J. Lo and the "Lowdown" on Fur

  • Thread starter Thread starter Catholicvegan
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
40.png
Catholicvegan:
Dear Condan,

Is the “farm” you claim to have been at a factory farm? A big slaughterhouse? Or a little barn with some animals? Please clarify for me. Also, you can go on about corrupt governments if you please but the facts have been presented and you cannot deny them as a testimony to the waste and greed of the U.S. meat industry.
A little barn with some animals?? Get real. Try 75,000 chickens raised for Tyson industries, millions of pounds of feed corn annually and a sizeable herd of milk cows sitting on 102 acres, in the middle of hundreds of other similar prosperous farms.

I would imagine that every industry has a fair amount of waste and greed with meat being no different. It doesn’t concern me in the least because people, who are infinitely more important than animals, need to eat. Further, the animals who live in my house are carnivores as well and they eat the by-products. So, waste and greed not withstanding, I’ll keep the meat industry. You refer to only the U.S. meat industry. Is the European meat industry better? How have they been handling the outbreak of Mad Cow disease and its seepage into the human food chain? It seems like the greedy and wasteful U.S. meat industry has been doing a better job, especially when considering the difference in the size of the markets.
 
40.png
Catholicvegan:
Dear Lisa N,

In regards to your health remarks, with the rise of the whole Atkins diet, it might help one lose weight, but at what cost? Your cholesterol will [will? according to whom? Personal experience, or heresay? Have you researched this?] skyrocket, and numerous other side effects will occur [such as…weight loss, fabulous skin, thicker hair, excellent nails, healthier hearts, better self esteem…pretty good side effects, I think!]. People do need protein to survive, but your claim that the “most complete” source is meat is simply ridiculous. Did you not see my previous post about that very matter? Please refer to that.
I’m not Lisa N, but you ignorance about the Atkins diet is glaring!!

I eat low carb. I have done so for 6 years (since 1999). I have had my blood work done every 2 years, with my starting cholesterol in 1999 at 230. I had blood drawn again last week, and guess what!! My cholesterol is 198. My LDL has gone down to 119 (and stayed down), my HDL has gone up to 68 (and stayed up). My mom has similar results. My MIL has similar results. My doctor thinks low carb is a great way to eat. So at what cost, you ask? Well, lowered cholesterol, lowered weight, no longer pre-diabetic…a pretty good cost, I think!!

So, CatholicVegan, before you open your mouth and stick your meaty foot in again, do a little educated research, and don’t just accept the conventional media’s garbage.

Meat is tasty, good for you, delicious, delectable, and just simply good eating!
 
originally posted by ByzCath
Animals are not equal to man. I could suggest that an animal does not feel pain as it is not sentient. That to feel pain as we do requries a level of intelligence an animal does not have.
I hope “could suggest” are the operative words here. Have you ever a accidently (Ihope!!) stepped on a dog’s foot? Don’t tell me animals don’t feel pain.
 
40.png
Catholicvegan:
Jennifer Lopez’s new fashion line features the skin of dead animals. No one should be wearing this, and it is awful that she has to show it off whenever she goes somewhere. Don’t support this, and don’t support the cruel fur industry by buying and wearing fur! If you would like more information, please, visit these websites:

jlodown.com

furisdead.com

peta.org
Does this mean I have to get rid of my wife’s $7,500 long mink coat to be considered a “good” Catholic? Do I throw it away, or bring it to church for a funeral and proper burial? I am so confused? Oh well, I am out to get a Double Bacon Cheeseburger. See you all around.
 
40.png
Scott_Lafrance:
Does this mean I have to get rid of my wife’s $7,500 long mink coat to be considered a “good” Catholic? Do I throw it away, or bring it to church for a funeral and proper burial? I am so confused? Oh well, I am out to get a Double Bacon Cheeseburger. See you all around.
Be sure and wear your fur trimmed leather jacket when you go, it’s cold out there. :o
 
40.png
HagiaSophia:
Be sure and wear your fur trimmed leather jacket when you go, it’s cold out there. :o
And my leather pants, and my leather boots, and gloves, and my leather and fur thong.
 
40.png
Scott_Lafrance:
Does this mean I have to get rid of my wife’s $7,500 long mink coat to be considered a “good” Catholic? Do I throw it away, or bring it to church for a funeral and proper burial? I am so confused? Oh well, I am out to get a Double Bacon Cheeseburger. See you all around.
Nope, Scott. You give it to your sweet VP! I’d gladly wear it.
 
