/o a gratuitous sex scene anymore?
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EndTimes
Guest
No.
Nothing within Catholicism’s Teachings suggests that notion…
What happened to Sodom and Gomorrah tells the tale
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jantonov
Guest
Take my word for it: homosexuality is one of the worst sins imaginable. It is really bad. I myself was such a sinner, before I repented and was absolved. I am now finally free from being an unwitting and unwilling slave to Satan.
Look, I’m not sure about what exists in the other unseen dimensions. I am, however, certain that both I and Father Alex heard someone clearly come in and out of the church after my confession and absolution.
Saint Paul The Apostle, in his letter to Romans, explains not only why homosexuality is abominable, but also the origins of this particular sin.
Read the Law of Moses. Read the law of the prophets. This Law is a very good moral codex. It explains what you should and shouldn’t do, so that God does not find you abominable. This is however not enough for Christ himself said that the first commandment is to love God with all your heart and all your soul, and the second commandment is like the first: love thy neighbor as thyself. Upon these rest the heavens and the earth.
You cannot, in view of the Law of Moses, claim to love God and sodomize thy neighbor. Nor is that showing any love to thy neighbor. You two have sunk to the bottom of moral corruption and are now unwillingly subverting other younger persons to partake of your sin. I have seen it: you cannot - you simply are not physically able to lead a righteous lifestyle and partake of homosexuality. The Lord will deliver you into wrath which is a deadly sin. It results in bloodshed.
Now, to those who have felt these lustful urges: homosexuality may feel “natural”. It, however, is a gross perversion of man’s goal to serve and love God; for a sexual union of two men will not produce an issue. It is an abomination of God’s work: the so called natural functions of your body. . . .
For it is written: ‘Do not have sex with a man as with a woman. It is Detestable.’ Leviticus 18:22.
It is detestable in the eyes of the Lord your God because he commanded mankind with a blessing “Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky and over every living creature that moves on the ground.” Genesis 1:28.
He is the Lord who led the jews out of the land of Egypt, He is the only God there is, God almighty who wrestled with Jacob. . . .
Look, I’m not sure about what exists in the other unseen dimensions. I am, however, certain that both I and Father Alex heard someone clearly come in and out of the church after my confession and absolution.
Saint Paul The Apostle, in his letter to Romans, explains not only why homosexuality is abominable, but also the origins of this particular sin.
Read the Law of Moses. Read the law of the prophets. This Law is a very good moral codex. It explains what you should and shouldn’t do, so that God does not find you abominable. This is however not enough for Christ himself said that the first commandment is to love God with all your heart and all your soul, and the second commandment is like the first: love thy neighbor as thyself. Upon these rest the heavens and the earth.
You cannot, in view of the Law of Moses, claim to love God and sodomize thy neighbor. Nor is that showing any love to thy neighbor. You two have sunk to the bottom of moral corruption and are now unwillingly subverting other younger persons to partake of your sin. I have seen it: you cannot - you simply are not physically able to lead a righteous lifestyle and partake of homosexuality. The Lord will deliver you into wrath which is a deadly sin. It results in bloodshed.
Now, to those who have felt these lustful urges: homosexuality may feel “natural”. It, however, is a gross perversion of man’s goal to serve and love God; for a sexual union of two men will not produce an issue. It is an abomination of God’s work: the so called natural functions of your body. . . .
For it is written: ‘Do not have sex with a man as with a woman. It is Detestable.’ Leviticus 18:22.
It is detestable in the eyes of the Lord your God because he commanded mankind with a blessing “Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky and over every living creature that moves on the ground.” Genesis 1:28.
He is the Lord who led the jews out of the land of Egypt, He is the only God there is, God almighty who wrestled with Jacob. . . .
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MarkRome
Guest
No, the act itself isn’t ordered to procreation. It’s not about the ability to conceive otherwise it would be sin if a sterile couple engaged in the marital act.
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gama232
Guest
Are you living how you want? If so, why do you need anyone’s approval? Has any Catholic personally caused you grief and pain? Have they walked up to you and caused you grief and pain? If not, you have no argument.
The truth the Church teaches is not a ‘position,’ it is the truth. We are all here today due to heterosexual activity. The obvious truth should be obvious.
The truth the Church teaches is not a ‘position,’ it is the truth. We are all here today due to heterosexual activity. The obvious truth should be obvious.
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gama232
Guest
To my fellow Catholics:
Follow Church teaching, which is meant for all men, and do not follow strangers who tell you it’s wrong. The truth is not an opinion. The term ‘hard question’ does not mean anything. And the Church has the truth, not a ‘policy.’
