Jesus Christ is our only 'mediator' as stated by St. Paul

[Bill_Pick]

Hey Bill Pick: If Jesus was sitting next to you, would you know it was Him? Do you believe that He would look like the pictures depict Him; smooth skin, clean, shiny hair? Would the Jesus you know, be welcome in your church?

HI
Yes the Jesus I know is in OUR Chruch all the time, and no He may be clean shave, and I do not know if He has smooth shin or not,He may just look like the guy next door ,What do you think He will look like.

 

[Richard_Kastner]

Quote=onenow1 Thank you Richard, some things in your post inconsistent with reality.

How so?

Jesus reaffirs that His Flesh is real food and His blood is real Drink. 6 X

Of coarse He does. The word that leads to eternal life is real food and real drink.

John’s Gospel considered by most to be a book of signs.

I don’t understand

I also gather in your post free will is not even considered by you ! So you try impose your understanding,and make it look like it is from Jesus; and that’s fine if it truly is your belief !

I’m not quite sure what you mean by the free will business. As for me imposing my understanding. What I am doing is simply answering one of your posts that had what I thought to be a mistaken view of John6 with what I consider to be the correct view. I mean isn’t that what this forum is for, to compare and contrast views. I’m assuming you are an adult and I really can’t impose anything on you.

 

[1beleevr]

Bill Pick: I don’t really know! He might look like your grandpa, or your dad! His face will radiate a lightlike we have never seen! He is in our church also. He said, For as you have done for the least of these, you have done for Me! Could Jesus come back in the body of a bum or some other “undesirable” person? Who knows? I do ministry for a non-profit organization called Jesus Shack. Someone once said, “isn’t that demeaning?” I said, “No, not really; when you consider who He hung out with!” I don’t know if He will have shiny hair or smooth skin. I know He will have scars on His hands and feet!

 

[onenow1]

onenow1: So, you’re saying, that when I take communion, and close my eyes, that it is impossible for me to visualize Christ with me, as I remember His words…“this is my Body, do this in remeberance Me…”? And I am not disagreeing with 2k years of apostolic teaching, as Christ shared the bread and wine with them, He broke it and gave each one their own piece, and each drank from the cup:thumbsupeace be with you, my sister

Quote =onenow1 #1 I am not saying that at all ! You certainly may be receving Jesus into your Heart Spiritually.

The CC teaches this: This ‘Last Supper’ is recreated at every Mass, as the priest acting
‘In Persona Christi’ or in the ‘Person of Christ’ (2Cor 2:10),
draws down ‘The Word’ by his word, ‘This is My Body’,and ‘This is My Blood’.

As these words are spoken, the Holy Spirit changes the bread and wine
into the Body, Blood, Soul, and Divinity of Jesus Christ.
Thus Jesus Christ in his entirety is made visible upon the altar
under the appearance of bread and wine.

On the road to emmaus they recognized Him in the breaking of the bread.Luke 24:35

In fact if you went to a Catholic Mass you are invited to receive Jesus spiritually , this is because you are not in commiunion with the One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church. The Body Of Christ ]
You must believe every thing Christ’s Church Teaches [be in communion with the body of believer’s in one faith ]

Peace, and God Bjess onenow1

 

[Bill_Pick]

onenow1: I have seen crosses on or near catholic properties, which do not contain a corpus! The cross I wear, is empty, as was Jesus’s, after He was REMOVED from it! I don’t need to see a corpus on the Cross, to remind of the pain, and humiliation He suffered. To me, an empty cross is a sign of V-I-C-T-O-R-Y!!!

A cross is just a cross with out showing what Our Lord did for us. The ffirst time My two two years old saw my cross they ask why was this guy on the cross and I had a whole story to tell,what did they say looking at your cross,looks nice

 

[1beleevr]

Bill Pick: That’s interesting, because I was explaining to my 8 year old granddaughter about the Cross, without the “benefit” of a body! It was a bit more interesting, because she had to use her imagination! I too had a story to tell her; in fact I am still telling her:thumbsup:

 

[onenow1]

How so?I’m not quite sure what you mean by the free will business. As for me imposing my understanding. What I am doing is simply answering one of your posts that had what I thought to be a mistaken view of John 6 with what I consider to be the correct view. I mean isn’t that what this forum is for, to compare and contrast views. I’m assuming you are an adult and I really can’t impose anything on you.

This is what you said Richard: He wanted to weed out those who did not or would not accept Him in faith.

