Mental Illness & Spirituality

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BarbaraTherese:
Hello to our cyberspace community out there:tiphat: :

I’m wondering what are the opinions re those who may suffer a major mental illness ie psychotic type illnesses. Do you think that sufferers of mental illness can continue to function as spiritual beings with spirituality intact? Do you think that a mentally ill person can still have a positive and quite healthy, active and functioning, quite valid, spiritual life as with the so called ‘normal’ and the chronically sane…

Thank you for your contribution if you vote and post to this Poll and the first time I have attempted to do a Poll, so if I err, please bear with me…

Barb;) …👍…Bethany…South Australia
Sunday, 17th. April, 2005 …2412hrs
Click to expand...
 
Hi Barbara
I have gone through most of the replies in response to your question.

You may find that mine is perhaps quit unique, it was next to impossible to determine what my problem was in spite of various opinions and examinations tests etc. by a number of Specialists including A Psychatrist and it was finally put down to Disturbance of the Chemistry of the Brain.

I reached a stage where I could not think which must have lasted for about a year or so… You will appreciate that when one cannot think how could one pray, even contemplatimg suicide was impossible because one would have to think and have a Will to do it, also commiting sin is impossible and thank goodness for that, a blessing in disguise I guess. Comments on this from all in the Forum will be very much appreciated. My Psychiatrist is highly qualified and experienced and also a Professor of Psychiatry.
 
As a person who suffers from mental illness, I say that it is possible to be a spiritual person. Over the years, I’ve heard all sorts of things. Like, “If you are really a christian, then Jesus would heal you.” But that isn’t the promise of the bible. There are all manners of illness in the world, why should mental illness be treated, by christians, any differently than other forms of illness?
 
Hi, slinky1882,

Actually, I thought I’d said Sola Fides…Sola Gratia,
meaning both.

Let me see if I can find the post I wrote on
scrupulosity and replicate it here.

Best,
Maureen
 
Hi Reen,
Thanks for your reply… 😃 Yes, indeed I have seen those TV commercials… There was one “infomercial” for those who suffer from depression/anxiety and had all these tapes and books on how to overcome it.

I can’t understand how a tape or book will help across the board those who suffer from mental illness. :s

Sometimes as my example…depression is not a result of a “chemical imbalance”,but, is psycological or from severe trauma that does such damage to the soul. I doubt a book or tape full of affirmations is going to remedy that in 3 to 6 months.

These days just about everyone wants a quick fix… but, if you don’t have therapy that combines mind, body, soul and spirituality then you are only dealing most of the time with 1 or two components (mind/emotions) and it leaves a void in other areas.

I can’t relate to therapy that does not have at its center ‘God’, it is very HARD to find a Catholic therapist that deals with my problem. I think no matter how many therapies I try or counselors I see… I feel deep inside that only the divine Physician can ultimately help me.

***I humbly ask for your prayers. In checking myself as I do monthly for breast lumps I came across one and even though I am only 32, am making an appointment for a mammography since breast cancer runs in my family.

God bless you Reen and your loved one. 😃 😃
 
Hi, slinky,

I looked over some of the posts I’ve written, and
discovered that in one instance I used Sola Fides…
Sola Gratia.

In others, I said Sola Fides…a shorthand way of
indicating the Sola’s. Not helpful, in terms of
clarity!

I couldn’t find the post where I said something like:
“Good. You guys cling to doctrine/dogma. I’m
drownding here! So I’ll cling to the cross…”
I pictured the cross floating by like a piece of
driftwood.

It’s existential, not particularly rational, given
what I understand about the Faith. That’s
why you’ll find me urging people to stay with
or become a Roman Catholic.

To have a Church with theology suggested by
those of us fluthering around in the water,
trying to keep afloat, would probably not be a good idea!:o

Got to go. The ol’ head is pretty tired, today.

God bless,
Maureen
 
Hi, Maryam,

I’ve already started praying for you, asking God to
help you through these days, and will continue
praying.

The emotional impact of trauma is so difficult.

The only way I could deal with it was to try
to understand, intellectually, in addition to
working with a psychologist for many years.
But that’s just me, Maryam. Others may not
feel the need to read and study.
I guess I could say: Study helped steady!

I have found that the damage done by trauma
is precisely the thing that has made me more
compassionate. Though it sure makes each
day interesting, trying to deal with it.

I’m glad that you posted and please be assured
of my prayers over the coming days,

God bless,
reen12
 
Hi Reen,
Thanks so much for your prayers… I can see that you are a sweet soul. 😃 😃

I also will keep you in my prayers as well.

