"Jesus IS God!"?

[ralphinal]

But the alternative states “One third of a triune “God””, and many have chosen it.

I bet most people read it like I did: One of the Three Persons in THe Trinity. In retrospect, that is not how the OP intended it. He clearly has no concept of how the Trinity works, and meant it to be 1/3

 

[scooter469]

Bible Minute Daily Transcript

Date: Mar 11, 2009
Topic: Salvation
Title: God’s Solution for You

Tami Weissert: If sin’s the problem, then what’s the solution? Woodrow Kroll has your Bible Minute.

Woodrow Kroll: If you’re looking for God and His compassion today, you know you are a sinner, we’re gonna take you to what the Bible says is the answer to your problem of sin. And the answer is that God has cared for it. You see, you couldn’t go to God, so He came to you in the person of His son, Jesus. “The Word became flesh and dwelt among us” (John 1:14 , NKJV). That’s Jesus–the Word. Jesus died at Calvary 's cross to pay the penalty for your sin. He had no sin Himself to bear. He paid my sin’s penalty at the cross. Now, my response to that needs to be to trust that what He did is all that God required. If you need a Savior, God in His mercy is waiting for you to call on Him.

Tami Weissert: Check out God’s plan for your sin problem. Pick up today’s study at bibleminute.org.

 

[Frank4YAHWEH]

I feel like I need to point out a little fact.

A mediator is someone who brokers a treaty. It is not someone who carries messages. That is an intermediary. Jesus is a mediator. He brokered a treaty between God and Man. Now, how did he do that?

mediator - "This word is used in the New Testament to denote simply an internuncius, an ambassador, one who acts as a medium of communication between two contracting parties. …

This office involves the three functions of prophet, priest, and king … These functions are so inherent in the one office that the quality appertaining to each gives character to every mediatorial act. They are never separated in the exercise of the office of mediator." - Easton’s 1897 Bible Dictionary

It is not someone who carries messages. That is an intermediary.

mediate - 3. to effect (a result) or convey (a message, gift, etc.) by or as if by an intermediary (Also cf. intercessor, advocate and agent).

Yahshua is most certainly our our mediator, intercessor, and advocate with Father Yahweh.

For there is one Yahweh, and one mediator between Yahweh and men, THE MAN Yahshua Messiah (1 Timothy 2:5).

Note that there are two seperate beings mentioned in this passage, Father Yahweh and His son Yahshua.

But now has he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better contract, which was established upon better promises (Hebrews 8:6).

And for this cause he is the mediator of the renewed contract, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first contract, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance (Hebrews 9:15, 12:24).

Who is he that condemns? It is the Messaih that died, yes rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of Yahweh, who also makes intercession for us (Romans 8:34).

Note that this passage proclaims that Yahshua, Father Yahweh’s son is at the right hand of his Father Yahweh. No, Yahshua (“Jesus”) is not Father Yahweh (“God”).

My little children, *these things write I unto you, that you sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous: And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world ( 2:1-2).

• The so called “New Tesament” definition of sin is the disobedience of Father Yahweh’s teaching [torah, law, instruction] ( 3:4).

Father Yahweh’s Teaching

To Believe “Jesus IS God!” Is To Be Deceived!

Did Yahshua Create?

The Name Yahweh

 

[Frank4YAHWEH]

Iam sorry Frank for side tracking your interesting discussion. Tell you what, Lets not call Jesus by his name here, instead can we call him by the name the Prophets gave him before his birth? “EMMANUEL” GOD IS WITH US.

Mathew;1:21
She will bear a son and you are to name him Jesus, 10 because he will save his people from their sins."
22
All this took place to fulfill what the Lord had said through the prophet:
23
11 "Behold, the virgin shall be with child and bear a son, and they shall name him Emmanuel," which means "God is with us."

You do not dictate by what name I refer to Father Yahweh’s son. I refer to the Messiah by the name that Father Yahweh gave His son.

“There is NONE OTHER NAME GIVEN AMONG MEN whereby we must be redeemed.”

The Name Yahweh And The Name Of His Son Yahshua

YHWH

 

[Frank4YAHWEH]

Never mind the Pope or Vicar title applied to the authority of Peter’s chair. I am amazed that you insist on calling Peter, “Kepha” the Aramaic name for Rock in referring to Peter and not his faith. You know by doing this, you shut down the argument protestants and non catholic use to describe Jesus was referring the rock to Peter’s faith, and not a name change from Simon bar Jona to “Kepha” = Rock = translated to Greek Peter.

