Male-Female Friendship

[TheLittleLady]

And look at the one friend who was there at His tomb to be the first to announce His resurrection?

It is sad that our culture has made friendship into some malignancy to be avoided.

 

[TheLittleLady]

Do you practice chastity? [Do you try and strive to practice complete abstinence from any sexual activity? (Not merely celibacy, but chastity.)] Can you practice chastity – continually for at least half a year?

Chastity according to one’s state of life is the default.

Half a year? How about for decades?

Don’t you have any emotional troubles because of your close friendships with persons of the opposite sex? Or are you certain that your opposite-sex friends don’t have any emotional troubles because of your close friendship?

Nope, no emotional troubles. My life is enriched by my friends. Honestly, I do not know how I’d have made it through some times without my friends. My friends do not have “emotional troubles” because of our friendship. Honestly, that sounds like a couple of people who never learned friendship as children/teens.

 

[do_justly_love_mercy]

It seems that you and some others on this thread (e.g. @Swiftdove) seem to subscribe to the Mike Pence school of interaction with the opposite sex.

It’s completely alien to me. It was just never part of how I grew up and is not how I choose to live my life now. With my friends, it makes no difference whether they are men or women. And when I say “friends”, I mean close friends, people I’ve known over a period of several years or longer, people I would meet with one-to-one once or twice per month for a period of several hours, sometimes go somewhere together for a weekend.

Same goes for my fiancé, as I have said. He has this particularly close female friend. They went to school together, went to university together (although belonging to different colleges), and now live in the same city. Typically they meet every other weekend, visit a museum, see a movie, take a long walk, then catch up for a couple of hours over a coffee or lunch. Occasionally they meet on a weekday evening. When we’re married, I don’t intend for them to change their routine and I don’t expect to be invited along each time.

The point that nobody has picked up is how this applies to people attracted to the same sex or both (a category in which I don’t mind stating that I include myself). When gay/bisexual men and women are friends, they’re not constantly falling in love with everyone and having sex together. Indeed, if one is bisexual, can one have any friends at all? And, if you are heterosexual, how do you cope with having gay and bisexual friends?

 

[C.laypersona]

Half a year? How about for decades?

Alright. And no adultery of the heart?

And you should know that women in general find it easier to practice chastity than men.

“Men perceived sex with their opposite-sex friends as more beneficial than did women. Women reported receiving protection from their opposite-sex friends more often than did men, and they perceived the protection as highly beneficial.” (Bleske and Buss, 2000)

Hmm, by the way, since you say that you’ve practiced chastity for decades, may I ask whether you’re [perhaps] a nun or only a celibate laywoman? [or elderly?]

 

[do_justly_love_mercy]

Never in my life heard of Mr Mike Pence until today, sorry.

Hmm. He is the vice president of the United States and chair of the White House Coronavirus Task Force. Even if you are not American, he is a pretty major figure in world affairs. In the event that Donald Trump were to die, resign, or be convicted of high crimes and misdemeanors, he would become the most powerful person in the world.

Hmm, by the way, since you say that you’ve practiced chastity for decades, may I ask whether you’re a nun or only a celibate laywoman?

Those are not the only two options. One can observe chastity by having sexual relations within marriage. Chastity does not mean never having sex.

And you should know that women in general find it easier to practice chastity than men.

That is often claimed, but I suspect usually by men. I can assure you, as a woman, that chastity is not always easy to practise. I think a lot of men who post on this forum seem not to understand that women often have equally strong sexual feelings.

 

[TheLittleLady]

Hmm, by the way, since you say that you’ve practiced chastity for decades, may I ask whether you’re a nun or only a celibate laywoman?

Sigh, every one of us is called to chastity according to their state in life. Single people, married people, religious, chastity is required of all!

You realize that marital chastity is not the same as that for a single or consecrated religious?

Some married people have practiced continence for long times in their marriage because of travel or illness or other situations. Continent or not, it is still chastity.

Alright. And no adultery of the heart?

And you should know that women in general find it easier to practice chastity than men.

Ahh, the old “When Harry Met Sally” myth.

Quoting a 20 year old secular journal is not likely to give you a complete picture of Christian behavior.

Both men and women have concupiscence. Don’t for a second believe that women are free of this human drive. Some individuals struggle more than others.

As Christians, learn to control our passions and it is not unusual for adults to have no desire to behave in an unchaste manner.

 

[phil19034]

Can they be close friends, yes they can be.

However, can one easily fall in love with the other, yes.

There is not an issue with men & women being friends. The potential problem is what happens when one falls in love with the other, but the feelings are not returned? This becomes especially hard when the person they love becomes romantically involved with another person.

For some, it is simply too hard & painful to watch the person they are in love with romantically be with another.