40.png
Catholicvegan:
Dear Condan,

I think that you have no idea about the way animal rights groups are. Ironically, you are acting “holier-than-thou” yourself by stereotyping these groups. The reality is that you, like most Americans, have been led to believe (by the meat and dairy industry) that meat and dairy products are essential for decent health. Yet we look at the country: some teenagers have arteries that are so clogged we wonder how old they really are. The obesity rate is enormous, and who can be blamed? The meat and dairy industries. And since you obviously don’t care for the well-being of animals, consider this:
  • Number of people worldwide who will die as a result of malnutrition this year: 20 million
  • Number of people who could be adequately fed using land freed if Americans reduced their intake of meat by 10%: 100 million
  • Percentage of corn grown in the U.S. eaten by people: 20
    *- *Percentage of corn grown in the U.S. eaten by livestock: 80
  • Percentage of oats grown in the U.S. eaten by livestock: 95
  • Percentage of protein wasted by cycling grain through livestock: 90
  • How frequently a child dies as a result of malnutrition: every 2.3 seconds
  • Pounds of potatoes that can be grown on an acre: 40,000
  • Pounds of beef produced on an acre: 250
  • Percentage of U.S. farmland devoted to beef production: 56
  • Pounds of grain and soybeans needed to produce a pound of edible flesh from feedlot beef: 16
Perhaps, the fate of millions who hunger will move you. Meat kills. In so many ways, meat kills.

Dear gnjsdad,

There is a moral argument, and you are ignorant of it.
Tons of US produced grain (including soy) rots in warehouses each year. It has been known for years that the world DOES produce enough food for everyone to have an ample amount of daily calories. The problem is not in production, but in distribution. We simply do not have methods in place to get the food where it needs to go before it goes bad. Instead of spending your time encouraging people to change their own personal healthy eating habits, wouldn’t it be better to work on a better distribution system so that people get an adaquate amount of food? If we can’t distribute the excess grain we have now, how is the US cutting down on meat consumption going to help?

And really, even if we had an easily workable model for grain distribution, that alone would not solve the world’s hunger issues. There will still be places like North Korea, where when food is sent to help the peasants, the government grabs it and instead feeds it to their soldiers.
 
40.png
Almeria:
Tons of US produced grain (including soy) rots in warehouses each year. It has been known for years that the world DOES produce enough food for everyone to have an ample amount of daily calories. The problem is not in production, but in distribution. We simply do not have methods in place to get the food where it needs to go before it goes bad.
I don’t think this is true–we do have adequate methods of distribution, but because the United States generally has a diet based on delayed consumption, most of the grain is slated for animal feed. In other words, the capacity for adequate distribution exists, but the economic/gastronomic norms in our country do not permit it.

Unlike most of the world, meat figures significantly into the daily diet of U.S. citizens. Third world countries tend to be vegeterian, but not by choice. The same amount of grain needed to feed one head of cattle can feed 10 people, and so delayed consumption is too costly an option in most countries, given their population size. The grain must go directly to the people.

If North Americans altered their diet, more grain could be used more effectively as food, both locally and abroad. This is simply a fact–I am not necessarily advocating it.
 
40.png
Catholicvegan:
Dear Lisa N,

In regards to your health remarks, with the rise of the whole Atkins diet, it might help one lose weight, but at what cost? Your cholesterol will skyrocket, and numerous other side effects will occur. People do need protein to survive, but your claim that the “most complete” source is meat is simply ridiculous. Did you not see my previous post about that very matter? Please refer to that.
CV I am no fan of the Atkins craze. I work for heart docs and we believe it is unhealthy in the long run. OTOH the POINT that you have conveniently ignored, is that you claim a high meat diet causes weight gain which is totally absurd.

As to your post on nutrition, you do not have any credibility so I don’t find your post informative.
Lisa N
 
40.png
Scott_Lafrance:
… and my leather and fur thong.
:rotfl: :rotfl:

Man, thats funny. Now I’m gonna go vomit to get the image of a grown man wearing one of those things out of my head. 😃
 
wabrams said:
:rotfl: :rotfl:

Man, thats funny. Now I’m gonna go vomit to get the image of a grown man wearing one of those things out of my head. 😃

I COULD post a picture…
 
40.png
maendem:
I don’t think this is true–we do have adequate methods of distribution, but because the United States generally has a diet based on delayed consumption, most of the grain is slated for animal feed. In other words, the capacity for adequate distribution exists, but the economic/gastronomic norms in our country do not permit it.

Unlike most of the world, meat figures significantly into the daily diet of U.S. citizens. Third world countries tend to be vegeterian, but not by choice. The same amount of grain needed to feed one head of cattle can feed 10 people, and so delayed consumption is too costly an option in most countries, given their population size. The grain must go directly to the people.