God bless you and all here 😃 😃
 
Maureen,
I hope you were able to get rest and thanks for looking back over your posts. Could you clarify this a little???
To have a Church with theology suggested by
those of us fluthering around in the water,
trying to keep afloat, would probably not be a good idea!:o
Click to expand...
And from your urging people to stay or become Roman Catholic, does the dorrway to the Church “look” different for them than for you??? Or extend your illustration of the Cross floating down the river, do you see portages for others but only a course of rocks for yourself??? Curious. Thanks and God Bless.
 
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slinky1882:
And from your urging people to stay or become Roman Catholic, does the dorrway to the Church “look” different for them than for you??? QUOTE]

I’ve finally figured out how to use the quote function, slinky!

To answer your question:

I guess I don’t see the issue in terms of a doorway.
I would see it as a “household”, as in “the household
of Faith.” [theologically, the Mystical Body of Christ.]

If a person is at ease, spiritually, intellectually and
psychologicaly, then I would urge them to stay or
to enter the “household.”

For example, I am very much at home in the
household, spiritually. Redemptive suffering,
stations of the cross, the Real Presence.

I have become less at home, intellectually, as
you can see in some of my posts on this topic.

I am not only not “at home” psychologically,
I am positively phobic!
Scrupulosity, thought to be form of obsessive-compulsive disorder,
makes the sacrament of confession impossible,
psychologically, for me. And then there is the
ancillary reality, “worthy communions”]
I’ve written on this elsewhere on the forum.

If this were not to make “sense” to someone, I
would have to stress that I am ill.

That is what I meant by a Church having a theology suggested
by those like me, fluthering about in the water,
would probably be not a good idea. I would not
be an ideal yardstick by which to measure any
‘reality’, theologically.

In a post to this thread on April 30, 2005 12:19 PM
[if I try to find the post #, I will lose this current post]
I explained the reality, for me, of having more than
one ‘identity.’
When I look at matters ecclesiastical, it depends on
which ‘part’ of me is responding to the matter at hand.

The Adult/Rational Reen has problems, intellectually,
with dogmas/doctrines.

reen12 [reen age twelve] is very angry. Because
that ‘part’ was a very gifted 12 year old, there
were lots of questions in 1958 that she could
neither formuate in an articulate fashion- nor
did this ‘part’ have the education that would come
later in life. You would had to have been a
Catholic in 1958 to understand where I’m coming
from here, slinky.

There is another ‘part’ that I cannot really identify
[not to make a pun.]

That part says: Why do I feel like I am a natural
Jew, raised Catholic, by circumstance? As the
saying goes: Let’s not go there. It’s way too
complex.
I think this is what is called… being “conflicted.”

I’ve said a prayer that your summer semester goes
well,

Maureen
PS Apparently, I have not learned how to use the
quote function, because it didn’t post in a yellow
background. Back to the drawing board.
Click to expand...
 
Maureen,

I don’t know if this will help any, but if you highlight the section you want to appear quotes with your mouse, the lil text wrap box on the very right of your reply should do the trick. Again, I do not know if you have tried that.

From your household analogy, you mention you are at home spiritually but apparently not elsewise. Do you feel on the threshold of Hope??? Is it like having one foot in the household and one foot outside??? I am curious and thank you for attemtpting to answer all of my questions. God Bless.
 
Hello out there…nice to meecha on Catholic Answers Forums Board…

There are some really great comments to my mind in quite a few of t he posts and I’ve just ducked back more or less to see if I can catch up with the threads that interest me…

As to the opening Poll of this thread, I think it all boils down to is the human a spiritual, emotional, mental and physical being?

If my answer is in the affirmative, which it is, then of course a person can suffer mentally and emotionally and still experience a valid and healthy spiritual life!

Problem tends to be that psychiatry and psychology have tended to view the human person as emotional, mental and physical but not spiritual as a valid functioning aspect of the personality or inner ground to be more precise. There is a movement nowadays amongst these professions to turn from the three aspect theory to the four. Even a view by some that they need to understand spirituality better to enable them to treat the whole person.

This movement towards the four aspect inner ground commenced in the US of A! Congrats my American brothers and sisters on The Board!..

Here is a quote, but do not ask me from where in a psychology book or a book of psychiatry indeed where I read it, for I cannot recall the reference, only the words…

“Every person is entitled to experience reality from their own inner ground” Reality is God…aspects of God…reflections of God …and reality is many faceted. As an example two people are exposed to strong perfume. One says “Oh it is so strong I can’t breathe” Another says " Oh what a beautiful odour!"

