Jesus Christ is our only 'mediator' as stated by St. Paul

[1beleevr]

shw: Would it be more appropriate to say that ALL Christians are “born again”, once they are baptized? Where does the Spirit fit in? Jesus told Nicodemus, “Unless a man is born of Spirit and water, he cannot see theKingdom of God.” Would you say that, believing in Christ, repenting of your sins, and turning to God for forgiveness, wold constitute the Spirit? Or would it be the blood of Christ, which washes away sins?

 

[1beleevr]

I think it’ rather curious, that freedomwriter lists himself as a “born again catholic”, when according to some, he is no longer a member! Why would someone/anyone do this? Is he making a statement of disappointment, mocking the religion, or is there something deeper going on here? Please don’t take this as an attack on the church, but it sounds like this person, was very disgusted with his catholic experience, and appears(on the surface, at least) to have found freedom, elsewhere. Is it really because he/she was poorly catechised, or could it be something else?

 

[SHW]

In other words whatever they bind or loose on earth is already bound or loosed in heaven.

You have it backwards. It is true that the Holy Spirit prevents His Church from teaching error regarding faith and morals, but Scripture specifically states, “And I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever you (CHURCH) bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you (CHURCH) loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.” Matthew 16:19 (cf. Matthew 18:18) Heaven agrees with whatever the Church mandates. This is the meaning of the “power/authority” of the “keys” of the kingdom of heaven.

The “keys” are the sign of authority. This authority is given by God to the Pope and to the Church and whatever they decide (bind or loose) on earth is ratified (bound or loosed) in heaven. So, if the Church states that Catholics must go to Mass on Sunday (unless they have a valid reason to miss Mass such as illness or caring for a sick child or they have to work) and if they do not, that they commit a mortal sin, then heaven (God) will also abide by the Church’s ruling. However, in this particular case, it is true that this command to worship God in assembly (Church) is part of the gospel of Christ.

Hebrews 10:24-27
And let us consider one another in order to stir up love and good works, 25 not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as is the manner of some, but exhorting one another, and so much the more as you see the Day approaching. 26 For if we sin willfully after we have received the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins, 27 but a certain fearful expectation of judgment, and fiery indignation which will devour the adversaries.

The rule that women must cover their heads/hair in church is a rule which the Church loosed in the latter 20th century so women no longer have to wear head coverings in church even though the women in the Apostles’ day had to cover their heads in church. (1 Corinthians 11:1-7) Men and women had to sit separately in church in the Apostles’ day, but the Church loosed that command and now families can sit together in church.

Moses permitted divorce, so God allowed it even though this was not God’s original plan. Moses and his successors had God’s authority to govern His people on earth (they sit in Moses seat–Matthew 23:2-3. He sent Jesus personally to straighten out this wrong thinking so divorce now can never again be permitted by the Church hierarchy. (Matthew 19:6-8)

 

[SHW]

Because I was a catholic for over 30 years till i got tired of all the misinterpretations the church was saying about scripture.

**You have made yourself your own little pope **since you have decided that your own private interpretation of Scripture is infallible, yet you claim the Church’s interpretations are not. (2 Peter 1:20, 2 Peter 3:16)

I also got tired of seeing the pope being worshipped as if he was Christ himself.

The pope represents Christ on earth, he is not Christ. The pope is deserving of respect because of his office.

1 Timothy 5:17-18
**Let the elders who rule well be counted worthy of double honor, especially those who labor in the word and doctrine. **18 For the Scripture says, “You shall not muzzle an ox while it treads out the grain,” and, “The laborer is worthy of his wages.”

2 Peter 2:10
and especially those who walk according to the flesh in the lust of uncleanness and despise authority. They are presumptuous, self-willed. They are not afraid to speak evil of dignitaries,

Jude 1:8
Likewise also these dreamers defile the flesh, reject authority, and speak evil of dignitaries.

Asking for money was a big issue for me as well. The church i now attend does not ask for money 2-3 a service. They simply have offering boxes around the church so if you want to give you can without being told. As the Lord loves a cheerful giver not a disgruntled one.

See 1 Timothy 5:17-18 above.

