Jehovah's Witnesse are the True Religion. Consider...

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but you sir, are living off the sacrifice of others and I do not respect you or your man-made (Charles Russell) religion.
I would say that its more accurate to call it an invention of Rutherford’s because there is very few similarities under him to what it was with Russell. By the way there is still a group out there that aren’t JWs that claim Russell as their own. biblestudents.net/
:confused:
He’s just like all the other JWs, they refer you to the elders when they cannot answer your questions…
Yes, there is a double standard. I once made a suggestion about a subject that I didn’t understand for them to go to a preacher or priest or another church leader to get a accurate interpretation of the church’s view especially since I wasn’t the one that initiated the conversation. Needless to say, my invitation wasn’t accepted.
 
I had a conversation yesterday with a JW…oh Lord ! Jesus is angel Michael…God so loved Michael that He created things for him and through him! can’t believe what i heard.
Indeed its true. We had quite a few threads dealing with the Archangel Michael issue here.

Not that they want to tell you all this when you start out.

In Jesus take a peek at their official site and after a ton of clicking around you will get to the who is Jesus? part. Make sure you are nice and calm before you read it all. Its bound to raise the blood pressure.
 
I said I’d post my conversation w/JWTruth, so here it is. Just let me tell you that I have to break it down to several posts because we emailed back and forth for a while yesterday.

Well, yesterday I got onto youtube, left a comment about my DH being disfellowshipped but JWTruth deleted it.

So then, I thought of telling him about my husband not answering my questions when I asked specifics about the religion and he said this:
You say that you are married to a witness, and “won’t” answer your questions? I find that more than extremely difficult to believe.
Here is your answer in detail. Ask for the brochure entitled “The Divine Name that will Endure Forever” and read it slowly, and notice all of the references in there to encyclopaedias and external sources to show facts and details abouts God’s name, and how False Religion does not use it or promote it.

It was also the Catholic church that burned people alive at the stake simply for owning a Bible and wanting to read it, and learn about Jehovah God. That is one of the things that the catholic church wanted to hide from people.
 
Then when I told him that it was true, that my DH doesn’t like to answer things because we will argue. To try to show him what my husband didn’t want to answer I asked about this one pioneer who came to my house telling me the Governing Body sends all their literature to the Vatican for approval before it’s published and sent out to the Kingdom Halls, then if it’s approved, then it’d be printed. I do believe this lady lied to me but I wanted to see what JWTruth would say, so this is his response:
We send stuff to the pope for approval??? You MUST be JOKING right? This is a lie. Sorry. Just read our literature, and I suggest that you type into the Watchtower CDRom Library (if you have it or can view a copy of it) “catholic church” into the search box and then start reading. Just TRY AND FIND positive things in there about the catholic church. You will not find anything in there at all that is positive for them! So how in the heck would we ask for their approval?

You attend the meetings and you write this stuff to me?

I am strongly suggesting this to you, assuming that what you are telling me is even true. Go to the elders in the congregation and TELL THEM what the alleged pioneer is saying! Eitehr way, go to the elders of the congregation and ask them for proper help and you need to have a bible study with one of the elders or their wives. You need help and urgently too.

I can’t help you from here. But the local congregation of Jehovah’s Witnesses and the elders that serve there, can help you and I am advising you to ask them for their help, and tell them your doubts and your worries, and anything else. Don’t lose out on the chance of everlasting life because of doubts. Ask for help.
 
In response I said this to him:
She did say this to me, that is why I have a hard time believing some things about the organization. I could go to the elders, however they might not believe me. She is pioneer who has the best reputation of all 9 in the congregation. I have all the literature and none goes by what the Vatican says, I know that. I have read “What Does the Bible Really Teach” twice, once for my study and almost done with it for the study meeting at the hall. I’ve been to 3 assemblies, 1 special assembly day, a circuit assembly, and a disctrict assembly. I have the greatest man, the apocalipsis, reasoning, I have basically all the books a witness has, my husband has all the tracts his hall offers… I just feel that if I’m being “taught” by a pioneer, I should be getting the right info, but I guess I’m not. Maybe I WILL go to the elders.
I had to lie a little in this one. I did go to the assemblies w/my DH (bad thing to do though), and I do have all that literature at home, I have read that “What Does the Bible Really Teach” book, but I’d never, ever would accept these ladies to give me a study session because I don’t think I could handle them at my own home telling me horrible things about my religion.