Personally, when I was in college, I became best friends with a girl I knew from high school. We were friends throughout all of high school, but started becoming really close friends senior year of high school, and became best friends in college.

I fell in love with her even though she had a boyfriend. I ignored my feelings for a while. Then, she eventually broke up with her boyfriend. I thought it was finally my chance to ask her out and confess my feelings. But she told me that she started to see another guy. I was broken hearted & started fall to jealousy. I said some things behind her back that destroyed her friendship with the other guy. It turned out that she really didn’t like him romantically and had feelings for me.

She could never forgive me. Not only did I allow my jealousy to take hold, but I lost her in the process. I was torn up over it for many years.

My point: are male/female friendships possible? Yes. However, the closer the friendship, the higher the possibility that one (or both) of you will fall in love.

For two single people, I think it’s good to be friends first. They often say nothing is better than falling in love & marrying your best friend.

But it’s important to be honest. If one falls in love with the other, you need to be 1st honest with yourself. And second, honest with your friend.

But if one is married, it’s often best to avoid the situation.

I hope this helps.

God Bless

 

[TheLittleLady]

However, can one easily fall in love with the other, yes

Perhaps for young people, but, as we mature we learn that love is a choice, not something into which one falls like a hidden mudpuddle.

 

[phil19034]

phil19034:

However, can one easily fall in love with the other, yes

Perhaps for young people, but, as we mature we learn that love is a choice, not something into which one falls like a hidden mudpuddle.

I don’t know. Perhaps it’s easier for men to fall in love with their best friend when that best friend is a woman?

NOTE: I’m not talking about women who are simply “friends” or acquaintances. I’m talking about when they are “best friends”

A best friend is someone you want to be around all the time & tell your deepest thoughts/feelings/desires/concerns/worries/joys/etc.

When a man is in a good marriage, our best friend is our wife.

Guys typically don’t have the same kind of relationship with a male best friend as women do with their best friends. Women tend to have more deep & emotional relationships with their best friends than men do with other men.

In other words, guys tend to have a bond of brotherhood with their male best friend, but two close brothers usually don’t have the same kind of relationship as two close sisters.

ANYWAY, my point is if a man becomes truly best friends with a woman, the idea of marrying her has AT LEAST crossed his mind (even if he doesn’t fall deeply in love with her).

And I would be willing to put money on that happening at any age for men.

 

[Lara]

Your fiancé and you aren’t living in the same country now. And you are not dependent upon him. When you are married, and you’ve barely seen him all week, and then he chooses to spend three of his precious hours with his female friend while you are doing housework and minding young children, you will not feel the same way.

It was all right for Jesus to spend some time with Mary and Martha because I presume they were all single. If Jesus had been married, his wife would find simple ways to dispense with Mary and Martha.

My advice is keep your man on a tight rein. Picture the rein on a horse’s mouth being very loose and you will see that you can’t keep the horse going in the right direction.

Opposite-sex friendships past youth are unnecessary and cause jealousy. Once you are married, drop all your beta-orbiters. It will help you attach emotionally to your husband.

It is much better to have five or ten female friends in addition to your nuclear family.

 

[Swiftdove]

I agree completely. I had guy friends all through growing up, cared alot about them, wasn’t sexual, and thought we would always be friends (some) after maturing a bit I’ve experienced jealousy on both ends, mixed feelings on both ends, and I’ve experienced the peace of valuing friendships with only the same sex inside of ourmarriage. No drama no questions… no jealousy. 6 children. Barely enough time for nurturing g female friendships ! Let alone going off to get close with another Male. My husband is the only man in my pereonal life other than family. Its nice. We are very close !

 

[TheLittleLady]

Again, some men may not be able to form close, intimate friendships with other men, and that is a tragedy.

My husband had the buddies, and then he had a circle of his best friends. They shared a beautiful intimacy. David and Johnathan is a scriptural example of male friendship. It is sad that some men have been made to feel they cannot share such friendship.

This pressure on married people to be the sole best friend for their spouse simply does not apply across the board. I never ever wanted to be my husband’s sole best friend nor he to be mine. Maybe that is where we differ. In my experience people can have more than one best friend.

 

[Swiftdove]

I’ve had relationships like that too. All was well and dandy till it wasn’t. Things go unspoken. Feelings get mixed, people are tempted, it’s not their fault.

My having only female friends is just where I am in life. I’m not subscribing to anyones ideas, and have no idea what Mike pence about it… It is personal choice just like your life is yours (and your fiances) . If were talking about separate sex schools, I think there can be some pros and cons to that. Not siding either way in childhood. Single people should know how to be friendly with the opposite sex and experience different personality types and find a spouse if they are called to marriage.