Sorry if i offend anyone but those are just a few of the reasons for being a “Born again Catholic”

Since you are “untaught” by the Church, you are therefore “unstable” so you “twist” the Scriptures to mean what you want them to mean. (2 Peter 3:16)

Galatians 1:9
As we have said before, so now I say again, if anyone preaches any other gospel to you than what you have received, let him be accursed.

Those who do not listen to the Church, the pillar/support and ground/foundation of the truth, are to be accursed. (1 Timothy 3:15)

 

[1beleevr]

shw: That is why I am glad that I am able to bid on a job, that gives me the time off to worship my God with my church family! Actually, I worship Him everyday, but Sunday, is the day that I meet in assembly with my brothers and sisters in Christ, to learn and grow in His Word:thumbsup:It is also the day, that we have our nursing home ministry, where we worship with those who are not able to make it to a church; so we bring church to them. It is pretty awesome to be able to fellowship, with all different types of people, from all different religious persuasions, just coming together to praise God! I understand most of the binding and loosing things, but the issue of divorce, and how some may use it too loosely for their own agenda, still confuses me at times! I know how much God hates divorce(not divorced people), but in Matthew 19:9, Jesus says,“I tell you this; that any man who divorces his wife,except marital unfaithfulness, commits adultery.” That part about unfaithfulness, does this mean that when my ex-wife, cheated on me, and had a child with her lover, that it was okay to divorce, on those grounds? I suggested counseling, and trying to let God restore the marriage, but she would not hear of it! What about my co-worker, who, BTW, is a catholic; married for 28 years, is now living with another woman, and has sired two children with her He is still married to his first wife.

 

[Richard_Kastner]

Hi, Richard What happened to these verses, in your post. Richard, they don’t count for you ?

I was using Jn 6:63 to make a specific point about the bread of life being THE WORD. This point is abundantly brought out in scripture. I didn’t believe that I needed all the vs. that you post.

62 Then what if you were to see the Son of man ascending where he was before?

Verse 62 I believe explains vs.63. Jesus is talking about His ascension a [Miracle] Just like Cana and more importantly, when He changes bread and wine into His body and blood. :yup:

Peace, and God Bless, onenow1. " Lunch time "

For v. 62 my bible has 62What and if ye shall see the Son of man ascend up where he was before? I believe that Jesus was here speaking against their lack of faith. He was saying would you believe me if you saw me asended and sitting at my Fathers side. The implication is that they probably wouldn’t. Jesus doesn’t change bread and wine into His body and blood.
Actually v. 63 explains what He means in v. 51I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world. 52The Jews therefore strove among themselves, saying, How can this man give us his flesh to eat?
53Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you.

v.63It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life. Take this along with my previous post and you can begin to understand what Jesus is saying.

While Jesus was talking directly to His disciples, He was also talking to you and me. In Matt 14:16 Just before He feeds the multitude He says: “But Jesus said unto them, They need not depart; give ye them to eat.” And in Mark 6:37 “He answered and said unto them, Give ye them to eat. And they say unto him, Shall we go and buy two hundred pennyworth of bread, and give them to eat?” These vs. are symbolic for what Christ was really going to do for them and that is give them the bread of life Jn 6:48I am that bread of life. And that life was manifest in THE WORD Jn 6:63 the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life. You will notice that Jesus always gives the food to the apostles first and they give it to the multitude. This is symbolic of Him giving the word to them first and they gave it to the world. Matt 13:16But blessed are your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear. 17For verily I say unto you, That many prophets and righteous men have desired to see those things which ye see, and have not seen them; and to hear those things which ye hear, and have not heard them.

The multitude that Jesus fed with the loaves and fishes and His words and the multitude that He fed with just His words in the sermon on the mount Matt5-7 where He gave them the Lord’s prayer I am sure were not all believers before He talked to them. Jn 12:32And I, if I be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto me. But if their spirit was willing they could not help but be changed after.

How about you onenow1 are you willing to eat the flesh and blood of Jesus manifest by His Holy Spirit in THE WORD OF GOD The Bible or will you have to see Him sitting next to His Father like He asks the multitude in Jn 6 or say that you have to put your finger into His wounds like Thomas or will you open your heart to His WORD and be healed?