If North Americans altered their diet, more grain could be used more effectively as food, both locally and abroad. This is simply a fact–I am not necessarily advocating it.
But your fact assumes that there is a shortage of food, world-wide. There isn’t.

People starve because governments and warlords use starvation as a weapon. People starve because of lack of transportation. People starve because corrupt governments use international credit to line their own pockets instead of develop their countries’ economy and transportation net.
 
vern humphrey:
But your fact assumes that there is a shortage of food, world-wide. There isn’t.

People starve because governments and warlords use starvation as a weapon. People starve because of lack of transportation. People starve because corrupt governments use international credit to line their own pockets instead of develop their countries’ economy and transportation net.
No one starves in a country where civil liberties and property rights are protected. It has NOTHING to do with how many cornfields feed cows vis a vis people. People in the US do not starve because we were founded on property rights and human rights. Compare this to a country where people COULD feed themselves but they are under the thumb of a corrupt dictator and have no property rights.

Also don’t forget the environmental whackos who won’t allow DDT in Africa to kill mosquitos. So we spend billions treating diseases that don’t need to happen…

Lisa N
 
Last time I checked, J-Lo wasn’t the poster child for modesty, so why would anyone here buy her clothing anyway?

As to diet, I believe “everything in moderation” is a pretty good rule of thumb. We eat some red meat, and we eat chicken, but not on Fridays. 😉 Anything in excess can be bad for you. People need a “balanced” diet. Whether you get that from a vegetarian or non-vegetarian diet shouldn’t matter so much among brothers and sisters in Christ. Personally, I respect the motivation of vegetarians, but I do not think I could be one.
I admire your passion, Catholicvegan. Your heart is in the right place. However, I really don’t think that eliminating meat from everyone’s diet would result in the end of hunger in the world. I think that may be a little idealistic. And would result in a lot of really crabby people. (Think of how well prohibition went over :rolleyes: ) Like we don’t have enough crabby people in this country, right? It is a nice thought, though.

Like others, I think there is a huge difference in necessity and frivolity. Fur for need and protection from cold is one thing. ( For example, the Native Americans were extremely grateful for the animals they used, and they had a use for the whole animal that provided for their needs.) Fur for the sole purpose of fashion is unnecessary and, I believe, wrong. I have no problem with fake fur for fashion reasons, though.
 
Lisa N:
No one starves in a country where civil liberties and property rights are protected. It has NOTHING to do with how many cornfields feed cows vis a vis people. People in the US do not starve because we were founded on property rights and human rights. Compare this to a country where people COULD feed themselves but they are under the thumb of a corrupt dictator and have no property rights.

Also don’t forget the environmental whackos who won’t allow DDT in Africa to kill mosquitos. So we spend billions treating diseases that don’t need to happen…

Lisa N
Dear Lisa,

Having worked for years in Texas shelters, I can tell you people in the U.S. ARE starving. It’s easy to point to corrupt dictatorships (they certainly exist) but improper distribution of food is not confined to other countries, and greed is a factor of maldistribution even more in 1st world countries than 3rd world.

Speaking of the property rights; the policies of the International Monetary Fund and World Bank have wreaked havoc on the economies of developing countries that are not under dictatorships. People are starving because these policies severely limit the amount of food that can be used internally (high export quotas are demanded) and the import prices of food for these same countries are exhorbitant. Lots of documentation available if you wish…

Your last point is quite strange–DDT has been banned in the United States because it has been directly linked to many forms of cancer. Far less toxic, and equally effective repellents have been developed since the 1970s. Why should Africa be subject to bad science and cheap, carcinogenic chemicals?
 
Well, it seems my one little post has certainly got some people reassuring themselves and each other that eating meat and wearing fur is okay! Well, I’m here to tell you that the EXACT OPPOSITE is true. Allow me to respond to each of you one at a time:

Dear Condan,

It is quite interesting that you feel that people are “infinitely more important” than animals. Why is this? Because you, like nearly everyone else here, have trouble showing compassion for anything but your fellow humans. I don’t know if you have trouble indentifying pain in an animal, but it occurs extremely often. As to your remarks about the U.S. industry, I was referring to it because that is where I live and it makes sense to use that term as the “U.S. meat indsutry” is the direct meat supplier to most Americans. Also, the U.S. meat industry has been known to pump it’s food so full of drugs to promote rapid, unnatural growth, that many foreign governments refuse to accept it. In conclusion, Condan, you can say about want about “dominion over animals” but I ask you: a mother has dominion over her child, yes? And the mother, therefore, protects and cares for the child, right? Shouldn’t we treat ALL animals (not just those who are “pets”) with kindness? Or should we exploit some and care for others? In some Asian countries, you know, people eat dog. Here, that would be a crime, a literal crime. But here we do the same they do to dogs to chickens, pigs, cows and turkeys. If all people are created equal, then why not all animals?