Quote =onenow1 What you are saying here is Jesus has pre-ordained no chance at salvation because he knew beforehand the ones who would leave. What I am saying is they were disciples STUDENTS. They were Jews and knew exactly what he was saying, if Jesus did’nt mean what he said he certainly would have called them back.

This is a highly improbable scenerio that Jesus would not call them back. ! Jesus was even willing to let His apostles go, when he asks will you to leave me.

As far as imposing on me no you can’t because we have the Church to guide us.

Peace,onenow1

 

[Richard_Kastner]

Richard Kastner: Which is more important, when I worship, or that I worship?

It is important that you worship but it is also important when you worship.

I worship God, everyday, but Sunday is my total God day; no work, just worship! The word Sabbath, also means rest. God didn’t rest on that seventh day, because He was tired; He “rested”, because He awas done:thumbsup:Sabbatical, is another word that has been spawned from sabbath, and I’m not sure about how the days were addressed in Moses’s time. Did they call Tuesday, Tuesday? I think that the tradition of celebrating the Sabbath on ,what is it, late Friday through Saturday night, came from the Jews, right? What if your Sabbath were on Wednesday? Would this be a mortal sin?

You are right. We should worship God all the time, but when you say that it doesn’t matter which day you keep for a Sabbath, what you are in effect saying is that God’s blessing doesn’t matter and that you are going to keep the Sabbath on the day that man says instead of the day that God says. In other words man’s authority takes precedent over God’s. I mean this is a commandment that God thought was so sacred He didn’t even let man write it down. He spoke it with his own mouth and wrote it with His own finger. The Sabath was not given to the Jews. It was given to all men at creation.

Gen 2:1Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.
2And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
3And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

As to which day is the Sabbath. Well we know that the Jews keep the Sabbath and they keep Saturday. But the way we can know for sure is
Gen 2:3 identifies God’s blessed day as the seventh day.
Ex20:11 identifies the seventh day as the Sabbath
11For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.
and luke 23:53-24:1 Makes the Sabbath Saturday
53And he took it down, and wrapped it in linen, and laid it in a sepulchre that was hewn in stone, wherein never man before was laid.
54And that day was the preparation, and the sabbath drew on.
55And the women also, which came with him from Galilee, followed after, and beheld the sepulchre, and how his body was laid.
56And they returned, and prepared spices and ointments; and rested the sabbath day according to the commandment.
24:1Now upon the first day of the week, very early in the morning, they came unto the sepulchre, bringing the spices which they had prepared, and certain others with them.

You certainly can keep any day for the Sabbath, but there is only one day that carries with it the blessing of almighty God. I look at it as similar to the tree of the knowledge of good and evil in the garden of Eden. This tree was probably one of a thousand other trees that looked just like it, no difference at all, except that God said they shouldn’t eat of it. The Sabbath is like that, there are six days that look just like it no difference except that God says it is blessed and we need to keep it in a special way. Jesus said in Jn14:15If ye love me, keep my commandments. If you keep this commandment not according to the way God says, but according to the way man says, If you recognize the sovereignty of man above the sovereignty of God. Do you really think that you are keeping God’s Sabbath holy and will be welcomed in as a “good and faithful servant?”

 

[guanophore]

Consider this Matt 13:10And the disciples came, and said unto him, Why speakest thou unto them in parables?

Since He is not using a parable in Jn.6,none of this applies.

I think the reason you give here is one very valid reason that Jesus talked in parables. He wanted to weed out those who did not or would not accept Him in faith

Since He was not using a parable here, that principle does not apply.

Let's take a look at Jn6 in context

The context of the NT is the Catholic Church. It was written by, for, and about Catholics. It cannot be understood properly outside the Catholic faith that produced it.

Jesus says here that He is the living bread and then that the bread that He will give is His flesh. Well, let me ask you is Jesus really bread, no of coarse not. And is His flesh bread?

Are you saying you believe He gave “symbolic” flesh and blood for the life of the world? Are you extracted from that strange Muslim sect that believes Jesus survived the Crucifixion and fled with HIs mother into India after He was taken down?

Well, the CC would say that that is communion. If Jesus is not actually bread and I think I can safely say that He is not.

It was Jesus who broke the bread saying “this is my body” and the cup “this is my blood”. I guess your argument is with Him, not us.

He was probably talking symbolically here.

The disciples of the Apostles called people who said such things heretics.

So, if He is talking symbolically about Himself being bread He probably is talking symbolically about His flesh being bread.