 

[1beleevr]

shw: The comment about,“making yourself your own little pope”, is disingenous at best! Someone used it with me(could have been you). And not everyone twists scripture to fit their own agenda; some actually read scripture, and with the discernment granted to them by the Holy Spirit, understand, and apply these scriptures to their everday life:thumbsup:As far as money, and giving to the church, let us not forget Luke 21:3-4, which says,“I tell you the truth, this poor widow has put in more than all of the others.4All these people put in their gifts out of their wealth, but she, out of her poverty, put in all she had to live on”. And we do respect the pope, because he is a man of God:thumbsup:No mere mortal, however is worthy to be called:Holy Father! Sorry, but that is blasphemy at it’s worst! Jesus is the Name above all names, and God is the ONLY one that will be called Holy Father! But another thing we must keep in mind: you can respect someone, without liking them, and like someone without respecting them! Romans 13:1-7, tells us that we must respect those that God has placed in authority over us, even if we don’t always like or agree with them! How many of you can apply Romans 13 to the situation with President Obama? Would you rather see someone else in there? Did God allow him to win for a reason? Plus, the pope is over catholics, not the rest of us! And one more thing about giving; it’s not about the amount, rather it is the spirit in which it was given:thumbsup::thumbsup:

 

[elvisman]

elvisman: Here we go again; now I am confusedI answered your questions previous to post#390, and I apologize for impling that you were anal! I was just reading about how we as the Body of Christ, are to edify each other, and not tear each other down, or question each other’s faith(Romans 14:10) Not saying that YOU personally challeng anyone else’s faith, but sometimes, in a contentious forum like this, onemight(myself included) may come across as such! I have never even believed that ANYONE prayed through Mary or the saints for salvation Until I came into this forum, I wasn’t sure why catholics did, just curious! It seems that we non-catholics, should be afforded the same courtesy, of not feeling either the need or desire to pray through the saints! And believe me, brother, as a member of not only the Bride of Christ, but my church’s intercessory prayer team, I practice and believe in inercessory prayer(for me, just through Jesus, not the saints!") Hey, do you believe everyone who makes it to Heaven, will shed their earthly spiritual titles, and just worship and praise as ONE big happy family? And will the worship and praise be loud and boisterous?

If you answered my post #390 - I can’t find it. Can you give me the post #?

I also think that many of the non-Catholics on this thread are being disingenuous about what they believe about the function of our brothers and sisters in heaven.

You ignore the scriptures that have been presented to you that illustrate how they interdede on our behalf. You also ignore the fact that they are not only not dead - they are MORE alive than any of us here on earth.

**We ARE one big happy family and that means that they intercede on our behalf just as our family here on earth. **To deny this is to deny the Scriptures and also denies the Body of Christ - PERIOD.

 

[SHW]

shw: Would it be more appropriate to say that ALL Christians are “born again”, once they are baptized? Where does the Spirit fit in? Jesus told Nicodemus, “Unless a man is born of Spirit and water, he cannot see theKingdom of God.” Would you say that, believing in Christ, repenting of your sins, and turning to God for forgiveness, wold constitute the Spirit? Or would it be the blood of Christ, which washes away sins?

“Christians” are born again if/when they are baptized in a legitimate manner. The Holy Spirit enters into people’s souls at the moment of Baptism. He puts a seal/mark/character on the soul (which cannot ever be removed even if salvation is lost later through sin) with His mighty power as He cleanses it from original sin (and all other sins if present) at the time of Baptism. (2 Corinthians 1:22, Ephesians 1:13, Ephesians 4:30)

The Holy Spirit cleanses our souls through Baptism as a result of the power of the Blood of Jesus shed on the cross. It there was no sacrifice on the cross, then there would be no cleansing from Original Sin by the Holy Spirit during Baptism. The Holy Spirit applies the merits of Jesus’ Blood Sacrifice to our souls through Baptism and this is what remits our sins. The water is used as a conduit of His graces, it is not the cause of His graces. Baptism washes away our sins by the power of the Holy Spirit as a result of Christ’s Blood shed on the cross. (1 Corinthians 6:11)

