Is our relationship with God repaired by His Son?

[Karen107]

doing sins constantly and then confess.

Isn’t that wonderful that we have the sacrament of confession so we don’t have to let sin get the ‘best of us’. That’s another gift from God. Jesus is the Priest (In Persona Christi) who hears our confessions and absolves us of our sins in the name of the Father, and the Son and the Holy Spirit… See… God is with us to help us fight our spiritual battles…

 

[STT]

Why?

Because love is an emotion. We can affect it by putting proper practice but we cannot learn it.

Why not?

Because spiritual growth should be based on a proper understanding of the person from what s/he is, what life is about, etc.

Of course not. I believe you have very little understanding of what you are arguing about.

That is not correct.

 

[STT]

Why are you so preoccupied with suffering? Maybe this preoccupation influences your view of the world. If all of life were suffering you might have a point.

There are people whom their life is merely covered by suffering. We are living in good part of world.

 

[STT]

Sir God is love and truth, can you see love? Well yes you can, you can see love in nature, in another persons eyes, in Creation, and most certainly Love Comforts us especially when we suffer…Love fills us up with Goodness and light and joy and everything that we need in order to help us with our suffering. Suffering brings us closer to God if we can let it or we can just choose to wallow in our suffering… I prefer to have God wrap His big arms around me… We most certainly can see God in the Precious Body and Blood of Our Lord Jesus Christ. That is the great gift God gave us when he suffered and died for us.

I am really happy for you and the way you feel about your life.

 

[STT]

Isn’t that wonderful that we have the sacrament of confession so we don’t have to let sin get the ‘best of us’. That’s another gift from God. Jesus is the Priest (In Persona Christi) who hears our confessions and absolves us of our sins in the name of the Father, and the Son and the Holy Spirit… See… God is with us to help us fight our spiritual battles…

No, I think the most important thing is that we learn from our mistake and consider them into the account for the next time. Confessing to me doesn’t make any sense since God knows what is really inside your heart and mind so why bother confessing what you have done to a priest.

 

[John_Martin]

davidv;14459441:

Though repairqa our relationship must be perfected. We must learn to love as God loves.

We cannot learn love.

Because love is an emotion. We can affect it by putting proper practice but we cannot learn it.
Because spiritual growth should be based on a proper understanding of the person from what s/he is, what life is about, etc.

Of course everyone here knows that when you say the word “love” you are speaking of the first, the principle, movement of appetite which is followed by desire.
But everyone here also cannot understand why you have never heard of the virtue, which is named “love”. It is a habit, a learned disposition, learned from your parents or guardians (if they are virtuous parents) as they require you to do actions that benefit other people, and require you to answer questions of “what could we do that would help this person be better off or happier?”
As you grow, the disposition to doing good to others becomes an apparent and regular choice when there is the apprehension of another person. And then, habitually (with a virtue of learned love, rather than with a vice of learned non-care) your appetite is moved in the emotion of love to use the virtue of love in how you relate to the person.
Now you know that we can learn love, and use that learned virtue love in the things we are attracted to (the appetite’s movement of the passion known as love).

 

[goout]

There are people whom their life is merely covered by suffering. We are living in good part of world.

You didn’t answer the question, you merely observed that people experience suffering. I agree with that.
How do you answer the question?

 

[Aloysium]

There are people whom their life is merely covered by suffering. We are living in good part of world.

We all suffer. If not now, then later.
We can control only what we do.
What matters is how we act in our suffering and how we respond to the suffering of others.
I might agree that we are “living in (a) good part of the world”, but only in the sense of the parable of Lazarus, living the “good life” of the rich man.
In the end, we are what we do. In this life we construct the person we are for eternity.

 

[Karen107]

I am really happy for you and the way you feel about your life.

This is the way You can feel about your life. There’s no need to see suffering as a bad thing because God is there for us. That’s the answer to your question.

 

[Karen107]

No, I think the most important thing is that we learn from our mistake and consider them into the account for the next time. Confessing to me doesn’t make any sense since God knows what is really inside your heart and mind so why bother confessing what you have done to a priest.

Well of course we learn from our mistakes, especially when we confess them to another person.