And He must have given “symbolic” flesh and blood on the cross for the life of the world.

 it is the Word of God that was made flesh and it is the Word of God that we are to eat that will give us eternal life. Ok, keep this principle in mind as you read through v. 58

Well, since the NT was not yet produced, how was that supposed to happen?

53Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you.
54Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.
55For my flesh is meat indeed, and my blood is drink indeed.
56He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, dwelleth in me, and I in him.
57As the living Father hath sent me, and I live by the Father: so he that eateth me, even he shall live by me.
58This is that bread which came down from heaven: not as your fathers did eat manna, and are dead: he that eateth of this bread shall live for ever.
59These things said he in the synagogue, as he taught in Capernaum.
60Many therefore of his disciples, when they had heard this, said, This is an hard saying; who can hear it?

This is not the twelve, but others. He hears them murmuring and decides to call them on their lack of faith.

61When Jesus knew in himself that his disciples murmured at it, he said unto them, Doth this offend you?
62What and if ye shall see the Son of man ascend up where he was before?

He says does this offend you? What if you saw me sitting in heaven next to my Father? Would you believe me then? The implied answer is of coarse no.

And some people don’t even believe HIm when He made it clear at the last supper!

63It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

In this v. I believe Jesus confirms what I have been saying. That His words are spirit and they are life. The flesh that He talks about in this v. is the spirit of the world.

Are you claiming that the flesh of Christ “profits nothing”? That is what needs to happen for this line of reasoning to be followed. I guess, if you think He only gave symbolic flesh on the cross, that makes sense.

66From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him.

The Apostles did not understand either, but stayed with Christ in faith. I find it interesting, however, that everywhere else they misunderstood Him, He took great pains to re-explain. Here, He just re-iterates and re-emphasizes Himself.

These disciples were not cooperating with the Holy Spirit that the Father had sent to them and therefore they walked no more with Him.

I thought you did not believe it was necessary to cooperate with the HS in order to be saved?

Here Peter affirms what Jesus has been saying all along and that is that the WORDS of Jesus lead to eternal life.

They do, but that life is purchased by His real flesh, and real blood- not symbolic.

 

[onenow1]

Hi,Richard Quote= onenow1John’s Gospel considered by most to be a book of signs.

= RichardI don’t understand ? Example : John 6:30 So they said to him, "Then what sign do you do, that we may see, and believe you? What work do you perform?

31 Our fathers ate the manna in the wilderness; as it is written, `He gave them bread from heaven to eat.’"

32 Jesus then said to them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, it was not Moses who gave you the bread from heaven; my Father gives you the true bread from heaven.

Richard The Gospel of John contains a series of signs Cana wine to water, cure of the royal official simply from a distance, cure of the paraletic, multiplacation of loaves and walking on water
Things no mere mortal can do. And Jesus tells them of the signs in John 6.

Peace,onenow1 God Bless All and Goodnight.zzzzz

 

[guanophore]

It is important that you worship but it is also important when you worship. You certainly can keep any day for the Sabbath, but there is only one day that carries with it the blessing of almighty God.

I just posted an off topic reply on Jn 6. I know you are a strict sabbatarian, and you can hardly resist a chance to lay into other believers about their sabbath disobedience, but let’s both try to get back on topic.

 

[ncgolf]

ncgolf: Never said that Jesus was dead; I know that He Lives!!! What I was getting at was, some of the disciples that heard Him say, “eat of My body, drink of My blood,” were probably repulsed, and turned away.

You brought up cannibiliism … so if you say Jesus is not dead then you must conclude we are not cannibals. You can disagree but not with that.

Try to put yourself in their place, and Jesus says that to you. Are you automatically going to say, “O, I know what He is talking about?”

NO … if I was there too at that time … I too would have misunderstood him … but then again He had not died and risen. The Apostles could have understood fully the events of John 6 only after the Resurrection and after Pentecost when the Holy Spirit came over them. I understand John 6 in lieu of how the Apostles treat Christ’s words. It was not symbolic for them nor us.

And yes, once someone is the victim of cannibals, then the flessh dies(eventually). So, if He really didn’t mean for us to eat His flesh(which cannot enter into Heaven) and drink His blood, wouldn’t what He said be symbolic?

It would be if any purely human uttered those words … but it was the Eternal Logos who did hence His words take on a diffrerent meaning in lieu of the Resurrection. Remember it is the same person who said “Let there be light” and it was who utters the words “This is my body”. I imagine then it is symbolic light that was created.