Galileo? How lame. I suggest every Catholic read about what actually happened to Galileo as opposed to accepting another line about how the Church got it wrong - again. And slavery? What did the Church get wrong there? Find out. Don’t just accept accusations without knowing what actually happened.
Follow Church teaching, which is meant for all men, and do not follow strangers who tell you it’s wrong. The truth is not an opinion. The term ‘hard question’ does not mean anything. And the Church has the truth, not a ‘policy.’
Galileo? How lame. I suggest every Catholic read about what actually happened to Galileo as opposed to accepting another line about how the Church got it wrong - again. And slavery? What did the Church get wrong there? Find out. Don’t just accept accusations without knowing what actually happened.
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gama232
Guest
“damage”? What damage? Gay people have same-sex marriage. The end. I am aware of the other issues. The Church is not a political organization. You are free to disagree with whatever it teaches. You are obviously looking for the Church’s approval based on the false ‘it’s all good’ thinking. Two men and two women are not one man and one woman. But, according to the Supreme Court, they can get married. You want the Church to change? Contact the Vatican. Present your arguments.
I have worked with gays, lesbians and transgender. At that time, I could care less about what they did in private. Now it’s very much in your face in the media. Why? Gay people can live how they want. In the past, privacy meant something, today, no. If gay couples, including women, have same-sex marriage, what do they want from the Church? They can go to Church. No one will be standing by the door to ask what their sexual orientation is.
I have worked with gays, lesbians and transgender. At that time, I could care less about what they did in private. Now it’s very much in your face in the media. Why? Gay people can live how they want. In the past, privacy meant something, today, no. If gay couples, including women, have same-sex marriage, what do they want from the Church? They can go to Church. No one will be standing by the door to ask what their sexual orientation is.
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Paul_Edwards
Guest
We must make a distinction between that which is by accident that that which is by nature. Some people by accident or timing cannot procreate, but that does not change the fact that particular physical act itself is designed by God as a procreative act and so it is moral.
On the contrary Homosexuality never has or ever will result in procreation and so that is certainly not part of Gods plan. This is not an accident(like infertility) or due to timing(like menopause) but this is rather deliberate and absolute. This indicates clearly that God plans for heterosexuality but not for homosexuality to take place.
No law can be based upon exceptions or accidents, a law cannot be subjective, but it must rather be based upon what is objective and general and usual.
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gama232
Guest
“pain” is an emotion word. It is not argument. Are people free to not attend a gay wedding based on Church teaching? Are Catholic adoption agencies free to close to uphold Church teaching? Do people have the freedom to practice their faith in public?
LGBT groups have lobbied for what they wanted. The Catholic Church has been consistent. This is not a one-way street. “position” is the wrong word. This is not about politics but the correct definition of human sexuality. In the meantime, aren’t gay weddings happening? If you don’t like what the Church is doing, don’t try to lobby Catholics here. Are gay couples adopting?
This “pain” argument is just like the pre-Supreme Court “Why are you standing in the way of our happiness?” So now with same-sex marriage and still not happy? No good argument.
LGBT groups have lobbied for what they wanted. The Catholic Church has been consistent. This is not a one-way street. “position” is the wrong word. This is not about politics but the correct definition of human sexuality. In the meantime, aren’t gay weddings happening? If you don’t like what the Church is doing, don’t try to lobby Catholics here. Are gay couples adopting?
This “pain” argument is just like the pre-Supreme Court “Why are you standing in the way of our happiness?” So now with same-sex marriage and still not happy? No good argument.
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gama232
Guest
Animals do not have human level cognition. There is no valid comparison.
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gama232
Guest
Guess what? Your post relies on cases and examples outside of my experience. The Church is free to lobby against a situation that can cause problems. Have you read any Church documents?
Why does a person’s sex matter for marriage?
"One’s sex matters for marriage because the body matters for love, and especially, spousal love. A person’s body is a necessary part of identity, even though who we are cannot be reduced to “just” our bodies. As St. John Paul II said, the body reveals the person. It is a deeply personal reality, not just a biological fact (see TOB, 14 Nov, 1979). Loving as a human person means loving as a man or as a woman. Our bodies direct us toward the other sex because we can never be the other sex. Only a man and a woman can truly unite and become “one flesh.”
“To consider the body (and one’s sex) as unimportant to marriage means treating the body as inconsequential or, at best, as an object or tool to be used according to one’s pleasure or desire. Instead, we know that the body is an essential – and beautiful – aspect of being human and loving as a human person. The spousal love between husband and wife calls for a free, full, faithful, and fruitful gift of self to each other, including the gift of their bodies. Sexual difference is necessary for such a full self-gift.” USCCB
No Catholic should accept anything other than what the Church teaches. You are free to disagree. I have never treated a gay, lesbian or transgender person differently, however, the Church has the authority to deny adoption to gay couples to protect Church teaching. Does religious freedom exist? Apparently not, according to you.