Why is it blashepemy to give Kepha the title of Vicar of Christ, when Jesus is the one who established his authority on earth upon him? Are you a blasphemer when you call your male parent “Father” or “Papa”. Kepha is our holy spiritual “papa” (father) in our faith, where is the blasephemy in this title we give our paternal Father, or our spiritual Father?

Kepha is not my paternal father nor is he my Heavenly Father. Yahweh is my Heavenly Father by inheritance and my earthly father is my paternal father by birth.

 

[look3467]

Hi AJ,

The “world” was also created through the Word (Second Person of the Blessed Trinity) who became flesh (Jesus Christ).

John 1:1-5 “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made. 4 In Him was life, and the life was the light of men. 5 And the light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it.”

Perhaps you’d like to read Holy Trinity. It is a different view than yours.

Pax,
SHW

Yes, I agree with you.

If we agree that Jesus is God, we can see that at the time of Jesus crucifixion, the beginning was.
Here’s what I mean.
The old had come to an end, nailed to the cross by death, but the new begun at the resurrection.
We have two distinct time periods that come to a “cross” road, the old/new.

For Jesus to, from the time He came to earth, must of necessity include all previous souls that ever lived and died in His redemptive work.

This takes Him to the beginning of mankind to His day and for all future generations.

That is why He is the Alpha and the Omega. (The beginning and the end)

He was the end of the first and the beginning of the second.

If He uses the same 7-day creation story, it means that He in physical practice must spiritually encapsulate all souls from the very start in His work of redemption.

We know God today as: Jesus.
Ref: Act 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

When you die, you will see Jesus as God!

Blessings, AJ

 

[Frank4YAHWEH]

Frank4YAHWEH;4920410:

The following is an excerpt from MY XANGA BLOG

.

Did Thomas Call Yahshua “God”?

Explanations proposed:

1. Thomas was surprised when he saw the Lord in their midst. “My God!” was just an expression, a “statement of surprise.”
2. Thomas was actually addressing both the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ when he said, “My Lord and my God.”
3. It is not a teaching text (non-didactic text); actually Thomas made a mistake when he said, “My Lord and my God.”
4. Thomas could have been saying my master and judge. The word ‘theos’ is generic and has many meanings and can mean ‘judge’.

Webmaster’s Comment: It is my stance that Thomas exclaimed “My master (lord) AND my Almighty One (‘God’)!”. He said “my master ‘lord’]” giving reference to Yahshua as his master AND “my Almighty One (‘God’)” giving reference to Father Yahweh as his Almighty One.

Here is the entire text from the ‘New American Standard Bible’ John 20:27-28:

“Then he (Yahshua) said to Thomas, ‘Reach here your finger, and see my hands, and reach here your hand, and put it into my side; and be not unbelieving, but believing.’ Thomas answered and said to him, ‘My Lord and my God!’”

Please observe the mark of exclamation (!) at the end of the phrase. The King James Version does not use an exclamation mark.
Please notice there was no question asked in the entire narration. Hence, the text which reads “Thomas answered” is inaccurate.

The last phrase “My Lord and my God!” was not an answer but it was an outburst by Thomas, having seen something inexplicable and baffling. It is not unusual that a man cries out; “O’ my God!” when he sees something totally bizarre.

Gabriel of 12;

Frank, Frank, Thomas does not state anything before Jesus takes Thomas’s finger and hands to confirm his wounds, besides what the heck is this Jesus doing appearing time and time again in his deathly wounds if he was not divine?

Thomas reaction does not come with an outburst as you incorrectly interpret this scripture and your sources.

Thomas’s statement does not come until he sees and touches Jesus wounds, and then Jesus speaks to Thomas again do not be unbelieving but believe; after all this, now Thomas is believing, realizing he had doubted all this time, is what was pondering his mind, not an outburst, not logical here.

Then doubting Thomas makes his faith known to say to Jesus himself “MY Lord ANDMY GOD”. Thomas did not say "Oh, my Lord, or Oh, my god as this is termed in the english language, your analogy does not fit the grammar of the text, nor the idium of the century. Remember Thomas was there when the Jews tried to stone Jesus for blasephemy many times for making himself out to be God, including his trial with the High Priest, accused Jesus of blashephemy. Doubting Thomas now sees and feels with his own hands, and confesses his doubt no more, but makes an acclamation of faith to Jesus as "My Lord ANDMy God!