Don’t we use examples, and symbolisms to teach others?

Yes, so what is your point, that what Christ says cannot be? Is “This is my body” really being Jesus’s body a possibility or an impossibility?

Jesus said,“You will know the Truth(Himself), and the Truth will set you free!”

Why is this not symbolic?

 

[elvisman]

elvisman: Step down off of your high horse for a moment! You guys have never asked us for help for the Body of Christ! Rather you have rebuked us for not being catholic. And no one has proven to me, by oral tradition or scripture, that anyone who has been sincerely saved, and baptized can lose their salvation! We sin every day of the week, and it is dificult to avoid it! Easier to remember that God’s grace restores after we have sinned! All of those verses are impressive,but I don’t know exactly what you are trying to prove Until you can show me that I can LOSE my salvation, it will be OSAS!

That’s where you’re wrong. The Lord wills that ALL belong to his Church. You are a separated brother from the Body of Christ. A body CANNOT be separated from itself and the Church wants ALL to come home. ** I’m not on a “high horse” - just a part of the Body of Christ. **

**As for what the Bible says about OSAS - **Who’s living in denial now, my scripturally ignorant friend?
The fact is - there is no such thing as being saved until you leave this world. Next time READ the scriptures and don’t just gloss over what they say:

Romans 11:22
“See, then, the kindness and severity of God: severity toward those who fell, but God’s kindness to you, provided you remain in his kindness; otherwise you too will be cut off.”

Hebrews 10:26-27
“If we sin deliberately after receiving knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains sacrifice for sins but a fearful prospect of judgment and a flaming fire that is going to consume the adversaries.”

2 Peter 2:26-27
**For if they, having escaped the defilements of the world through the knowledge of (our) Lord and savior Jesus Christ, again become entangled and overcome by them, their last condition is worse than their first. **
**For it would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness than after knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment handed down to them. **

Not everyone who says to me, “Lord, Lord” shall enter the kingdom of heaven’ (Matt. 7:21)."

"He who endures to the end will be saved" (Matt. 24:13)

Concerning his remaining life, Paul was frank in admitting that even he could fall away: “I pummel my body and subdue it, lest after preaching to others I myself should be disqualified” (1 Cor. 9:27).

**"I am not aware of anything against myself, but I am not thereby justified. **
It is the Lord who judges me" (1 Cor. 4:4).

SCRIPTURE tells us:
We are already saved (Rom. 8:24, Eph. 2:5–8)
We’re also being saved (1 Cor. 1:8, 2 Cor. 2:15, Phil. 2:12)
**We hope that I *will ***be saved (Rom. 5:9–10, 1 Cor. 3:12–15)

I rest my case.

 

[placido]

Because I was a catholic for over 30 years till i got tired of all the misinterpretations the church was saying about scripture. I also got tired of seeing the pope being worshipped as if he was Christ himself. Asking for money was a big issue for me as well. The church i now attend does not ask for money 2-3 a service. They simply have offering boxes around the church so if you want to give you can without being told. As the Lord loves a cheerful giver not a disgruntled one. Sorry if i offend anyone but those are just a few of the reasons for being a “Born again Catholic”

From John 6:66 to Judas all the way to our days, the history of the Church is littered with heretics who got tired of the “touch teachings” or the alleged “misinterpretations”. Because of pride a man refuses to submit to the extablished authority, gets up one beautiful morning and appoints himself as the final authority in matters of faitn and morals.
I think by using false identification (born again Catholic) you are not trying to offend anybody but your attempt to mislead - an un-Christian conduct indeed.

placido

 

[bicolmonk]

Where is this in St. Paul?

Very early in the Church people started referring to Our Lady as the mediatrix. Through her Christ is able to mediate grace, in fact. I assume that in context it means that only Christ, as true God and Man is able to justify us by mediating between us and the father through his crucifixion and resurrection.

Peace.

We are all co-redeemers in the sense we can save some: Please read –

1 timothy 4:16 16 Attend to yourself and to your teaching; persevere in both tasks, for by doing so you will save both yourself and those who listen to you.

1 Cor 9:22 To the weak I became weak, to win over the weak. I have become all things to all, to save at least some.

James 5:19-20
19 My brothers, if anyone among you should stray from the truth and someone bring him back,
20 he should know that whoever brings back a sinner from the error of his way will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins.

We are called to priesthood and what is a priest?