So God knows what is in our heart. What then? We make our own rules up about our sins? That is troubling to think of since we are humans. Confession makes sense because the Priest is the advocate for God when we sin. He will speak truth, ministers to us, know what is and isn’t a sin, give us penance fitting our sin, knows we walk with God, and IS able to absolve sins because Jesus Christ gave the Priest the power to forgive sins so we are certain we are forgiven by God. It’s a healing sacrament. You spoke of suffering being a wound, well spiritual suffering needs healing as it is a wound to our souls. When we are in the Sacrament of reconciliation we are confessing to God and God heals us. AND when our spirits are healed our bodies also receive healing. That then speaks to your question of whether God the Father reconciled with us in the garden. The garden is paradise and paradise exists when our souls are pure and In God. Blessed are the pure In heart for they shall see God. My friend that is Paradise.

 

[STT]

Of course everyone here knows that when you say the word “love” you are speaking of the first, the principle, movement of appetite which is followed by desire.
But everyone here also cannot understand why you have never heard of the virtue, which is named “love”. It is a habit, a learned disposition, learned from your parents or guardians (if they are virtuous parents) as they require you to do actions that benefit other people, and require you to answer questions of “what could we do that would help this person be better off or happier?”
As you grow, the disposition to doing good to others becomes an apparent and regular choice when there is the apprehension of another person. And then, habitually (with a virtue of learned love, rather than with a vice of learned non-care) your appetite is moved in the emotion of love to use the virtue of love in how you relate to the person.
Now you know that we can learn love, and use that learned virtue love in the things we are attracted to (the appetite’s movement of the passion known as love).

Thank you for informing me about virtue love.

 

[STT]

You didn’t answer the question, you merely observed that people experience suffering. I agree with that. How do you answer the question?

Because suffering is useless so the question is why God left us in such a situation.

 

[STT]

So God knows what is in our heart. What then? We make our own rules up about our sins?

We don’t need to confess. We feel sorry inside our hearts and minds and that is enough. Why tell our secretes to other individuals?

 

[John_Martin]

We don’t need to confess. We feel sorry inside our hearts and minds and that is enough. Why tell our secretes to other individuals?

Feeling sorry means you regret having hurt someone, and you let them know you hurt them and want them to not hate you, but still consider you their friend.
God is the one we hurt with moral wrongs, along with his creature that we hurt.
So we tell God we are sorry for offending him and ask him to let us continue being his friend. We tell it to his official representative, the Priest, who then replies for God back to us, either forgiving us for God, or asking us to first correct something to make friendship’s continuance possible.

We confess with these words, or words like them, "My God, I am heartily sorry for having OFFENDED you… " etc. Confession is notice of the one hurt. It is not just bad deeds, but another person hurt by what I did.

So, it is absolutely necessary to tell the secret, and re-establish the friendship with my Friend, God.

 

[STT]

Feeling sorry means you regret having hurt someone, and you let them know you hurt them and want them to not hate you, but still consider you their friend.
God is the one we hurt with moral wrongs, along with his creature that we hurt.
So we tell God we are sorry for offending him and ask him to let us continue being his friend. We tell it to his official representative, the Priest, who then replies for God back to us, either forgiving us for God, or asking us to first correct something to make friendship’s continuance possible.

We confess with these words, or words like them, "My God, I am heartily sorry for having OFFENDED you… " etc. Confession is notice of the one hurt. It is not just bad deeds, but another person hurt by what I did.

So, it is absolutely necessary to tell the secret, and re-establish the friendship with my Friend, God.

That I agree. I meant why we should go to priest and confess to them? God knows that we are sorry and we ask for forgiveness to those individuals that we hurt and that is enough.

 

[goout]

Because suffering is useless so the question is why God left us in such a situation.

You still not address the question. Here is the question again. Please, see if you can just speak to it.

Originally Posted by goout View Post
Why are you so preoccupied with suffering? Maybe this preoccupation influences your view of the world.

 

[Vonsalza]

We don’t need to confess. We feel sorry inside our hearts and minds and that is enough. Why tell our secretes to other individuals?

That I agree. I meant why we should go to priest and confess to them? God knows that we are sorry and we ask for forgiveness to those individuals that we hurt and that is enough.