The Holy Spirit takes up residence in our souls at our Baptisms and remains in our souls until/unless we commit mortal sins. He, residing in our souls, is what gives our souls sanctifying grace (saves us) and makes it possible for us to inherit eternal life when we die. If we commit mortal sins after Baptism, then He moves out. If we do not repent before death, then He destroys us (eternal damnation) when we die because He must be found residing in our souls at our deaths in order for God to recognize us as His own. If He is not found there, then we will be damned. (1 Corinthians 3:16-18) He must see Himself abiding in us at our deaths in order for us to be saved and inherit eternal life. (John 15:4-7) If we sin mortal sins, then He is no longer abiding in us because He cannot live in a soul that is defiled by mortal sin.

When Jesus states “I never knew you” to the goats on His left, this is what He is speaking of. He no longer recognizes them because they sinned mortal sins after Baptism and they did not confess and repent before death. (Matthew 7:21-23, Ezekiel 33:12-20) They thought that they were once saved, always saved regardless of whether they obeyed God’s commandments or not. They were incorrect and will now pay the eternal price of everlasting hellfire. (Revelation 21:8)

The Holy Spirit, found residing in our souls at our deaths, is our only guarantee that we will be saved. (2 Corinthians 1:22)

 

[1beleevr]

elvisman: Romans 14:10, says that we shouldn’t condemn or lookdown on another believer.And how can you say that we are disingenuous, because we don’t believe the same way as you do? At work, we have an Employee Assistance Program, but it doesn’t mean that if you don’t NEED to use it, you don’t belong to your work"family". Speaking of finding post #'s, would you mind finding all of mine, where I specifically stated that I believed that those who are “asleep”, as Jesus and Paul have alluded to are not useful to some, but not all! What I have said, on many occasions, is that, if you feel the desire, or the NEED to pray through the saints(or Mary, or both), please do! Or if you feel the obligation, or need to visit a priest, and call him father, once again; feel free! You know, God gave us free will for many reasons, the biggest one being, so that we could choose Him:thumbsup:

 

[Richard_Kastner]

shw: That is why I am glad that I am able to bid on a job, that gives me the time off to worship my God with my church family! Actually, I worship Him everyday, but Sunday, is the day that I meet in assembly with my brothers and sisters in Christ, to learn and grow in His Word:thumbsup:It is also the day, that we have our nursing home ministry, where we worship with those who are not able to make it to a church; so we bring church to them. It is pretty awesome to be able to fellowship, with all different types of people, from all different religious persuasions, just coming together to praise God!

Why Sunday, doesn’t the bible say Ex, 20:8Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
9Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: 10But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: 11For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it. The seventh day Sabbath is Saturday not Sunday.

I understand most of the binding and loosing things, but the issue of divorce, and how some may use it too loosely for their own agenda, still confuses me at times! I know how much God hates divorce(not divorced people), but in Matthew 19:9, Jesus says,“I tell you this; that any man who divorces his wife,except marital unfaithfulness, commits adultery.” That part about unfaithfulness, does this mean that when my ex-wife, cheated on me, and had a child with her lover, that it was okay to divorce, on those grounds?

I certainly believe that you would be justified in divorcing your wife here. However I think it is clear from scripture that you would not be free to remarry.

What about my co-worker, who, BTW, is a catholic; married for 28 years, is now living with another woman, and has sired two children with her He is still married to his first wife.

Because some choose to transgress God’s law doesn’t mean it is not binding on us.

 

[1beleevr]

shw: Great post:thumbsup:I believe in OSAS, and do not believe that if you are saved on Thursday, and sin on Friday, you will lose your salvation I work in prison, and there are inmates, who by the law, are allowed to have church services. On Wednesday, the catholic inmates, some who are doing life without parole for multiple murders, kidnapping or whatever, have their service, and take communion! Are they still saved? Is God’s grace bigger than any sin? When Jesus said to the goats," I never knew you, now get away from me," He very well could have meant that these never did know Him! They were just “grandstanding”, pretnding to know Him, so that they would be saved from eternal damnation! John 6:39, 17:12, and 1John 2:3-6 tells us that we belong to Him(prodigal son, lost sheep) He does take us back, but we cannot make a mockery of this privilege, and every day strive to follow His commandments!

