Male-only Altar Servers?

[Crusader]

Catholic2003:

I’m not “struggling” to do anything. Recognizing the prohibition of female altar servers as discrimination is a simple matter of looking up the word “discrimination” in the dictionary. I don’t see how that can credibly be termed a “struggle.”

So do I. The difference is that you want to limit this support to only boys and men, whereas I think that all who wish to grow in their love of Christ should be supported.

Placing sexist/feminist ideals ahead of helping to foster priestly vocations simply dosen’t fly any longer. No matter how you want to spin it, your shop-worn concept of “social justice” is nothing more than placing personal ideals/desires ahead of God.

 

[Catholic2003]

Crusader:

Placing sexist/feminist ideals ahead of helping to foster priestly vocations simply dosen’t fly any longer. No matter how you want to spin it, your shop-worn concept of “social justice” is nothing more than placing personal ideals/desires ahead of God.

It is clear that we disagree on this issue. But I think the very fact that the Church allows female altar servers is an indication that I am following God’s ideals and desires, and not my own as you accuse me of.

But if you want even more evidence of where the magisterium stands on this issue, here is an excerpt from the Statement on the Place of Women in the Liturgy by the Bishops’ Committee on the Liturgy, Feb. 14, 1971:

It is certain that in the liturgical celebration, as in other facets of the church’s life, there should be no discrimination or apparent discrimination against women. … The basic or radical equality of the baptized members of Christ takes priority over, and is more significant than, distinctions of order and ministry."

I agree completely with the bishops on this very important issue.

 

[Iohannes]

How do you know it is God’s desire and ideals to have female altar server?

 

[Catholic2003]

Iohannes:

How do you know it is God’s desire and ideals to have female altar server?

Because the Holy Spirit guides the Church, and this is what the Church has decided.

 

[beng]

Catholic2003:

Because the Holy Spirit guides the Church, and this is what the Church has decided.

Decide on what? To “required” female altar server?

One of this day the provision is gonna get revoked. I can feel it. Orthodoxy is burning now in the Church.

 

[Brad]

Just throwing in my 2 cents:

The honor of attending the sacrafice of the Mass should be sufficient enough for anyone. In fact, we all go to Mass to participate in the sacrafice - to give of ourselves totally so that we may become in union with the Body of Christ. If someone could not be an alter server who longed to be an alter server, that person has an even more full participation in the event that joins heaven and earth (the Mass) than someone who didn’t care because they would be sacraficing themselves even more.

We don’t go to mass to get glory, to get credit, to be “seen as equal” - we go to mass to reconcile with God, to give Him all the glory, to receive Him so that we may love others more fully day in and day out.

Being an alter server or a priest is not a competition for power or recognition.

From a more fundamental and earthly perspective, I have no problem with female alter servers. However, as with our entire educational system, we have to dramatically shift gears, not only to increase vocations, but also to increase the number of males who lead.

It is a known fact that girls mature at a faster rate than boys. With all of this “women can do anything that men can do” mentality, we have “equalized” the “roles” of boys and girls and men and women. Without denying the fact that males and females are equal in dignity, honor, esteem, and value, making them equal in “role” is a big mistake. Boys and girls must be educated and lead differently. We need to cultivate leadership in boys. Often, this doesn’t happen because most teachers are female. In general, boys are intimidated by girls of the same age when doing non-physical tasks because they are behind the maturity curve. Because they are treated “equally”, over time this develops into insecurity and low self-esteem, causing boys to opt out of the activity - soon, all you see is girls in meaningful activities and groups.

Boys are born to become leaders as men - at a minimum, they are to be leaders and protectors of their families. The Church can have female alter servers, but they must have programs that require and cultivate male alter servers to feed the priesthood and so that the boy can have another male role model in his life.

And so the women and girls do not feel left out, remember - the woman is the “heart” in God’s plan - the “leader of love”. Of faith, hope, and love, only love will remain eternally. Not only that, only women can bring a new eternal life into the world. They do not need prominent Church positions to be honorable or dignified - they are that by their very nature.

