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adf417
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…and while you are at it @CatholicsErr please make note of some of these same fathers which helped canonize the bible. You may find this quite alarming.
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annad347
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Both. Maybe not pushing but more like not belonging.
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BarbTh
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Apologies. I am unable to post and am just testing to see if my intended post might be too long.
Thank you
Thank you
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Annie
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You do realize that the “Scripture” referred to by Timothy is only the Old Testament?
The Bible is a Catholic-based book. The books of the NT were measured against what the Catholic Church taught, and what the Catholic Church taught and teaches still is what Christ taught. He did not give us the Bible to read; He taught His disciples and they taught others, who taught others, and that is how the Faith was spread. The Church is the pillar and ground of truth, according to the Bible (1Timothy 3:15)
And you yourself quoted Elizabeth (Luke 1:43): Who am I that the mother of our Lord should come to me?
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CatholicsErr
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Scripture means sacred writings. All scripture is sacred because it comes from mouth of God. In my previous comments, I proved how all apostle writings are also Scripture. (Comment #41)
The thing is, Mary is never called "Mother of God " in Scriptures.
Rather, she is called “mother of Jesus” ,“mother of my Lord”.
Then again, you fail to explain how Catholic and other denominational practices like infant baptism makes sense. The Bible is the Holy Word of God. It is not a “Catholic-based” book. Like the Pharisees of old, traditions of men are elevated above the word of God - Matthew 15:8-9. Where else will things then go, but downhill?
Try not to cherry-pick my statements but rather show how “Hail Mary” is based on Scripture, since the only infallible interpreter of Scripture is Scripture.
The thing is, Mary is never called "Mother of God " in Scriptures.
Rather, she is called “mother of Jesus” ,“mother of my Lord”.
Then again, you fail to explain how Catholic and other denominational practices like infant baptism makes sense. The Bible is the Holy Word of God. It is not a “Catholic-based” book. Like the Pharisees of old, traditions of men are elevated above the word of God - Matthew 15:8-9. Where else will things then go, but downhill?
Try not to cherry-pick my statements but rather show how “Hail Mary” is based on Scripture, since the only infallible interpreter of Scripture is Scripture.
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Annie
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Who do you think the Lord is?
Where does it say in the Bible that the Bible is the infallible interpreter of itself?
Where does it say in the Bible that the Bible is the infallible interpreter of itself?
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CatholicsErr
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We use Bible to explain the Bible itself. I think it is self-explanatory.
Rather, you should be trying to prove how man-made traditions can add to His Word and and still be right. Perhaps, you also think that Mary is a perpetual virgin and without sin?
Rather, you should be trying to prove how man-made traditions can add to His Word and and still be right. Perhaps, you also think that Mary is a perpetual virgin and without sin?
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adf417
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Everybody does including Mormons and Jw’s, therefore, your next quote below - is right back at you.
Peace
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CatholicsErr
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I am sorry? I do not get your point. No Christian practices infant baptism or recite Hail Mary and such. My point here is that not everyone is a Christian, although they think they are 
.
Why do you think Mary is a virgin? " Is this not the carpenter’s son? Is not His mother called Mary? And His brothers James, Joses, Simon, and Judas? And His sisters, are they not all with us? Where then did this Man get all these things? " (Matthew 13:55-56). Mary is never called a virgin after Jesus was born in the Bible. Since the evidence in the Scriptures is solid, then the question of why Christians say that Mary did not remain a virgin after giving birth to Jesus is self-evident. We do so because it is the truth.A better question, however, is to ask why the Roman Catholic Church(and other denominations) established a tradition contrary what is found in the Bible. What is it that they seek to gain?
Since Catholics believe that sin is inherited, they needed a way to explain how Jesus, who knew no sin, was born without sin. To accomplish this, they declared that Mary’s birth was a miracle and she was born without sin. If it takes sinless parents to create a sinless child, then wouldn’t Mary’s parents be without sin? Continue the idea and soon no one is born in sin, which happens to be the truth anyway.
Good luck trying to pass off your man-made traditions as truth.
.Why do you think Mary is a virgin? " Is this not the carpenter’s son? Is not His mother called Mary? And His brothers James, Joses, Simon, and Judas? And His sisters, are they not all with us? Where then did this Man get all these things? " (Matthew 13:55-56). Mary is never called a virgin after Jesus was born in the Bible. Since the evidence in the Scriptures is solid, then the question of why Christians say that Mary did not remain a virgin after giving birth to Jesus is self-evident. We do so because it is the truth.A better question, however, is to ask why the Roman Catholic Church(and other denominations) established a tradition contrary what is found in the Bible. What is it that they seek to gain?
Since Catholics believe that sin is inherited, they needed a way to explain how Jesus, who knew no sin, was born without sin. To accomplish this, they declared that Mary’s birth was a miracle and she was born without sin. If it takes sinless parents to create a sinless child, then wouldn’t Mary’s parents be without sin? Continue the idea and soon no one is born in sin, which happens to be the truth anyway.