Now then, which is the more accurate (the reality)…the quandry that is thus effected in our minds tells us that Yes! we all have the right to experience THE WHOLE OF REALITY from our own inner ground. In fact the unique inner experience of each unique being completes and proclaims Reality…

All the best in all things
Barb
Bethany Place
Friday, 1 3th. May, 2005
8.35pm

May The Lord and His Peace be with all
and go ahead of us … smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/11/11_12_11.gif
… smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/11/11_12_11.gif… smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/11/11_12_11.gif
 
Hi, Barbara Therese,

My own endeavor has been to try to understand
how the psychological *affects *the other 3 realities.
If a person suffers from great anxiety in the
psychological realm, the spiritual can be of
great help in easing that person’s distress.
Same with something like depression.
But how to deal with a person like myself,
for whom ‘religion’ actually impacted
psychological well-being negatively? My
task was then to step outside that reality ‘religion’]
to grasp what had happened to me, psychologically.
Only then could I try to adopt a rational religious
life. I believe that God was with me every step
of the way in this endeavor.
To paraphrase Fr. Benedict Groeschel, who
holds a PhD in psychology from Columbia
University:

Religion can also make a person very, very ill.
[Note: not the spiritual but ‘religion’.]

He says this as both a priest and a credentialed
psychologist.

So, while I agree instinctively with the 4 fold
view of the human person, I wanted to point
out that there can be a distinct difference between
the spiritual and religion.
Treat a kid with a steady diet of talk of hellfire and
brimstone, stress continually the sinful nature
of human beings, harp on the justice of God
and throw in an occassional reference to mercy,
and that kid may end up a trembling wreck of
a human being. This is distorted information,
as any psychologically sound person would
recognize immediately.

If the kid has neurotransmitter problems and
possible problems with the actual structure
of the brain itself, this combination, along with
the type of catechesis described above, can be
a hellish experience for that little person.

The last thing in the world that I needed, when
I collapsed psychologically, was someone
talking to me about religion. At that point,
I was positively phobic toward all things having
to do with religion.

In coming to an understanding of the other
3 realities, the 4th aspect was possible.

Does that make sense to you?

To express this in terms of the model I use:

If the religous information stored in the Parent
[see post #88] is distorted, then that information
has to be challenged and corrected by
Adult/Rational.

That is, the mental [intellectual] aspect has
to confront distorted religious information, in
order for the genuinely spiritual to emerge
and take it’s healthy place in the whole person.

That spiritual aspect [spiritual nature] is then free
to embrace the religious* expression* of the spiritual,
which is what is termed ‘religion.’

Does that make sense to you?

Best regards,
reen12

In all of this, through the mercy of God, I never lost
sight of the fact that God is the ground of my being.
 
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reen12:
Hi, Barbara Therese,

My own endeavor has been to try to understand
how the psychological *affects *the other 3 realities.
If a person suffers from great anxiety in the
psychological realm, the spiritual can be of
great help in easing that person’s distress.
Same with something like depression.
But how to deal with a person like myself,
for whom ‘religion’ actually impacted
psychological well-being negatively? My
task was then to step outside that reality ‘religion’]
to grasp what had happened to me, psychologically.
Only then could I try to adopt a rational religious
life. I believe that God was with me every step
of the way in this endeavor.
To paraphrase Fr. Benedict Groeschel, who
holds a PhD in psychology from Columbia
University:

Religion can also make a person very, very ill.
[Note: not the spiritual but ‘religion’.]

He says this as both a priest and a credentialed
psychologist.

So, while I agree instinctively with the 4 fold
view of the human person, I wanted to point
out that there can be a distinct difference between
the spiritual and religion.
Treat a kid with a steady diet of talk of hellfire and
brimstone, stress continually the sinful nature
of human beings, harp on the justice of God
and throw in an occassional reference to mercy,
and that kid may end up a trembling wreck of
a human being. This is distorted information,
as any psychologically sound person would
recognize immediately.

If the kid has neurotransmitter problems and
possible problems with the actual structure
of the brain itself, this combination, along with
the type of catechesis described above, can be
a hellish experience for that little person.

The last thing in the world that I needed, when
I collapsed psychologically, was someone
talking to me about religion. At that point,
I was positively phobic toward all things having
to do with religion.

In coming to an understanding of the other
3 realities, the 4th aspect was possible.

Does that make sense to you?

To express this in terms of the model I use:

If the religous information stored in the Parent
[see post #88] is distorted, then that information
has to be challenged and corrected by
Adult/Rational.

