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Maximilian75
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Who has said they have to go back alone?
Jorge Garcia, husband and father of two, deported Jan 15 2018 (MLK Day)
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catholic1seeks
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It’s completely ridiculous and not very compassionate for someone to suggest that the rest of his family must go to Mexico when the USA has ALWAYS been their home, when his wife and children are legal American citizens, and when he was brought to the USA when only 10 years old and has since been a productive member of society for a few decades.
Again. I’m with the bishops.
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LeafByNiggle
Well-known member
That is why we are asking for our mortal rulers to rule in favor of Jorge and his family. And since most people are favor of a path to citizenship for the dreamers, it is quite likely that they will - or be voted out of office.
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Maximilian75
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Post 68.
The system is broken. but the law is still the law. As Catholics, we should lobby for imigration reform. but until that occurs, we should follow the law, which gives a path for citizenship.
The system is broken. but the law is still the law. As Catholics, we should lobby for imigration reform. but until that occurs, we should follow the law, which gives a path for citizenship.
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catholic1seeks
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I can’t figure out how to see posts by post #. I can’t find the numbers anywhere
And I agree with your statement in general. But when it comes to a specific situation like the one this thread is speaking to, I think we have to make exceptions. Law might be law, and I’m glad you admit that the current law is not a good one. But I think that proves we shouldn’t be arguing for his family to move with him: He should never had to have moved in the first place.
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Loud-living-dogma
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Maximilian75
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if youre on mobile, there should be a scroll bar on the right and a number there as well.
And immigration is a quagmire of an issue… The sooner reform can occur, the better.
And immigration is a quagmire of an issue… The sooner reform can occur, the better.
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catholic1seeks
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Hmmmm I’m not certain of your point. There’s two different things going on.
LeafByNiggle
Well-known member
I don’t think any of us are in a position to do anything other than to lobby for a change in the law, or at least a change is the discretionary enforcement of that law until such time as a more formal change is enacted. That’s all we have been doing in this thread. No one is organizing a raid on ICE offices or anything like that. By calling for compassion for Jorge we are not breaking the law.
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catholic1seeks
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Honestly I think that’s the gist of it. Well said.
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starlady
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Technically there are ways for those who are here illegally to regularize their situation, but that can usually only happen when the undocumented immigrant has an immediate family relationship (spouse/parent/child) who is a US citizen or permanent resident. Children are not able to petition and sponsor their undocumented parents until they are 21 years old. It’s easier for undocumented immigrants who entered with a visa and overstayed; they don’t have to leave the country for processing. It’s a lot longer process for undocumented immigrants who crossed the border undetected, because after a long application process, they will have to leave the country for the consular interview, the final step.
Of course, it’s never guaranteed until the officer said “Welcome to the United States.” For undocumented immigrants who entered without visas, they need to prove that they have otherwise good, moral character (minor to no criminal history, paid taxes, involvement in community, etc.) and that their absence would cause “extreme hardship” to their citizen or permanent resident spouse/parent/child if they were to be separated or if their family member would have to go with them to their home country. It’s a steep burden of proof. And any number of reasons can disqualify them (multiple illegal entries, felonies, history of drug/alcohol abuse, lying to an officer about citizenship, previous deportations, etc.).
It is unfortunate that they could not apply for or did not achieve cancellation of deportation in Mr. Garcia’s case, and really shows the need for immigration reform (on both sides of the political aisle).
Of course, it’s never guaranteed until the officer said “Welcome to the United States.” For undocumented immigrants who entered without visas, they need to prove that they have otherwise good, moral character (minor to no criminal history, paid taxes, involvement in community, etc.) and that their absence would cause “extreme hardship” to their citizen or permanent resident spouse/parent/child if they were to be separated or if their family member would have to go with them to their home country. It’s a steep burden of proof. And any number of reasons can disqualify them (multiple illegal entries, felonies, history of drug/alcohol abuse, lying to an officer about citizenship, previous deportations, etc.).
It is unfortunate that they could not apply for or did not achieve cancellation of deportation in Mr. Garcia’s case, and really shows the need for immigration reform (on both sides of the political aisle).
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starlady
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But there’s not a path to citizenship for everyone. Dreamers are stuck in limbo. Undocumented immigrants normally can only become legal if they have an immediate family member (spouse/parent/child) who is a US citizen or permanent resident. Most (if not, all) Dreamers have undocumented parents. They may or may not have US-born children (who won’t be able to help them until they are 21 years old). They may or may not have a US citizen/permanent resident spouse.
