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AmosTown
Guest
I want to believe you but people here are giving me mixed answers. I read the mass book and see prayers for saints and Mary intercessions throughout. I ask then do Catholics have to pray these prayers in common with the priest in mass to be a Catholic? Everyone seems to hate me and my question and now you call me “bud”.
If you say so bud! but I have been to Mass all my life and never heard that but it must be there because you say so! If you read above at the beginnning of this so called mass prayer you will find that it is adressed to the Father. But hey you choose to believe what ever you want. You can only see through the lenses given to you by your sect(read cult) which is why you will not believe what we say. But hey all you have to do is go to a Mass on any given day. (there is mass everyday of the week in all cities around the world) You will not here that prayer or any of the hundreds you say are part of the Mass.
Good luck.
Catholics are suppose to pray the mass with the priest. Catholic mass is a prayer said together as one prayer. As I understand that means a prayer where hearts and minds are one, and offering to God.
My questions have been answered with No Catholics don’t have to pray ‘to’ saints and Mary and others have answered Yes they have to pray together in the mass.
Which one is correct is all I’m asking yet it seems now I’m being treated very bad just for asking.
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AmosTown
Guest
Does that mean the old prayers are wrong or bad and the church changed the prayers?
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ahs
Guest
“Novena books and such” are not the Mass.
Wrong? So the Scriptures are wrong? The book of Revelation is wrong? Paul was wrong? On what basis does this Bible study leader say that intercession is wrong?
Then what is it that you take issue with? Do you believe it is wrong to ask someone else to pray for you?
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KP3243
Guest
Without knowning what you are looking at it is hard to tell. What color is the book you are looking at and it is a daily missal or a Sunday missal?
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pablope
Guest
If you can find this, look for these inside the front pages…the Imprimatur and the Nihil Obstat…it should give a clue to the date it was published.
And also the Pope, if there is such one named.
Dates do not matter, the doctrines and dogmas of the Church do not change, but there are practices and disciplinary matters that change from time to time.
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AmosTown
Guest
I have the mass book too and that is what I am reading. Over the years at bible study its been taught that Catholics pray to saints or for saints help and thats wrong.
I ask a simple question. Do Catholics have to pray to saints. Some on this forum have said “Yes” at least once per week in the prayers of the mass that includes prayers to saints and Mary.
Others say ‘No’ which means that Catholics don’t have to pray together one prayer in common in the mass when the prayers are to saints and Mary.
Still other things I read say Catholics must pray the mass together with the priest and congregation as one prayer said together as one and offered to God.
If the answer “No” Catholics don’t have to pray “to” the saints or Mary for help, then how can Catholics pray the mass together with the priest as ONE prayer offered to God?
Do Catholics have two teachings or one teaching? Which one is it? Do Catholics have to pray the mass parts that are prayers to the saints or Mary or do they not?
Just yes or no is all I’m looking for.
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pablope
Guest
I think everyone is confused…
It is a lingo issue, I think. When you say prayer, you may mean something different than we assumed you meant.
Anyway, let me quantify the answer…private devotions, novenas, rosary…these are optional. Keep in mind, there are different kinds of prayers.
When you asked praying to saints, we all assumed you were talking about novenas, the rosary…that is why we said no, these are optional.
As for the intercessory prayers, these Biblical and from Tradition. When these are said in the Mass, it is asking those saints to pray for us and with us.
So, with this said, do you see anything wrong with asking for intercessions?
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ahs
Guest
So, is this your assertion that such is wrong, or your Bible study leader’s? If it is yours, you need to support it before expectign anyone to take it seriously. So…how is such wrong? How/Why is it wrong to ask someone to pray for you? Are the Scriptures are wrong when they teach us to pray for one another? Is the book of Revelation wrong? Was Paul wrong? On what basis do you, or this Bible study leader, say that intercession is wrong?
po18guy
Well-known member
You are not asking honest questions. You are framing the debate using anti-Catholic tactics. We have seen them before.
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pablope
Guest
Why do you think it is wrong?
Revelation 5:8
8 And when He had taken the book, the four living beings and the four and twenty elders fell down before the Lamb, having every one of them harps and golden vials full of incense, which are the prayers of saints.
cin.org/users/james/files/praying.htm
po18guy
Well-known member
Please ask honest questions that are not designed to entrap.
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KP3243
Guest
Most Catholics in the US participate in Ordinary Form of the Mass there are however nine forms of the Roman Rite Liturgy and they all differ. The most recent being the Anglican form where Anglican churches who have come into full communion with the Holy See, can use their same Anglican Liturgy with doctrinal corrections made by Pope Benedict.
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AmosTown
Guest
I don’t know. That is why I’m asking you. I hope you just tell me whether or not you have to pray to saints and Mary in the Mass to be Catholic.
I already know the difference about praying ‘to’ instead of praying by asking for help or intercessions. So please don’t go back to “Catholics don’t pray to”.
Catholics pray together in mass and in the masses there are prayers to saints and Mary. Do you have to pray these prayers to be Catholic? Or can you ignore them and not pray them? I’ve gotten answers that say you don’t have to pray them but that is opposite the idea of the mass is one prayer said together with one heart and offered to God.
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AmosTown
Guest
Its leather kind of burgundy red with a communion cup on the front and a cross behind it.
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JM3
Guest
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KP3243
Guest
If you say Form A of the penitential rite at the beginning of mass then yes you would ask for the intersession of Mary and the angels and Saint but it isn’t always said or said in Form A. We do not pray to Mary or the Saints or Angels in place of God, we always pray and ask for their intersession. More importantly we are praying with Mary and angels and Saints during the consecration of the Eucharist. Someday the veil will be lifted and man will see what has been there all along that heaven and earth are one. It helps if your Bible doesn’t omit the Book of Tobit.
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AmosTown
Guest
Then what you are saying is to be a Catholic and if Form A prayers are prayed together at Mass then Catholics must pray for the intercession of Mary and the angels and saints. ?
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KP3243
Guest
Among others you are asking for intercession, does this intercession bother you?
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