We have children and are busy in the family. I’m particularly happy my husband is not going out with other women for friendly evenings and meals. We already have to carve out the time to build on our own friendship and marriage and arrange dates. And to nurture existing female friendships of mine, his Male It would be taxing to take away from that for some guy or gal friend. It just, wouldn’t happen. Been there done that (outside of marriage).

 

[Swiftdove]

From what you have said in separate conversations, you are maybe seeking a female to date, marry too. Ones stage in life will have different relationships. God bless you !

 

[Daisy]

With my friends, it makes no difference whether they are men or women.

While I’d agree that a man and woman can have an enriching platonic relationship, I think it’s foolish to ignore the sexual component a male/female relationship introduces.

My husband has longtime female friends in his home state. He has even dated one of them. He enjoys women friendships, which makes him an awesome spouse, actually. Ive met these ladies and am friends with them. It would become a problem if I knew he was spending more time with them or was emotionally distant from me. Or if he was dishonest in anything. But I’m confident he’s madly in love with me. He is an open book, a rational, mature individual who has my complete trust. He also never spends a great deal of time with these women at all.

I personally have never indulged in meeting men who have invited me out in one-on-one situations. I’ve always seen that as a date, whether he verbally intended it to be, or not (I’ve only accepted if I was interested in a date haha). Then again, I’m not one of types to just hang with the boys and watch a game and have a beer. Though I will say, my brother is one of my closest friends. And now so is his wife.

My friend’s husband has a female best friend who is destroying the marriage. I highly doubt there is an overpowering sexual chemistry in this friendship, but he places this friend’s judgement above his wife’s. He has even spent the night at this lady’s house after a fight. It is an absolute devastation.

 

[CTBcin]

My friend’s husband has a female best friend who is destroying the marriage. I highly doubt there is an overpowering sexual chemistry in this friendship, but he places this friend’s judgement above his wife’s. He has even spent the night at this lady’s house after a fight. It is an absolute devastation.

Yeah, while I value having healthy opposite-sex friendships, even after marriage, that’s way too far. If a friendship is coming in the way of one’s marriage, then that is definitely not a healthy friendship.

 

[phil19034]

Again, some men may not be able to form close, intimate friendships with other men, and that is a tragedy.

My husband had the buddies, and then he had a circle of his best friends. They shared a beautiful intimacy. David and Johnathan is a scriptural example of male friendship. It is sad that some men have been made to feel they cannot share such friendship.

This pressure on married people to be the sole best friend for their spouse simply does not apply across the board. I never ever wanted to be my husband’s sole best friend nor he to be mine. Maybe that is where we differ. In my experience people can have more than one best friend.

I’m not saying that it can’t happen. I’m implying that a lot of men, if not most men (not all men), don’t have same kind of emotional relationship with their best buddies that women have with theirs.

Most men have a relationship with their best male friend built on shared experiences, loyalty, brotherhood, etc. Many would be willing to take a bullet for their best male friend. But the relationship is usually not based on vulnerability.

Men are usually more vulnerable with their wives, fiancees, and good female friends than with their best male friends. In other words, men usually don’t express their “feminine side” with other men, even their best male friends. Even if it’s a guy they would be willing to literally take a bullet for.

While women can and often are vulnerable with both sexes without fear of judgement.

 

[C.laypersona]

I can assure you, as a woman, that chastity is not always easy to practise. . . . women often have equally strong sexual feelings.

St Mary of Egypt (c.344–421) comes to mind, how she lived before the beginning of her repentance, and how she struggled with old temptations even while living alone in a desert. If you don’t know about her, it’s really worth reading about her life. (Though I’m not saying that you should also go into the wilderness and live like a solitary.)

 

[RolandThompsonGunner]

This is a very complicated way to ask a relatively simple question: can a man and woman be platonic friends? Sure, of course. Can a particular man and particular woman be platonic friends? Depends on the individuals. There’s no universal answer, but it’s certainly possible.

 

[phil19034]

It seems that you and some others on this thread (e.g. @Swiftdove) seem to subscribe to the Mike Pence school of interaction with the opposite sex.

I don’t think it’s a “Mike Pence school of interaction”

From my own personal experience as a man, I have NEVER been able to be friends with a women without having some romantic thoughts about her. Even as a married man.

NOTE: I’m not talking about constant thoughts, but flashes, momentary thoughts that come & go, etc.

When I find a woman I enjoy spending time with, it is impossible for me not think what it would be like to spend all my time with her. And since I’m married, and love my wife & family, those kinds of thoughts are not good.

The problem for some men is that it’s easy for them to emotionally cheat on their wives. So some men, who realize that about themselves, simply remove all temptation instead of trying to resist all temptation.

Honestly: I think this is exactly why so many men cheat on their wives with someone they are first “friends” with. I.E. work friends, wife’s friend, friend’s wife, gym friend, neighbor, friend from high school / college, etc.