There are very very narrow criteria for Dreamers to get a green card, and that is through advance parole, which is basically permission to leave the US and return for specific dates and for a specific reason. Dreamers need to prove that it is for educational purposes or dire family crisis (family member sick/dying, etc.). The advance parole allows them to legally reenter the country, which counts as a lawful entry. But there are all kinds of requirements for advance parole and it’s not granted to everyone. And they would also need to be married to a US citizen or have a US citizen old enough to petition them in order to get the green card.
Immigration law is complicated. My previous job was in immigration. I agree that reform is needed.
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pnewton
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It is the “if” that is my moral issue to this deportation. Do you really think a father would be separated from his wife and kids if there was a legal option?
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Arkansan
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There’s nothing “anti-family” about living in Mexico. His wife chose to marry him knowing that he could be removed from the country at any time, no wrong is done to her by saying that she must accept a risk that she voluntarily chose to take on. I’m not even saying she did anything wrong by marrying him, but if you marry a foreigner without legal status then you need to accept that you might have to immigrate yourself one day.
The children are dual citizens, Mexico is as much their homeland as America.
Being made to live in one’s own country isn’t a penalty. Most people get along just fine under such a “penalty”.
The difference is that his wife never tried to illegally entered Mexico.catholic1seeks:
Also, it is contrary to the Golden Rule to suggest that immigration to Mexico for his family is okay, but immigration to the US for him is not.
His kids are dual citizens. They have an absolute right to live in Mexico, it’s just a matter of submitting their paperwork to a Mexican consulate.
Mexico allows its citizens to get visas for their spouses. Unless his wife has a criminal record or something there’s no reason to think she couldn’t move to Mexico.
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JimR-OCDS
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You’re speaking about the people seeking to come into the US, not the children of parents who took them here illegally.
The laws have never been made to address their situation and DACA was merely a bandaid, until Trump let it expire
Jim
The laws have never been made to address their situation and DACA was merely a bandaid, until Trump let it expire
Jim
LeafByNiggle
Well-known member
No, but there is something anti-family about making a family who has never lived there move there or be split up.
That might be almost true of Jorge. It is definitely not true of the rest of his family. They have never lived there.
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starlady
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I’m sorry, I misunderstood then. I thought you meant in general.
There are very narrow criteria for Dreamers to get a green card, but very few can meet the requirements, as I mentioned in the following post. And that is only because they had prior permission to leave the country and re-enter legally. Obviously that only applies to very few and for most Dreamers, you’re right, DACA was only a bandaid that isn’t a long-term solution.
There are very narrow criteria for Dreamers to get a green card, but very few can meet the requirements, as I mentioned in the following post. And that is only because they had prior permission to leave the country and re-enter legally. Obviously that only applies to very few and for most Dreamers, you’re right, DACA was only a bandaid that isn’t a long-term solution.
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Arkansan
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Living somewhere doesn’t make you a native. There are American English teachers in Japan whose kids are born and raised there, but that doesn’t make them Japanese.
The fact that Jorge’s children are American citizens doesn’t mean they aren’t Mexicans as well. There’s nothing wrong with him taking them with him.
As for his wife, she chose to marry a foreign man who was in the country illegally. She could hardly have been unaware that she could one day have to immigrate to be with him.
The fact that Jorge’s children are American citizens doesn’t mean they aren’t Mexicans as well. There’s nothing wrong with him taking them with him.
As for his wife, she chose to marry a foreign man who was in the country illegally. She could hardly have been unaware that she could one day have to immigrate to be with him.
LeafByNiggle
Well-known member
Yes there is. Regardless of what any official documents say, these children have lived their whole lives in the US and have deep connections with their community. They would have to leave the friends they have made and interrupt their schooling to live in a culture totally unfamiliar to them. To them, US is their country. They are a part of it. It would hurt them just as much if not more than it would hurt you if you were forced to move to Mexico. But of course you don’t have to. That is the only difference.
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Arkansan
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Kids have to move all the time because of decisions their parents make. The objection that it’s unfair for them to have to leave their school and local community holds no water unless you also want to ban internal migration of families.
The difference between them and I is that I’m not a Mexican. My ancestors have lived here for generations, and never came from Mexico. Just glossing over the fact that that’s where their roots are doesn’t make it go away.
The difference between them and I is that I’m not a Mexican. My ancestors have lived here for generations, and never came from Mexico. Just glossing over the fact that that’s where their roots are doesn’t make it go away.
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