Now pay attention to Jesus response to Thomas faith; “Have you come to believe because you have seen me?” Jesus response would have been different if Thomas was going to take the Lords name in vain in front of him, instead Thomas directs his faith now to Jesus being His Lord and His God, anything else he would of been guilty of taking the Lords name in vain.

No, Thomas did not take Father Yahweh’s Name IN VAIN! Note that in the translation that you use the word “God” is not a name but, is an attributive title. Even if Thomas did use His Name, the context does not say that he used His Name IN VAIN.

The Name Yahweh

Baal Gad

 

[Frank4YAHWEH]

Thanks for telling me when I’m wrong, Frank. No really, I appreciate it, no sarcasm.

Can you please elaborate and tell me why Thomas did not violate Exodus 20:7?

Answered in my previous post to Gabriel.

 

[Frank4YAHWEH]

Note that the passage from Timothy says ALL, not ONLY. That is why we also have Sacred Tradition (with a big T). After all, without Sacred Tradition, we wouldn’t even have the Bible. The Catholic Church existed before anything in the New Testament was even written down. The Catholic Church has the authority to interpret scripture as has been pointed out by Jesus giving authority to Peter and later to the apostles.

Also, you are instructed to hold fast to the traditions taught and not just from scripture:

2 Thess 2:13-15

So, where does **YOUR **authority come from to interpret the scriptures? I’m pretty sure I never read anywhere that Frank had that authority. Therefore, I’ll trust what the Holy Catholic Church teaches.

To quote another poster here:

Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation ( 1:20).

My authority does not come from “private interpretation”. Scripture interprets itself. Note that the following passage when using the word “Scripture” is in reference to the so called “Old Testament” since, the so called “New Testament” had not yet been compiled at that time.

All scripture is given by inspiration of Yahweh, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of Yahweh may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all righteous works (2 Timothy 3:16-17).

As for “traditions”, there are traditions that are of Father Yahweh and there are traditions of men.

And he said unto them, Full well you reject the commandment of Yahweh, that you may keep your own tradition. … Making the word of Yahweh of none effect through your tradition, which you have delivered: and many such like things do you (Yahchanan Mark 7:9-13).

 

[Frank4YAHWEH]

“God in three persons, blessed Trinity” is hymnal and not Sciptural.

Trinity Links

To Believe “Jesus IS God!” Is To Be Deceived!

Did Yahshua Create?

 

[MHalsey]

Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation ( 1:20).

My authority does not come from “private interpretation”. Scripture interprets itself. Note that the following passage when using the word “Scripture” is in reference to the so called “Old Testament” since, the so called “New Testament” had not yet been compiled at that time.

All scripture is given by inspiration of Yahweh, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of Yahweh may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all righteous works (2 Timothy 3:16-17).

As for “traditions”, there are traditions that are of Father Yahweh and there are traditions of men.

And he said unto them, Full well you reject the commandment of Yahweh, that you may keep your own tradition. … Making the word of Yahweh of none effect through your tradition, which you have delivered: and many such like things do you (Yahchanan Mark 7:9-13).

So you’re saying we should reject the traditions that come to us from Paul and the rest of the Apostles? Yet you accept what Paul says in his letter to Timothy.

and your quote from Mark is taken out of context. Here Jesus is reprimanding the Pharisees for complaining that the disciples were eating with unclean hands. This is not a reference to the traditions Paul is referring to.

Scripture does not interpret itself. If it did, you would not have such a big problem with the first chapter of John’s Gospel. You want to interpret a different way than the way it is written.

 

[Frank4YAHWEH]

But the alternative states “One third of a triune “God””, and many have chosen it.

This is because there are diverse beliefs espoused to by Trinitarians, even Catholic Trinitarians. I have even confronted those who profess to be Catholic that do not believe that doctrine “Jesus IS God!”.

Trinity Links

To Believe “Jesus IS God!” Is To Be Deceived!

Did Yahshua Create?

 

[DLClark]

Question for Frank the originator of this thread. Are you really interested in knowing what the Bible says about the diety of Christ or are you just wanting to argue with us? You are free to email me a private rely if you want.

Darrel

 

[Frank4YAHWEH]

Question for Frank the originator of this thread. Are you really interested in knowing what the Bible says about the diety of Christ or are you just wanting to argue with us? You are free to email me a private rely if you want.

Darrel

Darrel,

Argue = Discuss

Is this not a discussion forum?

No, I am not interested in e-mailing you a private reply.

There in no mention in Scripture about “diety of Christ”.

Trinity Links

To Believe “Jesus IS God!” Is To Be Deceived!