Aside from all this, here’s his response:
PLEASE listen to me. If a “pioneer” has told you that the pope approves everything prior to printing (this must be a joke surely) then I am telling you to go to the elders. SHE NEEDS HELP, and SO DO YOU. Understand what I am saying? It is an act of love to help her, and help yourself.

Go to the local elders, as this sort of thing is not tolerated and its an insult to Jehovah God (if it was true, and I doubt it) Personally I don’t believe that a pioneer would do this, but then we do get people disfellowshipped for many and varied reasons. GO TO THE ELDERS. Its important. If you have doubts, then talk to them. The elders are lovely people and they are there specifically to help those that ask for help and to teach. So don’t be afraid, as there is nothing at all to be afraid of.

Christian love
JWTruth
 
Because he thought of this to be a joke, which it wasn’t, I sent him another email explaining him something I made up. Since my DH is a JW, I know how things go in the Halls, also because I attend here and there to make sure I know what lies are being fed onto my DH’s head. Let me tell you that these people are SOOOOO brainwashed because all that is being said to them is false, I mean, it’s so obvious! This is what I told him:
I’m sorry you don’t believe me, but it is true, she did say that. I could even give you her name and the name of the Kingdom Hall, the name of the president of the congregation, anything you want to prove it to you. My husband IS a JW, he was baptized in the Cow Palace in SF in 2001. I can even tell you what my part was at the school, I can even send it to you. I had to say why there are benefits to the existence of evil. I presented on Oct 17th. Check your Scripture study guide/calendar. I had my presentation in the 2nd room because it was my first time, and because of my background I was the publisher and the pioneer who gives me the study was my helper aka. home owner. I had to explain why God allows evil and why we benefit from it, how the 144,000 wouldn’t benefit, how we wouldn’t have time to repent and do works. I have a part this coming January in the main room, but I don’t think I’m gonna doing because if I’m having doubts I don’t want to waste anyone’s time… I can give you the name of the Superintendent, he came a few months ago. His name is Jorge Cruz. We also had a renovation of the hall. We were moved to a different one but now are back to the renovated one.
Why is it so hard to believe me? Even Raymond Franz deviated, he was in the Governing Body, he was one of the 144,000. Why not a pioneeer? Why do you think I know all this? I know that if an elder is an illegal alien, he gets his elder position taken away. That happened recently in the hall I attend. Also, this same pioneer tells me things about how she used to be Catholic and then saw the light. She tells me many things, her husband has privileges at the hall. He does all kinds of things, he distribute the Watchtower during the Watchtower meeting on Sundays when people don’t have a copy, he has the microphone to let others comment, he gives speaches once in a while, he finds seats for people when they arrive to the meetinggs. Tis couple has 4 daughters, an older one, and triplets, 2 who are disfellowhipped, they don’t even speak to their disfellowshipped daughters.

Now, do you believe me or do you need more proof? I’m not trying to attack you, I was trying to find someone who’d advice me since I cannot do it at home.

Let me tell you, my husband was raised as a JW. His mom converted from Catholicism when he was 10, at 19 he baptized. He has 4 sisters, 3 are JWs, 1 remains Catholic. His dad is still Catholic. His mom used to take them to their local Kingdom Hall behind his dad’s back so she could attend the meetings. He was completely against that, but he got tired of arguing, and saw it was a good thing for them, so he let his wife and children attend. Now the mom, the 3 sisters and him are all baptized.

Hope you see I’m being sincere, otherwise, I’m sorry because I know what I was told and I have asked why this person told me this. I have only asked my husband, some ex-JWs and you, but you have come out more agressively than anyone else. I feel quite sad that you being a true Christian would actually act this way towards a person who sincerely is searching for the truth. I know you are told to refer me to someone locally since you cannot help me, but I just wanted some (name removed by moderator)ut before I address this to anyone else.
 
No offense to the JWs, but how would I know all this? It’s called I’ve researched the JWs for over a year, and my DH is a JW… duh!! Plus, all I have to do is grab my DH’s books and all the reading schedules w/dates are on his books… mmmm… sounds like I kind of outsmarted JWTruth… he responded to this as follows:
Please don’t be offended. I am not aggressive but a kind person. I am an older person, and very experienced too. I have read your email slowly and carefully. I have a feeling that you are a good person, and genuinely searching. YOu seem to have doubts by the way you write.
I get a lot of hate emails from people, and sometimes it hard to pick the nice ones and what is really going on in the persons mind.

So with that in mind, PLEASE (I am not shouting but trying to encourage you) do yourself a huge spiritual favour. GO TO THE ELDERS and sit with them and talk to them. Get it out in the open, and find out for sure for yourself.