1 Peter 2:5-9

5 and, like living stones, let yourselves be built into a spiritual house to be a holy priesthood to offer spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ.
6
For it says in scripture: “Behold, I am laying a stone in Zion, a cornerstone, chosen and precious, and whoever believes in it shall not be put to shame.”
7
Therefore, its value is for you who have faith, but for those without faith: “The stone which the builders rejected has become the cornerstone,”
8
and “A stone that will make people stumble, and a rock that will make them fall.” They stumble by disobeying the word, as is their destiny.
9
5 But you are “a chosen race, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people of his own, so that you may announce the praises” of him who called you out of darkness into his wonderful light.

 

[bicolmonk]

glory to jesus christ!

hi jessi, please explain what mediatrix of all graces means to you.

Is it hyperbole, as in “the mekong is the mother of waters” or “my wife has the most beautiful eyes!” ? Is it intended as a compliment about mary, as a praise?

Or is it a function…does it mean every type of grace passes through her but not necessarily every bit of grace? … Or does it mean the sum total of all grace passes through her in some active fashion, or what else exactly?

What happened before she died…was there no grace or was she doing this all along?

Does it mean that mary has the ability to control grace or to block grace? Or does it mean she acts like a conduit of grace with nothing to say about the outcome?

What about the other saints and the angels, do they share in this mediation or is it unique?

Please pardon me, but i cannot clearly see the point of such an acclamation.
I believe that it is improper to stat “it is **not yet **dogma” as it presupposes that it will someday be.

No one, not even a pope, can know that, not even if he has a definite intention to pronounce it.

michael

co-redemptrix it is an ordinary teaching of the church.

 

[bicolmonk]

You are right but i think the point that is being made on this thread is that you don’t have to confess your sin’s to a priest, mary or “saints”. Christ is the only one who can ask the father on our behalf.

We Catholics never NEVER confess our sins to Mary nor to the saints. However, you miss the point. Simply that we confess our sins and whoever sins you forgive are forgiven as Jesus said. Does it matter who have relations with after Adam & Eve. Their sons & daughters? The point is “creation”. People are so particulars that they no longer see the truth.

 

[1beleevr]

Richard Kastner: At the risk of upsetting guanophore, I would like to extend our discussion about the Sabbath! I know, that like me, and many others, guan observes the Sabbath on Sunday! I want to ask point blank, because you say that if you observe the Sabbath on any other day, but Saturday, you miss God’s blessing; who designated that Saturday was the Sabbath(named the day), God or man? The bible says, the seventh day; so I guess someone could pick any day, count forward seven days, and say,"Today’s my Sabbath I am also aware that in Spanish, at least, the word “Sabado”, means both, Saturday, and Sabbath. God was not specific in scripture, as to the Sabbath(which also means “rest”), being Saturday! I applaud and respect all Christians who spend a day, whatever day, observing the Sabbath, being obedient not so much to the exact day of the week, but what the Sabbath is about! I have heard, that the reason most Christians observ the Sabbath on Sunday(or Sonday), is because it is the day of the week, supposedly, when Jesus rose from the grave! Believe me Richard, I have the utmost respect for you, and think that you re doing a marvelous job in this thread; and I respect not just SDA’s, but all religions, although some would think otherwise! Was talking to a woman, who as it turned out, was an SDA, at a function for Jesus Shack; a faith-based organization, which serves communities, in His name! She was rebuking me for not observing the “real” Sabbath! This was on a Saturday. I turned to her, and asked,“Then what are you doing here, today?”. She got up and walked away, never speaking to me the rest of the day,…hmmmmm!

 

[1beleevr]