 

[Brad]

not “alter”, should be “altar” - my apologies

 

[TLM_Altar_Boy]

Brad:

Bravo! No one has a “right” to be an altar server; it is a privelege every altar server should be aware of and thankful for every time we serve at Mass, and all of us servers should take to heart the words of St. John Berchmans:

To be Christ’s page at the altar,
To serve Him freely there,
Where even angels falter,
Bowed low in reverent prayer.
To touch the throne most holy,
To hand the gifts for the feast.
To see Him meekly, lowly,
Descend at the word of the priest.
To hear man’s poor petition,
To sound the silvery bell,
When he in sweet submission,
Comes down with us to dwell.
No grander mission surely
Could saints or men enjoy:
No heart should love more purely,
Than yours who serve with joy.
God bless you child forever,
And keep you in his care.
And guard you that you never
Belie the robes you wear.
For white bespeaks untainted
A heart both tried and true:
And red tells love the sainted
And holy martyrs knew.
Throughout your life, then, endeavor
God’s graces to do right;
And be in heart forever
God’s witness and God’s knight.

 

[Crusader]

A.Pelliccio:

Hey im new to the board, so first off “howdy”. Secondly whats the age limit on being an altar server? The reason I ask is because I just turned 18 and I’m trying to learn more about my faith(CCD was a joke) and I want to help out in my Church. Alter server, usher, free minister of the eucharist (i think its called that, deacon, or priest, those are the issues i debate in my head daily.

Anthony Pelliccio

No maximum age limit to being an altar server – so long as one can do the job. However, serving at the altar is a powerful way to foster priestly vocations. For that reason serving at the altar should be limited to those who might possibly receive priestly vocations.

It’s Extraordinary Minister of Holy Communion…

 

[Crusader]

Brad:

Just throwing in my 2 cents:

The honor of attending the sacrafice of the Mass should be sufficient enough for anyone. In fact, we all go to Mass to participate in the sacrafice - to give of ourselves totally so that we may become in union with the Body of Christ. If someone could not be an alter server who longed to be an alter server, that person has an even more full participation in the event that joins heaven and earth (the Mass) than someone who didn’t care because they would be sacraficing themselves even more.

We don’t go to mass to get glory, to get credit, to be “seen as equal” - we go to mass to reconcile with God, to give Him all the glory, to receive Him so that we may love others more fully day in and day out.

Being an alter server or a priest is not a competition for power or recognition.

From a more fundamental and earthly perspective, I have no problem with female alter servers. However, as with our entire educational system, we have to dramatically shift gears, not only to increase vocations, but also to increase the number of males who lead.

It is a known fact that girls mature at a faster rate than boys. With all of this “women can do anything that men can do” mentality, we have “equalized” the “roles” of boys and girls and men and women. Without denying the fact that males and females are equal in dignity, honor, esteem, and value, making them equal in “role” is a big mistake. Boys and girls must be educated and lead differently. We need to cultivate leadership in boys. Often, this doesn’t happen because most teachers are female. In general, boys are intimidated by girls of the same age when doing non-physical tasks because they are behind the maturity curve. Because they are treated “equally”, over time this develops into insecurity and low self-esteem, causing boys to opt out of the activity - soon, all you see is girls in meaningful activities and groups.

Boys are born to become leaders as men - at a minimum, they are to be leaders and protectors of their families. The Church can have female alter servers, but they must have programs that require and cultivate male alter servers to feed the priesthood and so that the boy can have another male role model in his life.

And so the women and girls do not feel left out, remember - the woman is the “heart” in God’s plan - the “leader of love”. Of faith, hope, and love, only love will remain eternally. Not only that, only women can bring a new eternal life into the world. They do not need prominent Church positions to be honorable or dignified - they are that by their very nature.

Amen. Excellent posting.

 

[Crusader]

Acadien:

In large parish’s, yes, but smaller parish’s dont have enough capable and willing children as it is to staff the alter server team, and they wouldnt be able too…

Nonsense. I attend a tiny parish from time to time and they have a large and polished all-male altar server corps.

 

[Catholic2003]

Brad:

Being an alter server or a priest is not a competition for power or recognition.

Agreed. I’ve heard a saying along the lines of anyone who enters the priesthood intending to be a bishop isn’t suited to being a priest.

 

[Catholic2003]

TLM Altar Boy:

Bravo! No one has a “right” to be an altar server; it is a privelege every altar server should be aware of and thankful for every time we serve at Mass, and all of us servers should take to heart the words of St. John Berchmans

Also agreed.

 

[Fullsizesedan]

JPII in his 9/3/1995 address:

The 1987 Synod on the laity expressed precisely this need and asked that “without discrimination women should be participants in the life of the Church and also in consultation and the process of coming to decisions” (Propositio 47; cf. Christifideles laici, n. 51).