Tell them everything, and don’t be afraid of them. They are such loving and kind people. They are not there to hurt anyone, but rather to be encouraging and warm towards you. If you have doubts, then PLEASE talk to them about specifics and why you are feeling this way.

Ask the elders if its possible for one of their wives to study with you. Is there an elder you like? Does the elder have a wife that you like and identify with? Then PLEASE ask that person to study with you and teach you and PROVE it to you from the Bible.

I am trying to give you the best and most honest way to get to the truth and show you positive things to prove it to yourself. Hope that this information can help you.

Yes I do believe you that you are spiritually low, and need some kind encouragement. PLEASE do the right thing, and talk to the elders locally.

The next email from you should read taht you wil do it? Hope so, and may Jehovah God bless you and draw you to himself. John 6:44

Christian love
JWTruth
 
After this I started to feel bad for the guy, but then again, if he comes to CAF and insults our religion and is using his website promoting his videos, then, whatever… besides, I got what I wanted out of it.

I proved my point, they just run to the elders if they don’t know what to tell you.

Because I felt bad I sent this:
I’m sorry this has happened to you. I truly am. I think I might speak to my husband and then to the elders about this.
Many thanks.

His last response is this:
I am so pleased that you wish to communiate your fears and concerns to the elders. YES that is a wonderful idea, and Jehovah God WILL bless you for this and he WILL help you. Keep away from the people of the world and seek the association of Jehovah God and his people. Psalms 1:1,2
The elders are such kind and loving people, and they are there to encourage, and they are trained to answer all of your questions, doubts and fears. So be honest with them, and tell them what specifically you are worried about. ASK ESPECIALLY if they could assign you one of their wives to study with you and get to the real issues in your mind. May I suggest the “Draw Close to Jehovah” publication? It is DYNAMITE and FANTASTIC to build faith. Trust me when I say that. In addtition to that book, go through something else that the elders suggest that will cover the information and questions that you have personally. Maybe they might want to go through some special articles, or maybe they will go through specific part of the Bible with you. Just follow their direction. The “Draw Close to Jehovah” book is one you should ask about and someone could go through it with you and build your faith in Jehovah’s Organisation.

I am so thrilled today, that I was able to help someone who is searching. I won’t block your emails and if you want to keep me informed, after your talk with them, that would be fine, but the best way is locally to you, and that is face to face, and it really does get to the heart of the problem and that is to build you up spiritualy and give you the needed hope you are seeking.

Christian love
JWTruth
 
So, then, we were wondering if he actually comes back to read the posts??? He does because he sent this to me:
“I lied a bit to get him to talk tome, but he tells me he feels attacked by people, and it’s understandable. I will be posting what he told me and what I told him tomorrow… now, off to Church I am to celebrate Our Lady of Guadalupe!!”

Are you the same person that said this? If you are, and if you have two different logins to youtube, then I will no longer be communicating with you.

If you are NOT “yessisan” then you were advised previously and also with very kind words.

JWTruth
So there you have it! Gosh! I feel dirty for having lied, I think I’m going to go confess today since we have our special yearly reconciliation at my parish tonight. I seriously feel bad for having lied to him, but that just proves everything we’ve said in our posts…

The End
 
jwtruth:

Please don’t think that we think bad of you as a person. We honestly do not. I think you riled up some people by your in and out post. Understand though, there are some people here that feel as badly hurt by the actions of some Jehovah Witnesses as you may have felt towards some Catholics when you left Catholicism. Its a shame to all of us.

I do wish that you would come back here to CAF. So many times, we have questions about what a particular belief or actions are going on with JWs. All that we have are each other or ex-JWs to offer any explanation. We have all types here from all backgrounds - atheists, jews, mormans, muslims etc. Occasionally, they get attacked - heck, sometimes we even attack each other. But I don’t think people truly want to be mean. We all have our faults and we are all sinners (JWs, Catholics, etc). We are all good people and yet we are all sinners at the same time.

The word “catholic” doesn’t just refer to a church or beliefs. The dictionary definition is also comprehensive or universal. We don’t always agree but in the end we should all universally accept that we are all the creation of God. He loves you. He loves me. We are both taught to love one another.

I meant it the other day when I said a prayer for you. I hope you will think to do the same for me.
 
