Mayor wants Trump to delay Phoenix rally

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LeafByNiggle said:
I don’t think the mayor of Phoenix was comparing a campaign rally with a protest march. It is just that there should be a brief period of healing before we get right back to the business of “rah rah rah, aren’t I great!”
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Every time he takes a big shot to his political head he goes out to get a hit of “rah rah rah, aren’t I great! You are great, too, they all hate us, because WE LOVE AMERICA!! MAGA!!”
 
exnihilo said:
The police didn’t even try to protect that speaker who was attacked the day after the rally. If that is how they did things the day before no wonder violence broke out.

There are definitely agent provocateurs on both sides. The government always has a guy in on any plot.
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+1
 
7_Sorrows said:
No they did not have a permit for their own rally there or anywhere else.

Someone posted on one thread that counter protesters do not need a permit.
Perhaps if they wanted to counter protest they should have got a permit for
another location far away from the white supremists and then perhaps no violence
would have occurred and the young woman would still be alive today.

But I do feel the people with the permit had a right to protest the removal of the
Robert E. Lee statue. That was the original reason for the protest.
It is too bad the white spremists and neo-nazis had to be there to give a bad name to the people who wanted the statue to remain.
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The white supremecist groups organized the gathering, and they were not secretive about it. It was never implied that it was organized by some local benevolent Friends of Our Old Bronze Statues group.

There was no way anyone at that protest was unaware who was organizing it, either. Let’s not imply that anybody showed up with an “oh, I had* no idea* what sort of people were behind this pro-statue rally!” Someone would have to be monumentally thick to get themselves in that position or just not care what sort of political bedfellows they were making.
 
exnihilo said:
There are definitely agent provocateurs on both sides. The government always has a guy in on any plot.
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Paranoid, much?

Do you believe the flyers that say the Pope is secretly running everything, too?
 
Jig_Saw said:
Yep, let’s blame both sides. The white supremacists and those that were protesting the white supremacists.

Personally, I think Catholics that can’t see the intrinsic sin of racism growing in American culture and working to stop it are the problem, but that’s me.
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From a tweet:

The cancer was aggressive, so aggressive chemotherapy was prescribed.
There was aggression on both sides.
 
josie_L said:
They had a permit to hold their own rally, but they protested at and physically disrupted another rally, which there is no permit for, nor do they have the constitutional right to do.

I was referring to Emancipation park where the “Unite the RIght” rally was being held.
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Good. After all the denials an admission: they had a permit.
They did not need a permit to counter protest.
AFAIK there was no confrontation in Emancipation Park; the counter protestors did not disrupt the rally within the park.
The terrorist incident happened on 4th which runs street adjacent to Justice park, where conterprotestors had a permit.
 
7_Sorrows said:
Trump is going up against 3 fronts - the media, the democrats, and the republicans
(you can also add the deep state)
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The number one force holding President Trump back is his habit of shooting from the hip and asking questions of himself never.

The Republicans held on in his defense as long as they decently could, and some beyond that, but everyone has a limit.
 
I’m with the mayor. Tensions are high right now. Trump has not done much to ease it. In fact, he’s widening the divide. Not to mention, we’ve all seen his rallies. I don’t know if these new rallies have shown to become violent like the ones he held during the campaign, but it definitely is something he shouldn’t risk.

Besides, these rallies are literally held to boost trumps ego. His core base attends and tells him he’s the prettiest girl at the ball. I’d like to think trump can put that off a little while.
 
dvdjs said:
Good.After all the denials: they had a permit.
They did not need a permit to counter protest.
AFAIK there was no confrontation in Emancipation Park; the counter protestors did not disrupt the rally within the park.

The terrorist incident happened on 4th which runs street adjacent to Justice park, where conterprotestors had a permit.
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I’ve already said that they did not need a permit to assemble in the park, I was, however, wrong that they did not have a permit at all, but the fact of the matter is that they were physically disrupting the rally at the park and that they do not have a permit for:

And yes, they did disrupt the rally that was in the park:
Washington Post reporter Joe Heim: “Although Virginia State Police and Charlottesville police were stationed along the sides and the rear of Emancipation Park, the Market Street side was unattended. As it filled with rally-goers and counter-protesters, the mix quickly became volatile. The two sides screamed at each other. ‘[Expletive] … Nazis!’ the counter-protesters chanted. ‘[More expletives]’ was the response from the park where the rally-goers stood behind metal barricades.”
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Jordan Green in the Nation, a leftist publication: “A phalanx of black-helmeted white supremacists — members of the Traditionalist Workers Party, Identity Evropa, American Vanguard, and other hate warriors — commanded the steps at the southeast corner of the park, repelling attempted incursions by Wobblies, communists, and a multiracial cast of irregulars eager to fight back. Water bottles and other projectiles flew in both directions, while police tear-gas canisters thudded into an adjacent parking lot, oftentimes lobbed back into the park by plucky leftists.”
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Unicorn Riot: “Police then pushed the white supremacists out of Emancipation Park, and closed the park… Unable to continue rallying in the park, the white supremacists took to the streets, where they were quickly followed and confronted by anti-racists. Several more extremely violent fights took place, with police looking on from their nearby substation.”
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**Leftist anti-fascist organizers from Washington, D.C.: “Before the attack occurred, we chased the Nazis out of their park, removing their platform. They were on the move toward a community with many people of color. We mobilized to intercept. We were at our most powerful, all of us together chanting with enthusiastic support from the people of Charlottesville. That was the moment that we were attacked.”
**
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latimes.com/nation/la-na-charlottesville-witnesses-20170815-story.html
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If the counter protesters had a rally of their own, why were they preventing the “Unite The Right” rally from happening, i.e., they had a permit, they had a right to rally?
 
dvdjs said:
I saw the video of that incident. The police bodily shielded him and led him to dsafety.
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What? He was run off by an angry mob who got in his face. They were allowed to approach him. He was also tackled by someone. That is battery. They after a while did something, but only after the man was attacked.

Let’s reverse the situation. Would police allow the Unite the Right group to get in the face of a press conference by the other side?
 
josie_L said:
I’ve already said that they did not need a permit to assemble in the park, I was, however, wrong that they did not have a permit at all, but the fact of the matter is that they were physically disrupting the rally at the park and that they do not have a permit for.
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It is not clear that counter-protestors were allowed in the park.
It is not clear that there was any confrontation in Emancipation Park or any disruption inside the park.

I think that confrontations happened outside the park as people were entering or leaving the planned rally. The level of intimidation was high, but the degree and share of violence is less clear.

It is interesting that while there were many carrying guns, I have not heard a report of gun fire. Or any detailed injury reports. The salient feature of the event was the but - apart from the murder/terrorist incident. And that came from the alt-right, well-removed from Emancipation Park.
 
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