1. This is the way to be courageously taken. To a large extent, it is a question of making full use of the ample room for a lay and feminine presence recognized by the Church’s law. I am thinking, for example, of theological teaching, the forms of liturgical ministry permitted, including service at the altar,

It would seem that the church is advocating the installation of girls and women as acolytesses, in the interests of non-discrimination. I don’t know if JPII was sitting in the chair when he delivered the instructions, but they are at least the instructions for his own pontificate.

 

[TLM_Altar_Boy]

Fullsizesedan:

JPII in his 9/3/1995 address:
It would seem that the church is advocating the installation of girls and women as acolytesses, in the interests of non-discrimination. I don’t know if JPII was sitting in the chair when he delivered the instructions, but they are at least the instructions for his own pontificate.

To be an “acolyte” in the strict sense of the word is to be conferred a Minor Order. Only a man may be ordained to Minor or Major Orders, although for the Minor Orders, any member of the laity may serve the same role. It’s the same idea with lectors. Only men may be lectors, but everyone may be a reader.

Can. 230 §1 Lay men whose age and talents meet the requirements prescribed by decree of the Episcopal Conference, can be given the stable ministry of lector and of acolyte, through the prescribed liturgical rite.

As to the quote from His Holiness, he has also issued statements against female altar servers. These must be taken into account, too. Many have already posted quotes from the Holy Father on this issue, but just last month, in his letter to the priests for Holy Thursday, 2004, the Supreme Pontiff stated (emphasis his):

In the light of this, dear brother priests, I would ask you, among other initiatives, to *show special care for altar servers, *who represent a kind of “garden” of priestly vocations. The group of altar servers, under your guidance as part of the parish community, can be given a valuable experience of Christian education and become a kind of pre-seminary.

 

[Catholic2003]

TLM Altar Boy:

To be an “acolyte” in the strict sense of the word is to be conferred a Minor Order. Only a man may be ordained to Minor or Major Orders, although for the Minor Orders, any member of the laity may serve the same role. It’s the same idea with lectors. Only men may be lectors, but everyone may be a reader.

I think you may be missing the point here. The 1987 Synod of Bishops on the Laity was considering whether to change canon 230 §1 to allow the Minor Orders of Acolyte and Lector to be conferred onto women. But the end result of their deliberations was that no change was recommended to be made.

 

[TLM_Altar_Boy]

Catholic2003:

I think you may be missing the point here. The 1987 Synod of Bishops on the Laity was considering whether to change canon 230 §1 to allow the Minor Orders of Acolyte and Lector to be conferred onto women. But the end result of their deliberations was that no change was recommended to be made.

My mistake. I’m kinda slow like that sometimes. :whacky: But the fact is that, as you say yourself, they were *considering *whether to change that part of the canon law but chose not to in the end. That the commission considered an action does not mean too much, as countless commissions have considered actions but the Holy Spirit later discouraged them.

 

[Thomas]

The practice of female altar servers arose as an act of disobedience, to which Rome (unwisely) has made an appeasement.

When will the Church stop rewarding dissent in the liturgy?

Personally, I have two older sons who were altar boys, before altar girls were used. My two younger sons were not interested in serving with girls.

 

[Catholic2003]

The filioque in the creed, and repeated confession also started as acts of disobedience. Sometimes that’s how the “sensus fidelium” of the Church works.

The 2001 CDW letter that allowed priests to disobey their bishops with respect to the use of female altar servers came about because of that very act of disobedience by the priests in question.

Finally, the use of female altar servers did not begin as an act of disobedience. The coetus that was response for canon 230 in the 1983 canon law based their decision to remove the “male only” requirement on the fact that females were allowed to perform other liturgical functions in the sanctuary.

 

[Crusader]

Thomas:

The practice of female altar servers arose as an act of disobedience, to which Rome (unwisely) has made an appeasement.

When will the Church stop rewarding dissent in the liturgy?

Personally, I have two older sons who were altar boys, before altar girls were used. My two younger sons were not interested in serving with girls.

The Holy See certainly makes it known that male altar servers are preferred to female altar servers in Redemptoris Sacramentum.

Many have suggested that Redemptoris Sacramentum initially forbade female altar servers, but it was feared that the uproar from the sexists/feminists would be too great so they softened the language.

On step at a time…