Did Yahshua Create?

 

[Frank4YAHWEH]

So you’re saying we should reject the traditions that come to us from Paul and the rest of the Apostles? Yet you accept what Paul says in his letter to Timothy.

and your quote from Mark is taken out of context. Here Jesus is reprimanding the Pharisees for complaining that the disciples were eating with unclean hands. This is not a reference to the traditions Paul is referring to.

Scripture does not interpret itself. If it did, you would not have such a big problem with the first chapter of John’s Gospel. You want to interpret a different way than the way it is written.

If I said “We should reject the traditions that come to us from Paul and the rest of the Apostles.” I would have said it but, I have never made such a statement as this. Are you attempting to put words in my mouth, or what?

Eating with unclean hands is a tradition of the Jews and is not of Yahweh. Like I said, “Scripture interprets itself.” No, I have no problem with the first chapter of Yahchanan [John]. No, I do not want to interpret a different way than the way it is written.

Trinity Links

To Believe “Jesus IS God!” Is To Be Deceived!

Did Yahshua Create?

 

[JJ59]

Hi again, Frank!

You do not dictate by what name I refer to Father Yahweh’s son. I refer to the Messiah by the name that Father Yahweh gave His son.

“There is NONE OTHER NAME GIVEN AMONG MEN whereby we must be redeemed.”

The Name Yahweh And The Name Of His Son Yahshua

YHWH

Now, “name” doesn’t necessarily refer to someone’s given name. In this case, it is a description of who they are.

Calling Jesus “Immanuel” (as it is in Scripture) does not do anything to his Holy Name. Jesus was just called “Immanuel” because that means “God With Us” (Jesus truly was “God With Us”, because he is God.)

I’m sorry if I misunderstand your point made for john 20:28…

How is that not in vain? I mean, crying out “My Lord and my God” as an exclamation sure does seem vain. How does the context make it not so?

And as a side note-- As to the Papacy and the Church (a little of topic), you said that scripture “interprets itself”.

But this makes no sense, considering there are very many protestant denominations (33,000), disagreeing on every topic from the Trinity to Salvation, and still saying that Scripture interprets itself.

We haven’t had an extremely friendly discussion between the two of us, Frank, and that’s mostly because of me, and I apologize .

God Bless.

 

[Eggnotz]

“One-third of a triune God” doesn’t work. The Godhead cannot be carved up like a pie. Father, Son and Holy Spirit, One God. Mathematics doesn’t work. Human words cannot describe it. (This is why arguing over the Filioque is ridiculous in the first place.)

 

[Frank4YAHWEH]

Now, “name” doesn’t necessarily refer to someone’s given name. In this case, it is a description of who they are.

I believe I said “I refer to the Messiah by the name that Father Yahweh gave His son.”

Calling Jesus “Immanuel” (as it is in Scripture) does not do anything to his Holy Name. Jesus was just called “Immanuel” because that means “God With Us” (Jesus truly was “God With Us”, because he is God.)

I never said “Calling Jesus “Immanuel” does anything to his Holy Name.” Nowhere in Scripture does it say “Jesus truly was “God With Us”, because he is God.”

How is that not in vain? I mean, crying out “My Lord and my God” as an exclamation sure does seem vain. How does the context make it not so?

Maybe you would like to accuse Yahshua of vanity!

Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani? which is, being interpreted, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?" (Mark 15:34 A.K.J.V.)

And as a side note-- As to the Papacy and the Church (a little of topic), you said that scripture “interprets itself”.

But this makes no sense, considering there are very many protestant denominations (33,000), disagreeing on every topic from the Trinity to Salvation, and still saying that Scripture interprets itself.

Just because one says that Scripture interprets itself, does not necessarily means that they are not giving their own private interpretation to certain Scriptural passages by taking them out of context. There are also those who properly interpret Scripture in saying “You shall not steal.” and then they turn right around and disobey this teaching.

To Believe “Jesus IS God!” Is To Be Deceived!

Did Yahshua Create?

 

[DLClark]

Fred what if you wrong and I can show you will you be open to this?

Darrel

 

[Frank4YAHWEH]

Fred what if you wrong and I can show you will you be open to this?

Darrel

Who are you addressing here Darrel? I see no one named Fred in this thread. If you are addressing me, my name is Frank. Wrong about what? What is your “If” about? About me e-mailing you a private message? What I said is what I meant. I am in no way interested in e-mailing you a private message. And that is that!

To Believe “Jesus IS God!” Is To Be Deceived!

Did Yahshua Create?