 

[1beleevr]

Richard Kastner: Which is more important, when I worship, or that I worship? I worship God, everyday, but Sunday is my total God day; no work, just worship! The word Sabbath, also means rest. God didn’t rest on that seventh day, because He was tired; He “rested”, because He awas done:thumbsup:Sabbatical, is another word that has been spawned from sabbath, and I’m not sure about how the days were addressed in Moses’s time. Did they call Tuesday, Tuesday? I think that the tradition of celebrating the Sabbath on ,what is it, late Friday through Saturday night, came from the Jews, right? What if your Sabbath were on Wednesday? Would this be a mortal sin? And as far as divorce; I do believe that if you divorce your wife/husband just because you don’t think they’re pretty anymore, and remarry, you are committing adultery. I have read so much about Jesus’s statements, regarding unfaithfulness, and maybe I’m wrong, but it sounds like to me, that if you are the victim of unfaithfulness, and get divorced, you can remarry. That and death.God bless you, Richard; keep up the good fight:thumbsup:

 

[onenow1]

I For v. 62 my bible has 62What and if ye shall see the Son of man ascend up where he was before? I believe that Jesus was here speaking against their lack of faith. He was saying would you believe me if you saw me asended and sitting at my Fathers side. The implication is that they probably wouldn’t.
Actually v. 63

Quote= onenow1. Exactly ! The whole context of John 6.

Seems to me Jesus never calls the disciples back that walked away.

Did Jesus want them to leave, and that’s why he did"nt call them back and say no I’m only talking in symbols. I find that hard to believe.

Peace, onenow1

 

[1beleevr]

onenow1: It’s not so much about speaking symbolically, its more about being able to understand the symbolism Jesus spoke to His disciples in parables on many occasions, and totally confused all or some of them, depending on the parable! Would we have been able to discern that the lost sheep parable was about one believer being lost and the Shepherd looking for us? Those who walked away, were not His true disciples, and were afraid of actually having to eat His flesh and drnk His blood; which is what they believed! His twelve, later understood, as we do, what He meant! His body, THE WORD, and His Blood, the River of Life, are what sustains us! No need to pretend that the bread becomes flesh, and the wine becomes, His blood!

 

[ncgolf]

onenow1: You have to admit, that many who would hear Jesus speak these verses; may have the tendency to beieve that they convey a message of cannibalism

Cannibilisim can only be done to one who is dead … Christ is not dead … He lives. So you can argue against it but don’t use cannibilisim as it does not meet the definition of cannibilism.

We know that He didn’t mean to eat His flesh and drink His blood literally, but figuratively!

How do you know this … were you taught?

Jesus’s blood is the river of life, and His body, is the Bread of Life!

It truly and really is … and is available daily if you wish to recieve it.

In communion, we are remembering His sacrifice on the Cross, and how He told us that His blood was the sign of the New Covenant; and then the veil was torn from the top down, to allow us access to a place only reserved for priests before: the throneroom of grace!(Hebrews 4:16)

It is a memorial but one that re-presents or makes present what happened at Calvary.

So, you can continue doing communion the way you have(transsubstantiation), and we(non-catholics will continue doing it the way that Jesus and His disciples did it!

Read Luke’s account on of the “Appearance on the Road to Emmaus” Luke 13-35. In Verse 30 it says, “And it happened that while he was with them at table, he took bread, said the blessing, broke it, and gave it to them.” … what happened after they ate … there eyes were opened v 31. They were not opened as Jesus taught Scripture on the road but only after eating of the bread. Powerful stuff.

Read 1 Corinthians 11:23-27. … Paul then writes in 27 Therefore whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord unworthily will have to answer for the body and blood of the Lord. 28 A person should examine himself, 13 and so eat the bread and drink the cup.
29 For anyone who eats and drinks without discerning the body, eats and drinks judgment on himself.
Why the harshness of the warning for a merely figurative consumption? If you cannot discern that this truly is the Body and Blood then it is right that one not particpate … hence the divide.

And we will both believe that we are doing it right:thumbsup:

The goal should be doing as Christ taught.

