McCarrick Report: a great relief

[phil19034]

phil19034:

In defense of +Vigano, in his first letter he implies the fact that didn’t act on McCarrick and that he was doing Penance for that.

Taking no accountability for oneself other than vague implications while blasting the current pope is hardly “penance”

I don’t know what his penance is. I don’t think he’s ever said what penance he’s paying.

Look - I don’t wish to get into a “+Vigano is this or that” debate. I really don’t have an opinion about the Archbishop either way. There are somethings I agree with him on and there are others that I absolutely do not agree with him on. Unlike many others, I don’t consider him a Saint and I don’t consider him a devil.

He’s simply a man & archbishop who is red-pilled regarding what’s going on in the Church & the world today. There are many good people today who have become very jaded and “red-pilled” due to the state of our world. I’m not defending them, I’m just stating it as I see it.

God Bless

 

[BornInMarch]

Crimes of a sexual nature often leave little evidence behind, and the fact that victims sometimes wait years to press charges means what evidence there initially was is often quickly lost. This means a lot of rape trials are a case of one person’s word against another person’s word, and in situations like that the Presumption of Innocence means that the courts side with the accused.

 

[BornInMarch]

The Seminarians probably held back out of fear of retaliation. McCarrick was in a position that he could pull strings to make sure a seminary student never becomes a Priest, or at least that students would believe such threats.

Apart from that seminary students are more likely to turn the other cheek than to fill a sinner with lead.

 

[Maximian]

To do what he did - the money, the villas, the jet-setting, the sex, the politics, McCarrick must have had hundreds if not thousands of high level contacts. He even claims to have got the Pope elected. Imagine what legions of friends he must have had to achieve such a thing.

Sure, many are dead. But we deserve to know who the living are.

 

[commenter]

The fact that Vigano admittedly should have spoken up sooner about Mc Carrick does not justify ignoring Vigano’s other allegations: that McVarrick helped steer some of the US appointments in Pope Francis early pontificate.

It may well be McCarrick was a name dropper, who exaggerated his influence and contacts…ok but then Vatican should respond, what appointments did he successfully push.

 

[Maximian]

My worry is that some of the people McCarrick promoted are now in senior positions and may even try to influence the Pope.

 

[commenter]

My worry is that some of the people McCarrick promoted are now in senior positions and may even try to influence the Pope.

I suspect McCarrick exaggerated his influence. (Given what I have read about him this would fit in with the larger pattern). He may well have been a “friend of Francis’” only in the sense that a thousand people claimed to be a “friend of Bill” (Clinton).

The problem is that Pope Francis leaves himself vulnerable for this kind of thing. He reportedly bypassed the normal vetting process to make promotions to Chicago and Newark.
There is a need for non stop clarifications due to ambiguous informal remarks.

Where there is a pattern of an extraordinary degree of looseness,
then it’s reasonable to expect an explicit response.

 

[mary15]

I think your “two cents” is pretty awesome! Love the graphics. So cute and creative

 

[mary15]

Seems so many in positions of power fall to sexual sin.

This seems to be the downfall of man.

I’m sure there was an effort made to forgive and to move on ahead in prayer.

I’m chief of sinners, no better, and look forwards to confession.

What can we do?

We must examine our souls daily and walk the walk in all earnestness.

 

[Dolphin]

This “deservedness” of canonization argument after the fact seems very bizarre, nobody is going to de-canonize him, what would that even mean, he got kicked out of heaven?

Nobody is perfect and we know this, some of the greatest saints were the worst sinners. The fact is, beautiful amazing miracles took place as a result of JPII’s intercession and that is cause enough for his canonization. Period.

 

[Maximian]

The problem is that Pope Francis leaves himself vulnerable for this kind of thing. He reportedly bypassed the normal vetting process to make promotions to Chicago and Newark.
There is a need for non stop clarifications due to ambiguous informal remarks.

Where there is a pattern of an extraordinary degree of looseness,
then it’s reasonable to expect an explicit response.

Spot on. Well said.

 

[Maximian]

Put like that, there are many examples - st Paul, St Augustine.

But being a bad sinner after turning to God - that’s another matter.

 

[Diaconia]

Saul of Tarsus, and Augustine of Hippo come to mind, right off the top.

Deacon Christopher

 

[Maximian]

Seems so many in positions of power fall to sexual sin.

Yes. But the sexual sin is only one part of it. The other part is the organised networks which support these sins. Blackmailable clerics being an important concern.

 

[Pitcairn17]

mary15:

Seems so many in positions of power fall to sexual sin.

Yes. But the sexual sin is only one part of it. The other part is the organised networks which support these sins. Blackmailable clerics being an important concern.

This. As we’ve learned since Boston in 2002, it’s almost less about the sin than the cover-up. Whatever else Saul of Tarsus or Augustine May have done, I don’t recall their being involved in an organized cover-up.

 

[JimG]

“We are talking about psychologically, sexually disordered men who were allowed into the seminary even when their disorders were known and the desire was to make the seminary a therapeutic community to heal them. That is being charitable. Known homosexuals were allowed to enter the seminary and often for nefarious reasons from vocation directors, to bishops to seminary personnel.”

Source

 

[JimG]

From Rod Dreher:

" A very senior figure who had been part of the aborted clean-up of Vatican finances once told me that they had known that sexual corruption (always gay) was a serious problem in the Vatican, and they had known too that financial corruption was a problem. But it wasn’t until they started working on this case that they saw how deeply entwined the two are. A gay reader who lost his Catholic faith in seminary and dropped out e-mailed yesterday to say that reading the report brought him back to the things he saw on the inside that caused him to crack. He said, of the hierarchy, that “the amount of grooming and testing that happens is so orchestrated and intense” — meaning that they identify and promote fellow gay men willing to play the game, so to speak."

Source

 

[commenter]

A very senior figure who had been part of the aborted clean-up of Vatican finances once told me

It’s odd that so many Very Senior Figures have the time and desire to confide anonymously to bloggers. It’s also odd that, considering these bloggers have labelled the Very Senior hierarchy of the Church to be filled with lies, dishonesty, deceit, that the bloggers expect us to accept without question the veracity of these Very Senior Figures only when they confide anonymously to the bloggers! Apparently all the rest of the time the Very Senior Figures are busy lying.

Since Rod Dreher left the Catholic Church, he seems fixated on evil only in the Catholic Church.

Odd.

 

[Kei]

The Seminarians probably held back out of fear of retaliation. McCarrick was in a position that he could pull strings to make sure a seminary student never becomes a Priest, or at least that students would believe such threats.

Apart from that seminary students are more likely to turn the other cheek than to fill a sinner with lead.

Really makes you wonder about the type of people brought into his seminary…
If a priest intends to offend God by doing some funny business with a seminarian, it seems a good idea to knock some sense into him to defend both yourself and his soul, and perhaps future victims. Also should probably tell the authorities. I’m not gonna judge these people, and thankfully I’ve never been in that situation, but I imagine if I were in seminary and somebody tried to do some funny business like that, I’d hafta teach that somebody a lesson

 

[Kei]

Why didn’t God tell the Pope(s) about the widespread problems in the priesthood?

While God does guide the pope in leading the Church in a sense and defends him from error when declaring things infallibly, the pope doesn’t have a radio to God like that, to know everything. Doctrine is not the same as knowing every little jot and tittle of what some cleric somewhere is doing. I do wish they had acted sooner, or that one of his victims woulda decked him or something, but he was so persuasive and groomed people…it’s all terrible. He will have to answer about it. His victims will have their own reward. God understands. It may take time for them to be healed…but it’s a process, and there may be a scar. But God offers relief and rest for the burdened.