Dear Legeorge,

I am glad that you, unlike others here, don’t throw out my opinions, which may seem a bit extreme to some. However, I didn’t neccesarily insinuate that giving up meat would end world hunger completely, rather, I meant that it was be a large positive step toward doing so. Also, fur isn’t neccesary for warmth and protection against the cold, because we have other alternatives that are probably much more inexpensive, durable, and have the potential to keep up warm. But, obviously, I am not opposed to fake fur.

Dear Lisa N,

You say I have no credibility about health. I guess that whenever someone says something you don’t want to hear, you question their credibility. I suppose that’s in imitation of our wonderful President. But then, you know what they say: imitation is the sincerest form of flattering!

Dear Catholic90,

I was talking from personal experience, as I know several people who have left the diet because of health problems and other unwanted “side-effects.” Also, do you speak from experience when making your claims about the (alleged) positive “side-effects” of the Atkins diet? Please explain.

Dear Scott LaFrance,

Your jokes don’t amuse me much, and they are simply further proof of your obvious ignorance to animal cruelty in this world. Or, perhaps you are knowlegeable of it and simply don’t care or are denying that it occurs. Wouldn’t that be a shame! In any event, Mr. LaFrance, perhaps you wouldn’t laugh if you actually understood what animals must go through to become a coat or a meal.

Just a general note to everyone: if you don’t believe my accusations, please view some of the videos at the following sites:

“Meet Your Meat”: meetyourmeat.com

“J Lodown”: peta.org

If you questions the content of any of these videos, which you undoubtedly will, go ahead and ask me or anyone else you feel the need to.
 
Well, it seems my one little post has certainly got some people reassuring themselves and each other that eating meat and wearing fur is okay! Well, I’m here to tell you that the EXACT OPPOSITE is true. Allow me to respond to each of you one at a time:

Dear Condan,

It is quite interesting that you feel that people are “infinitely more important” than animals. Why is this? Because you, like nearly everyone else here, have trouble showing compassion for anything but your fellow humans. I don’t know if you have trouble indentifying pain in an animal, but it occurs extremely often. As to your remarks about the U.S. industry, I was referring to it because that is where I live and it makes sense to use that term as the “U.S. meat indsutry” is the direct meat supplier to most Americans. Also, the U.S. meat industry has been known to pump it’s food so full of drugs to promote rapid, unnatural growth, that many foreign governments refuse to accept it. In conclusion, Condan, you can say about want about “dominion over animals” but I ask you: a mother has dominion over her child, yes? And the mother, therefore, protects and cares for the child, right? Shouldn’t we treat ALL animals (not just those who are “pets”) with kindness? Or should we exploit some and care for others? In some Asian countries, you know, people eat dog. Here, that would be a crime, a literal crime. But here we do the same they do to dogs to chickens, pigs, cows and turkeys. If all people are created equal, then why not all animals?

Dear Legeorge,

I am glad that you, unlike others here, don’t throw out my opinions, which may seem a bit extreme to some. However, I didn’t neccesarily insinuate that giving up meat would end world hunger completely, rather, I meant that it was be a large positive step toward doing so. Also, fur isn’t neccesary for warmth and protection against the cold, because we have other alternatives that are probably much more inexpensive, durable, and have the potential to keep up warm. But, obviously, I am not opposed to fake fur.

Dear Lisa N,

You say I have no credibility about health. I guess that whenever someone says something you don’t want to hear, you question their credibility. I suppose that’s in imitation of our wonderful President. But then, you know what they say: imitation is the sincerest form of flattering!

Dear Catholic90,

I was talking from personal experience, as I know several people who have left the diet because of health problems and other unwanted “side-effects.” Also, do you speak from experience when making your claims about the (alleged) positive “side-effects” of the Atkins diet? Please explain.

Dear Scott LaFrance,

Your jokes don’t amuse me much, and they are simply further proof of your obvious ignorance to animal cruelty in this world. Or, perhaps you are knowlegeable of it and simply don’t care or are denying that it occurs. Wouldn’t that be a shame! In any event, Mr. LaFrance, perhaps you wouldn’t laugh if you actually understood what animals must go through to become a coat or a meal.

Just a general note to everyone: if you don’t believe my accusations, please view some of the videos at the following sites:

“Meet Your Meat”: meetyourmeat.com

“J Lodown”: peta.org

If you questions the content of any of these videos, which you undoubtedly will, go ahead and ask me or anyone else you feel the need to.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top