As Catholics, we confess because scripture tells us to confess our sins to a priest for forgiveness because they were given the authority to forgive them by Christ - as mentioned specifically in scripture.

Moreover, after your confession, you are to make reconciliation for the harm your sin has caused. “Sorry” doesn’t restore embezzled funds, “sorry” doesn’t repair a broken window, “sorry” doesn’t bring back someone you killed because you drove drunk. Your priest instructs you on what this reconciling action will be, especially when it’s not obvious. As a easy, soft-pitch example, if you stole ten bucks from someone, your priest is probably going to tell you that you must give it back.

Because suffering is useless so the question is why God left us in such a situation.

Respectfully, your constant habit of reciting axioms as facts is a bit tiring. You have no way of knowing that suffering is useless in any particular situation. No way at all. None.

By rule of logic, you simply cannot use an axiom of questionable truth value as a “true” premise in a syllogism and expect everyone to pretend your argument is valid and thus deserves consideration. By rule it’s not and thus doesn’t.

This is something you do very, very frequently.

 

[Karen107]

We don’t need to confess. We feel sorry inside our hearts and minds and that is enough. Why tell our secretes to other individuals?

Let me show you in scripture.

James 5: 16*Therefore confess your sins to one another, and pray for one another, so that you may be healed. The prayer of the righteous is powerful and effective.

So where in scripture does it mention the sacrament of reconciliation?

2 Corinthians 5:16From now on, therefore, we regard no one from a human point of view; even though we once knew Christ from a human point of view, we know him no longer in that way. 17So if anyone is in Christ, there is a new creation: everything old has passed away; see, everything has become new!

18All this is from God, who reconciled us to himself through Christ, and has given us the ministry of reconciliation; 19that is, in Christ God was reconciling the world to himself,[d] not counting their trespasses against them, and entrusting the message of reconciliation to us. 20So we are ambassadors for Christ, since God is making his appeal through us; we entreat you on behalf of Christ, be reconciled to God.* 21*For our sake he made him to be sin who knew no sin, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God.

So 2 Corinthians 5:18 speaks to your original question… We are reconciled to God through the sacrament of reconciliation…That’s why Jesus started the Church, to have us ministered to and reconciled to God. In the Sacrament of Reconciliation our hearts are transformed and turn back to God and receive grace (conversion)… In the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit… Amen

 

[Vonsalza]

As a philosophical public service announcement - the default truth value of literally any statement is “uncertain”, no matter how obvious it may appear; no matter who said it.

A man and his argument are two separate things. The fact that he may have a PhD in whatever he’s talking about doesn’t matter. There’s almost certainly someone else with a PhD in the same field who disagrees.

So how should we approach any kind of statement, including axioms?

“This is true unless you can prove it false.” Wrong. :nope:

“This is false unless you can prove it true.” Wrong. :nope:

“This is uncertain until proven otherwise.” There ya go!!! :choocho:

It might be hard to believe, but virtually everything metaphysical is very, very difficult to empirically prove. This is because it’s not a quantitative subject. Hypothesis testing - the primary way we “prove” things, generally requires quantifiable objects in order to “work”.

Can a moderator pull this out and put it in a “sticky” in the “Philosophy” directory? I’m only 40% joking.

 

[Karen107]

As a philosophical public service announcement - the default truth value of literally any statement is “uncertain”, no matter how obvious it may appear; no matter who said it.

A man and his argument are two separate things. The fact that he may have a PhD in whatever he’s talking about doesn’t matter. There’s almost certainly someone else with a PhD in the same field who disagrees.

So how should we approach any kind of statement, including axioms?

“This is true unless you can prove it false.” Wrong. :nope:

“This is false unless you can prove it true.” Wrong. :nope:

“This is uncertain until proven otherwise.” There ya go!!! :choocho:

It might be hard to believe, but virtually everything metaphysical is very, very difficult to empirically prove. This is because it’s not a quantitative subject. Hypothesis testing - the primary way we “prove” things, generally requires quantifiable objects in order to “work”.

Can a moderator pull this out and put it in a “sticky” in the “Philosophy” directory? I’m only 40% joking.

The truth is truth because it’s the truth! Yeah well 6 pages of the same thing going on is too much anyway…lol Let the spirit of God lead STT to the truth, he’s not hearing us anyways… ."