This guy repeats and repeats that the elders are “such kind and loving people”.
Who’s he trying to convince?
I’ve known some of the most nasty, lying, underhanded and alcoholic jw elders. In fact, it was one of these that put the nail in the coffin of my “study time” with the jws 25 years ago.
 
jwtruth:

Please don’t think that we think bad of you as a person. We honestly do not. I think you riled up some people by your in and out post. Understand though, there are some people here that feel as badly hurt by the actions of some Jehovah Witnesses as you may have felt towards some Catholics when you left Catholicism. Its a shame to all of us.

I do wish that you would come back here to CAF. So many times, we have questions about what a particular belief or actions are going on with JWs. All that we have are each other or ex-JWs to offer any explanation. We have all types here from all backgrounds - atheists, jews, mormans, muslims etc. Occasionally, they get attacked - heck, sometimes we even attack each other. But I don’t think people truly want to be mean. We all have our faults and we are all sinners (JWs, Catholics, etc). We are all good people and yet we are all sinners at the same time.

The word “catholic” doesn’t just refer to a church or beliefs. The dictionary definition is also comprehensive or universal. We don’t always agree but in the end we should all universally accept that we are all the creation of God. He loves you. He loves me. We are both taught to love one another.

I meant it the other day when I said a prayer for you. I hope you will think to do the same for me.
That is why I feel so bad I led to him. I was being honest the first few messages, but then when I got JWTruth’s good side, I felt bad, and I told him this when he told me people attack him w/rude comments.

I am sorry if this has hapened to you JWTruth. You came here and started a post and we wanted to talk to you to get our questions answered, but no luck. My husband won’t answer my questions at home, so do you see why I look for them elsewhere? Having a JW at home, but get no straight answers becomes somewhat frustrating, being why I am always here on CAF looking for the answers on my own.

God Bless you, whether you call him Jehovah, Yahweh, Father, Jesus Christ or God…
 
So, then, we were wondering if he actually comes back to read the posts??? He does because he sent this to me:

So there you have it! Gosh! I feel dirty for having lied, I think I’m going to go confess today since we have our special yearly reconciliation at my parish tonight. I seriously feel bad for having lied to him, but that just proves everything we’ve said in our posts…

The End
:rotfl: :rotfl:
Yes. He got his hooks into you and you sinned. You need to go to Confession tonight. Know that you are not alone. Happens all the time. Your intentions were good but…look on the bright side- you have a confessional to go to. He doesn’t.
 
Yessian,

You meant to get to the bottom of all this and well, you got a lot of information that you would not have otherwise, even though you now have to do the right thing and get “good with Jehovah” now.

I love going to confession. I just wish I did not have so many reasons to have to go.
 
Sad thing is that even though I get to go to confession, I am still sinning. Until I get that sanation thing approved (I pray to God that it does) I will get complete absolution. Then I can receive the Eucharist and finally be at peace w/myself!

Almost there!!!
 
Sad thing is that even though I get to go to confession, I am still sinning. Until I get that sanation thing approved (I pray to God that it does) I will get complete absolution. Then I can receive the Eucharist and finally be at peace w/myself!

Almost there!!!
In my ignorance, I don’t think I understand the concept. Is that something that’s requested anytime someone marries someone of another faith outside the blessing of the church? (not that I would ever allow myself to do that again). Please explain to me - not in terms of your own situation but of the hows, whys, etc.

Thanks
 
In my ignorance, I don’t think I understand the concept. Is that something that’s requested anytime someone marries someone of another faith outside the blessing of the church? (not that I would ever allow myself to do that again). Please explain to me - not in terms of your own situation but of the hows, whys, etc.

Thanks
Take a look at this site:

http://www.catholic.com/thisrock/1995/9504qq.asp

you might get your answer, if not, ask me again, and I’ll tell you…
 
That has to be absolutely the worst anti-catholic argument that I have ever heard.
 
I guess that really doesn’t answer the question I was looking for. Would that apply only to someone who was Catholic at the time of the marriage?
I’m not sure if it’d apply to people who became Catholic after marriage. I know of a couple who baptized Catholic together, and they didn’t have to get “married” through the CC. The baptism itself counted as the sacrament of marriage, or so I heard.

I guess it would be for someone who was Catholic at the time of marriage. I really can’t answer this, but I know who can… search for cameron_lansing or click here forums.catholic-questions.org/member.php?u=25194

He is the one who told me about the sanation. He’s a canon lawyer so he’d know the answer to this.

I would think it would apply to all Catholics but I also know that if one was married in a Protestant Church, the CC might count it as a sacramental marriage. So I guess it depends on the case…

Sorry I couldn’t be of help there.
 
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