LGBT groups are making a point of shoving what they want in our faces. That’s a fact.
Why does a person’s sex matter for marriage?
"One’s sex matters for marriage because the body matters for love, and especially, spousal love. A person’s body is a necessary part of identity, even though who we are cannot be reduced to “just” our bodies. As St. John Paul II said, the body reveals the person. It is a deeply personal reality, not just a biological fact (see TOB, 14 Nov, 1979). Loving as a human person means loving as a man or as a woman. Our bodies direct us toward the other sex because we can never be the other sex. Only a man and a woman can truly unite and become “one flesh.”
“To consider the body (and one’s sex) as unimportant to marriage means treating the body as inconsequential or, at best, as an object or tool to be used according to one’s pleasure or desire. Instead, we know that the body is an essential – and beautiful – aspect of being human and loving as a human person. The spousal love between husband and wife calls for a free, full, faithful, and fruitful gift of self to each other, including the gift of their bodies. Sexual difference is necessary for such a full self-gift.” USCCB
No Catholic should accept anything other than what the Church teaches. You are free to disagree. I have never treated a gay, lesbian or transgender person differently, however, the Church has the authority to deny adoption to gay couples to protect Church teaching. Does religious freedom exist? Apparently not, according to you.
LGBT groups are making a point of shoving what they want in our faces. That’s a fact.
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humbleseeker
Guest
Please read the Catechism sections 2357 and
2358 to understand the Church’s official position on gays and how they should be treated by faithful Catholics.
The Church does not lobby against either if the action is not being asked to be performed within a Catholic ceremony or institution. If you are asking the Catholic Church to recognize a Gay marriage as valid/sacramental or that the Catholic Church cannot regulate a Catholic adoption agency based on Catholic teaching then you are violating your premise that:
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AlNg
Guest
Are there not errors in the Bible? This would not be possible if God was the author.
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gama232
Guest
Please point out a few errors.
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AlNg
Guest
Matthew 13: 32 says that the mustard seed is the smallest of all seeds.
It is not. Orchid seeds are smaller. It also says that the mustard seed becomes a tree. It does not. It becomes a bush.
John 7: 38 Anyone who believes in me may come and drink! For the Scriptures declare, ‘Rivers of living water will flow from his heart.’”
Where is this in Scripture? I thought that living waters come from God, not from believers in God?
1 Chronicles 19: 18 David killed 7000 charioteers before they fled.
2 Samuel 10: 18 David killed 700 charioteers before they fled.
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Freddy
Guest
Should we burn prostitutes and stone adulterers?
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Freddy
Guest
Let’s say you are a young Catholic who has found this forum and is looking for answers to her personal problem. Which is that she is gay. She hasn’t chosen go be gay. It is simply part of who she is. She is confused and not a little scared about what people might think of her. Then she comes across this thread and just in the last couple of dozen posts she reads:
HomoSexuality is akin to Alcoholism… LUSTism…
Homosexuality is one of the worst sins imaginable.
You cannot, in view of the Law of Moses, claim to love God and sodomize thy neighbor.
It, however, is a gross perversion.
Sexual perversion and hedonic eating lead the list.
Plus we have had comparisons of homosexuality to paedophilia, necrophilia and bestiality.
And you ask if anyone has caused any pain? To call someone a pervert? To suggest that they cannot love God because they ‘sodomise’ their neighbour? To compare them to paedophiles? That she has no love in her heart but only lust? That what she feels is actually an illness?
Are you serious?
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gama232
Guest
Regarding the smallest of seeds. The Bible was written for men that were used to certain things as common truths of their time. If they thought the mustard seed was smallest then it sufficed to say it was. However, challenges to the accuracy of the Bible are not new and require a bit of research. The following article explains:
www.catholic.com
Is Everything in the Bible True?
Does the Bible contain errors? If those errors are scientific or historical, as opposed to matters of faith and morals, does it even matter? These questions cam...
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Pattylt
Guest
Maybe I missed it but I don’t recall anyone saying that the church should change its stance on performing sacramental marriages in the church. The church did oppose the civil recognition of marriage in the civil court. I think it still declares that a civil gay marriage is not valid whereas it doesn’t publicly call non catholic straight marriages not valid.
Second point. A catholic agency is allowed to refuse adoption of gay couples UNLESS they accept government monies for adoption services. Once you accept government money, you must obey government civil law. They are perfectly fine rejecting gays as long as all money comes from private sources.
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