Good luck trying to pass off your man-made traditions as truth.
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Yep
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Stop hijacking my thread. If you want to convert people to Protestantism start your own thread about it.
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CatholicsErr
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I’m not a Protestant. I am a Christian. I only tried to make you understand that many Catholic beliefs are not based on Scripture, rather, they are man-made. If you do not like it, I shall take my leave.
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Techno2000
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The Scriptures come from the Catholic Church.
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adf417
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the point is - you said
And I said, “everybody does including Mormons and JWs”.
Therefore ,
you should be trying to prove how man-made traditions can add to His Word and still be right.
The rest of your post is just a red herring and until you address your authority on the interpretation of said scriptures and your infallibility there is no point addressing the rest of the post.
Peace!!!
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CatholicsErr
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I think I already made many comments on how Scripture is authority and how it is what makes a man complete. That you do not want to accept it doesn’t change anything.
The thing is you think Scripture only means Old Testament which is wrong and also proved it. Paul says Scripture equips man for every good work. This means no good work is absent in the Bible. 2 Peter 1:3 states everything pertaining to life and godliness have been revealed to us. Anything else is simply adding to God’s word.
“Do not add to His words, Lest He rebuke you, and you be found a liar.” Proverbs 30:6.
Either way, there is nothing good in performing infant baptism. The primary condition for baptism is belief and repentance. Infants can’t do any of these. So good luck getting into the kingdom with such traditions.
I do not want to keep repeating myself so many times. It is tiring indeed, and your hearts still remain closed.
The thing is you think Scripture only means Old Testament which is wrong and also proved it. Paul says Scripture equips man for every good work. This means no good work is absent in the Bible. 2 Peter 1:3 states everything pertaining to life and godliness have been revealed to us. Anything else is simply adding to God’s word.
“Do not add to His words, Lest He rebuke you, and you be found a liar.” Proverbs 30:6.
Either way, there is nothing good in performing infant baptism. The primary condition for baptism is belief and repentance. Infants can’t do any of these. So good luck getting into the kingdom with such traditions.
I do not want to keep repeating myself so many times. It is tiring indeed, and your hearts still remain closed.
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adf417
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And yet there are so many differing interpretations disagreeing with each other and using this paradigm. :man_shrugging:t3:
If i did accept it which interpretation would i be accepting? Yours? My neighbors? The JWs?
No! I dont! This statement proves you are completely ignorant to the Catholic religion and this is a waste of time.
Thanks but i wont be counting on luck.
It sounds like you have a much bigger battle than just us Catholics to teach. There are many non-Catholics with some of the same “traditions” you disagree with. It would seem you can fix them 1st before coming here to fix us.
Why ARE yall not all on the same page with these issues anyhow?
Peace!!!
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Pattylt
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You seem to be telling Catholics what you believe. I’m sorry but on what authority are you interpreting scripture? I’m not Christian but even I will accept the 2000 years of catholic scholars interpretation over some random guy on the internet.
Perhaps if you told us who’s authority you are using? What denomination you follow? Have you done any serious research into the Catholic reasoning for your challenges? You do know they are based on scripture, don’t you? The scriptures are written by and come from the Church…don’t you think they may understand them a bit after 2000 yrs of using them?
I’m sorry but you just sound like a petty person trying to act like you have some superior knowledge over Catholics. How about you ASK why they interpret things the way they do instead of just telling them how wrong they are…you know…that humility and charity you are supposed to have?
Perhaps if you told us who’s authority you are using? What denomination you follow? Have you done any serious research into the Catholic reasoning for your challenges? You do know they are based on scripture, don’t you? The scriptures are written by and come from the Church…don’t you think they may understand them a bit after 2000 yrs of using them?
I’m sorry but you just sound like a petty person trying to act like you have some superior knowledge over Catholics. How about you ASK why they interpret things the way they do instead of just telling them how wrong they are…you know…that humility and charity you are supposed to have?
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Lenten_ashes
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You are a protestant
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Lenten_ashes
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Bravo, bravo
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Lenten_ashes
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Or maybe you have a very, VERY fallible interpretation that you are in here trying to push and you are the one in error.
Your entire premise of Sola Scriptura is an assumption, is incorrect and can be demonstrated. The bible never claims to be a do it all manual. While the scriptures point to themselves, they also point to tradition (2 Thess 2:15), to the Church (1 Tim 3:15/Matthew 16) and to authoritative church councils(ACTS 15).
And not only is your premise incorrect, you have no pedigree, you have no succession. Anyone can claim anything. I can claim to be the President but it does not make it so because there is a process involved that I have tried to bypass in my wild claims.
And all burden of proof here is on you to demonstrate your positions. At best, what you have is your personal, fallible interpretation vs our fallible interpretation. So we are at a standstill.
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