That is, the mental [intellectual] aspect has
to confront distorted religious information, in
order for the genuinely spiritual to emerge
and take it’s healthy place in the whole person.

That spiritual aspect [spiritual nature] is then free
to embrace the religious* expression* of the spiritual,
which is what is termed ‘religion.’

Does that make sense to you?

Best regards,
reen12

In all of this, through the mercy of God, I never lost
sight of the fact that God is the ground of my being.
Click to expand...
That makes perfect sense to me. (You just have to be crazy to understand some things…j/k) I read Fr. Groeschel’s book “A Priest Forever” and it’s wonderful - I recommend it!

Quintin, I’m trying to figure out what the cause was of your inability to think. Did you experience severe trauma? A head injury? I’m very curious. God bless you all!

I love to think…the bad part is when I can’t control my thoughts, they’re going too fast, I can’t slow down my mind. Then it’s time to sleep or exercise or write in a journal or pray or have a long talk with DH.

my Mother my Confidence,
Corinne
my Mother my Confidence,
Corinne
 
Good morning, coralewisjr,

“(You just have to be crazy to understand some things…j/k)”
quote, corolewisjr

Ain’t it the truth!🙂
I employ the term “looney”, myself.:o

I’m so glad that my post made sense to you.

BTW, I once had a hypomanic experience for 3
days due to a new medication. Perfectly awful.

I have to be very careful about not getting
over-excited. I can’t “metabolize” the excitement.

Thoughts start racing 100 miles an hour,
my “hard-drive” starts making connections
between concepts, in a geometric progression
that get’s out of hand.
It’s overwhelming.

You know what I do? I find the most softly lit
room in the house. I lie down and try to breathe
quietly, and let time pass a bit. If that doesn’t
work, I have medication that I can take, that
helps.

I don’t have bipolar. But excitement can drive
me into racing thoughts.
My husband is so dear. He is wise and kind
and very patient. He understands when I say
“I’ve gotta go and find some dark and quiet.”
*

As I like to say: Living with mental illness sure makes
each day interesting, trying to deal with it.

I hope that you have a grand day, Corinne,
Maureen*
 
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slinky1882:
Maureen,
I don’t know if this will help any, but if you highlight the section you want to appear quotes with your mouse, the lil text wrap box on the very right of your reply should do the trick. Again, I do not know if you have tried that.
Click to expand...
Ha! slinky, it worked. Thank you!
Maureen
Click to expand...
 
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reen12:
Good morning, coralewisjr,

“(You just have to be crazy to understand some things…j/k)”
quote, corolewisjr

Ain’t it the truth!🙂
I employ the term “looney”, myself.:o

I’m so glad that my post made sense to you.

BTW, I once had a hypomanic experience for 3
days due to a new medication. Perfectly awful.

I have to be very careful about not getting
over-excited. I can’t “metabolize” the excitement.

Thoughts start racing 100 miles an hour,
my “hard-drive” starts making connections
between concepts, in a geometric progression
that get’s out of hand.
It’s overwhelming.

You know what I do? I find the most softly lit
room in the house. I lie down and try to breathe
quietly, and let time pass a bit. If that doesn’t
work, I have medication that I can take, that
helps.

I don’t have bipolar. But excitement can drive
me into racing thoughts.
My husband is so dear. He is wise and kind
and very patient. He understands when I say
“I’ve gotta go and find some dark and quiet.”
*

As I like to say: Living with mental illness sure makes
each day interesting, trying to deal with it.

I hope that you have a grand day, Corinne,
Maureen*

Thank you! DH and I are having a great night.

Back in 2002, the year I went crazy, I wrote a lot of poems. (I even wrote poems in classes! This was my senior year of high school.) When I was able to think more clearly and I was medicated, I reread those poems. It’s strange: as I was writing them, they made perfect sense and I just had to get the thoughts out onto paper. When I reread them, it was painful to read them (some of them were about painful things I was going through) and they didn’t make sense so I ended up throwing all of them away.

I learned to write better poems. I haven’t written in several months. Maybe after preborn Baby is born, God will inspire me to write a few more. Here’s my poems if you’re interested:
dashjr.is-a-geek.org/~cora-jr/myworks/

God bless you all!

my Mother my Confidence,
Corinne
Click to expand...
 
Dear coarlewisjr,

Oh my gosh. I just read several of your poems.
Anyone who can craft the following line:

“Like an atmospheric slow dance
To which all the cousins of Red, Green, and Blue came.”

is a poet. Truely.

I rejoice that you have a lifetime before you, to
write and share such insight.

Maureen
 
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