 

[Bill_Pick]

ncgolf, You are beatting a death horse,if Jesus was setting next to believe1 and said all of John is to be believe as written she?he still not believe, if she he things it has any thing to do with a Cathloic teaching

 

[SHW]

shw: That is why I am glad that I am able to bid on a job, that gives me the time off to worship my God with my church family! Actually, I worship Him everyday, but Sunday, is the day that I meet in assembly with my brothers and sisters in Christ, to learn and grow in His Word:thumbsup:It is also the day, that we have our nursing home ministry, where we worship with those who are not able to make it to a church; so we bring church to them. It is pretty awesome to be able to fellowship, with all different types of people, from all different religious persuasions, just coming together to praise God!

You are doing your best for God as you understand it. God is pleased.

I understand most of the binding and loosing things, but the issue of divorce, and how some may use it too loosely for their own agenda, still confuses me at times! I know how much God hates divorce(not divorced people), but in Matthew 19:9, Jesus says,“I tell you this; that any man who divorces his wife,except marital unfaithfulness, commits adultery.” That part about unfaithfulness, does this mean that when my ex-wife, cheated on me, and had a child with her lover, that it was okay to divorce, on those grounds? I suggested counseling, and trying to let God restore the marriage, but she would not hear of it!

I am sorry that your wife was unfaithful and caused you pain. Unfortunately, there is a lot of that type of behavior these days. Yes, you can divorce if your spouse commits adultery, but you still are not free to remarry unless she dies. (Matthew 5:31-32, Matthew 19:8-10, Luke 16:18) You and your wife have a covenant/vow to be one flesh until death parts you. (Matthew 19:6) God actually joined you together.

They were simply amazed at this hard teaching of “no remarriage after divorce” so they ask Jesus again about it just to be sure that they were not mistaken in their understanding:

Mark 10:2-12
Then He arose from there and came to the region of Judea by the other side of the Jordan. And multitudes gathered to Him again, and as He was accustomed, He taught them again. 2 The Pharisees came and asked Him, “Is it lawful for a man to divorce his wife?” testing Him. 3 And He answered and said to them, “What did Moses command you?”
4 They said, “Moses permitted a man to write a certificate of divorce, and to dismiss her.”
5 And Jesus answered and said to them, “Because of the hardness of your heart he wrote you this precept. 6 But from the beginning of the creation, God ‘made them male and female.’ 7 ‘For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, 8 and the two shall become one flesh’; so then they are no longer two, but one flesh. 9 Therefore what God has joined together, let not man separate.” 10 In the house His disciples also asked Him again about the same matter. 11 So He said to them, “Whoever divorces his wife and marries another commits adultery against her. 12 And if a woman divorces her husband and marries another, she commits adultery.”

The Church/Scriptures never allow remarriage after divorce unless one of the spouses dies. This is why "The disciples said to him, “If such is the case of a man with his wife, it is not expedient to marry.” Matthew 19:9-10 They are saying that they think it would better to never marry at all than to not be able to remarry after divorce if their marriages did not work out. Jesus’ teaching about “no remarriage after divorce” was not what they wanted to hear.

What about my co-worker, who, BTW, is a catholic; married for 28 years, is now living with another woman, and has sired two children with her He is still married to his first wife.

He is hell-bound and will end up there unless he confesses, repents, and makes a firm resolution to not do this sin again, before he dies.

I would bet that not all annulments (decrees stating that a legitimate marriage never took place) that are granted by the Catholic Church are pleasing to God either. This is my personal opinion. But, God honors them because He gave His Church the authority to bind and loose just as He gave Moses the authority to make rules about divorce for the Israelites.

 

[1beleevr]

Hey Bill Pick: If Jesus was sitting next to you, would you know it was Him? Do you believe that He would look like the pictures depict Him; smooth skin, clean, shiny hair? Would the Jesus you know, be welcome in your church?

 

[onenow1]

THE WORD, and His Blood, the River of Life, are what sustains us! No need to pretend that the bread becomes flesh, and the wine becomes, His blood!

Quote=onenow1. Indeed ! Something it seems you do not understand. No pretend. Jesus was not pretending 6 times when He said My flesh is real food. That would be absurd .

Peace, onenow1