elvisman: If it please the court, for the defense:1beleevr Well. well, the mighty elvisman has spoken, and I should be shaking in my boots, I supposeAfter reading your post, a word which stood out to me, was DELIBERATELY; as in sin deliberately! Of course, you would be rejected, if you DELIBERATELY sinned, after you had known grace! It would be tantamount to abusing the privilege, or taking it for granted! Listen, even though I am ignorant and naive, I know that salvation is a lifelong process. And even though at different times in the Bible, it says things like,“For all who call upon the Lord, shall be saved,” and John 3:16, etc., I know that God is constantly refining us through trials, tribulations,obedience/disobedience, until He has us like He wants us. But in order for Him to work on us, He must have us in the “fold”. When we come to Jesus, for forgiveness, and “salvation”, it is step one; we are “saved” from the slavery of sin, and spiritual death. We are still prone to sin, because I do not believe our sin nature is removed! Even Paul said,“For it is not I who sins, it is the sin within me.” Being covered by the blood of Christ, and God’s incredible grace, we are His, and there is nothing we can do to make Him love us more, nor anything we can do to make Him love us less.And as far as this repetitive use of Matthew 7:21,“Not everyone who says to me, Lord, Lord, Shall enter into the Kingdom of Heaven,” is becoming rather tedious I asked someone, earlier, if it was posible, that Jesus was addressing so-called"wannabes", you know, those who pretend to follow Him, knowing that He is the only Way to Heaven. Salvation is not, nor should it be approached as an easy, or simple process! I have been “saved”(let the record reflect, Your Honor, that parentheses are used for the benefit of the prosecution) for 42 years, and have had many people over that span of time, challenge not only the sincerity of my salvation, but the degree of my faith! Thanks to the amazing peace, which Christ gives me, I am able to “turn the other cheek”.Do you remember how in the NT, many of the Jewish believers wanted to turn back to their own ways, thus rejecting their new faith? Some Christians are like that. Even though they have been raised in the church, saved and baptized,they get caught up in the world, and abandon their faith, and may even become atheists! To you, I may be separated from the catholic church, but I know, without any doubts, that I am not eparated from Jesus! The few times that I have been invited to, and attended cathoilc churches, I have felt like a foreigner in a foreign land. Not many speak to you, and you are reminded, that you cannot do this, and cannot do this, unless you are catholic! Good thing Jesus didn’t treat people like this, huh? all of your scriptures are rather impressive, itis obvious that you are schooled well in using the Bible, but Jesus also said,“I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; and no one can snatch them out of my hand.” Do we sin, yes. Does this cause loss of salvation,???. If it did, we’d have to get saved all over again, possibly every day! OSAS

 

[davidv]

elvisman: If it please the court, for the defense:1beleevr Well. well, the mighty elvisman has spoken, and I should be shaking in my boots, I supposeAfter reading your post, a word which stood out to me, was DELIBERATELY; as in sin deliberately! Of course, you would be rejected, if you DELIBERATELY sinned, after you had known grace! It would be tantamount to abusing the privilege, or taking it for granted! Listen, even though I am ignorant and naive, I know that salvation is a lifelong process. And even though at different times in the Bible, it says things like,“For all who call upon the Lord, shall be saved,” and John 3:16, etc., I know that God is constantly refining us through trials, tribulations,obedience/disobedience, until He has us like He wants us. But in order for Him to work on us, He must have us in the “fold”. When we come to Jesus, for forgiveness, and “salvation”, it is step one; we are “saved” from the slavery of sin, and spiritual death. We are still prone to sin, because I do not believe our sin nature is removed! Even Paul said,“For it is not I who sins, it is the sin within me.” Being covered by the blood of Christ, and God’s incredible grace, we are His, and there is nothing we can do to make Him love us more, nor anything we can do to make Him love us less.And as far as this repetitive use of Matthew 7:21,“Not everyone who says to me, Lord, Lord, Shall enter into the Kingdom of Heaven,” is becoming rather tedious I asked someone, earlier, if it was posible, that Jesus was addressing so-called"wannabes", you know, those who pretend to follow Him, knowing that He is the only Way to Heaven. Salvation is not, nor should it be approached as an easy, or simple process! I have been “saved”(let the record reflect, Your Honor, that parentheses are used for the benefit of the prosecution) for 42 years, and have had many people over that span of time, challenge not only the sincerity of my salvation, but the degree of my faith! Thanks to the amazing peace, which Christ gives me, I am able to “turn the other cheek”.Do you remember how in the NT, many of the Jewish believers wanted to turn back to their own ways, thus rejecting their new faith? Some Christians are like that. Even though they have been raised in the church, saved and baptized,they get caught up in the world, and abandon their faith, and may even become atheists! To you, I may be separated from the catholic church, but I know, without any doubts, that I am not eparated from Jesus! The few times that I have been invited to, and attended cathoilc churches, I have felt like a foreigner in a foreign land. Not many speak to you, and you are reminded, that you cannot do this, and cannot do this, unless you are catholic! Good thing Jesus didn’t treat people like this, huh? all of your scriptures are rather impressive, itis obvious that you are schooled well in using the Bible, but Jesus also said,“I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; and no one can snatch them out of my hand.” Do we sin, yes. Does this cause loss of salvation,???. If it did, we’d have to get saved all over again, possibly every day! OSAS

What sin is not deliberate?